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"Noob"

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RoundItis

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"Noob"
« on: October 14, 2012, 05:11:38 PM »
Alright please tell me how in the world did you people start reasoning like this. Oh, and please answer this. Has any one of you been to space? I really doubt that and even if you have any evidence of where you prove the earth is flat it is all BS. You can't take all of the facts in the world and turn them into a complete nothing. No matter what your evidence and no matter how badly you don't believe in the real world facts the only way to prove yourself right is to go to space. So you can believe anything you want and be stubborn about reality. SO please, especially the admin go get a reality check. Not to be mean, but when I heard about this society I thought it was a joke. I'm not trying to be mean to you people. Really though, what proof do you have that there's a gigantic "ice wall" on the sides of the earth. All of you people are in your own world.
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randomism

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2012, 05:13:58 PM »
I swear people here live for posts like this :|
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iwanttobelieve

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2012, 06:00:26 PM »
Hello Roundy,
the FAQ has many metaphors, 
the "ice wall" is just another word for Antarctica, (unless you follow Willmores model)
and flat, is just another word for disc, or planar.   

welcome, i hope you stay.
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qwerty565

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2012, 07:05:46 PM »
Although it's very...crudely...said here, and there are mountains beyond mountains of evidence equally as legitimate as going into space, I think Mr. RoundItis was trying to say exactly what a lot of us are thinking. He was just a little rough around the edges.

This society is not grounded in science. To claim to be a Flat Earth Believer AND someone who practices scientific thinking (whether it be out of personal interest in the sciences or for a career) as many people on this site do, is absurd. As a student currently studying to acquire his doctorate in Astrophysics, this website, at some points, literally made me laugh out loud, and at others, hang my head in embarrassment.

If you are a part of this society because you genuinely believe this, I take pity on you.

If you're part of this forum as a troll, then mission successful. You got me.
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ManFromMars

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2012, 07:48:18 PM »
I want to know who here really believes the earth is flat and who are trolls. Everyone here sounds so foolish that I believe they may all be trolls.
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randomism

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2012, 08:15:34 PM »
Quote from: ManFromMars on October 14, 2012, 07:48:18 PM
I want to know who here really believes the earth is flat and who are trolls. Everyone here sounds so foolish that I believe they may all be trolls.

If you really want to know look at their post history. The ones who started out posting for RET then spent a while on the lower forums and suddenly showed up in the upper forums supporting FET are probably insincere.
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ManFromMars

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2012, 08:23:17 PM »
They sound too much like intellectually masturbating science geeks for them to believe what they claim to.
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timdefrag

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2012, 11:46:09 PM »
Yeah, I saw at least one guy who was clearly versed in the math of relativity theory defending the FET. I'm not really sure how you can even reconcile those two ideas. I think there are a few true believers, and a lot of god-tier trolls; and that the true believers read the troll arguments and treat them as real arguments because they're on the same side.
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Mr Pseudonym

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #8 on: October 15, 2012, 12:08:13 AM »
Most of the FETers here are genuine; the few trolls that were here have been purged and don't post anymore.
And please lay off the insults if you want to really find out more about this society.

@qwerty - I don't think any FEers follow the scientific method as most are utterly disgusted by it and would much rather follow the zetetic method of inquiry. When one learns more about zeteticism they realise that the scientific method is heavily flawed and tend to favour it less.
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Quote from: hallsofvallhalla on July 07, 2010, 01:06:43 PM
Why do we fall back to earth? Because our weight pushes us down, no laws, no gravity pulling us. It is the law of intelligence.
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Solmyre

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #9 on: October 15, 2012, 12:55:10 AM »
Quote from: Mr Pseudonym on October 15, 2012, 12:08:13 AM
@qwerty - I don't think any FEers follow the scientific method as most are utterly disgusted by it and would much rather follow the zetetic method of inquiry. When one learns more about zeteticism they realise that the scientific method is heavily flawed and tend to favour it less.

If this was true then it archetypically would follow that zeteticism would gain momentum per capita.  As it stands, scientific method and engineering derived from such has continued to gain acceptance globally (pardon the term).


Regardless, this is a bold statement Pseudonym.  Which aspects of the scientific method do you feel are heavily flawed? 

How do you feel the zetetic method overcomes these?  Do you believe the zetetic method you use is generally accepted by everyone who practices the zetetic method?

