To the "look out your window" crowd:

You do not exist. In fact, according to you, no one does, and (almost) nothing exists. I've got 4 walls around me and a computer screen, which is simulating conversations with other people, of course, all of these other posts are just in my head. You can tell me to "look out my window", but I KNOW it's just a projection. I can't see any of you, or touch any of you, so obviously it's not possible for you to exist. There are no blacks, or asians, or even countries. It's just me, in my room. Even my parents, whom I still "live" with, are part of the elaborate conspiracy against everyone else to make you believe that you're part of some bigger world. But really, the world is just this room i'm in.


And this is the problem with this viewpoint. You choose to isolate yourself into a bubble of indeterminate size, and claim that anything else that happens, isn't really. Everything I said above is a valid viewpoint, according to you. And you cling to that delusion like you're in the middle of the ocean with hellfire raining down on you, because the moment you ACCEPT a viewpoint from someone other than yourselves, the illusion is shattered.

Part of what makes us HUMAN is (supposed to be) the ability to see a wider view of things: to look past our immediate surroundings, and say YES! there is more out there than I can see immediately.

You do realize that "look out your window"isn't meant literally right?

You appear to simply believe that no one is living their everyday lives. This is a discussion forum for free thinking people to air their views and theories.
We all go along in life following protocol, all of us, in some way, shape of form.
Yes, we can all just simply go picnicking in the park and looking at nature, eat ice cream, have a beverage, good food and all the rest of it, without giving any thought to dimensions and what makes us what we are.
The problem is, we are actual thinkers; explorers, physical builders, inquisitive, etc.
We are born to mimic at first, like a bird reliant on it's parents until it's ready to face it's own destiny in the world.
We are born to mimic our parents, then we are FORCED to mimic what mainstream society tells us we should mimic. It's all put on a plate for us and your life is mapped out from that point.
Those who comply, then go into production. Those who don't, go to prison or are shunned by society.
Those who show a real talent for telling lies in a really clever way, become politicians and such like.
Those who are real thinkers with the ability to have the patience to scrutinise and absorb stuff, become scientists, as long as they follow protocol.

If every person had a scientific brain then the world would fall apart. We are deliberately formed into social classes, which isn't actually a bad thing except for the fact that the classes are so lopsided in terms of who gets the paradise and who gets the basic rations.

Having said all that, it's about brains over brawn and a mixture of good and evil.
We are all vibrating. We are all what we term as electrically operated. Basically we are a robot, designed to think and learn.
Your veins are your wiring. Your brain is your cpu. Your blood is your electricity.
So basically, we are nothing but sensors that depict reality, to us. We are a cpu that operates a walking talking feeling, vibrating machine of the main part of life, which is... we are all alight. Everything glows at different rates. Some we see, some we don't. Some that other animals see that we can't.

Your pc screen is simply glowing heat to your eyes, as everything else is that you see, made up into various frequency waves, producing colours.

We are all slowly vibrating back into the ground, like everything else is that is ejected onto the surface where it starts it's demise by being slowly but surely put back into place in a never ending (to out perception) cycle.

You do realize that "look out your window"isn't meant literally right?

So what is the metaphor?

Quote from: DuckDodgers on April 07, 2014, 11:45:53 AM

You do realize that "look out your window"isn't meant literally right?

So what is the metaphor?

I figured it was pretty obvious considering the focus on zeteticism.

You appear to simply believe that no one is living their everyday lives. This is a discussion forum for free thinking people to air their views and theories.
We all go along in life following protocol, all of us, in some way, shape of form.
Yes, we can all just simply go picnicking in the park and looking at nature, eat ice cream, have a beverage, good food and all the rest of it, without giving any thought to dimensions and what makes us what we are.
The problem is, we are actual thinkers; explorers, physical builders, inquisitive, etc.
We are born to mimic at first, like a bird reliant on it's parents until it's ready to face it's own destiny in the world.
We are born to mimic our parents, then we are FORCED to mimic what mainstream society tells us we should mimic. It's all put on a plate for us and your life is mapped out from that point.
Those who comply, then go into production. Those who don't, go to prison or are shunned by society.
Those who show a real talent for telling lies in a really clever way, become politicians and such like.
Those who are real thinkers with the ability to have the patience to scrutinise and absorb stuff, become scientists, as long as they follow protocol.

If every person had a scientific brain then the world would fall apart. We are deliberately formed into social classes, which isn't actually a bad thing except for the fact that the classes are so lopsided in terms of who gets the paradise and who gets the basic rations.

