I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge

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rabinoz

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11160 on: November 17, 2019, 11:48:33 PM »
It's hard to take you defending a government given they have started the worst bushfire this country has seen.
The dementia's deep in this! I did not not defend any government!

But why do you have to be blatantly lie by claiming "they have started the worst bushfire this country has seen" when you haven't a trace of evidence.

Quote from: Shifter
But this topic is about whether humans can get to the moon and back.
That question was answered six times from 1969 to 1972 don't you remember it?

Quote from: Shifter
So why don't you spend your efforts trying to win the challenge.
There's no point even trying! Heiwa's just fraud. Have you read the first half-dozen posts in this thread?
About a week ago, Heiwa informed me of his €1,000,000 challenge on his website, not the one about proving that the 9/11 incident was done by terrorists but the second one at the bottom of the page about the Apollo missions.  This is it:
Quote
The Anders Björkman Challenge 2 is first to calculate using first principles the amount of fuel (or energy) required to complete a manned Moon and/or planet Mars return trip after being ejected into space from Earth towards the Moon and/or planet Mars by external rockets, second to describe the space ship incl. its masses before/after the various maneuvers of the trip, any heat shield(s), if fitted, the engines and fuel tanks that can carry the amount of fuel using 1960 or 2015 technology, the accommodation for the persons aboard and finally to show that it is actually feasable to do the trip. Please do not present dreams and fantasies.
How I won was I showed him a simulator that when paired with a mod can simulate the Apollo missions, and I even offered to check the config files for realism.  As for the reentry part, I drew a diagram that illustrates how reentry capsules control their orientation and trajectory.  I have been presenting all this to Heiwa via PM's and he has not responded in almost a day now after I said "If I'm not mistaken, you owe me some money", so I figured that I might as well mention this on the forum to get the word out and to force him to not make the trademark flat earther move of ignoring my victory.

After verifying the OP's result myself, I must concur that Heiwa definitely needs to award you the prize now. Congratulations !!!

If I get the money then I plan on using some of it to go to space and see for myself how round the Earth is.  There are some relatively cheap rides into sub orbit available commercially.

If I get the money then I plan on using some of it to go to space and see for myself how round the Earth is.  There are some relatively cheap rides into sub orbit available commercially.

Bring scepti with you too please.

And leave him there.

I wait with bated breath to where Anders will move the goalposts this time.

By the way, Anders. I get about as much traffic to my server as you do. Except my box is smart enough to flag the bulk of them being scanners from pretty much all countries. My server is about as popular as yours, except mine is SUPPOSED be used by like 3 people.

Quote from: Shifter
Which of course you can't because the premise of getting man to the moon and back especially for the 1960s is preposterous.
It might seem preposterous to those with as little knowledge of the relevant science and technology as you and Heiwa but while it was difficult and extremely expensive it was eminently possible.

And Russia was not that far from doing the same thing.
Their poor management and being ordered to rush in without all the preparation and rehearsals that NASA killed their chances.
And every launch of their massive N1 rocket ended like this!

With a big BANG!

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Shifter

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11161 on: November 18, 2019, 12:22:23 AM »
Yes, and where is the OP MikeMan7918 now? Just another fraudster twerp thinking he can score easy money by lying

RIP rabinoz. Forum legend

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Heiwa

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11162 on: November 18, 2019, 12:46:51 AM »
Many years ago I explained to OP MikeMan7918 why he didn’t win my Challenge. His software just calculated the fuel to leave Earth with no guarantee to arrive anywhere, incl. the Moon. And then there was the question how to return. Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!

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Shifter

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11163 on: November 18, 2019, 12:56:23 AM »
Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!

How Neil, Buzz et al managed to survive the G forces of this braking maneuver without turning into stains on wall is certainly a mystery. How the ship remained intact is another one!

Well not so much a mystery because it never happened anyway
RIP rabinoz. Forum legend

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rabinoz

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11164 on: November 18, 2019, 02:24:37 AM »
Many years ago I explained to OP MikeMan7918 why he didn’t win my Challenge. His software just calculated the fuel to leave Earth with no guarantee to arrive anywhere, incl. the Moon. And then there was the question how to return. Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!
In other words you have no idea how space missions leave Earth and then re-enter the atmosphere.
You've had it explained over and over and you've proven you self quite in capable of understanding it.

