Ok, So This is what I want to know

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Ok, So This is what I want to know
« on: August 07, 2013, 06:49:55 AM »
You guys truely believe the earth is flat obviously, I want to know. What makes you think this is true in anyway shape or form ? I mean, We have been to space, we have orbited the earth, we have taking millions of photos of the earth, All this proves that the earth is round, Also, How do you explain the fact that if I sailed from the West Coast and Sailed Straight, I would run right into Japan / China ? If the earth was flat, Would I not fall off eventually ?

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REphoenix

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2013, 07:13:51 AM »
You guys truely believe the earth is flat obviously, I want to know. What makes you think this is true in anyway shape or form ? I mean, We have been to space, we have orbited the earth, we have taking millions of photos of the earth, All this proves that the earth is round, Also, How do you explain the fact that if I sailed from the West Coast and Sailed Straight, I would run right into Japan / China ? If the earth was flat, Would I not fall off eventually ?

I believe RE but this has all been answered in the FAQ. If you want to argue RE bring up something that isn't covered in this. You are just going to get ignored or told to read the FAQ.
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DuckDodgers

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2013, 09:36:48 AM »
There is an FAQ and wiki which has a lot of information as well as a plethora of threads.  But the basic answer is observations of surroundings.  I'd suggest looking at other threads to get an idea.
markjo, what force can not pass through a solid or liquid?
Magnetism for one and electric is the other.

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Adolf Hipster

Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2013, 09:50:59 AM »
Read the FAQ and the Wiki. There are also tons of threads to look through.

Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2013, 09:56:50 AM »
You guys truely believe the earth is flat obviously, I want to know. What makes you think this is true in anyway shape or form ? I mean, We have been to space, we have orbited the earth, we have taking millions of photos of the earth, All this proves that the earth is round, Also, How do you explain the fact that if I sailed from the West Coast and Sailed Straight, I would run right into Japan / China ? If the earth was flat, Would I not fall off eventually ?

While everyone above me is correct, I'll provide common FE answers:

Photos from space are fake.

Circumnavigation is possible because people don't notice the gentle right turn required to do so (that is, to circle to the west. East would be a gentle left turn).

You don't fall off because of the Ice Wall (possibly guarded by NASA death squads?) which we know as Antarctica.

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Tom Bishop

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2013, 11:34:11 AM »
You guys truely believe the earth is flat obviously, I want to know. What makes you think this is true in anyway shape or form ? I mean, We have been to space, we have orbited the earth, we have taking millions of photos of the earth, All this proves that the earth is round, Also, How do you explain the fact that if I sailed from the West Coast and Sailed Straight, I would run right into Japan / China ? If the earth was flat, Would I not fall off eventually ?

"We" have not done those things. A military organization claims to have done it.

On a compass East and West are always at a right angle to North. The North Pole is at center, causing East and West to be curved. Therefore traveling Eastwards or Westwards would take you in a circle around the North Pole.

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Pyrolizard

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2013, 11:48:52 AM »
You guys truely believe the earth is flat obviously, I want to know. What makes you think this is true in anyway shape or form ? I mean, We have been to space, we have orbited the earth, we have taking millions of photos of the earth, All this proves that the earth is round, Also, How do you explain the fact that if I sailed from the West Coast and Sailed Straight, I would run right into Japan / China ? If the earth was flat, Would I not fall off eventually ?

"We" have not done those things. A military organization claims to have done it.

On a compass East and West are always at a right angle to North. The North Pole is at center, causing East and West to be curved. Therefore traveling Eastwards or Westwards would take you in a circle around the North Pole.

Civilian, Tom.  NASA is specifically a civilian government organization.  ARPA, now DARPA, was formed specifically for military innovations in space.

This post is not intended to start a debate, this is just pointing out the facts as they are available.
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Tom Bishop

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2013, 11:55:36 AM »
NASA is not civilian. The concept of a "civilian" space agency is just lip service to hide the fact that NASA's true agenda from the very start was to perform rocket research for ICBM's. Those "civilians" at NASA are military defense contractors - Northrop Grumman, Boeing, Raytrheon, DynCorp, etc.

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markjo

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2013, 12:01:09 PM »
NASA is not civilian. The concept of a "civilian" space agency is just lip service to hide the fact that NASA's true agenda from the very start was to perform rocket research for ICBM's. Those "civilians" at NASA are military defense contractors - Northrop Grumman, Boeing, Raytrheon, DynCorp, etc.

