What we need

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What we need
« on: October 26, 2006, 01:19:42 PM »
I don't think any of us RE and CEs are going to be able to convince the flat earthers of anything. What we need is Steven Hawking, that is the only way we can prove anything.
he earth is a cube!

What we need
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2006, 03:16:19 PM »
What we need is to know when to quit and realize what you just said, and leave the board. I'm planning to do so soon... I realize that there really isn't any use of staying here, because I doubt I even have a 1 in 1000 chance of convincing anyone that the earth is round...
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Daniel

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What we need
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2006, 03:38:31 PM »
Quote from: "Skeptical Listener"
What we need is to know when to quit and realize what you just said, and leave the board. I'm planning to do so soon... I realize that there really isn't any use of staying here, because I doubt I even have a 1 in 1000 chance of convincing anyone that the earth is round...


I'm curious: why are you interested in convincing people that the Earth is round?  And I mean that as a sincere question.  There are a lot of people on here who seem to have joined specifically to convince us that the Earth is round rather than flat.  When they aren't successful, they often get angry or frustrated.  Why is it so important to convince others of your views in the first place, though?

What we need
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2006, 03:46:37 PM »
I joined it to have questions answered about FE... I'm just interested in how it works. There's no way I'd ever believe it, but it's just cool to learn about it.
he earth is a giant frisbee being thrown around the universe by George Bush and Zeus.

What we need
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2006, 03:47:01 PM »
A good comparison is the spanish inquisition lol.

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James

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What we need
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2006, 03:55:58 PM »
They have to try and surpress ideas which run counter to their conspiracy upbringing. It's second nature to some types of people - they just can't accept, under any circumstances, that anyone could believe that the Earth was not the shape they've been taught it is.
"For your own sake, as well as for that of our beloved country, be bold and firm against error and evil of every kind." - David Wardlaw Scott, Terra Firma 1901

What we need
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2006, 04:26:08 PM »
Quote from: "Dogplatter"
They have to try and surpress ideas which run counter to their conspiracy upbringing. It's second nature to some types of people - they just can't accept, under any circumstances, that anyone could believe that the Earth was not the shape they've been taught it is.

I think it's more the fact that Earth being flat makes no sense whatsoever*.






*To RE'ers

What we need
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2006, 04:29:36 PM »
Does the existence of God make any sense? To some people no, others yes.

I'm not arguing for FE, but it's like anything else people believe. Some do, some don't.

To an atheist the existence of God could be laughable. But to a devout Christian, denying the existence of God is equally ridiculous.

I mean yeah, earth being a sphere is the accepted idea of today, that's what it is a sphere, I'm sure of it and so are most other people. But some think it's not, that's what they think, and we have to accept it.
he earth is a giant frisbee being thrown around the universe by George Bush and Zeus.

What we need
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2006, 05:27:46 PM »
Quote from: "Dogplatter"
They have to try and surpress ideas which run counter to their conspiracy upbringing.


Thats not true Dogplatter.

It may suprise you, but people (myself included) do not blindly accept everything that is jammed down our throats.

It's true, I was brought up to belive that the Earth was round, but as soon as I had the money and the means, I went out and verified it for myself.

Did I prove it?  No.  Science can never prove anything.  But I did amass evidence which suggested to me that the Earth was indeed a sphere.

Have you done the same?  When you became convinced that the Earth was flat, was it because of observational evidence?  I'm going to go out on a limb and say that it wasn't.

Why?  Because with the possible exception of Rowbotham, I have never seen any FE'er provide one shread of evidence that the Earth is flat.  Not one.

You have engaged on some interesting theorizing about how RE observations can be integrated into FE, but you have never provided direct evidence to suporrt FE in the first place.  If any FE'er thinks I am wrong about that, then please prove me so.

I do not debate FE because it is counter to my upbringing.  I debate it for the thrill of discusion, as an exersise in critical thinking, and for the love for the free exchange of ideas.
"The earth looks flat; therefore it is flat."
-Flat Earthers

"Triangle ABC looks isosceles; therefore . . ."
-3rd grade geometry student

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3

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What we need
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2006, 07:26:49 PM »
Quote from: "link222"
A good comparison is the spanish inquisition lol.


