Some Schemes from the Holy Quran

The Quran says : " the sun runs to its resting place " 40 - Ya Sin

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the Quran says one of his servers reached (in the past or in the future) the place where the sun sets
and adds, " when he reached the place where the sun rises
he found it rising on a people to whom We had given no shelter instead of it (the sun) = a cold place like Antarctica

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the Quran says : " And We have decreed set classes for the Moon, until it ends up looking like an old palm spathe" Ya Sin 38

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By the Sun and its morning brightness, and the moon when it follows it, and the day when it displays it, and the night when it conceals it (Surat ash-Shams, 1-4)
He created the heavens and the Earth with truth. He wraps the night around the day and wraps the day around the night, and has made the Sun and Moon subservient, each one running for a specified term. Is He not indeed the Almighty, the Endlessly Forgiving? az-Zumar, 5

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the Quran says : " It is not permitted to the Sun to catch up the Moon, nor can the Night outstrip the Day, and they all swim in an orbit". Yasin/40
it says: " we made the earth like a carpet for you, so as you can walk on it " 19 - NOAH
it says : " didn't they see that we diminish the earth from its extrimities " verse 45 - Al Anbiya
it says : " God sends mountains of hail from the sky..." verse 43 - An Nour (light)

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I hope this will help flatearthiers !

The Quran is a fantasy novel.

How will this "help" us, exactly? If anything, arguments from religious text hurt us.

sorry!  this was not my intention !

sorry!  this was not my intention !

Mohamed, religious views are similar to opinions, they will not hurt us. The very nature of this website calls for expression of different views.

Quote from: mohamed on February 20, 2015, 01:25:13 PM

sorry!  this was not my intention !

Mohamed, religious views are similar to opinions, they will not hurt us. The very nature of this website calls for expression of different views.

They will hurt our credibility as a society if they are not identified properly as equivalent to opinions. When religious text is presented as real evidence that hurts our credibility.

No it doesn't hurt our credibility. NASA has been brainwashing people that we should only take their scientific words for granted as a proof. Why shouldn't we take the word of God from Bible or Quran as one source of proof.

No it doesn't hurt our credibility. NASA has been brainwashing people that we should only take their scientific words for granted as a proof. Why shouldn't we take the word of God from Bible or Quran as one source of proof.

Because there is no evidence at all that they are credible sources of factual information. It has nothing to do with NASA or brainwashing.

Why don't we use Harry Potter for information as well? Why limit it to a few fictional books? Fuck, if we used Discworld as a basis we'd have a completely sound theory but unfortunately Discworld is a work of fiction... as are the Bible, Quran, etc. The only difference is that the Bible/Quran/etc asserts that it is factual, when really there is no evidence to back that up. So if we take the Bible's word as fact, then we are proving that with the Bible itself. This creates circular logic and reasoning, which is not helpful to understanding the world around us.

Theories for Flat Earth should be formed from observable evidence. Not some stuff written by ancient desert people.

Theories for Flat Earth should be formed from observable evidence. Not some stuff written by ancient desert people.

Unless said observable evidence contradicts FET, then its faked.

Dear Vauxhall,
no one is forcing you to respond in this topic, if you're not interesting in religion, you're free, but do not disturb our path please !

The Quran is a fantasy novel.

I'd go even further and say that all religious texts/holy books are based on myths, parables, disinformation, fabrications, allegory, superstition, fables, deceptions etc etc etc.

No religious book can ever be used in support of any meaningful scientific hypotheses.  It's counterproductive considering they were all written thousands of years ago by relatively primitive men who couldn't even comprehend the simplest of things in the natural world.

Far be it from me to find occasion to defend the Qur'an, but anybody who believes the Earth is flat, and yet criticises a religious work, is truly out of their mind. A further question I might pose is the following: how have you proven that the Jewish Bible, or the Qur'an, for that matter, is false?

