Aliens

Is bringing up the FE in a non-FE board like giving up the argument?

I think that may fit the criteria of ad-hominem. 
Besides, I'm not even FE. 

You're ours now, th3rm0m3t3r0!

You're ours now, th3rm0m3t3r0!

I know you guys have wanted me for a long time. 

I am still waiting to be shown the flat earth.

I'm not.

One possible explanation of Fermi's paradox is the speed of light - if there is no way to bypass this limit, then even thousand alien civilizations in Milky Way don't not know of each other just because the signal may requires thousands of years to travel.

One possible explanation of Fermi's paradox is the speed of light - if there is no way to bypass this limit, then even thousand alien civilizations in Milky Way don't not know of each other just because the signal may requires thousands of years to travel.

That's been discussed.
I think there's a subsection of the Wiki talking about that.
As a side note: By any practical rate, even using the numbers for the space travel technology we have today, it would only take a few million or tens of millions years to completely colonize a galaxy.

In Drake's equation,

N = the number of civilizations in our galaxy with which radio-communication might be possible.

You don't think we fit the criteria of N? I know for sure I can radio a few different people on this planet. I know we're a civilization, evidenced by the fact that I'm on a computer conversing with another member of our civilization.

Thanks FlatOrange. 

The biggest problem with the Drake equation is that no one knows what numbers to put in any of the variables.

Quote from: th3rm0m3t3r0 on March 28, 2014, 12:51:27 PM

In Drake's equation,

N = the number of civilizations in our galaxy with which radio-communication might be possible.

You don't think we fit the criteria of N? I know for sure I can radio a few different people on this planet. I know we're a civilization, evidenced by the fact that I'm on a computer conversing with another member of our civilization.

Thanks FlatOrange. 

The biggest problem with the Drake equation is that no one knows what numbers to put in any of the variables.

I'm just saying that we fit the criteria for N, therefore N can be no less than one.

Quote from: markjo on April 03, 2014, 12:44:10 PM

Quote from: th3rm0m3t3r0 on March 28, 2014, 12:51:27 PM

In Drake's equation,

N = the number of civilizations in our galaxy with which radio-communication might be possible.

You don't think we fit the criteria of N? I know for sure I can radio a few different people on this planet. I know we're a civilization, evidenced by the fact that I'm on a computer conversing with another member of our civilization.

Thanks FlatOrange. 

The biggest problem with the Drake equation is that no one knows what numbers to put in any of the variables.

I'm just saying that we fit the criteria for N, therefore N can be no less than one.

You can plug all the figures into Drake and still end up with N<1, easily in fact.

Quote from: th3rm0m3t3r0 on April 03, 2014, 04:06:22 PM

Quote from: markjo on April 03, 2014, 12:44:10 PM

Quote from: th3rm0m3t3r0 on March 28, 2014, 12:51:27 PM

In Drake's equation,

N = the number of civilizations in our galaxy with which radio-communication might be possible.

You don't think we fit the criteria of N? I know for sure I can radio a few different people on this planet. I know we're a civilization, evidenced by the fact that I'm on a computer conversing with another member of our civilization.

Thanks FlatOrange. 

The biggest problem with the Drake equation is that no one knows what numbers to put in any of the variables.

I'm just saying that we fit the criteria for N, therefore N can be no less than one.

You can plug all the figures into Drake and still end up with N<1, easily in fact.

You can't though, if we fit the criteria of N.
That would mean N has 1 as a given value regardless of any of the other numbers.

The idea of the drake equation is to plug all your variable estimates into it and obtain a value for N.  You don't start with N.

As it is there are an infinite number of permutations that lead to N<1, here are some examples:

http://astroweb.case.edu/ssm/220f99/drake.html

If you don't like it, then argue with Drake, not me - that's the way the equation works.  It seems to me that Drake was concerned with estimating the number of detectable extraterrestrial civillisations, of which humanity wouldn't be included.

N is less than 1?   Are you sure?

N is less than 1?   Are you sure?

