ENaG Chapter XIV: "Difference in Solar and Sidereal Times"

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Tom Bishop

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Re: ENaG Chapter XIV: "Difference in Solar and Sidereal Times"
« Reply #30 on: May 15, 2013, 07:06:27 AM »
Ptolemaic epicycles have never fully explained the motion of the planets. Even worse, you would still be left left with how the orbital paths are traversed; what mechanism causes their motion?

That's not a Ptolemaic epicycle. It's heliocentric. The planets are revolving around the sun, not an invisible point in space.

But has it been reproduced in a lab?  After all, stellar fusion has been observed in our sun but has hot been reproduced in a lab, therefore you claim that stellar fusion is an unexplained mystery.  I'm simply applying the same burden to planetary retrograde as you apply to stellar fusion.

We can see the movement of the planets visually, and have observational evidence that they physically retrograde in the sky. However, in RET this retrograde is not physical, but a complex illusion.

Quote
Actually, it has:


That toy doesn't show that the retrograde is an illusion. I don't even think what you posted can visualize a retrograde. However, such toys and diagrams would only suggest that a retrograde is possible through a complex movement of bodies, not that it actually occurs. FET already has winning evidence that a physical retrograde occurs through direct observation. Direct observation of planetary movements are on our side. What does RET have showing that the observation of retrogrades is an illusion and that the planets are not really making loops in the sky?
« Last Edit: May 15, 2013, 07:12:27 AM by Tom Bishop »

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Rama Set

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Re: ENaG Chapter XIV: "Difference in Solar and Sidereal Times"
« Reply #31 on: May 15, 2013, 07:22:32 AM »
No one has ever successfully made a model that can accurately describe retrograde that does not have a heliocentric system and a spherical Earth.  You cannot explain, you have only observed it.  You are of course welcome to try and explain it not using a heliocentric system and a spherical Earth.  I know you tried before with a software program and could never get it to match in 3 dimensions.  Has anything changed since then?
Aether is the  characteristic of action or inaction of charged  & noncharged particals.

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Tom Bishop

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Re: ENaG Chapter XIV: "Difference in Solar and Sidereal Times"
« Reply #32 on: May 15, 2013, 07:26:58 AM »
No one has ever successfully made a model that can accurately describe retrograde that does not have a heliocentric system and a spherical Earth.  You cannot explain, you have only observed it.  You are of course welcome to try and explain it not using a heliocentric system and a spherical Earth.  I know you tried before with a software program and could never get it to match in 3 dimensions.  Has anything changed since then?

The FET system is heliocentric. The sun is the center of the solar system, which the planets all revolve around. It is not a Ptolemaic epicycle system. It's a slightly modified heliocentric system which replaces the movement of the earth with the movement of the sun.

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Rama Set

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Re: ENaG Chapter XIV: "Difference in Solar and Sidereal Times"
« Reply #33 on: May 15, 2013, 07:30:15 AM »
No one has ever successfully made a model that can accurately describe retrograde that does not have a heliocentric system and a spherical Earth.  You cannot explain, you have only observed it.  You are of course welcome to try and explain it not using a heliocentric system and a spherical Earth.  I know you tried before with a software program and could never get it to match in 3 dimensions.  Has anything changed since then?

The FET system is heliocentric. The sun is the center of the solar system, which the planets all revolve around. It is not a Ptolemaic epicycle system. It's a slightly modified heliocentric system which replaces the movement of the earth with the movement of the sun.

Right, you don't include the Earth as part of the solar system. Well my criticism still stands, as retrograde motion relative to the Earth has never been accurately modelled without incorporating the Earth's motion around the sun as well. 
Aether is the  characteristic of action or inaction of charged  & noncharged particals.

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markjo

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Re: ENaG Chapter XIV: "Difference in Solar and Sidereal Times"
« Reply #34 on: May 15, 2013, 08:16:20 AM »
But has it been reproduced in a lab?  After all, stellar fusion has been observed in our sun but has hot been reproduced in a lab, therefore you claim that stellar fusion is an unexplained mystery.  I'm simply applying the same burden to planetary retrograde as you apply to stellar fusion.

We can see the movement of the planets visually, and have observational evidence that they physically retrograde in the sky. However, in RET this retrograde is not physical, but a complex illusion.

Quote
Actually, it has:


That toy doesn't show that the retrograde is an illusion. I don't even think what you posted can visualize a retrograde. 
Think harder.  Use Mercury or Venus as a reference and then trace the apparent motion of the Earth.  Presto, retrograde motion.

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However, such toys and diagrams would only suggest that a retrograde is possible through a complex movement of bodies, not that it actually occurs.
Actually, the motions of the bodies are quite simple (circular orbits around the sun).  The only complexity is tracing the movements of the bodies relative to each other.

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FET already has winning evidence that a physical retrograde occurs through direct observation. Direct observation of planetary movements are on our side.
Except you can't use any accepted laws of motion to explain why the planets retrograde.

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What does RET have showing that the observation of retrogrades is an illusion and that the planets are not really making loops in the sky?
A better explanation that doesn't violate accepted laws of motion.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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RealScientist

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Re: ENaG Chapter XIV: "Difference in Solar and Sidereal Times"
« Reply #35 on: May 15, 2013, 10:09:20 AM »

Lunar eclipses are caused by a celestial body intersecting the path of light between the sun and moon, as is physically observed.



Your very own photograph shows a story that is different from yours. The penumbra that your photograph shows is totally inconsistent with an object intersecting the path of light between the Sun and the Moon just 3000 miles above us.

If the Moon produces its own light then parts of the Moon will be covered by the dark object and others will not be. No penumbra. And if the Sun somehow illuminates the Moon then it will also illuminate the dark object, making it visible. You have been asked for a diagram for many years, as far as I have seen, but never have produced it. I think it is just impossible to do because it is impossible to make your scenario work.

By the way, it would be absolutely easy to see almost any night the effect of a dark object the size of the Moon. On a clear night far away from light pollution from the cities it is impossible to find any dark, star-less piece of sky the size of the Moon. It would have to be made of a magic substance that is perfectly transparent to star light but perfectly opaque to moonlight. And we know, because we have centuries of experience in the matter, this kind of substance is impossible.

Re: ENaG Chapter XIV: "Difference in Solar and Sidereal Times"
« Reply #36 on: May 15, 2013, 12:56:24 PM »
The FET system is heliocentric. The sun is the center of the solar system, which the planets all revolve around. It is not a Ptolemaic epicycle system. It's a slightly modified heliocentric system which replaces the movement of the earth with the movement of the sun.

What about exoplanets? Do they exist in FET? I don't think I've seen any info on that anywhere.

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markjo

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Re: ENaG Chapter XIV: "Difference in Solar and Sidereal Times"
« Reply #37 on: May 15, 2013, 01:20:49 PM »
The FET system is heliocentric. The sun is the center of the solar system, which the planets all revolve around. It is not a Ptolemaic epicycle system. It's a slightly modified heliocentric system which replaces the movement of the earth with the movement of the sun.
What observational evidence do you have that the planets orbit the sun? 
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.