Although i am hardly fond of Muslims, to the best of my knowledge, he married her when she was 9, and took her when she was about 15. I would have to check the Sahi al Bukhari on that one, though.

Yeah, HEALTHY EARTH, I agree with you. Muslims aren't my favourites either.

how have you proven that the Jewish Bible, or the Qur'an, for that matter, is false?

How have you proven Harry Potter false? There could be a world of wizards out there.
Point is, there is no evidence at all to suggest that it is true.

Aside from archeology all over Eretz Israel.

Can we please ban people that post decapitated bodies? That shit is seriously beyond the pale to me.

LEMMI, I won't dispute, its disgusting, and I wouldn't post it myself. And if they want to ban it, that is their business. But, it does speak to the barbarity of the group of people in the world that engage in the practice.

LEMMI, I won't dispute, its disgusting, and I wouldn't post it myself. And if they want to ban it, that is their business. But, it does speak to the barbarity of the group of people in the world that engage in the practice.

To ISIS yes. I would agree with you on that. And I personally will give any and all support to my nation in regards to eradicating them.

But I have been rather successful in avoiding images and video of the beheadings and I'm pretty pissed some right wing nutjob broke my streak.

Given the Wuss-in-Chief we currently have as President, don't look for action any time soon. And no, I am not a RWNJ. I voted for him twice, and volunteered to get him elected twice. I now regret that.  I shall be changing my party affiliation from Democrat to Independent very soon. But, I agree with you, posting that was unnecessary.

As much as I am not fond of the domestic policies of Republicans, I prefer their foreign policies, and I think we need one in office in 2016 to restore American greatness abroad. Its time to kick some ISIS (and frankly general Arab) ass and show the world who's boss again.

Aside from archeology all over Eretz Israel.

Of course the the Hebrew bible is a historical record, but there is no evidence for any of the supernatural claims it makes.

Many prophesies in the Hebrew bible didn't happen. For example, God explicitly state that Nebuchadnezzar will completely demolish Tyre. This never happened. Is God wrong, or was the Hebrew bible wrong?

I'm not going to get into the supernatural claims. There are simply too many ways of interpreting prophecy. I would have to know which prophecy you refer to, exactly where it is in the Scripture, how it was issued, by whom, when, under what conditions, etc, etc,etc. Right now, I am speaking of the historical aspects.

I certainly can't claim to prove to you with 100% certainty that there is a deity.That would be stupid. I can show you that there is a strong possibility that one exists, but beyond that I can go no further.

Well I must concede that the Bible is an accurate representation of history to an extent.

Then I think we agree insofar as the historical facts presented are essentially accurate, and the supernatural claims must ultimately be determined by the individual. Certainly I don't pretend for a moment to be able to prove that G-d exists, except insofar as you are willing to acknowledge certain philosophical precepts.

1. Something does not arise from nothing. The principle that a thing, such as the universe, can arise from nothing, is an atheist canard that must be abandoned as insufficient.

2. That which creates must possess intelligence. This in no way posits the Jewish deity of necessity. But we do know that the Universe  has existed for app. 13.8 billion years. Ergo, the universe did not create itself. That would violate Point 1 above.

3. So something had to exist in order to START the "Big Bang", which, though a theory, can be accepted for the purposes of our discussion.

4. What was that something? That is the question that we are seeking to answer.

1. Something does not arise from nothing. The principle that a thing, such as the universe, can arise from nothing, is an atheist canard that must be abandoned as insufficient.

Although I tend to agree, we have insufficient knowledge of the universe to claim this as absolutely true.

2. That which creates must possess intelligence.

Evolution tends to disagree.

This in no way posits the Jewish deity of necessity. But we do know that the Universe  has existed for app. 13.8 billion years. Ergo, the universe did not create itself. That would violate Point 1 above.

If 1 is true, the 2 likely is as well.  This is of course contingent on the universe not being eternal in the past.  We don't know if this is true, we just assume it.

