Please explain satellite tracking

A quick Google search for "satellite tracking" turns up websites that let you determine when and where you can see satellites.  For example, spaceweather.com asks me for my zip code and then tells me that tomorrow at 4:49:53am I can look  in a WSW direction at an elevation of 60 degrees and see the Lacrosse 5 satellite.  Anyone who doubts this information can enter their own zip code on that site, get up in the early morning, look up, and verify that a starlike-light is travelling quickly across the sky just at the predicted time and place.  And if you have a cheap telescope, you can easily see that it's not a planet or a star.

If you are a member of the "satellites don't exist crowd", how do you explain this?

You see a little light in the sky and assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.  Truth is, you have no idea what is making that light shine. 

I do have an idea what it is: it's a satellite, and there is lots of evidence to back this up.  For example, there is lots of footage of satellite launches, photos from satellites, and the fact that numerous companies that are independent of each other and from many different countries have all put satellites into space.

So please state your theory as to what could account for these highly predictable, fast-moving lights in the sky?

You see a little light in the sky and assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.  Truth is, you have no idea what is making that light shine.

And space agencies can make them appear in a time frame corresponding to their launch schedule?

So please state your theory as to what could account for these highly predictable, fast-moving lights in the sky?

It could be anything.  You just soak it up when they tell you they are satellites. 

Quote from: jroa on August 27, 2014, 09:05:28 AM

You see a little light in the sky and assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.  Truth is, you have no idea what is making that light shine.

And space agencies can make them appear in a time frame corresponding to their launch schedule?

lol, you think those are satellites being launched? 

It could be anything.  You just soak it up when they tell you they are satellites. 

Ok, name one thing that it could be.

Pseudolites.

Apparently pseudolites are ground-based:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudolite.  Are you saying they are in the sky?  If they are in the sky and they orbit earth, then they are just like satellites in terms of location and movement.  So please elaborate on how pseudolites can appear as predictable, fast moving lights in the sky.

Quote from: FlatAllTheWay on August 27, 2014, 09:27:15 AM

So please state your theory as to what could account for these highly predictable, fast-moving lights in the sky?

It could be anything.  You just soak it up when they tell you they are satellites. 

Quote from: Goggleman on August 27, 2014, 09:34:06 AM

Quote from: jroa on August 27, 2014, 09:05:28 AM

You see a little light in the sky and assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.  Truth is, you have no idea what is making that light shine.

And space agencies can make them appear in a time frame corresponding to their launch schedule?

lol, you think those are satellites being launched?

You see a rocket get loaded with a satellite, then launched into orbit, send pictures down, and immediately, right on schedule, a light appears in the sky which orbits periodically and predictably overhead, broadcasting a clear signal down from space and you think it's a satellite? Hah, such weak minded fools. *Rolls eyes* Look man, if they're not satellites, then what are they? Don't give me the pseudolites or stratolites crap, because it's crap. Outhouses and blimps don't orbit the earth, and of they did they would be satellites. Get the picture?

Pseudolites.

Pseudolites fly (actually I'm pretty sure they just hover) much lower than satellites allegedly do. It's simple trig to find out how high they are (assuming a flat surface for simplicity ). As you can see, there's no chance that a pseudolite could be mistaken for a satellite given two observers checking at the same time. A satellite will always appear at a higher angle to observer B than a pseudolite would.

Quote from: FlatAllTheWay on August 27, 2014, 09:27:15 AM

So please state your theory as to what could account for these highly predictable, fast-moving lights in the sky?

It could be anything.  You just soak it up when they tell you they are satellites. 

Quote from: Goggleman on August 27, 2014, 09:34:06 AM

Quote from: jroa on August 27, 2014, 09:05:28 AM

You see a little light in the sky and assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.  Truth is, you have no idea what is making that light shine.

And space agencies can make them appear in a time frame corresponding to their launch schedule?

lol, you think those are satellites being launched?

Still waiting for you to provide a full and detailed description of how satellite TV operates.

Still waiting for you to provide a full and detailed description of how satellite TV operates.

If he won't answer you in the appropriate thread, then what makes you think that pestering him in the wrong thread will help? 

Pseudolites.

Let's get back on track here.  So far, jroa has provided a grand total of one word in response to the question about what else those fast moving, highly predictable lights are: "pseudolites".  When asked to elaborate, we get....silence.  The ball is in your court, jroa.  Please explain how pseudolites differ from satellites and how they account for what we see in the sky.

Still looking for an explanation of how pseudolites work, jroa (or someone else).  Also, you said that the things that I know are satellites could actually be "anything", yet you gave only one example (pseudolites) without any explanation at all.  After elaborating on the pseudolite thing, please tell us what else you think could look so much like satellites.