Having said all that, it's about brains over brawn and a mixture of good and evil.
We are all vibrating. We are all what we term as electrically operated. Basically we are a robot, designed to think and learn.
Your veins are your wiring. Your brain is your cpu. Your blood is your electricity.
So basically, we are nothing but sensors that depict reality, to us. We are a cpu that operates a walking talking feeling, vibrating machine of the main part of life, which is... we are all alight. Everything glows at different rates. Some we see, some we don't. Some that other animals see that we can't.

Your pc screen is simply glowing heat to your eyes, as everything else is that you see, made up into various frequency waves, producing colours.

We are all slowly vibrating back into the ground, like everything else is that is ejected onto the surface where it starts it's demise by being slowly but surely put back into place in a never ending (to out perception) cycle.

This is probably the most coherent thing I've seen you written Scep, and I will actually agree with most of your points in it.

But my point is "look out your window" and see a flat horizon, doesn't equate to a wider view in life, and I do believe the people of this form that say it, mean it quite literally! In fact I've seen them posting pictures as their proof!

Quote from: JimmyTheCrab on April 07, 2014, 11:52:21 AM

Quote from: DuckDodgers on April 07, 2014, 11:45:53 AM

You do realize that "look out your window"isn't meant literally right?

So what is the metaphor?

I figured it was pretty obvious considering the focus on zeteticism.

I thought it was pretty obvious it was meant to be taken literally - I understood direct observation (such as looking out of your window) was the entire basis of zeteticism?

Direct observation is the name of the game.  That's what it means, not to literally only look out your window.

Direct observation is the name of the game.  That's what it means, not to literally only look out your window.

So, you're admitting that the ice wall is completely bunkus, because NO ONE has "directly observed it", os it can't exist, right?

Are you sure no one has observed it?

Are you sure no one has observed it?

No one here has claimed it. The general response is "we can't, it's too dangerous", no one has been able to provide photographic proof og a wall with nothingness beyond it.

In other words:

Based on my observations, no one has observed it, therefore, it is not real.

Why do you assume there is nothingness beyond the ice wall?

One of you around here said it. jroa maybe?

Are you sure no one has observed it?

Then it does not exist.

You appear to be mistaking the ice wall for the edge of the earth. While the ice wall is the end of the liquid water, it does not likely end anywhere near the sea and continues on for some distance to reach an uninhabitable zone.

You appear to be mistaking the ice wall for the edge of the earth. While the ice wall is the end of the liquid water, it does not likely end anywhere near the sea and continues on for some distance to reach an uninhabitable zone.

How would you know. No one has ever traveled there.

Here is a question, when the sun, or the moon sets would it not then intersect with the plane of the Flat Earth, and therefore collide with the extent past the "Ice Wall?"  How do you get a lunar eclipse since the Earth is obscuring the sun, therefore must be in between the sun and the moon.  For that to happen either the sun or the moon would have had to go through the plane of the Earth, you think that would cause an earthquake or something.

Quote from: DuckDodgers on April 07, 2014, 02:27:08 PM

You appear to be mistaking the ice wall for the edge of the earth. While the ice wall is the end of the liquid water, it does not likely end anywhere near the sea and continues on for some distance to reach an uninhabitable zone.

How would you know. No one has ever traveled there.

No one has ever been to Antarctica? 

Here is a question, when the sun, or the moon sets would it not then intersect with the plane of the Flat Earth, and therefore collide with the extent past the "Ice Wall?"  How do you get a lunar eclipse since the Earth is obscuring the sun, therefore must be in between the sun and the moon.  For that to happen either the sun or the moon would have had to go through the plane of the Earth, you think that would cause an earthquake or something.

I have yet to see evidence that Lunar Eclipses even exist.  Have you ever seen one? 

I have seen several lunar eclipses, and your in luck the next one is in a week!

Quote from: EvilJeffy on April 07, 2014, 05:48:46 PM

Here is a question, when the sun, or the moon sets would it not then intersect with the plane of the Flat Earth, and therefore collide with the extent past the "Ice Wall?"  How do you get a lunar eclipse since the Earth is obscuring the sun, therefore must be in between the sun and the moon.  For that to happen either the sun or the moon would have had to go through the plane of the Earth, you think that would cause an earthquake or something.

I have yet to see evidence that Lunar Eclipses even exist.  Have you ever seen one?

There is one coming up on the 15th better stay up and watch it.

This is also directed at the "look out your window" crowd.

I was just wondering what might have influenced them into thinking of the idea of a flat earth from their childhood and youth days or if something in later life had caused them to think the way they do ?

Until I came across this website I could not even think that some people think that way and much less have a website on the Internet .

 IMHO I really don't believe that there are real  flat earth persons  and this website is just one big joke. But I know they will deny that , so let's leave that be.

