If FET is accurate, then why can't I see Mt. Everest?

Should I explain in more detail? If you're an ant crawling across my dinner plate, you'll be able to see the top of my mash potatoes no matter where you are; however, if my dinner plate were spherical, there would be points on the plate where you couldn't see the peak of my potato mountain.

EDIT: this goes for all tall structures - not just the tallest. why cant I see the Rockies? Why can't i see the skyscrapers in the city 45 minutes away?

http://theflatearthsociety.org/wiki/index.php?title=Viewing_Distance

So basically, if we were on a plane we could see Mt. Everest.

Quote from: Genius on April 11, 2013, 12:37:01 PM

http://theflatearthsociety.org/wiki/index.php?title=Viewing_Distance

So basically, if we were on a plane we could see Mt. Everest.

I'm just doing that thing people always want people to do, link to the wiki and previous articles and stuff. I believe the Earth is a sphere that bulges at the equator. Keep your arguments for pros, like scepti.

Quote from: Genius on April 11, 2013, 12:37:01 PM

http://theflatearthsociety.org/wiki/index.php?title=Viewing_Distance

So basically, if we were on a plane we could see Mt. Everest.

That depends.  How good are your eyes?

Even on a very clear day visibility does not exceed 40km. Air is not perfectly clear. Air stops you seeing Everest. Or more specifically the stuff in air like water vapour and particulates.

I suppose that this "viewing distance" through air refutes my argument that we should all see Mt. Everest when we look around outside if FET is accurate.

Even on a very clear day visibility does not exceed 40km. Air is not perfectly clear. Air stops you seeing Everest. Or more specifically the stuff in air like water vapour and particulates.

While I totally agree that suspended particulate does limit visibility, it is possible to see much further on very clear days. My friends and I can routinely see 150 km quite easily from an altitude of only 11000 feet, yet I can't see the small mountain range that is only 90 km away while I'm at 500 feet. On a flat earth, I should be able to see those mountains. Any thoughts on why I can't?

You do not see Mt Everest because the known earth is in a form of a disc. Just like the round earth it curves just not spherically. Also a human eye can only see so far.

I suppose that this "viewing distance" through air refutes my argument that we should all see Mt. Everest when we look around outside if FET is accurate.

I'm guessing that you don't live anywhere near Tibet, so I'm not really sure why you you would expect to a mountain several thousand miles away, even if the earth were flat and you the atmosphere were perfectly transparent.  Perspective would make even the mightiest mountain appear small enough to just blend into the horizon.

So if I'm, say, 10,000km west of Mt. Everest at the equinox, how can I see the sun rise over the horizon; shouldn't Everest block it?

No silly, the sun never sets remember?  It recedes and some garbage laws of perspective and/or a nascent and unwieldy hypothesis bends the light to make it look like it is setting or rising

No silly, the sun never sets remember?  It recedes and some garbage laws of perspective and/or a nascent and unwieldy hypothesis bends the light to make it look like it is setting or rising

Oh yeah my bad. 

So if I'm, say, 10,000km west of Mt. Everest at the equinox, how can I see the sun rise over the horizon; shouldn't Everest block it?

Why?  The sun rises over the equator on the days of the equinox.  Is Mt. Everest located on the equator?

Quote from: jason_85 on April 11, 2013, 05:51:23 PM

So if I'm, say, 10,000km west of Mt. Everest at the equinox, how can I see the sun rise over the horizon; shouldn't Everest block it?

Why?  The sun rises over the equator on the days of the equinox.  Is Mt. Everest located on the equator?

Oh right, I muddled up solstice and equinox. My point was just that if you're at a location where Everest is in the way of the sunrise, shouldn't you see a projection of the mountain, or at least observe a decreased luminosity of the sun as part of it is blocked by the mountain?

My point was just that if you're at a location where Everest is in the way of the sunrise, shouldn't you see a projection of the mountain, or at least observe a decreased luminosity of the sun as part of it is blocked by the mountain?

Why would Mt. Everest block the sun if it's 10,000 km away?  Is it 5000 km high?

Why would Mt. Everest block the sun if it's 10,000 km away?  Is it 5000 km high?

  Pretty sure it's about 9km high dude...

Quote from: markjo on April 11, 2013, 07:25:56 PM

Why would Mt. Everest block the sun if it's 10,000 km away?  Is it 5000 km high?

  Pretty sure it's about 9km high dude...

Then why would it block the sun if you're 10,000 km away?

Ok let me clarify so we can avoid the rhetorical questions rigmarole.

If the earth is a 30km sphere as per the FE model (as I understand it), and its light path passes through the projected area of a 9km mountain, then regardless of the distance of the mountain, it is going to have a palpable effect on the quantity of light reaching the observer, ranging from 0% if you are standing in front of the mountain, to something in the order of 70% at the limit where both the mountain and sun are at an infinite distance - I get that number from approximating the relative projection area of the mountain to a 30km sphere projection.