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Shifter

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11165 on: November 18, 2019, 02:32:15 AM »
Many years ago I explained to OP MikeMan7918 why he didn’t win my Challenge. His software just calculated the fuel to leave Earth with no guarantee to arrive anywhere, incl. the Moon. And then there was the question how to return. Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!
In other words you have no idea how space missions leave Earth and then re-enter the atmosphere.
You've had it explained over and over and you've proven you self quite in capable of understanding it.


Rab, have a look at this

https://rechneronline.de/g-acceleration/

I plugged in a starting speed of 11,000 m/s. End speed of 0m/s within 10 seconds

The result is -112 g

Can you explain how you could survive that? How any ship could not disintegrate from that?
RIP rabinoz. Forum legend

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Heiwa

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11166 on: November 18, 2019, 02:42:05 AM »
Many years ago I explained to OP MikeMan7918 why he didn’t win my Challenge. His software just calculated the fuel to leave Earth with no guarantee to arrive anywhere, incl. the Moon. And then there was the question how to return. Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!
In other words you have no idea how space missions leave Earth and then re-enter the atmosphere.
You've had it explained over and over and you've proven you self quite in capable of understanding it.
Please, I am an expert at safety a sea. I just apply the same ideas to space. It is free of charge.

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rabinoz

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11167 on: November 18, 2019, 02:57:17 AM »
Please, I am an expert at safety a sea. I just apply the same ideas to space. It is free of charge.
You might be "an expert at safety a sea"  but you obviously haven't the slightest idea of crewed space missions: anybody would think it was rocket science . . . .

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rabinoz

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11168 on: November 18, 2019, 02:58:07 AM »
Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!

How Neil, Buzz et al managed to survive the G forces of this braking maneuver without turning into stains on wall is certainly a mystery. How the ship remained intact is another one!
"How Neil, Buzz et al managed to survive the G forces of this braking maneuver" is simply that Heiwa is talking utter crap.
He's got no more understanding of atmospheric re-entry than a pigeon has of playing chess.
And trying to debate this sort of thing with either you or Heiwa is about as rewarding as playing chess with a pigeon.

Quote from: Shifter
Well not so much a mystery because it never happened anyway
See if you of your buddy in ignorance, Heiwa, can find fault with: Apollo 11 delta-v, TWR, fuel use relating to Heiwa's Challenge
and this might be a clue as to how to get from a low Earth orbit to an orbit at the Moon's distance.

Technology, Science & Alt Science / Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge « on June 21, 2018, 08:00:35 PM »
.
Apollo-11 didn't follow that trajectory but one through the Earth-Moon L1 point that formed an "automatic return" orbit, which was just as well for Apollo-13.

Here wade through this report: SATURN V LAUNCH VEHICLE FLIGHT EVALUATION REPORT-AS-506
Then see if your ASI can make head or tail of that and dumb it down to your level.

Though, for some strange reason ;), bothering to post this sort of thing to you or Heiwa brings the words pearls and swine to mind and I can't think why ::).

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Shifter

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11169 on: November 18, 2019, 03:16:24 AM »
See if you of your buddy in ignorance, Heiwa, can find fault with:

Do not use the word buddy if you claim to be Australian. 'Buddy' is American. We say 'mate'
RIP rabinoz. Forum legend

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Heiwa

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11170 on: November 18, 2019, 05:14:54 AM »

See if you of your buddy in ignorance, Heiwa, can find fault with: Apollo 11 delta-v, TWR, fuel use relating to Heiwa's Challenge
and this might be a clue as to how to get from a low Earth orbit to an orbit at the Moon's distance.

Technology, Science & Alt Science / Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge « on June 21, 2018, 08:00:35 PM »
.
Apollo-11 didn't follow that trajectory but one through the Earth-Moon L1 point that formed an "automatic return" orbit, which was just as well for Apollo-13.

Here wade through this report: SATURN V LAUNCH VEHICLE FLIGHT EVALUATION REPORT-AS-506
Then see if your ASI can make head or tail of that and dumb it down to your level.

Though, for some strange reason ;), bothering to post this sort of thing to you or Heiwa brings the words pearls and swine to mind and I can't think why ::).

Yes, I saw your post way back. So you are in 3D space and fire your rocket. But where, when, for how long and in what direction?
Just because you can fire a rocket doesn't mean you'll arrive at the Moon.