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ManFromMars

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #10 on: October 15, 2012, 01:20:50 AM »
The Zetetic Method sounds like no method at all. The only flat earthers I've read who seem like genuinely possible crazies are Tom Bishop, Dino, and New Earth. Even them I'm not sure about, but they seem like they may be crazy. Everyone else sounds like they are sane and faking it.
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Mr Pseudonym

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2012, 02:12:38 AM »
Quote from: Solmyre on October 15, 2012, 12:55:10 AM
Quote from: Mr Pseudonym on October 15, 2012, 12:08:13 AM
@qwerty - I don't think any FEers follow the scientific method as most are utterly disgusted by it and would much rather follow the zetetic method of inquiry. When one learns more about zeteticism they realise that the scientific method is heavily flawed and tend to favour it less.

If this was true then it archetypically would follow that zeteticism would gain momentum per capita.  As it stands, scientific method and engineering derived from such has continued to gain acceptance globally (pardon the term).


Regardless, this is a bold statement Pseudonym.  Which aspects of the scientific method do you feel are heavily flawed? 

How do you feel the zetetic method overcomes these?  Do you believe the zetetic method you use is generally accepted by everyone who practices the zetetic method?
That first part sounds like argumentum ad populum.
The next barrage of questions are nothing new and have been asked and answered many times before. I think this first post by James here sums it up well

http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php/topic,12438.msg176097.html#msg176097
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Quote from: hallsofvallhalla on July 07, 2010, 01:06:43 PM
Why do we fall back to earth? Because our weight pushes us down, no laws, no gravity pulling us. It is the law of intelligence.
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Beorn

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #12 on: October 15, 2012, 02:56:49 AM »
Quote from: timdefrag on October 14, 2012, 11:46:09 PM
Yeah, I saw at least one guy who was clearly versed in the math of relativity theory defending the FET.

Why would there be no relativity on a flat earth?
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Solmyre

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #13 on: October 15, 2012, 03:01:15 AM »
Quote from: Mr Pseudonym on October 15, 2012, 02:12:38 AM
Quote from: Solmyre on October 15, 2012, 12:55:10 AM
Quote from: Mr Pseudonym on October 15, 2012, 12:08:13 AM
@qwerty - I don't think any FEers follow the scientific method as most are utterly disgusted by it and would much rather follow the zetetic method of inquiry. When one learns more about zeteticism they realise that the scientific method is heavily flawed and tend to favour it less.

If this was true then it archetypically would follow that zeteticism would gain momentum per capita.  As it stands, scientific method and engineering derived from such has continued to gain acceptance globally (pardon the term).


Regardless, this is a bold statement Pseudonym.  Which aspects of the scientific method do you feel are heavily flawed? 

How do you feel the zetetic method overcomes these?  Do you believe the zetetic method you use is generally accepted by everyone who practices the zetetic method?
That first part sounds like argumentum ad populum.
The next barrage of questions are nothing new and have been asked and answered many times before. I think this first post by James here sums it up well

http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php/topic,12438.msg176097.html#msg176097

I can see where you would argue that except that the grounds of your assertion are that people ditch SM in favor of ZM once they learn about it.  If this was true then people who hear about ZM would inevitably use it, in doing so others would be exposed to ZM and learn of it, once learning of it they would ditch SM in favor of ZM.

So it is not a "because this is popular it must be true" approach.  It is a "because this is not spread, it must be rejected more often than it is accepted when someone is exposed to it". 

Additionally James gets the cornerstone of SM wrong in his second paragraph.  Any scientist that first claim's this is how it works and I'm going to prove it!  Is generally considered a bad scientist and dismissed by most of the community.  SM first step is to consider possibilities for how something occurs etc. and then try to develope solid ways of testing and isolating variables so that things can get narrowed down further.

Much like one of the projects I'm working on to characterize fluid interface behaviors on a laser drilled sparge system.  Unfortunately, at the moment, much of the equations (as I was explaning to Dino a bit ago) are all empircally based directly from experimental data running an array of regressions.  So I can speculate until the sun comes down but until I can match all constants and variables and get repeatable results that agree with one core equation, you can bet your tail I wouldn't dare claim to know the truth about the fine details of the system behavior. 

If your philosophy is that SM suggests believing you know something without testing then yes, I can see your disgust.  It might be worth knowing whomever taught James the SM did an increadibly poor job. 
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qwerty565

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #14 on: October 15, 2012, 08:40:56 AM »
In response to Mr Pseudonym, I never mentioned the scientific method. I mentioned those who practice "scientific thinking", meaning that they look at the shape of the Earth from a purely scientific point of view, disregarding things based on anything other than pure, hard evidence gathered through correct experiment and observation. Reading into zeteticism, it appears that practice plays a big role as well.

The simple fact of the matter is: Those who genuinely believe that the Earth is flat and not elliptical are blatantly ignoring or ferociously twisting the evidence that points to the latter in order to make their point. I have yet to see someone in this society that both genuinely understands the Earth's workings AND genuinely believes that the Earth is flat. This is simply because the two don't exist together. And the fact that "Most of the FETers here are genuine" is FRIGHTENING.