Assuming you don't believe the sun is a 30km sphere, and is rather a massive light source (commonly known to be composed of a quark gluon plasma) at an optically infinite distance, then you would expect the light reaching the observer to range from 0% directly in front of the observer, asymptoting to 100% at the limit where the moon and comparatively infinitely large sun are at an infinite distance from the observer.

I am of course making the assumption here that the FE model uses the 30km sun sphere.

You do realize that Mt. Everest is part of a mountain range, don't you?  People who keep bringing up Mt. Everest seem to think that since it's the tallest mountain, it should stick out like a sore thumb.  Well, it doesn't, even if you live in Tibet.  It's pretty much just one mountain among many in mountainous region. 

FET has a lot of problems.  Not being able to see Mt. Everest is not one of them.

FET has a lot of problems.  Not being able to see Mt. Everest is not one of them.

This. Unless it's the sun or moon, nothing on earth is visible in the atmosphere past around 200 miles, and even that is stretching it. So no OP, you can't see Mount Everest from thousands of miles away on a flat earth, for the same reason you can't see anything that far away on a round earth.

Even on a very clear day visibility does not exceed 40km.

How did you come up with that number?  I've seen tall buildings in Seattle 100km away with only binoculars (I was 2400 feet high, the city is at sea-level, and only the upper portion of the taller building were visible above the horizon)

I can also easily see mountains 80-120km away.

Quote from: acesuv on April 11, 2013, 04:14:49 PM

I suppose that this "viewing distance" through air refutes my argument that we should all see Mt. Everest when we look around outside if FET is accurate.

I'm guessing that you don't live anywhere near Tibet, so I'm not really sure why you you would expect to a mountain several thousand miles away, even if the earth were flat and you the atmosphere were perfectly transparent.  Perspective would make even the mightiest mountain appear small enough to just blend into the horizon.

I hadn't thought about that. In my defense, I was thinking about using a telescope to see the mountain.

You do realize that Mt. Everest is part of a mountain range, don't you?  People who keep bringing up Mt. Everest seem to think that since it's the tallest mountain, it should stick out like a sore thumb.  Well, it doesn't, even if you live in Tibet.  It's pretty much just one mountain among many in mountainous region. 

FET has a lot of problems.  Not being able to see Mt. Everest is not one of them.

You're evading the question.

Quote from: Thork on April 11, 2013, 02:38:10 PM

Even on a very clear day visibility does not exceed 40km. Air is not perfectly clear. Air stops you seeing Everest. Or more specifically the stuff in air like water vapour and particulates.

While I totally agree that suspended particulate does limit visibility, it is possible to see much further on very clear days. My friends and I can routinely see 150 km quite easily from an altitude of only 11000 feet, yet I can't see the small mountain range that is only 90 km away while I'm at 500 feet. On a flat earth, I should be able to see those mountains. Any thoughts on why I can't?

Hook, line, and sinker.

Hm, did anybody see where Thork went?

Quote from: Thork on April 11, 2013, 02:38:10 PM

Even on a very clear day visibility does not exceed 40km. Air is not perfectly clear. Air stops you seeing Everest. Or more specifically the stuff in air like water vapour and particulates.

While I totally agree that suspended particulate does limit visibility, it is possible to see much further on very clear days. My friends and I can routinely see 150 km quite easily from an altitude of only 11000 feet, yet I can't see the small mountain range that is only 90 km away while I'm at 500 feet. On a flat earth, I should be able to see those mountains. Any thoughts on why I can't?

The air is most dense at or near the surface. The higher you get the thinner the air and the further you can see. Also the air near the surface has a much higher amount of dirt and dust in it. That's where most of the grime in it is. Air higher up is much cleaner and doesn't hold as much muck hence the reason you can see further as you gain altitude.



In a dirty city, the effect is quite marked.


Its very typical for round earthers to leap to the conclusion that something they observed must be because the earth is round. Stop blaming everything on earth being round and you'll understand a lot more about the world around you.

You do not see Mt Everest because the known earth is in a form of a disc. Just like the round earth it curves just not spherically. Also a human eye can only see so far.

What is the max distance the eye can see?  Wouldn't it keep us from seeing the sun?

Quote from: markjo on April 11, 2013, 08:15:59 PM

You do realize that Mt. Everest is part of a mountain range, don't you?  People who keep bringing up Mt. Everest seem to think that since it's the tallest mountain, it should stick out like a sore thumb.  Well, it doesn't, even if you live in Tibet.  It's pretty much just one mountain among many in mountainous region. 

FET has a lot of problems.  Not being able to see Mt. Everest is not one of them.

You're evading the question.

That's because it's a stupid question.

Quote from: sandmanMike on April 12, 2013, 06:09:20 AM

Quote from: New Earth on April 11, 2013, 04:33:55 PM

You do not see Mt Everest because the known earth is in a form of a disc. Just like the round earth it curves just not spherically. Also a human eye can only see so far.

What is the max distance the eye can see?  Wouldn't it keep us from seeing the sun?

The sun is up in the sky, it's high and you can see through the air as it gets thinner and thinner.

How do you know the air gets thinner?