NOBODY EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION!!

lolmontypythonrefrence

What we need
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2006, 07:34:20 PM »
Quote from: "Daniel"
Quote from: "Skeptical Listener"
What we need is to know when to quit and realize what you just said, and leave the board. I'm planning to do so soon... I realize that there really isn't any use of staying here, because I doubt I even have a 1 in 1000 chance of convincing anyone that the earth is round...


I'm curious: why are you interested in convincing people that the Earth is round?  And I mean that as a sincere question.  There are a lot of people on here who seem to have joined specifically to convince us that the Earth is round rather than flat.  When they aren't successful, they often get angry or frustrated.  Why is it so important to convince others of your views in the first place, though?


Why did Socrates go around asking people questions about their beliefs?
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beast

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What we need
« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2006, 08:26:00 PM »
Are you comparing yourself to Socrates?

I joined this forum because I thought the idea was hilarious and because I love debating and especially debating on the side of ridiculousness.  I find it hilarious how frustrated and angry REers get, especially because in my opinion there are no genuine FEers on this site and so the REers can pretty much never win.  Actually I think they could win, they're just not smart enough.

What we need
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2006, 12:01:51 AM »
they're just not smart enough.

Umm who believes the earth is flat again? oh right you do.
he earth is a cube!

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beast

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What we need
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2006, 01:38:23 AM »
Oh lol.  Did you actually read all of what I wrote or just the bottom sentence?  Because if you read all of what I wrote and made that comment - wouldn't it make you look stupid?

How ironic...

What we need
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2006, 02:57:35 AM »
Quote from: "beast"
in my opinion there are no genuine FEers on this site and so the REers can pretty much never win. Actually I think they could win, they're just not smart enough.


Quote from: "Earthisround99"
Umm who believes the earth is flat again? oh right you do.




The challenge is out: Is anyone dumber than Earthisround99?


Earthisround99 is so dumb, that I think I'm going to have to become an FEer just to not be associated with him (all REers look the same. <_<).

What we need
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2006, 10:29:33 AM »
Hey, I might be stupid but atleast I am smarter than how ever many people believe the earth is flat.


SNAP!
he earth is a cube!

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beast

  • 2997
What we need
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2006, 04:53:46 PM »
I really, really think you should read the post you are commenting on.  

What I said was that I didn't think anybody actually believes the Earth is flat.  That would mean based on your comment that you're stupid and you're smarter than nobody.  I'm not saying that this is actually the case - you are.

What we need
« Reply #17 on: December 21, 2006, 05:32:44 PM »
Quote from: "Daniel"
I'm curious: why are you interested in convincing people that the Earth is round?  And I mean that as a sincere question.  There are a lot of people on here who seem to have joined specifically to convince us that the Earth is round rather than flat.  When they aren't successful, they often get angry or frustrated.  Why is it so important to convince others of your views in the first place, though?

Probably for the same reason you try and convince people the Earth is flat.

I must say I've seen plenty of explanations that the Earth is round, including ones which don't rely on physics, photos or other evidence which you would consider inadmissible. I believe most of the frustration then stems from the FE'ers basically putting their fingers in their ears and saying "I'm not listening, I can't hear you."

Realizing the Earth is round would allow you to reconnect with society as a whole and further your own life experiences with rich sensations, such as flight (from which you would see the Earth is curved, not flat).

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Desu

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What we need
« Reply #18 on: December 21, 2006, 05:52:40 PM »
Quote from: "ArmyJonHall"
Quote from: "Daniel"
I'm curious: why are you interested in convincing people that the Earth is round?  And I mean that as a sincere question.  There are a lot of people on here who seem to have joined specifically to convince us that the Earth is round rather than flat.  When they aren't successful, they often get angry or frustrated.  Why is it so important to convince others of your views in the first place, though?

Probably for the same reason you try and convince people the Earth is flat.

I must say I've seen plenty of explanations that the Earth is round, including ones which don't rely on physics, photos or other evidence which you would consider inadmissible. I believe most of the frustration then stems from the FE'ers basically putting their fingers in their ears and saying "I'm not listening, I can't hear you."

Realizing the Earth is round would allow you to reconnect with society as a whole and further your own life experiences with rich sensations, such as flight (from which you would see the Earth is curved, not flat).

That's funny because you know nothing about the people you're talking about, and also, no one's trying to convince anyone the Earth is flat, the Round Earthers are the guests here, not the other way around.
Quote from: sam712
It must suck living in Richmond.
Since June 2006.