That being said, Solmyre, what a breath of fresh air. Thank you for posting and best of luck on your project. It really sounds fascinating  :D
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Beorn

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #15 on: October 15, 2012, 08:45:00 AM »
Quote from: qwerty565 on October 15, 2012, 08:40:56 AM
Those who genuinely believe that the Earth is flat and not elliptical are blatantly ignoring or ferociously twisting the evidence that points to the latter in order to make their point.

What evidence?  ???
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qwerty565

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #16 on: October 15, 2012, 08:56:13 AM »
I'll keep it nice and simple for you.

http://www.physlink.com/education/askexperts/ae535.cfm

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Beorn

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #17 on: October 15, 2012, 08:57:37 AM »
Quote from: qwerty565 on October 15, 2012, 08:56:13 AM
I'll keep it nice and simple for you.

http://www.physlink.com/education/askexperts/ae535.cfm

You didn't keep anything. Try making your own arguments. Also every single argument in that post has been debunked on this site.
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Only one thing can save our future. Give Thork a BanHammer for Th*rksakes!
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qwerty565

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #18 on: October 15, 2012, 09:25:52 AM »
No, they have not.

I've read through the FAQ's. I've gone through the document library. Hell, I've even been on the wiki. In all of those bogus writings, there is not a single place where any sort of scientifically sound argument resides for the Earth being flat.

But, ya know, as I'm typing this, I realize that this is a joke. This entire society is, simply put, a joke. And the fact that people genuinely believe this big, steaming pile of bullshit is the punch line.

So, thank you FES, for providing me with a new , steady flow of hilarious entertainment.

I leave you with a summary of my thoughts.

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Beorn

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #19 on: October 15, 2012, 09:33:23 AM »
Quote from: qwerty565 on October 15, 2012, 09:25:52 AM
No, they have not.

I've read through the FAQ's. I've gone through the document library. Hell, I've even been on the wiki. In all of those bogus writings, there is not a single place where any sort of scientifically sound argument resides for the Earth being flat.

But, ya know, as I'm typing this, I realize that this is a joke. This entire society is, simply put, a joke. And the fact that people genuinely believe this big, steaming pile of bullshit is the punch line.

So, thank you FES, for providing me with a new , steady flow of hilarious entertainment.

I leave you with a summary of my thoughts.



You've read all the FAQs and you say it's so easy to show that the earth is round and still you didn't manage to come with your own arguments. I guess that picture applies to yourself.
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ManFromMars

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #20 on: October 15, 2012, 10:20:35 AM »
There is no evidence that flat earth believers believe their own bullshit. All I've read here is silly shit about dinosaurs building boats and having civil wars and that the moon is a cannonball and there are shrimp on it.

Silly, silly, silly, stuff.
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Beorn

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #21 on: October 15, 2012, 10:59:50 AM »
Quote from: ManFromMars on October 15, 2012, 10:20:35 AM
There is no evidence that flat earth believers believe their own bullshit. All I've read here is silly shit about dinosaurs building boats and having civil wars and that the moon is a cannonball and there are shrimp on it.

Silly, silly, silly, stuff.

Luckily no one is because they want to convince you that they believe in a flat earth.
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mexicanwave

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #22 on: October 23, 2012, 07:48:08 AM »
Quote from: qwerty565 on October 14, 2012, 07:05:46 PM

If you are a part of this society because you genuinely believe this, I take pity on you.

If you're part of this forum as a troll, then mission successful. You got me.

This is exactly how I feel.
When I found this site I was sure it was just some elaborate and hilarious meme.
Whilst I believe that there are quite a few trolls on here, there are obviously some who genuinely do believe this FE nonsense.

I have posted some questions and some rants and got back only more gibberish.

I don't intend to be mean to you guys, it's just that the sheer level of ignorance that it requires to defend FE makes it difficult to be kind.

I would hope that those of you who do really believe this can some day open your eyes and use your intellect and time to benefit the world, no matter in how small a way, rather than to hold it back in this futile and, frankly, stupid belief.

Peace
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Beorn

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #23 on: October 23, 2012, 07:49:35 AM »
Quote from: mexicanwave on October 23, 2012, 07:48:08 AM
Quote from: qwerty565 on October 14, 2012, 07:05:46 PM

If you are a part of this society because you genuinely believe this, I take pity on you.

If you're part of this forum as a troll, then mission successful. You got me.

This is exactly how I feel.
When I found this site I was sure it was just some elaborate and hilarious meme.
Whilst I believe that there are quite a few trolls on here, there are obviously some who genuinely do believe this FE nonsense.