These military contractors also make civilian products.  Or are you saying that the Boeing 787 is a military troop transport?
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Pyrolizard

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2013, 12:05:57 PM »
NASA is not civilian. The concept of a "civilian" space agency is just lip service to hide the fact that NASA's true agenda from the very start was to perform rocket research for ICBM's. Those "civilians" at NASA are military defense contractors - Northrop Grumman, Boeing, Raytrheon, DynCorp, etc.

Again, as NASA stands, it is civilian.  It's great that people suspected from the very beginning that it's intent was to research ICBMs, even though that was pretty much ARPA's entire purpose and reason of formation.  That may even be true, I can't say it's not granted the state of the world at the time.  We only have speculation to support that claim, however likely or unlikely it may seem, though.
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robintex

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #10 on: August 07, 2013, 01:35:24 PM »
NASA is not civilian. The concept of a "civilian" space agency is just lip service to hide the fact that NASA's true agenda from the very start was to perform rocket research for ICBM's. Those "civilians" at NASA are military defense contractors - Northrop Grumman, Boeing, Raytrheon, DynCorp, etc.

Again, as NASA stands, it is civilian.  It's great that people suspected from the very beginning that it's intent was to research ICBMs, even though that was pretty much ARPA's entire purpose and reason of formation.  That may even be true, I can't say it's not granted the state of the world at the time.  We only have speculation to support that claim, however likely or unlikely it may seem, though.

NASA employees are civilians part of the Civil Service  in the United States. Their pay scales are "GS" (General Service) with pay grades as in other government civil service agencies such as the Federal Aviation Administration for example or other branches of United States Department of Transportation.
http://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/salaries-wages/2013/general-schedule/rus.pdf

IMO Tom Bishop's statements should be viewed as merely a part of the FE train of thought and not based on fact.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2013, 01:46:58 PM by Googleotomy »
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Tom Bishop

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #11 on: August 07, 2013, 03:01:52 PM »
NASA is not civilian. The concept of a "civilian" space agency is just lip service to hide the fact that NASA's true agenda from the very start was to perform rocket research for ICBM's. Those "civilians" at NASA are military defense contractors - Northrop Grumman, Boeing, Raytrheon, DynCorp, etc.

These military contractors also make civilian products.  Or are you saying that the Boeing 787 is a military troop transport?

The Atlas and Saturn line of rockets aren't civilian products. They are highly classified and owned by the government.

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Tom Bishop

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #12 on: August 07, 2013, 03:03:06 PM »
NASA is not civilian. The concept of a "civilian" space agency is just lip service to hide the fact that NASA's true agenda from the very start was to perform rocket research for ICBM's. Those "civilians" at NASA are military defense contractors - Northrop Grumman, Boeing, Raytrheon, DynCorp, etc.

Again, as NASA stands, it is civilian.  It's great that people suspected from the very beginning that it's intent was to research ICBMs, even though that was pretty much ARPA's entire purpose and reason of formation.  That may even be true, I can't say it's not granted the state of the world at the time.  We only have speculation to support that claim, however likely or unlikely it may seem, though.

If NASA is civilian then why do they use Confidential, Secret, and Top Secret classifications?

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Rama Set

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #13 on: August 07, 2013, 03:06:47 PM »
NASA is not civilian. The concept of a "civilian" space agency is just lip service to hide the fact that NASA's true agenda from the very start was to perform rocket research for ICBM's. Those "civilians" at NASA are military defense contractors - Northrop Grumman, Boeing, Raytrheon, DynCorp, etc.

Again, as NASA stands, it is civilian.  It's great that people suspected from the very beginning that it's intent was to research ICBMs, even though that was pretty much ARPA's entire purpose and reason of formation.  That may even be true, I can't say it's not granted the state of the world at the time.  We only have speculation to support that claim, however likely or unlikely it may seem, though.

If NASA is civilian then why do they use Confidential, Secret, and Top Secret classifications?

Because some of their work is meant to be secret?
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Pyrolizard

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #14 on: August 07, 2013, 04:27:56 PM »
NASA is not civilian. The concept of a "civilian" space agency is just lip service to hide the fact that NASA's true agenda from the very start was to perform rocket research for ICBM's. Those "civilians" at NASA are military defense contractors - Northrop Grumman, Boeing, Raytrheon, DynCorp, etc.