3. So something had to exist in order to START the "Big Bang", which, though a theory, can be accepted for the purposes of our discussion.

Those working on the theory are not sure this is true.

4. What was that something? That is the question that we are seeking to answer.

I agree.  I reject that even if there was a prime mover that it would out of necessity have to be a personal god.

From my standpoint, the more we learn about the science of the very very small, the more the impossible seems to happen as a matter of course.  Now there are theorists postulating that fluctuations in zero-energy fields could cause not only the Big Bang, but also create the laws of physics.  This is of course subject to a regression of "what caused the fluctuation?", but then the idea of God is also subject to this same regression. 

Does this regression have to have a beginning where we arrive at an eternal something?  Rationally we cannot cope with any answer other "yes", but I also submit that perhaps the answer lies beyond rationality and we may never comprehend something as miraculous or wondrous as "before creation".

2. That which creates must possess intelligence. This in no way posits the Jewish deity of necessity. But we do know that the Universe  has existed for app. 13.8 billion years. Ergo, the universe did not create itself. That would violate Point 1 above.

Why? I'm happy to agree with most of what you've said, but you've yet to show intelligence is necessary: you've just stated it free of justification.

To ISIS yes. I would agree with you on that. And I personally will give any and all support to my nation in regards to eradicating them.

But I have been rather successful in avoiding images and video of the beheadings and I'm pretty pissed some right wing nutjob broke my streak.

I laughed so hard at this. I'll take the hit for a low content post, but I just wanted to say you made my (now morning) a lot brighter.

In terms of god/religion - no way to know, prove, or disprove, short of the entity making itself known.

Quote from: Lemmiwinks on February 23, 2015, 06:48:00 PM

To ISIS yes. I would agree with you on that. And I personally will give any and all support to my nation in regards to eradicating them.

But I have been rather successful in avoiding images and video of the beheadings and I'm pretty pissed some right wing nutjob broke my streak.

I laughed so hard at this. I'll take the hit for a low content post, but I just wanted to say you made my (now morning) a lot brighter.

In terms of god/religion - no way to know, prove, or disprove, short of the entity making itself known.

I feel sad for you that a discussion about real decapitations makes you so happy in the morning.  These were real people that were killed for no other reason than for the murderers to get some publicity.  I almost removed the post, but I left it because the media has been showing this for quite sometime now. 

Quote from: healthy earth on February 23, 2015, 05:59:54 PM

Edited out graphic violence.

I know damn well whats happening there, about the rape squads and burnings and beheadings and firing squads mowing down entire villages. Doesn't mean I need to see it to be outraged and give what approval I can to my government to drop a few hundred thousand tons of munitions on ISIS.

Quote from: Lemmiwinks on February 23, 2015, 06:37:20 PM

Can we please ban people that post decapitated bodies? That shit is seriously beyond the pale to me.

Sorry , but all this butchery propaganda come from the quran , not from me , time for you to wake up .

Can we all ban butchery and violence propaganda all over the world ?

Can we let this go further in this way ?

There are laws made by civilized people to ban all this violence and deadly propaganda .

The reality is that this book is full of incitation to violence and butchery ,

this is the reality , are you strong enought to take it





There are laws made by civilized people to ban all this deadly crap propaganda .

Bullshit is bullshit.

The Torah shows God commanding Moses to have his army rape the virgins of his conquered foes, including the little girls.

The Catholic Church started the whole, you know, Crusades AND Spanish Inquisition. Would you like some descriptions of what happened during the Spanish Inquisition in the name of Jesus?

Under the strict Atheism and secularism of North Korea, China and the USSR tens of millions were slaughtered in the name of the state.

The only person here deceived is you trying to hide your blatant racism towards Muslims and middle easterners as some justified crusade against a book.

Wow. A non-believer who can admit that non-believers can be Major Assholes just like believers. I'm impressed.