perpetual motion machine?

#" class="bbc_link" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">Evolution of Perpetual Motion, WORKING Free Energy Generator.mp4

i have only seen one that nearly works but in reality it was just very efficient. this looks more like the real deal.

Who is funding those clowns?

The machine starts with potential energy until the guy pulls the pin. That gets the thing going. And it keeps going efficiently because what he has actually designed is a flywheel. But its not perpetual motion. That thing will slow because it costs energy to lift the magnet out of the way or energy to move a magnet in and out of a field if you don't.

So a one word debunking of this would be 'flywheel'.

Now seriously, whose paying for this bad science?

People with more money than sense, obviously.

thork in your opinion would you say the spin is a result of the person dropping the bar of magnets at the top. after that release of energy its then just very efficient at turning?
irush im away of your link, i saw this on youtube last night and its the closest attempt i have seen. i love the theoretical machines on there.

lets say making a perpetual motion machine was possible. thork manages to crack it and builds one. using the same logic that you used for pulling the pin. wouldnt it be impossible to build the machine, because building is putting energy into the parts. we have a perpetual paradox right there.

lets say making a perpetual motion machine was possible.

It would literally break physics. We would have to start building our knowledge from scratch.

thork manages to crack it and builds one. using the same logic that you used for pulling the pin. wouldnt it be impossible to build the machine, because building is putting energy into the parts. we have a perpetual paradox right there.

That doesn't make sense. Building an engine does not equal to putting energy into it. The V6 gasoline engine in my truck doesn't get more efficient based on how much work was done on it while being built.

fuck off you twat. its not an arguement.

Actually, perpetual motion is impossible. It does break the thermodynamics and I believe it also breaks conservation of momentum. That machine will only be useful if it can have an energy output. It can't. All of it's output is going back into running itself, and eventually, it will stop. There are energy losses in the form of heat from friction, and those will wear on the material used to build it. it will stop.

Actually, perpetual motion is impossible. It does break the thermodynamics and I believe it also breaks conservation of momentum. That machine will only be useful if it can have an energy output. It can't. All of it's output is going back into running itself, and eventually, it will stop. There are energy losses in the form of heat from friction, and those will wear on the material used to build it. it will stop.

i was talking to my friend about that. do you think the parts would just wear out for it to stop? im aware that its impossible but this is a very cool machine that come quite close. i bet if you used magnetic bearings and make the system levitate you could have it running for years!

you mention energy output. does it need to give off energy for such a machine to qualify?

thork in your opinion would you say the spin is a result of the person dropping the bar of magnets at the top. after that release of energy its then just very efficient at turning?

I gave a link but I shall have to quote from it.

Flywheels are often used to provide continuous energy in systems where the energy source is not continuous. In such cases, the flywheel stores energy when torque is applied by the energy source, and it releases stored energy when the energy source is not applying torque to it.

The removal of the pin allows gravity/UA to start the machine and put energy into it. And the flywheel is able to store that energy ready for use efficiently. IE its spinning ready for you to tap it. There are few losses.

The problem comes when you want to use that energy. The machine isn't going to make more. Its not getting any faster. Its not going to give an ounce of strength more than the potential energy it started with (minus losses).

So this man hasn't made a perpetual motion machine or anything like it. He's made a fancy flywheel that trades potential energy with electromagnetic energy ... which actually has a cost. He'd have been better off with a regular mechanical flywheel.

The removal of the pin allows gravity/UA to start the machine and put energy into it. And the flywheel is able to store that energy ready for use efficiently. IE its spinning ready for you to tap it. There are few losses.

The only problem I see with your argument is that if you watch closely, you will notice that it takes 2-3 rotations to get up to speed.  I would think that if it was indeed all flywheel effect, then it would have gotten up to full speed within the first rotation.

Quote from: ThinkingMan on October 17, 2012, 09:22:53 AM

Actually, perpetual motion is impossible. It does break the thermodynamics and I believe it also breaks conservation of momentum. That machine will only be useful if it can have an energy output. It can't. All of it's output is going back into running itself, and eventually, it will stop. There are energy losses in the form of heat from friction, and those will wear on the material used to build it. it will stop.

i was talking to my friend about that. do you think the parts would just wear out for it to stop? im aware that its impossible but this is a very cool machine that come quite close. i bet if you used magnetic bearings and make the system levitate you could have it running for years!

you mention energy output. does it need to give off energy for such a machine to qualify?

Perpetual motion means that the machine runs itself off of the energy it produces. To do this it would have to produce more energy than it took to start the thing going. This would require it to create energy from nothing, which cannot be done. Breaks thermodynamics, breaks conservation of momentum.

I built a machine similar to that, but I hooked it up to a small 9V motor and was able to light a lightbulb. When I moved the stator magnet to initiate the rotation, it worked just fine. But if I hooked it up to the machine (whether by the way he did it or a pulley sort of system) the machine ran to a stop, I had to push it to get it moving again. That says that it, like any other power generation system, produces less energy than it takes to start it.

Quote from: Thork on October 17, 2012, 09:33:34 AM

The removal of the pin allows gravity/UA to start the machine and put energy into it. And the flywheel is able to store that energy ready for use efficiently. IE its spinning ready for you to tap it. There are few losses.