What we need
« Reply #19 on: December 21, 2006, 06:38:02 PM »
Quote from: "Desu"
That's funny because you know nothing about the people you're talking about, and also, no one's trying to convince anyone the Earth is flat, the Round Earthers are the guests here, not the other way around.

Hence my use of the word probably. And for a group thats not trying to convince others the Earth is flat, they sure put forward a lot of arguments saying it is.

I believe a majority (note the word majority) of RE'ers here aren't just here for the flaming and name-calling, but rather they are interested in the thoughts of those who believe in something that has been overwhelmingly disproved over a period of nearly 300 years. I know I am. At the same time, they (and I) feel compelled to help them understand the situation better. Just as someone who observes a kid having trouble with maths, and helps him out and corrects him so the kid won't grow up to be continually ripped off by nefarious merchants in the future, the RE'ers have observed the FE'ers having trouble understanding basic concepts backed by irrefutable evidence, and don't want them growing up to be continually ripped off by those who prey upon people without a sense for what is real and what is not.

Having read most of the forum, most especially the 'Flat Earth Believers' thread, it certainly illuminates certain details about that persons character, and you soon notice many similarities between those who truly embrace the Flat Earth theory. Religion is a big one. Well, actually that's it. Religion is the single most defining aspect of the FE'ers.

Strangely though, other religious scholars have believed the earth was round- from present day and going all the way back to Augustine's literal translations of Genesis.

The biggest indication of FE believers however, comes from the founder of the Flat Earth Society itself- Charles K Johnson. He once stated-

Quote from: "Charles K Johnson"
We maintain that what is called 'Science' today and 'scientists' consist of the same old gang of witch doctors, sorcerers, tellers of tales, the 'Priest-Entertainers' for the common people. 'Science' consists of a weird, way-out occult concoction of gibberish theory-theology...unrelated to the real world of facts, technology and inventions, tall buildings and fast cars, airplanes and other Real and Good things in life; technology is not in any way related to the web of idiotic scientific theory


He claims scientists have nothing to do with modern technology of all forms. That, right there, pretty much tells me the important points I need to know about FE exponents.

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trig

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What we need
« Reply #20 on: January 10, 2007, 01:49:32 PM »
Quote from: "ArmyJonHall"


Quote from: "Charles K Johnson"
We maintain that what is called 'Science' today and 'scientists' consist of the same old gang of witch doctors, sorcerers, tellers of tales, the 'Priest-Entertainers' for the common people. 'Science' consists of a weird, way-out occult concoction of gibberish theory-theology...unrelated to the real world of facts, technology and inventions, tall buildings and fast cars, airplanes and other Real and Good things in life; technology is not in any way related to the web of idiotic scientific theory


He claims scientists have nothing to do with modern technology of all forms. That, right there, pretty much tells me the important points I need to know about FE exponents.


I came to this forum with the nagging question: how on earth can you try to explain timezones in a flat earth? I thought an FE had to live in Aristotle's or Ptolomey's time, when the vision of giant glass spheres holding the stars, sun and planets was more than enough to explain the observed cosmos. Maybe you could live in the early Renaissance and reject such technologies as long distance telephones and star charts that are accurate at any latitude. All the science, technology and theology of the time gave a consistent view of the universe, so there is some logic in staying there. But it is hard to live within reach of all the technological means to measure the shape of the earth by yourself, and still declare that there is an outside conspiracy stopping you from reaching the truth.

But in fact the proposed hypothesis shown here are far worse than those in Ptolomey's works. They do not predict the observed movement of the sun and stars, much less the movement of the planets. They do not predict the observed shape of the surface of the sea or large lakes. They do not predict the aparent size of the moon and sun at different times of the day. Let's not even talk about the observed trajectories of the planets. And the list goes on and on.

What you can see everywhere in this forum is the idea that you can be a scientist just by believing what you like and considering everything else an evil conspiracy. You can live in both the 12th and the 21st century comfortably at the same time because we the scientists have failed in the process of winning over the hearts and minds of the general population.

Anyone proposes a flimsy hypothesis and calls it a scientific theory or a fact. Anyone proposes any objection on a time proven experiment, with no experimental data, observations or analysis and calls it scientific objection.

But Johnson, in the quote above, is at least honest in his rejection of science. In his isolation from all things human he at least was consistent. What should make all of us think is all of these people suposedly embracing science but championing models of the cosmos that could have been disproven even by the Mayas before the 10th century.