I have posted some questions and some rants and got back only more gibberish.

I don't intend to be mean to you guys, it's just that the sheer level of ignorance that it requires to defend FE makes it difficult to be kind.

I would hope that those of you who do really believe this can some day open your eyes and use your intellect and time to benefit the world, no matter in how small a way, rather than to hold it back in this futile and, frankly, stupid belief.

Peace

How exactly are you benefiting the world? At least we show people the true shape of the earth.
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ThinkingMan

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #24 on: October 23, 2012, 01:35:56 PM »
Quote from: Beorn on October 23, 2012, 07:49:35 AM
Quote from: mexicanwave on October 23, 2012, 07:48:08 AM
Quote from: qwerty565 on October 14, 2012, 07:05:46 PM

If you are a part of this society because you genuinely believe this, I take pity on you.

If you're part of this forum as a troll, then mission successful. You got me.

This is exactly how I feel.
When I found this site I was sure it was just some elaborate and hilarious meme.
Whilst I believe that there are quite a few trolls on here, there are obviously some who genuinely do believe this FE nonsense.

I have posted some questions and some rants and got back only more gibberish.

I don't intend to be mean to you guys, it's just that the sheer level of ignorance that it requires to defend FE makes it difficult to be kind.

I would hope that those of you who do really believe this can some day open your eyes and use your intellect and time to benefit the world, no matter in how small a way, rather than to hold it back in this futile and, frankly, stupid belief.

Peace

How exactly are you benefiting the world? At least we show people the true shape of the earth.

Actually, you haven't "shown" anyone anything. I mean, if you break it down, there's really nothing backing up any of the assertions and claims anyone on this website has made. Just ad hoc speculation and interesting thought experiments is all I've seen. No math or anything to back it up. Just because the scientific method is "bad" for what ever reason, doesn't mean you can't back it up with some hard, undeniable evidence. If the equations are sound and can be verified by real-world testing, then that's evidence.

Again. No one's been shown anything.
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Quote from: BoatswainsMate on August 24, 2012, 12:18:02 PM
When Tom farts, the special gasses released open a sort of worm hole into the past. There Tom is able to freely discuss with Rowbotham all of his ideas and thoughts.
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Ichimaru Gin :]

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #25 on: October 23, 2012, 04:23:53 PM »
The scientific isn't automatically bad. It is simply insufficient for the most foundational and basic questions we have about existence, ourselves, and the world.
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Quote from: James on August 26, 2011, 05:40:53 AM
I saw a slight haze in the hotel bathroom this morning after I took a shower, have I discovered a new planet?
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squevil

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #26 on: October 23, 2012, 04:41:58 PM »
Quote from: Mr Pseudonym on October 15, 2012, 12:08:13 AM
Most of the FETers here are genuine; the few trolls that were here have been purged and don't post anymore.
And please lay off the insults if you want to really find out more about this society.

@qwerty - I don't think any FEers follow the scientific method as most are utterly disgusted by it and would much rather follow the zetetic method of inquiry. When one learns more about zeteticism they realise that the scientific method is heavily flawed and tend to favour it less.

what a load of crap!

irush
ibeleive
thork

then you got others who are not so easily to believe. i wouldnt just call people out usually but saying they all left is misleading.
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squevil

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #27 on: October 23, 2012, 04:47:22 PM »
Quote from: Beorn on October 15, 2012, 08:57:37 AM
Quote from: qwerty565 on October 15, 2012, 08:56:13 AM
I'll keep it nice and simple for you.

http://www.physlink.com/education/askexperts/ae535.cfm

You didn't keep anything. Try making your own arguments. Also every single argument in that post has been debunked on this site.

over the last few weeks all i have seen is many new people destroying fet very easily. you say debunked but really thats a matter of opinion.
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iwanttobelieve

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #28 on: October 23, 2012, 05:14:13 PM »
Quote from: squevil on October 23, 2012, 04:47:22 PM
Quote from: Beorn on October 15, 2012, 08:57:37 AM
Quote from: qwerty565 on October 15, 2012, 08:56:13 AM
I'll keep it nice and simple for you.

http://www.physlink.com/education/askexperts/ae535.cfm

You didn't keep anything. Try making your own arguments. Also every single argument in that post has been debunked on this site.



Destroying FES? no
But they may have good reasons to doubt the FAQ, to which even hard core FES believe its flawed, and sadly can never be changed.

over the last few weeks all i have seen is many new people destroying fet very easily. you say debunked but really thats a matter of opinion.
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squevil

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Re: "Noob"
« Reply #29 on: October 23, 2012, 05:16:37 PM »
its a figure of speech...

the FAQ represents FET if you like it or not, thats why it is there.
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