Again, as NASA stands, it is civilian.  It's great that people suspected from the very beginning that it's intent was to research ICBMs, even though that was pretty much ARPA's entire purpose and reason of formation.  That may even be true, I can't say it's not granted the state of the world at the time.  We only have speculation to support that claim, however likely or unlikely it may seem, though.

If NASA is civilian then why do they use Confidential, Secret, and Top Secret classifications?

Is there some reason civilian organizations can't use those classifications?  I don't believe they're limited to military use.
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markjo

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2013, 05:01:22 PM »
NASA is not civilian. The concept of a "civilian" space agency is just lip service to hide the fact that NASA's true agenda from the very start was to perform rocket research for ICBM's. Those "civilians" at NASA are military defense contractors - Northrop Grumman, Boeing, Raytrheon, DynCorp, etc.

These military contractors also make civilian products.  Or are you saying that the Boeing 787 is a military troop transport?

The Atlas and Saturn line of rockets aren't civilian products. They are highly classified and owned by the government.

???  What military application did the Saturn line of rockets ever serve?  Also, why can't military contractors make civilian variants of ICBMs for commercial use?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
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Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
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bullhorn

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2013, 06:40:32 PM »
BigTalon

      It is most wise to be skeptical about the world in that you live your life.  The powers that be care nothing for
your personal discovery.  They take your money through taxes.  Take life by producing toxins that cause cancer and sell it to you. 

It is wise to think for yourself and not as a sheep to the machine.

Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2013, 10:27:24 PM »
None of us have been to space. NASA employed many people who are sworn to secrecy.
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Lorddave

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #18 on: August 08, 2013, 05:18:46 AM »
NASA is not civilian. The concept of a "civilian" space agency is just lip service to hide the fact that NASA's true agenda from the very start was to perform rocket research for ICBM's. Those "civilians" at NASA are military defense contractors - Northrop Grumman, Boeing, Raytrheon, DynCorp, etc.

These military contractors also make civilian products.  Or are you saying that the Boeing 787 is a military troop transport?
And receive a sizable amount of funding via Military contracts.
Even ARPA produced things that were later used by civilians.
You have been ignored for common interest of mankind.

I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2013, 05:34:45 AM »
Out of interest how many people who swear to have been into space will it take to reach a tipping point where the combined testimonies form a believable whole?

I'd like to agree with you but then we'd both be wrong!

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Lorddave

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #20 on: August 08, 2013, 05:45:13 AM »
Out of interest how many people who swear to have been into space will it take to reach a tipping point where the combined testimonies form a believable whole?
None. 
Drunk people swear they hit the bowl when they didn't. 
You have been ignored for common interest of mankind.

I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #21 on: August 08, 2013, 06:47:18 AM »
Out of interest how many people who swear to have been into space will it take to reach a tipping point where the combined testimonies form a believable whole?
None. 
Drunk people swear they hit the bowl when they didn't.

So you're saying flight--once thought an impossibility--is still impossible and the billions of people who've flown are lying through their teeth.

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Lorddave

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #22 on: August 08, 2013, 09:36:26 AM »
Out of interest how many people who swear to have been into space will it take to reach a tipping point where the combined testimonies form a believable whole?
None. 
Drunk people swear they hit the bowl when they didn't.

So you're saying flight--once thought an impossibility--is still impossible and the billions of people who've flown are lying through their teeth.
Lying is knowingly speaking falsely.  If you believe what you say, its not a lie.

As for flight, one can only believe what one has done.  I've flown so I believe that flight is possible.  In fact, I don't know of any FEer who says that airplanes are impossible.
You have been ignored for common interest of mankind.

I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #23 on: August 08, 2013, 12:48:02 PM »
You guys truely believe the earth is flat obviously, I want to know. What makes you think this is true in anyway shape or form ? I mean, We have been to space, we have orbited the earth, we have taking millions of photos of the earth, All this proves that the earth is round, Also, How do you explain the fact that if I sailed from the West Coast and Sailed Straight, I would run right into Japan / China ? If the earth was flat, Would I not fall off eventually ?

"We" have not done those things. A military organization claims to have done it.