Right?
Some people.

N is less than 1?   Are you sure?

Did you click the link?  There are a infinite variety of permutations of variables that will cause the Drake equation to come up with N<1.

Do you actually dispute this basic arithmetic?  I you think it should have it so that N >=1 for all potential values, then you need to adjust the equation.  As it stands, I'm correct.

Personally, I think it works fine - I don't count humans as an extraterrestrial civilisation.

Quote from: jroa on April 06, 2014, 06:47:48 PM

N is less than 1?   Are you sure?

Did you click the link?  There are a infinite variety of permutations of variables that will cause the Drake equation to come up with N<1.

Do you actually dispute this basic arithmetic?  I you think it should have it so that N >=1 for all potential values, then you need to adjust the equation.  As it stands, I'm correct.

Personally, I think it works fine - I don't count humans as an extraterrestrial civilisation.

Did you read that whole page?
From your link:

Here
N = the number of communication capable civilizations...

We are a communication capable civilization.

A number larger than one indicates the number of civilizations currently estimated to exist in the galaxy...

We currently exist in the galaxy.

We qualify as one, so this implies that our civilization is a rare and transient phenomenon.

Remember, a number less than one doesn't mean zero.

Remember, a number less than one doesn't mean zero.

No shit, Fermat.

Quote

Remember, a number less than one doesn't mean zero.

No shit, Fermat.

Nice.

Quote

Remember, a number less than one doesn't mean zero.

No shit, Fermat.

Out of fallacious arguments, you resort to this.
Your points have been rendered mute and void, and you have nothing relevant left to say.
Instead of admitting defeat, you construct a poor joke, at my expense, to let me know I'm right.
You sir, need to learn to fight with honor.

I think the idea of aliens is another means of keeping us confused and ignorant.  If you look on the net today for information just in general, there is so much garbage that it is almost impossible to learn what is really going on.  If what science and astronomy is correct in what is taught in universities, then aliens would be confined to their own solar systems.  They aren't going anywhere because the distances between gravitationally bound objects in the universe is too great.  I've learned about the fraud that exists in science though, and even though it seems that this is only within the space programs of the world powers, and nuclear weapons existing, I don't think it gets into particle physics and biology.  It may though, because Jesuits have incredible influence in everything.  It just seems too unlikely and I haven't come across any real evidence beyond what I know.

Someone can come up to you though and believe that aliens exist, and they may even have NASA transmissions and astronaut acknowledgement that there are UFOs in our solar system.  UFOs don't mean aliens, but because NASA is a fraud and they are pretending that UFOs have been recorded, it is supposed to make you think that the U.S. government is covering up aliens in our solar system.  NASA really doesn't do science, they never have.  The genuine sightings of UFOs might be secret government technology.  This agenda has existed for a long time, and I don't know what the purpose is.  But I've looked into it, and I haven't found anything real.  We are being lied to every single day, and it is important to look at evidence and not believe anything.  Know what you are talking about.  Don't believe.  You can start unraveling bullshit by learning what is false and what's really part of corruption and go from there.

In Drake's equation,

N = the number of civilizations in our galaxy with which radio-communication might be possible.

You don't think we fit the criteria of N? I know for sure I can radio a few different people on this planet. I know we're a civilization, evidenced by the fact that I'm on a computer conversing with another member of our civilization.

I do believe that you are misreading what N is.  N is obviously one civilization communicating with another civilization.  Not a civilization communicating internally. To support my stance, I quote what the Drake Equation is used for.

The Drake equation is a probabilistic argument used to estimate the number of active, communicative extraterrestrial civilizations in the Milky Way galaxy.

As we are not an extraterrestrial civilization, we are not included in the figure N.

I think the idea of aliens is another means of keeping us confused and ignorant.  If you look on the net today for information just in general, there is so much garbage that it is almost impossible to learn what is really going on.  If what science and astronomy is correct in what is taught in universities, then aliens would be confined to their own solar systems.  They aren't going anywhere because the distances between gravitationally bound objects in the universe is too great.  I've learned about the fraud that exists in science though, and even though it seems that this is only within the space programs of the world powers, and nuclear weapons existing, I don't think it gets into particle physics and biology.  It may though, because Jesuits have incredible influence in everything.  It just seems too unlikely and I haven't come across any real evidence beyond what I know.

