Theory: the moon, sun and stars are just reflections

Quote from: inquisitive on July 23, 2014, 02:49:11 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on July 23, 2014, 02:24:32 AM

I'll discuss it when you put up a picture of Saturn done by you. You know everything about everything on this Earth as well as the universe as a whole, so I assume you have pictures of Saturn taken by yourself.  I'll wait to see those and then we can discuss it.

How will you know who it is done by? Are you afraid to discuss outside this forum?

Whomever actually captured the image is immaterial to everybody except sceptimatic. He uses this silly stipulation of his that any photos posted here by round earthers must have been captured by them personally, otherwise he refuses to discuss their subject matter.

It's so obviously a feeble cop-out on his part.  It's also painfully obvious that despite sceptimatic demanding that everybody else post photos, he's not once posted even one single photo he's personally taken.  The "fake" photo call is the last resort of a flat earther whenever they're backed into a corner in the face of legitimate photographic images severely and obviously at odds with their own beliefs.

It's not up to me to prove the authenticity of this image sceptimatic—it's up to you to provide some viable evidence to prove your claim that it may be fake.  Just claiming it is has no meaning.

So... please go ahead and post your refutation of the image's authenticity.  If you can.

Oh, ok Geoffrey, I'll have a stab.
Look at the photo and tell me how the person who took the supposed shot managed to get into a space craft higher than this saturn?

What do I mean?

Well, here's the problem with the shot, apart from it having a shadow in the ring top left...is...if the person is looking at saturn from Earth as I presume he was, then shouldn't his picture show saturns' rings from the underside? I mean, I presume he was looking up into the sky wasn't he and not down the side of your globe?

I'll await your response.

If Saturn's rings are its "belly" then Saturn is just lying on its belly in this photo.  Simple right?

Quote from: ausGeoff on July 23, 2014, 05:39:09 AM

Quote from: inquisitive on July 23, 2014, 02:49:11 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on July 23, 2014, 02:24:32 AM

I'll discuss it when you put up a picture of Saturn done by you. You know everything about everything on this Earth as well as the universe as a whole, so I assume you have pictures of Saturn taken by yourself.  I'll wait to see those and then we can discuss it.

How will you know who it is done by? Are you afraid to discuss outside this forum?

Whomever actually captured the image is immaterial to everybody except sceptimatic. He uses this silly stipulation of his that any photos posted here by round earthers must have been captured by them personally, otherwise he refuses to discuss their subject matter.

It's so obviously a feeble cop-out on his part.  It's also painfully obvious that despite sceptimatic demanding that everybody else post photos, he's not once posted even one single photo he's personally taken.  The "fake" photo call is the last resort of a flat earther whenever they're backed into a corner in the face of legitimate photographic images severely and obviously at odds with their own beliefs.

It's not up to me to prove the authenticity of this image sceptimatic—it's up to you to provide some viable evidence to prove your claim that it may be fake.  Just claiming it is has no meaning.

So... please go ahead and post your refutation of the image's authenticity.  If you can.

Oh, ok Geoffrey, I'll have a stab.
Look at the photo and tell me how the person who took the supposed shot managed to get into a space craft higher than this saturn?

What do I mean?

Well, here's the problem with the shot, apart from it having a shadow in the ring top left...is...if the person is looking at saturn from Earth as I presume he was, then shouldn't his picture show saturns' rings from the underside? I mean, I presume he was looking up into the sky wasn't he and not down the side of your globe?

I'll await your response.

Are you real? First off when one "looks up" from anywhere that isn't a polar location, that's pretty much what you seem to be suggesting as "from the side". Secondly, what does Saturns ring configuration have to do with how it is viewed from earth? If you roll a die on to a table, should you always see the "1" on top because you are looking down on it? That'd make roulette a lot easier.

If Saturn's rings are its "belly" then Saturn is just lying on its belly in this photo.  Simple right?

Let me try and clarify it.

You see a person on a roof with a hoola hoop around him/her. The bottom side is..say...red and the top side it green.
Which side will you see and which side won't you see?