The only problem I see with your argument is that if you watch closely, you will notice that it takes 2-3 rotations to get up to speed.  I would think that if it was indeed all flywheel effect, then it would have gotten up to full speed within the first rotation.

I don't think all the power is from the pendulum. I think there is also electro-magantic power stored in the position of the wheel to the above magnet (ie its already trying to push away from the magnet bar at the top + possibly power stored from the spring/magnet thingy underneath. The upshot is not all the power is delivered at once in half a turn. The potential power is added to the wheel first - that takes half a rotation, then you have almost a full rotation to add the electromagnetic power, + you have a delayed magnetic/spring power which starts half way round after the potential energy is used to help the machine back on its way up.

Long story short, it takes a revolution or so to get all of the stored energy into the wheel and find its equilibrium, at which point it ceases to accelerate.

Who is funding those clowns?

Now seriously, whose paying for this bad science?

It's not expensive to buy magnets and wood and all the shit they used. I don't think there funded.


(thork nose nothing of economics.)

i did read the link dude as i was interested in how this is a fly wheel.
i know this is not a perpetual motion machine for now this remains and probable will forever be impossible. i just liked it and as we all have a common interest in wacko science i thought id share.
magnets are fun though have a look for the largest rare earth magnet. they are about £200 and are real bone breakers! if a large version of this was made with 1kg magnets.....

I would say this very close to a perpetual motion machine, it is very cool. It certainly puts out more energy than is needed to start the motion. It is harvesting the energy of the magnetic fields, it overcomes the friction of the system and keeps moving. It seems somhow you must account for the energy required to charge the magnets, but it is very cool. Good work squevil.


BTW I have bought some of those rare earth magnets and they are very strong and can hurt you(pinches).

No Hoppy, it is transferring stored energy to a flywheel where the energy waits to be used.

A perpetual motion machine doesn't need a kickstart.

I think perpetual motion would be classified as a machine that out puts more energy than is needed to start it. It looks like that machine would qualify to me.

You can not get an output higher than your input. Is that really difficult to understand?

It looks like that thing could run for a year, do you think it will stop in a couple of hours or something?

It looks like that thing could run for a year, do you think it will stop in a couple of hours or something?

As only a short video is available, I really couldn't say exactly when it will stop. The point is that it will stop. Thermodynamics doesn't say something can't be a very efficient energy storage device, it simply says it can't store the energy indefinitely (i.e. a perpetual motion machine).

How long would it have to run before you would think of it as some sort of perpetual machine? 2 hours, a day, a week or what?

How long would it have to run before you would think of it as some sort of perpetual machine? 2 hours, a day, a week or what?

There is only one kind of perpetual motion machine: the kind that is in motion perpetually. A machine that runs on its own energy for a few days is just a long-time motion machine.

OK, we are saying perpetuL motion. What I really mean is a machine that outputs more energy than is required to start it. Sorry.

The key to a perpetual motion machine is that when you slow it down, it speeds back up again. When you take energy from the system, it generates more.

You make something out of nothing, magic, God.

You may as well be dividing by zero.

OK, we are saying perpetuL motion. What I really mean is a machine that outputs more energy than is required to start it. Sorry.

You can't make more energy than there is in a system. It doesn't happen. One could have the machine somehow convert it's matter into energy, giving it a higher energy output. But this wont be perpetual, the matter will "disappear" eventually. It's not possible. People can fantasize all they want. I thought "perpetual motion machines" sounded cool too. Then I took physics 101 in college. Now whenever someone brings the topic up it makes me want to punch them in the mouth for being so ignorant to basic physics.

Quote from: hoppy on October 18, 2012, 01:02:13 PM

OK, we are saying perpetuL motion. What I really mean is a machine that outputs more energy than is required to start it. Sorry.

You can't make more energy than there is in a system. It doesn't happen. One could have the machine somehow convert it's matter into energy, giving it a higher energy output. But this wont be perpetual, the matter will "disappear" eventually. It's not possible. People can fantasize all they want. I thought "perpetual motion machines" sounded cool too. Then I took physics 101 in college. Now whenever someone brings the topic up it makes me want to punch them in the mouth for being so ignorant to basic physics.

I, too, hate disgusting plebians. They're probably too busy eating dirt or whatever to go to college.

The key to a perpetual motion machine is that when you slow it down, it speeds back up again. When you take energy from the system, it generates more.

You make something out of nothing, magic, God.

You may as well be dividing by zero.

I guess it depends on how long it will run. It looks to be overcoming the resistance of air and the bearings.  If it runs 24 hrs would you concede?

Quote from: Thork on October 18, 2012, 01:07:54 PM

The key to a perpetual motion machine is that when you slow it down, it speeds back up again. When you take energy from the system, it generates more.

You make something out of nothing, magic, God.

You may as well be dividing by zero.

I guess it depends on how long it will run. It looks to be overcoming the resistance of air and the bearings.  If it runs 24 hrs would you concede?

Perpetual motion machines run FOREVER. So no, no one would concede.

Is there a perpetual Motion machine in sheep in the big city or am I making shit up?