I messed up when I said pseudolites.  I was posting in several different threads at the same time.

What I was implying is that a light shooting across the sky could be anything at all.  You only assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.

...you are so foolish. That is just the tip of the freakin' iceberg as to how we know. Ex: only appears in the orbit of a planned satellite after said satellite has launched, the I.S.S., the largest satellite, can literally be seen in full view from the ground with a pair of binoculars. I've done it. Its quite beautiful.

I messed up when I said pseudolites.  I was posting in several different threads at the same time.

What I was implying is that a light shooting across the sky could be anything at all.  You only assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.

Clearly it can't be just anything since we know it's not a pseudolite, or a stratellite for that matter. It is possible to figure things out in this world, if people try and think.

...you are so foolish. That is just the tip of the freakin' iceberg as to how we know. Ex: only appears in the orbit of a planned satellite after said satellite has launched, the I.S.S., the largest satellite, can literally be seen in full view from the ground with a pair of binoculars. I've done it. Its quite beautiful.

Apparently you can also contact the astronauts on the ISS using HAM radio, if you get the timing right. That's another way to gather evidence for what you're actually looking at.

I messed up when I said pseudolites.  I was posting in several different threads at the same time.

What I was implying is that a light shooting across the sky could be anything at all.  You only assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.

Ok, so it's not a pseudolite.  So give us one -- just one! -- example of what it could be?

Quote from: jroa on August 29, 2014, 09:29:06 AM

I messed up when I said pseudolites.  I was posting in several different threads at the same time.

What I was implying is that a light shooting across the sky could be anything at all.  You only assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.

Ok, so it's not a pseudolite.  So give us one -- just one! -- example of what it could be?

He obviously won't man. They could possibly be planes, but satellites seem to move slower. It moves way faster than a plane, but it just looks like it moves slower.

Quote from: jroa on August 29, 2014, 09:29:06 AM

I messed up when I said pseudolites.  I was posting in several different threads at the same time.

What I was implying is that a light shooting across the sky could be anything at all.  You only assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.

Ok, so it's not a pseudolite.  So give us one -- just one! -- example of what it could be?

An airplane. 

Quote from: FlatAllTheWay on August 29, 2014, 02:24:31 PM

Quote from: jroa on August 29, 2014, 09:29:06 AM

I messed up when I said pseudolites.  I was posting in several different threads at the same time.

What I was implying is that a light shooting across the sky could be anything at all.  You only assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.

Ok, so it's not a pseudolite.  So give us one -- just one! -- example of what it could be?

An airplane.

A satellite doesn't have any other lights on it though.

Quote from: jroa on August 29, 2014, 08:12:16 PM

Quote from: FlatAllTheWay on August 29, 2014, 02:24:31 PM

Quote from: jroa on August 29, 2014, 09:29:06 AM

I messed up when I said pseudolites.  I was posting in several different threads at the same time.

What I was implying is that a light shooting across the sky could be anything at all.  You only assume it is a satellite because that is what they tell you it is.

Ok, so it's not a pseudolite.  So give us one -- just one! -- example of what it could be?

An airplane.

A satellite doesn't have any other lights on it though.

Airplanes aren't visible to entire continents at once either. Satellites can be.

And the exact time and location where one can see an airplane cannot be predicted days in advance.  Take a look at any of the satellite tracking sites, and you will see that the time and location are specified with great precision.

JROA, I guess we are ready for your next suggestion for what these things could be if not satellites.

You can not calculate where and when an airplane will be days in advance?  Are you being serious? 

You can not calculate where and when an airplane will be days in advance?  Are you being serious?

Turbulance, storms, etc can effect it. Satellites track it more precisely.

You can not calculate where and when an airplane will be days in advance?

Of course you can't.  Weather, air traffic control instructions, re-fueling and changes to airspace safety due to wars etc will all make it impossible to predict to hours, let alone minutes. 

Anyway, we are not predicting "days in advance" but years in advance - you seem to be suggesting that 100s of aircraft all fly continuously round the world for decades on end like clockwork?  Presumably there is a massive support network involved for in-flight refueling etc. It must cost hundreds of billions each year to run, yet this is all done so that people are fooled into thinking satellite predictions work properly?

Are you being serious? 

You can not calculate where and when an airplane will be days in advance?  Are you being serious?

Have you seen the on time statistics for airlines?

You can not calculate where and when an airplane will be days in advance?  Are you being serious?

Not to the precision that you can predict satellites.

Quote from: jroa on August 30, 2014, 07:02:18 AM

You can not calculate where and when an airplane will be days in advance?  Are you being serious?

Not to the precision that you can predict satellites.

I love how he is ignoring us now.