Now stick saturn on that roof and tell me how you can see the top part of the rings.

Quote from: sceptimatic on July 23, 2014, 06:04:54 AM

Quote from: ausGeoff on July 23, 2014, 05:39:09 AM

Quote from: inquisitive on July 23, 2014, 02:49:11 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on July 23, 2014, 02:24:32 AM

I'll discuss it when you put up a picture of Saturn done by you. You know everything about everything on this Earth as well as the universe as a whole, so I assume you have pictures of Saturn taken by yourself.  I'll wait to see those and then we can discuss it.

How will you know who it is done by? Are you afraid to discuss outside this forum?

Whomever actually captured the image is immaterial to everybody except sceptimatic. He uses this silly stipulation of his that any photos posted here by round earthers must have been captured by them personally, otherwise he refuses to discuss their subject matter.

It's so obviously a feeble cop-out on his part.  It's also painfully obvious that despite sceptimatic demanding that everybody else post photos, he's not once posted even one single photo he's personally taken.  The "fake" photo call is the last resort of a flat earther whenever they're backed into a corner in the face of legitimate photographic images severely and obviously at odds with their own beliefs.

It's not up to me to prove the authenticity of this image sceptimatic—it's up to you to provide some viable evidence to prove your claim that it may be fake.  Just claiming it is has no meaning.

So... please go ahead and post your refutation of the image's authenticity.  If you can.

Oh, ok Geoffrey, I'll have a stab.
Look at the photo and tell me how the person who took the supposed shot managed to get into a space craft higher than this saturn?

What do I mean?

Well, here's the problem with the shot, apart from it having a shadow in the ring top left...is...if the person is looking at saturn from Earth as I presume he was, then shouldn't his picture show saturns' rings from the underside? I mean, I presume he was looking up into the sky wasn't he and not down the side of your globe?

I'll await your response.

Are you real? First off when one "looks up" from anywhere that isn't a polar location, that's pretty much what you seem to be suggesting as "from the side". Secondly, what does Saturns ring configuration have to do with how it is viewed from earth? If you roll a die on to a table, should you always see the "1" on top because you are looking down on it? That'd make roulette a lot easier.

On your globe you are not looking anywhere from the side. You are always looking up.
Go outside and see this for yourself.

Now tell me how saturns rings can be seen from the top and not underside as they should be in any real form.

Quote from: Rama Set on July 23, 2014, 06:12:24 AM

If Saturn's rings are its "belly" then Saturn is just lying on its belly in this photo.  Simple right?

Let me try and clarify it.

You see a person on a roof with a hoola hoop around him/her. The bottom side is..say...red and the top side it green.
Which side will you see and which side won't you see?

Now stick saturn on that roof and tell me how you can see the top part of the rings.

Saturn is not on a roof, Saturn is across a really long lake.  Earth's and Saturn's orbit are on approximately the same plane.  The viewing position is caused by our different axial tilts.  You might think you are looking up but it is like you are bending at the waist and then trying to look across the lake with binoculars; you have to lift your head to do so.

Quote from: Rama Set on July 23, 2014, 06:12:24 AM

If Saturn's rings are its "belly" then Saturn is just lying on its belly in this photo.  Simple right?

Let me try and clarify it.

You see a person on a roof with a hoola hoop around him/her. The bottom side is..say...red and the top side it green.
Which side will you see and which side won't you see?

Now stick saturn on that roof and tell me how you can see the top part of the rings.

Because the orbital plane of saturns rings (axial tilt to us) are not aligned with the solar systems orbital plane. Very easy.

On your globe you are not looking anywhere from the side. You are always looking up.
Go outside and see this for yourself.

Now tell me how Saturn's rings can be seen from the top and not underside as they should be in any real form.

Ahhh... this proves what I've suspected for some time with you sceptimatic.

You haven't grasped the concept that, astronomically speaking, there is NO "up" or "down".  Also there is NO "top" or "underside".

This also explains some of your other bizarre "understanding" of space.

One is NOT "always looking up".  When I look "up" in Australia at the same time as somebody in Greenland is looking "up", are we—according to you—both looking in the same direction?