Someone can come up to you though and believe that aliens exist, and they may even have NASA transmissions and astronaut acknowledgement that there are UFOs in our solar system.  UFOs don't mean aliens, but because NASA is a fraud and they are pretending that UFOs have been recorded, it is supposed to make you think that the U.S. government is covering up aliens in our solar system.  NASA really doesn't do science, they never have.  The genuine sightings of UFOs might be secret government technology.  This agenda has existed for a long time, and I don't know what the purpose is.  But I've looked into it, and I haven't found anything real.  We are being lied to every single day, and it is important to look at evidence and not believe anything.  Know what you are talking about.  Don't believe.  You can start unraveling bullshit by learning what is false and what's really part of corruption and go from there.

It's refreshing to see people that don't just swallow any old bull crap for the sake of it. Good post.

because NASA is a fraud and they are pretending that UFOs have been recorded, it is supposed to make you think that the U.S. government is covering up aliens in our solar system.  NASA really doesn't do science, they never have.  The genuine sightings of UFOs might be secret government technology.  This agenda has existed for a long time, and I don't know what the purpose is.  But I've looked into it, and I haven't found anything real.  We are being lied to every single day, and it is important to look at evidence and not believe anything.  Know what you are talking about.  Don't believe.  You can start unraveling bullshit by learning what is false and what's really part of corruption and go from there.

NASA pretends that UFO's have been recorded?

Anyways, everyone should read this http://www.space.com/26449-contact-intelligent-aliens-active-seti.html?utm_content=bufferb743a&utm_medium=social&utm_source=plus.google.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Enjoyable.

The alien stuff is very clever. It's a case of leading the sniffer dogs away from the scent by sprinkling pepper on the real trail.
Any theorist questioning space exploits or potentially doing so, will think twice when they start reading about aliens from other worlds buzzing us.
TV coverage of it was to ridicule it, which made people suspicious about space aliens. It's a classic and very clever.
It gets people saying, " ahhh, they're ridiculing those that say they were abducted or see space craft, because they are hiding the truth."
Roswell is a classic example. It plants the seed into people's heads that there really is space aliens.
You get rational people arguing about space and saying, " we can't be the only life on all these planets in our universe."
It brings aliens to life, almost.

By planting this seed, they are strengthening their hand that space missions are real, with the masses, just by this alone.
The reality of it can be entirely different.
It keeps up the Earth being a ball ruse, making us think that we know our own Earth in it's entirety and that we are just a piddly insignificant ball whizzing about a ball of fire.

The bitter truth, maybe, could be that the aliens we think are from space, are actually another race of human like people from another part of this Earth.

The alien stuff is very clever. It's a case of leading the sniffer dogs away from the scent by sprinkling pepper on the real trail.
Any theorist questioning space exploits or potentially doing so, will think twice when they start reading about aliens from other worlds buzzing us.
TV coverage of it was to ridicule it, which made people suspicious about space aliens. It's a classic and very clever.
It gets people saying, " ahhh, they're ridiculing those that say they were abducted or see space craft, because they are hiding the truth."
Roswell is a classic example. It plants the seed into people's heads that there really is space aliens.
You get rational people arguing about space and saying, " we can't be the only life on all these planets in our universe."
It brings aliens to life, almost.

By planting this seed, they are strengthening their hand that space missions are real, with the masses, just by this alone.
The reality of it can be entirely different.
It keeps up the Earth being a ball ruse, making us think that we know our own Earth in it's entirety and that we are just a piddly insignificant ball whizzing about a ball of fire.

The bitter truth, maybe, could be that the aliens we think are from space, are actually another race of human like people from another part of this Earth.

Can't you just express your opinion without being so vitriol?