I was just looking back in my old High School Annual . It wasn't a really remarkable high school. Only about 1,500 students in a city of about 300,000 at that time. But we had classes in physics , mathematics, geography and other science related subjects. And we had clubs for camera nuts, radio nuts, science nuts and astronomy nuts and other extra-curricular acitivities. We were curious about those things and went on field trips to museums and libraries to learn more about those things. And we fooled around building radio crystal sets and developing and printing camera films in photography and learned something in the process. Some of went on trips, even some overseas.

Then some of us went on to colllege and university and others in the military. Some of us were even in the Navy at one time and observed the sinking ship effect and observed we couldn't recover it no matter how strong a telescope we had. And we learned more about such things as radio and radar and other things which the FE's simply deny exists. And we have carried on in hobbies along those lines in subjects that FE's seem to posess complete, very complete ignorance.Also, believe it or not, jroa,we did observe lunar and solar eclipses and so forth.We were just curious about things and had to prove them to ourselves.

So my question is if there are really ardent flat earth believers such as jroa and sceptimatic in particular. (And once again I don't believe they really are, but I know they are not going to admit that. LOL) Why do think there is a flat earth, et cetera, et cetera and so forth ?

But supposing they really are, is their problem a result of being deprived of the advantages that some of us had in our earlier days ? ....Maybe we were the exceptions to the rule ?.....That has caused them to think the way they do ?

Maybe some of the so-called flat earthers can explain it bettter than we so-called round earthers can imagine ? So that's where we ...or maybe a few of us....come from. How about you ?.....all those other persons out there in Internet Land...that some of we so-called "round earthers" call "the look out your window crowd" ? Let's hear it from you ?

You appear to be mistaking the ice wall for the edge of the earth. While the ice wall is the end of the liquid water, it does not likely end anywhere near the sea and continues on for some distance to reach an uninhabitable zone.

You use the word "likely", which suggests a probability, which in turn suggests data.  What data are you basing this on?

People will believe in anything if it makes them part of the crowd. Few will go against mass opinion. Only the very strong will do that.
You've probably all done some kind of test at school at one time or another, where you've played chinese whispers; basically pass on a snippet to each person until it comes back as something totally different. In our normal world it's called idle gossip...but the same scenario can start with something like, "hey, I just heard that crabby wears a womans ankle bracelet." To be replied with, " oh my god, what a strange person." Then that person tells someone else and says, " I've heard crabby wears an ankle bracelet and probably womens panties." This goes on until crabby is actually a transexual and has had the operation, etc.
Once that becomes the norm, then that's that and it's the same thing with anything.

Having said that. Let's talk about the fear of peer pressure and why people would rather stand by a belief even though they know it's wrong but keep questioning themselves that maybe it's right and they simply missed something that they believed 100% was correct in their mind.

The same circle of people are all in on the trick, except for you. The questioner asks you all to add these simple numbers up in your head and reel the answer off as you go around the circle.
Let's say there's 20 people and you are sat in 18th place.

The question is: 5+5+25+3. Now the answer is obviously 38 but the class (except you) have been told to say 36, so one by one they are asked, "what's your answer?" Number 1, "36", 2 "36" and so on and so on, all saying 36.
You are sat there adding uop again and again and each time you do so, it's 38...but as each person says 36, you are becoming confused and flustered. It's 38 for gods sake, you say to yourself in your mind.
9, 10, 11, 12, all say 36 and you are now seriously questioning your simply adding up skills, wondering what you're missing.
Now it's your turn and you have a decision to make. You can say 38 and face laughing ridicule or you can follow the crowd. 9 out of 10 people will simply say, 36, because it's easier to become part of the crowd than to stand against it.

This is indoctrination and brainwashing in it's more deliberate form. The other brainwashing techniques make questioning it much harder.
It takes a very strong mind to say 38. It takes a weak mind to say 36.

People will believe in anything if it makes them part of the crowd. Few will go against mass opinion. Only the very strong will do that.
You've probably all done some kind of test at school at one time or another, where you've played chinese whispers; basically pass on a snippet to each person until it comes back as something totally different. In our normal world it's called idle gossip...but the same scenario can start with something like, "hey, I just heard that crabby wears a womans ankle bracelet." To be replied with, " oh my god, what a strange person." Then that person tells someone else and says, " I've heard crabby wears an ankle bracelet and probably womens panties." This goes on until crabby is actually a transexual and has had the operation, etc.
Once that becomes the norm, then that's that and it's the same thing with anything.

Having said that. Let's talk about the fear of peer pressure and why people would rather stand by a belief even though they know it's wrong but keep questioning themselves that maybe it's right and they simply missed something that they believed 100% was correct in their mind.

The same circle of people are all in on the trick, except for you. The questioner asks you all to add these simple numbers up in your head and reel the answer off as you go around the circle.
Let's say there's 20 people and you are sat in 18th place.