   

Quote from: sceptimatic on July 23, 2014, 06:21:53 AM

On your globe you are not looking anywhere from the side. You are always looking up.
Go outside and see this for yourself.

Now tell me how Saturn's rings can be seen from the top and not underside as they should be in any real form.

Ahhh... this proves what I've suspected for some time with you sceptimatic.

You haven't grasped the concept that, astronomically speaking, there is NO "up" or "down".  Also there is NO "top" or "underside".

This also explains some of your other bizarre "understanding" of space.

One is NOT "always looking up".  When I look "up" in Australia at the same time as somebody in Greenland is looking "up", are we—according to you—both looking in the same direction?

   

No... Both would be looking up at the sky in different places.

Because the orbital plane of saturns rings (axial tilt to us) are not aligned with the solar systems orbital plane. Very easy.

You do realize you just went way over his head.

At least I laughed for about 5 minutes straight at this last page but now my sides hurt.

Scepti if you have such a wonderful telescope that shows these things as reflections you might want to adjust this little knob right here:



Anyways. Up and down! lol "Nobel prize coming right up!" or wait "it's coming down!"

 

Septic go buy a telescope and shut the fuck up.


Please, Moderators Attention Is Desperately Needed Here,,,,

If any of you expert astronomer type global Earth people would like to put up some of your pictures of saturn taken over time from your own devices, would you kindly put then into the forum so I can see what I'm actually viewing in real time.

You see, I see so many pictures of saturn, it's really hard to tell which ones are merely paintings, etc.

I would be glad to post some pictures of Saturn taken in my backyard.

But first I think it would only be fair for you to show diagrams on how the sun and moon cycles work on your concave earth with an ice dome.

If any of you expert astronomer type global Earth people would like to put up some of your pictures of saturn taken over time from your own devices, would you kindly put then into the forum so I can see what I'm actually viewing in real time.

You see, I see so many pictures of saturn, it's really hard to tell which ones are merely paintings, etc.

But then you can still cry foul. The only way for you to solve this is to go to your nearest observatory. Here is a list:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_astronomical_observatories

Quote from: sceptimatic on July 24, 2014, 03:45:18 AM

If any of you expert astronomer type global Earth people would like to put up some of your pictures of saturn taken over time from your own devices, would you kindly put then into the forum so I can see what I'm actually viewing in real time.

You see, I see so many pictures of saturn, it's really hard to tell which ones are merely paintings, etc.

But then you can still cry foul. The only way for you to solve this is to go to your nearest observatory. Here is a list:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_astronomical_observatories

I'm not denying it's existence as a spot of light in the sky. I simply want to see some pictures from people like yourself who are experts in what this thing is.
You all said it has rings and stuff that are easily seen, going around a ball, so That's what I want to see.

But first I think it would only be fair for you to show diagrams on how the sun and moon cycles work on your concave earth with an ice dome.

This ^^

All scepti ever does is ask for stuff from other people (which he will invariably declare as fake), without ever putting anything up himself.  It's almost as if he just enjoys wasting everyone's time...

Come on scepti, lets have a diagram.  It's your chance to show your "model" isn't total bullshit.

Quote from: obviouslyround on July 24, 2014, 04:17:41 AM

But first I think it would only be fair for you to show diagrams on how the sun and moon cycles work on your concave earth with an ice dome.

This ^^

All scepti ever does is ask for stuff from other people (which he will invariably declare as fake), without ever putting anything up himself.  It's almost as if he just enjoys wasting everyone's time...

Come on scepti, lets have a diagram.  It's your chance to show your "model" isn't total bullshit.

It's not my chance to show anything to you people. My aim is to make the people looking in, plus the genuine thinkers on here, see how much bull crap we are fed.
I'm here to enhance my thinking. You are here to try and stifle that. Your biggest problem is trying to stifle a super strong and focused mind.

The way I see it is this: for every person that opens their mind and actually sees a lot of this dog and pony show for what it is...there will be a thousand that jump into the ridicule pool or denial pool.
The one that counts is the person that wakes up. that's all that interests me.