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Yes

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11171 on: November 18, 2019, 05:28:56 AM »
Yes, I saw your post way back. So you are in 3D space and fire your rocket. But where, when, for how long and in what direction?
Just because you can fire a rocket doesn't mean you'll arrive at the Moon.
Heiwa, you are extraordinarily bad at Googling.
https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a11/a11fltpln_final_reformat.pdf
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markjo

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11172 on: November 18, 2019, 06:16:37 AM »
Yes, and where is the OP MikeMan7918 now?
Probably somewhere out there happily living his Heiwa free life, which is more that I can say for the rest of us.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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markjo

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11173 on: November 18, 2019, 06:20:57 AM »
Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!

How Neil, Buzz et al managed to survive the G forces of this braking maneuver without turning into stains on wall is certainly a mystery. How the ship remained intact is another one!
The Apollo 11 crew survived reentry pretty much the same way that every other spacecraft (manned and unmanned) before and since survived reenty.  Very carefully.
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/aam/cami/library/online_libraries/aerospace_medicine/tutorial/media/iii.4.1.7_returning_from_space.pdf
« Last Edit: November 18, 2019, 06:23:45 AM by markjo »
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Heiwa

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11174 on: November 18, 2019, 06:31:08 AM »
Yes, I saw your post way back. So you are in 3D space and fire your rocket. But where, when, for how long and in what direction?
Just because you can fire a rocket doesn't mean you'll arrive at the Moon.
Heiwa, you are extraordinarily bad at Googling.
https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a11/a11fltpln_final_reformat.pdf
I link to it at my site. The report is pure fantasy.

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Heiwa

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SA
« Reply #11175 on: November 18, 2019, 06:36:18 AM »
Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!

How Neil, Buzz et al managed to survive the G forces of this braking maneuver without turning into stains on wall is certainly a mystery. How the ship remained intact is another one!
The Apollo 11 crew survived reentry pretty much the same way that every other spacecraft (manned and unmanned) before and since survived reenty.  Very carefully.
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/aam/cami/library/online_libraries/aerospace_medicine/tutorial/media/iii.4.1.7_returning_from_space.pdf
Please - you drop vertically down from the Moon and arrive at the top of Earth atmosphere at 11 000 m/s speed at an altitude of 110 000 m and ... then you land!!! But you have no means to brake! How to stop a spacecraft doing 11 000 m/s?
Since 50 years NASA has not been able to answer that simple question!
Reason - NASA has never sent a human into space. Only trained plenty poor actors stating they have been in space.

Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11176 on: November 18, 2019, 06:45:39 AM »
I asked earlier -
Are you in denial that parachutes exist?



Also
110,000 vs 11,000 is a x10 factor.
Maybe someone smarter here could calculate the average decelleeation?
Its beyond me and you.

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markjo

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Re: SA
« Reply #11177 on: November 18, 2019, 06:57:30 AM »
Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!

How Neil, Buzz et al managed to survive the G forces of this braking maneuver without turning into stains on wall is certainly a mystery. How the ship remained intact is another one!
The Apollo 11 crew survived reentry pretty much the same way that every other spacecraft (manned and unmanned) before and since survived reenty.  Very carefully.
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/aam/cami/library/online_libraries/aerospace_medicine/tutorial/media/iii.4.1.7_returning_from_space.pdf
Please - you drop vertically down from the Moon...
You could try it that way, but NASA figured that something like this would work better.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Heiwa

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Re: SA
« Reply #11178 on: November 18, 2019, 07:57:13 AM »
Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!

How Neil, Buzz et al managed to survive the G forces of this braking maneuver without turning into stains on wall is certainly a mystery. How the ship remained intact is another one!
The Apollo 11 crew survived reentry pretty much the same way that every other spacecraft (manned and unmanned) before and since survived reenty.  Very carefully.
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/aam/cami/library/online_libraries/aerospace_medicine/tutorial/media/iii.4.1.7_returning_from_space.pdf
Please - you drop vertically down from the Moon...
You could try it that way, but NASA figured that something like this would work better.

No vertical drop but several bouncing against ... what ... ?  Do you really believe anyone  dropping down vertically from the Moon on Earth bounces? Sideways?
« Last Edit: November 18, 2019, 01:38:19 PM by Heiwa »

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Yes

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11179 on: November 18, 2019, 08:13:07 AM »
Yes, I saw your post way back. So you are in 3D space and fire your rocket. But where, when, for how long and in what direction?
Just because you can fire a rocket doesn't mean you'll arrive at the Moon.
Heiwa, you are extraordinarily bad at Googling.
https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a11/a11fltpln_final_reformat.pdf
I link to it at my site. The report is pure fantasy.