On a compass East and West are always at a right angle to North. The North Pole is at center, causing East and West to be curved. Therefore traveling Eastwards or Westwards would take you in a circle around the North Pole.

"A" military organisation?
What about the rest of the world? Other countries have been to space, not just the U.S. Why the hell would we be slightly turning when walking straight? Wouldn't it make more sense to just walk straight, around the earth, back to the point you started from?

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Tausami

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #24 on: August 08, 2013, 01:06:45 PM »
You guys truely believe the earth is flat obviously, I want to know. What makes you think this is true in anyway shape or form ? I mean, We have been to space, we have orbited the earth, we have taking millions of photos of the earth, All this proves that the earth is round, Also, How do you explain the fact that if I sailed from the West Coast and Sailed Straight, I would run right into Japan / China ? If the earth was flat, Would I not fall off eventually ?

"We" have not done those things. A military organization claims to have done it.

On a compass East and West are always at a right angle to North. The North Pole is at center, causing East and West to be curved. Therefore traveling Eastwards or Westwards would take you in a circle around the North Pole.

"A" military organisation?
What about the rest of the world? Other countries have been to space, not just the U.S. Why the hell would we be slightly turning when walking straight? Wouldn't it make more sense to just walk straight, around the earth, back to the point you started from?

You can't walk around the Earth. There's a bit of water in the way.

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Lorddave

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #25 on: August 08, 2013, 01:08:00 PM »
The rest of the world follows our example.

As for walking...

If the whole world was a paved parking lot, I'd say yeah.  But it isn't.  It's full of trees and hills and rivers and mountains and oceans.  Walking in one direction sounds easy until you hit that very first solid object.  Then you have to go around it. And if you're not careful, you can get lost.
You have been ignored for common interest of mankind.

I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #26 on: August 08, 2013, 01:54:29 PM »
The rest of the world follows our example.

As for walking...

If the whole world was a paved parking lot, I'd say yeah.  But it isn't.  It's full of trees and hills and rivers and mountains and oceans.  Walking in one direction sounds easy until you hit that very first solid object.  Then you have to go around it. And if you're not careful, you can get lost.

Have you ever heard of orienteering? Yeah, they have a system for going around objects when trying to walk a straight line. It goes something like this.

Walk along heading A.
If you encounter an object, turn to heading B and count paces.
When heading A is clear of object, turn back to heading A.
When heading 180+B is clear of object, turn to heading 180+B and count paces.
When pace count equals pace count in step 2, turn back to heading A.

Congratulations; you've just navigated your way around the obstacle.

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Son of Orospu

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #27 on: August 08, 2013, 02:18:01 PM »
Why the hell would we be slightly turning when walking straight? Wouldn't it make more sense to just walk straight, around the earth, back to the point you started from?

How would you know if you are walking straight and not turning?  If you use a compass to, say, travel west, then even on a sphere, you would have to turn in order for the compass to continuously point west, unless you are exactly on the equator.

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Lorddave

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Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #28 on: August 08, 2013, 05:30:21 PM »
The rest of the world follows our example.

As for walking...

If the whole world was a paved parking lot, I'd say yeah.  But it isn't.  It's full of trees and hills and rivers and mountains and oceans.  Walking in one direction sounds easy until you hit that very first solid object.  Then you have to go around it. And if you're not careful, you can get lost.

Have you ever heard of orienteering? Yeah, they have a system for going around objects when trying to walk a straight line. It goes something like this.

Walk along heading A.
If you encounter an object, turn to heading B and count paces.
When heading A is clear of object, turn back to heading A.
When heading 180+B is clear of object, turn to heading 180+B and count paces.
When pace count equals pace count in step 2, turn back to heading A.

Congratulations; you've just navigated your way around the obstacle.
So you want to rely on counting an imprecise measurement AND turning at exactly 180 degrees?

Also, water.  Can't walk on that unless you're Jesus.
You have been ignored for common interest of mankind.

I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

Re: Ok, So This is what I want to know
« Reply #29 on: August 08, 2013, 05:43:43 PM »
its about 65 miles from earth to space, this is counting sea level. Yet since the 1960's the beginning of space program, how many people have traveled to space? There are almost 8 billion people on earth, how many traveled to space? Space is not far, why no one goes? Why does it cost 100 million to go 65 miles up? Yes I know the answers that government gives, but logic dictates space is forbidden and conspiracy is damn real.
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