So far it's looks like you have awakened...........zero minds.

Splendid job chap.

So far it's looks like you have awakened...........zero minds.

Splendid job chap.

Unless you have extra sensory perception, I'd say all you can do is rely on those who are actually typing against my thoughts, which number in the few.
What you can't judge is who is reading what I'm saying and possibly quietly thinking, "hmmm, I think their person is right, I'll start questioning this stuff."
That's what counts with me, not who tries to shoot me down with words on a forum.
You'll do well to remember this.

I can only judge what I see and what I see is everyone here believes you're an idiot.

Perception isn't everything, but it's something.

What you can't judge is who is reading what I'm saying and possibly quietly thinking, "hmmm, I think their person is right, I'll start questioning this stuff."
That's what counts with me, not who tries to shoot me down with words on a forum.

So what matters to you is the thoughts of others that you don't even hear or get feedback about?

You're far more delusional than I originally believed.

You'll do well to remember this.

Yeah, probably not.

I can only judge what I see and what I see is everyone here believes you're an idiot.

Perception isn't everything, but it's something.

Quote

What you can't judge is who is reading what I'm saying and possibly quietly thinking, "hmmm, I think their person is right, I'll start questioning this stuff."
That's what counts with me, not who tries to shoot me down with words on a forum.

So what matters to you is the thoughts of others that you don't even hear or get feedback about?

You're far more delusional than I originally believed.

Quote

You'll do well to remember this.

Yeah, probably not.

I put my thoughts out. Each person that reads what I say can either respond in a positive or negative or ridiculing way. Mostly it's the latter two, which is fine.
There are also people reading the forums who do not feel under any pressure to go with the majority. They can then look at what I say with a more open and clear mind, free from any bias, if they can read past the put down posts of those in disagreement.

Very few will take onboard what I'm saying, initially and I can't blame them. When you are brought up to believe what you believe, it's hard to have thet belief questioned, especially when it's majority bias.

People will simply believe what they are told to believe by the person in the lab coat or the person in the suit of authority. They rarely ever think to question the validity of anything given out. It is what it is, so deal with it because that's the way your life is run.

You have trouble teaching an old dog new tricks, because it was schooled by you into doing what it does, so it does what it does. See any connection here?

The owner of the dog can make the dog obey. An outsider will have trouble doing that, because the dog's allegiance is to it's master.
A science wannabe's allegiance is to their master...the tutor. No outsider will take that place.

The thing that confuses me about scepti is that this stuff he accuses science for is exactly what science says about a lot of aspects in religion. Science is the view where we question things with an open mind. It is the view where instead of being indoctrinated with baseless claims, we try to understand our world with empirical evidence and all that good stuff.

You speak a good game scepti, when you say how we ought to look at the world, but you don't practice it. The very things you criticize science for are the same exact things that science criticizes. It's always wacky wednesday with you. Some sort of opposite world.

Quote from: obviouslyround on July 24, 2014, 05:45:16 AM

So far it's looks like you have awakened...........zero minds.

Splendid job chap.

Unless you have extra sensory perception, I'd say all you can do is rely on those who are actually typing against my thoughts, which number in the few.
What you can't judge is who is reading what I'm saying and possibly quietly thinking, "hmmm, I think their person is right, I'll start questioning this stuff."
That's what counts with me, not who tries to shoot me down with words on a forum.
You'll do well to remember this.

What happened to the diagrams of your sun and earth?

The thing that confuses me about scepti is that this stuff he accuses science for is exactly what science says about a lot of aspects in religion. Science is the view where we question things with an open mind. It is the view where instead of being indoctrinated with baseless claims, we try to understand our world with empirical evidence and all that good stuff.

You speak a good game scepti, when you say how we ought to look at the world, but you don't practice it. The very things you criticize science for are the same exact things that science criticizes. It's always wacky wednesday with you. Some sort of opposite world.

Yeah well. If I can question it, I will. I don't just accept it for what is told, espcially when a lot of answers to questions are merely guesses that are passed off as scientific theory, which is basically sold to us as fact.