Heiwa: "NASA can't explain what they did!"
Internet: "Here's NASA's explanation of what they did."
Heiwa: "Yeah okay but I don't believe that so I'm just going to ignore it."

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Heiwa

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11180 on: November 18, 2019, 08:59:04 AM »
Yes, I saw your post way back. So you are in 3D space and fire your rocket. But where, when, for how long and in what direction?
Just because you can fire a rocket doesn't mean you'll arrive at the Moon.
Heiwa, you are extraordinarily bad at Googling.
https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a11/a11fltpln_final_reformat.pdf
I link to it at my site. The report is pure fantasy.

Heiwa: "NASA can't explain what they did!"
Internet: "Here's NASA's explanation of what they did."
Heiwa: "Yeah okay but I don't believe that so I'm just going to ignore it."



OK, you drop vertically at 11 000 m/s speed and pass the top of atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude and ... what happens after 10 seconds?

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Yes

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11181 on: November 18, 2019, 09:14:49 AM »
OK, you drop vertically at 11 000 m/s speed and pass the top of atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude and ... what happens after 10 seconds?
Why drop vertically when you can drop diagonally?  O0
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Heiwa

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11182 on: November 18, 2019, 09:21:54 AM »
OK, you drop vertically at 11 000 m/s speed and pass the top of atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude and ... what happens after 10 seconds?
Why drop vertically when you can drop diagonally?  O0

Only way to go from Moon to Earth is vertically down. Basic astronautics. Only idiots think you drop horizontally.

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Yes

  • 604
Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11183 on: November 18, 2019, 09:32:54 AM »
haha, yes, those idiots like Isaac Newton
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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11184 on: November 18, 2019, 10:47:23 AM »
Yes, I saw your post way back. So you are in 3D space and fire your rocket. But where, when, for how long and in what direction?
Just because you can fire a rocket doesn't mean you'll arrive at the Moon.
Heiwa, you are extraordinarily bad at Googling.
https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a11/a11fltpln_final_reformat.pdf
I link to it at my site. The report is pure fantasy.

Heiwa: "NASA can't explain what they did!"
Internet: "Here's NASA's explanation of what they did."
Heiwa: "Yeah okay but I don't believe that so I'm just going to ignore it."



OK, you drop vertically at 11 000 m/s speed and pass the top of atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude and ... what happens after 10 seconds?

Aah whoops
You are correct sir.
I did the math incorrdctly in my head.

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markjo

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Re: SA
« Reply #11185 on: November 18, 2019, 11:36:17 AM »
Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!

How Neil, Buzz et al managed to survive the G forces of this braking maneuver without turning into stains on wall is certainly a mystery. How the ship remained intact is another one!
The Apollo 11 crew survived reentry pretty much the same way that every other spacecraft (manned and unmanned) before and since survived reenty.  Very carefully.
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/aam/cami/library/online_libraries/aerospace_medicine/tutorial/media/iii.4.1.7_returning_from_space.pdf
Please - you drop vertically down from the Moon...
You could try it that way, but NASA figured that something like this would work better.

No vertical drop but several bouncing against ... what ... ? 
Against the atmosphere, of course.  What else would they bounce against?

Do you really anyone dropping down vertically from the Moon on Earth bounces? Sideways?
Huh?  Could you try that again, but in English this time?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

*

Shifter

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  • Flat Earth Believer
Re: SA
« Reply #11186 on: November 18, 2019, 01:25:30 PM »
Apparently you push a button on the Moon, your spacecraft takes off and then drops vertically back to Earth going faster and faster reaching >11 000 m/s speed,  when reaching the top of the atmosphere at 110 000 m altitude.  You then have 10 seconds to stop and land! Question is how! OP MikeMan7918 had no idea!

How Neil, Buzz et al managed to survive the G forces of this braking maneuver without turning into stains on wall is certainly a mystery. How the ship remained intact is another one!
The Apollo 11 crew survived reentry pretty much the same way that every other spacecraft (manned and unmanned) before and since survived reenty.  Very carefully.
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/aam/cami/library/online_libraries/aerospace_medicine/tutorial/media/iii.4.1.7_returning_from_space.pdf
Please - you drop vertically down from the Moon...
You could try it that way, but NASA figured that something like this would work better.