The question is: 5+5+25+3. Now the answer is obviously 38 but the class (except you) have been told to say 36, so one by one they are asked, "what's your answer?" Number 1, "36", 2 "36" and so on and so on, all saying 36.
You are sat there adding uop again and again and each time you do so, it's 38...but as each person says 36, you are becoming confused and flustered. It's 38 for gods sake, you say to yourself in your mind.
9, 10, 11, 12, all say 36 and you are now seriously questioning your simply adding up skills, wondering what you're missing.
Now it's your turn and you have a decision to make. You can say 38 and face laughing ridicule or you can follow the crowd. 9 out of 10 people will simply say, 36, because it's easier to become part of the crowd than to stand against it.

This is indoctrination and brainwashing in it's more deliberate form. The other brainwashing techniques make questioning it much harder.
It takes a very strong mind to say 38. It takes a weak mind to say 36.

Except that we all know and understand why the answer is 38. Just like why we know the earth is round.

You're the one proclaiming that the answer is 36.

You're the one proclaiming that the answer is 36.

The masses tell you that is not true. Have a little think over that. You're a very weak person.

Quote from: rottingroom on April 08, 2014, 07:08:56 AM

You're the one proclaiming that the answer is 36.

The masses tell you that is not true. Have a little think over that. You're a very weak person.

It has nothing to do with weakness and everything to do with having a brain. I think very differently from the masses on a wide assortment of subjects and topics so don't tell me that I'm just going with the flow.

People will believe in anything if it makes them part of the crowd. Few will go against mass opinion. Only the very strong will do that.
You've probably all done some kind of test at school at one time or another, where you've played chinese whispers; basically pass on a snippet to each person until it comes back as something totally different. In our normal world it's called idle gossip...but the same scenario can start with something like, "hey, I just heard that crabby wears a womans ankle bracelet." To be replied with, " oh my god, what a strange person." Then that person tells someone else and says, " I've heard crabby wears an ankle bracelet and probably womens panties." This goes on until crabby is actually a transexual and has had the operation, etc.
Once that becomes the norm, then that's that and it's the same thing with anything.

Having said that. Let's talk about the fear of peer pressure and why people would rather stand by a belief even though they know it's wrong but keep questioning themselves that maybe it's right and they simply missed something that they believed 100% was correct in their mind.

The same circle of people are all in on the trick, except for you. The questioner asks you all to add these simple numbers up in your head and reel the answer off as you go around the circle.
Let's say there's 20 people and you are sat in 18th place.

The question is: 5+5+25+3. Now the answer is obviously 38 but the class (except you) have been told to say 36, so one by one they are asked, "what's your answer?" Number 1, "36", 2 "36" and so on and so on, all saying 36.
You are sat there adding uop again and again and each time you do so, it's 38...but as each person says 36, you are becoming confused and flustered. It's 38 for gods sake, you say to yourself in your mind.
9, 10, 11, 12, all say 36 and you are now seriously questioning your simply adding up skills, wondering what you're missing.
Now it's your turn and you have a decision to make. You can say 38 and face laughing ridicule or you can follow the crowd. 9 out of 10 people will simply say, 36, because it's easier to become part of the crowd than to stand against it.

This is indoctrination and brainwashing in it's more deliberate form. The other brainwashing techniques make questioning it much harder.
It takes a very strong mind to say 38. It takes a weak mind to say 36.

Is your explanation based on the assumption that the average person is stupid?

Quote from: sceptimatic on April 08, 2014, 07:10:24 AM

Quote from: rottingroom on April 08, 2014, 07:08:56 AM

You're the one proclaiming that the answer is 36.

The masses tell you that is not true. Have a little think over that. You're a very weak person.

It has nothing to do with weakness and everything to do with having a brain. I think very differently from the masses on a wide assortment of subjects and topics so don't tell me that I'm just going with the flow.

You are just going with the flow. Prove me wrong. You are smart enough to think for yourself, so why not do it and start to question some stuff, instead of simply taking it all on simply judging the book by it's cover.

Quote from: rottingroom on April 08, 2014, 07:16:04 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on April 08, 2014, 07:10:24 AM

Quote from: rottingroom on April 08, 2014, 07:08:56 AM

You're the one proclaiming that the answer is 36.

The masses tell you that is not true. Have a little think over that. You're a very weak person.

It has nothing to do with weakness and everything to do with having a brain. I think very differently from the masses on a wide assortment of subjects and topics so don't tell me that I'm just going with the flow.

You are just going with the flow. Prove me wrong. You are smart enough to think for yourself, so why not do it and start to question some stuff, instead of simply taking it all on simply judging the book by it's cover.

Are you assuming the average person is stupid and can't think by themselves?