Quote from: Rama Set on July 24, 2014, 04:24:41 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on July 24, 2014, 03:45:18 AM

If any of you expert astronomer type global Earth people would like to put up some of your pictures of saturn taken over time from your own devices, would you kindly put then into the forum so I can see what I'm actually viewing in real time.

You see, I see so many pictures of saturn, it's really hard to tell which ones are merely paintings, etc.

But then you can still cry foul. The only way for you to solve this is to go to your nearest observatory. Here is a list:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_astronomical_observatories

I'm not denying it's existence as a spot of light in the sky. I simply want to see some pictures from people like yourself who are experts in what this thing is.
You all said it has rings and stuff that are easily seen, going around a ball, so That's what I want to see.

Don't you want to see for yourself?  It is the only way you will ever be satisifed.

You speak a good game scepti

Actually, he doesn't at all because anyone that is actually capable of thinking for themselves (something he claims to want everyone can do) can clearly see where and why he is so wrong about every topic he tries to talk about.

Even the most diehard anti-global, anti-nasa people could come in this forum and disagree with scepti.

He contradicts himself without knowing it because he is ignorant. And he blatantly denies any credible evidence even though it would be plainly obvious to an uneducated child that the evidence is proving him wrong.

One of two things must be true....

1. He's crazy. Has some sort of delusions or mental disorder of some type.

2. He knows he is wrong with everything he says on this forum and is just having fun in making stuff up.

I would vote on number 2 but number 1 is certainly possible.

espcially when a lot of answers to questions are merely guesses that are passed off as scientific theory, which is basically sold to us as fact.

Science never sells theories as fact. That is why they are theories. They get tested again and again. And theories change over time.

You're accusing the science world of something it never does.

The beauty of science is that the fact that it's an open forum where each scientists work is scrutinized and can be argued against. This is the opposite of religion and political think tanks.

Furthermore, what you're accusing science of is what you have done on this forum. Passed off guesses as your facts. The problem lies in the fact you never even attempt to provide any kind of diagrams, tests, experiments, or data.

Any scientific theory in existence can be researched and tested in some capacity. Provide some data for your beliefs before you ridicule other stuff.

Quote from: rottingroom on July 24, 2014, 06:33:08 AM

The thing that confuses me about scepti is that this stuff he accuses science for is exactly what science says about a lot of aspects in religion. Science is the view where we question things with an open mind. It is the view where instead of being indoctrinated with baseless claims, we try to understand our world with empirical evidence and all that good stuff.

You speak a good game scepti, when you say how we ought to look at the world, but you don't practice it. The very things you criticize science for are the same exact things that science criticizes. It's always wacky wednesday with you. Some sort of opposite world.

Yeah well. If I can question it, I will. I don't just accept it for what is told, espcially when a lot of answers to questions are merely guesses that are passed off as scientific theory, which is basically sold to us as fact.

Great, question it. You don't have to accept what you are being told. Science doesn't ask you to do that. As a matter of fact science is set up in a way where you are meant to be able to demonstrate these things to yourself. It isn't about blindly accepting things. It's quite the opposite of that. How you've managed to convince yourself otherwise confuses me.

Quote

You speak a good game scepti

Actually, he doesn't at all because anyone that is actually capable of thinking for themselves (something he claims to want everyone can do) can clearly see where and why he is so wrong about every topic he tries to talk about.

Even the most diehard anti-global, anti-nasa people could come in this forum and disagree with scepti.

He contradicts himself without knowing it because he is ignorant. And he blatantly denies any credible evidence even though it would be plainly obvious to an uneducated child that the evidence is proving him wrong.

One of two things must be true....

1. He's crazy. Has some sort of delusions or mental disorder of some type.

2. He knows he is wrong with everything he says on this forum and is just having fun in making stuff up.

I would vote on number 2 but number 1 is certainly possible.

When I said that he speaks a good game I meant that I appreciate that he is against concept likes indoctrination and all that. The part that makes no sense is that the if this is how he feels then he should be with science, not against it.