No vertical drop but several bouncing against ... what ... ? 
Against the atmosphere, of course.  What else would they bounce against?

Do you really anyone dropping down vertically from the Moon on Earth bounces? Sideways?
Huh?  Could you try that again, but in English this time?

Are you for real? 'bouncing' off an atmosphere? Which is just gas. Can't a ship of a few tonnes flying 11km/s cut through a thin layer of gas? Afterall, it's quite razor thin on the edge of space. Hence why it's the edge of space.

Relax guts. You don't need to worry about killer asteroids. They'll bounce right off of thin air!

What a joke. Bouncing off an atmosphere has to be the biggest joke and least thought out stories they have come up with. Seriously and you buy it?

Must be a twerp thing
RIP rabinoz. Forum legend

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Yes

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11187 on: November 18, 2019, 01:34:51 PM »
You can find a more precise description on this post: http://blogs.esa.int/rocketscience/2015/02/05/the-facts-on-reentry-accurate-navigation-is-everything/  Don't worry, it's not from NASA, so you can trust it.

Here's the part relevant to this discussion:
If the entry angle is much too shallow, the spacecraft will not ‘bounce off the atmosphere like a flat stone skipping off the water surface of a pond’. A spacecraft generates little or no lift, and the outer reaches of the atmosphere are very tenuous. What will happen is that the spacecraft does enter the atmosphere at orbital velocity, but because it does not enter the denser atmosphere layers, it will not undergo much braking. It will therefore not lose enough of its velocity, and then it will simply continue on its orbit. As this orbit is slightly elliptic, the spacecraft will start gaining altitude again, go out into space and then re-enter the atmosphere after an hour (or more), as its trajectory again leads down – but then it will be at a completely different location than planned and its second entry will certainly no longer be within the ‘corridor’!
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Heiwa

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11188 on: November 18, 2019, 01:49:06 PM »
You can find a more precise description on this post: http://blogs.esa.int/rocketscience/2015/02/05/the-facts-on-reentry-accurate-navigation-is-everything/  Don't worry, it's not from NASA, so you can trust it.

Here's the part relevant to this discussion:
If the entry angle is much too shallow, the spacecraft will not ‘bounce off the atmosphere like a flat stone skipping off the water surface of a pond’. A spacecraft generates little or no lift, and the outer reaches of the atmosphere are very tenuous. What will happen is that the spacecraft does enter the atmosphere at orbital velocity, but because it does not enter the denser atmosphere layers, it will not undergo much braking. It will therefore not lose enough of its velocity, and then it will simply continue on its orbit. As this orbit is slightly elliptic, the spacecraft will start gaining altitude again, go out into space and then re-enter the atmosphere after an hour (or more), as its trajectory again leads down – but then it will be at a completely different location than planned and its second entry will certainly no longer be within the ‘corridor’!

Anything dropping from the Moon down on the Earth has entry angle 90°, i.e. straight down and cannot bounce on thin air. The orbit is a straight line!

Same with an apple dropping from a tree.

Or rain dropping from a cloud.

Of course if it is windy the rain drops sideways but it always end up splashing on the ground.

To win my Challenge you must explain how to get safely back from the Moon. See post #1.

*

rabinoz

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Re: I won Heiwa's €1,000,000 challenge
« Reply #11189 on: November 18, 2019, 02:33:22 PM »
Anything dropping from the Moon down on the Earth has entry angle 90°, i.e. straight down and cannot bounce on thin air. The orbit is a straight line!
Totally incorrect garbage! The return orbit is a NOT a straight line! Whatever gave you that idea.

Why would any spacecraft drop "from the Moon down on the Earth" with an "entry angle 90°, i.e. straight down"? when it can just as easily follow a near elliptical trajectory as in here:

From the source of all wisdom on space thingos ::) NASA ;D!

Here, read all about it in: Apollo 11 Moon Landing Timeline: From Liftoff to Splashdown.

What I do find impossible to comprehend is why you, with your supposed engineering expertise, can remain so ignorant of even the simplest aspects orbital mechanics etc.

Your claim that"
"Anything dropping from the Moon down on the Earth has entry angle 90°, i.e. straight down and cannot bounce on thin air. The orbit is a straight line!"
proves you utter ignorance, so why do you carry on with it?
« Last Edit: November 19, 2019, 12:47:14 PM by rabinoz »