What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?

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Cat Earth Theory

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #30 on: June 12, 2012, 05:23:14 PM »
So you have no actual evidence that this footage is faked, other than your supposed belief in a flat earth.

How disappointing.
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BoatswainsMate

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #31 on: June 12, 2012, 05:32:27 PM »
I am watching the feed right now, does not look fake to me. Seems legit and fun to watch.

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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #32 on: June 12, 2012, 05:54:16 PM »
So you have no actual evidence that this footage is faked, other than your supposed belief in a flat earth.

How disappointing.

Where is your evidence? 

Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #33 on: June 12, 2012, 07:04:22 PM »
I want to push you a bit on this; why would it only make you consider the possibility and not convince you fairly solidly? Like I said, I don't believe in FET but if I went up in a rocket and went up and up and up and all I saw was land expanding out in all directions my belief in the spherical-ish Earth with 13,000 km diameter would be pretty darn shaken.

How could you see land expanding out in all directions infinitely?  Maybe God could, but not a human.  That is just silly.  The human eye has limitations.

Once I was certain I saw it expanding outward for more than a magnitude greater distance than it should (i.e. I could discern that it was at LEAST 130,000 km in diameter when I strongly believe it to be 13,000 km) I would be fairly certain (well, pretty much downright certain) that my previous notion was wrong. I would not yet be even vaguely sure that it expanded out infinitely far though.

Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #34 on: June 12, 2012, 07:05:48 PM »
Also let's try and stay civil guys, I'd really like this to not degenerate into an argument. I want to have a discussion.

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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #35 on: June 12, 2012, 07:20:42 PM »
Once I was certain I saw it expanding outward for more than a magnitude greater distance than it should (i.e. I could discern that it was at LEAST 130,000 km in diameter when I strongly believe it to be 13,000 km) I would be fairly certain (well, pretty much downright certain) that my previous notion was wrong. I would not yet be even vaguely sure that it expanded out infinitely far though.

I am not sure exactly how far one could see through the atmosplane, but I doubt it is anywhere close to 130,000 km.  Moisture, dust, pressure differences, pollution, etc. would keep light from traveling that distance.

Also, there is no evidence that the sun's light would make it that far, much less bounce back to your eye.  After all, the known world is not all lit up at once.

Finally, if by some magical chance, you could see 130,000 km through the atmosplane, how would you know how far you are seeing?

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Cat Earth Theory

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #36 on: June 12, 2012, 07:59:40 PM »
Where is your evidence?

You can see the ISS with a telescope.  You can even see it without a telescope sometimes!  Check out Lola's thread if you have any genuine interest in how to do this.
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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #37 on: June 12, 2012, 08:24:20 PM »
Where is your evidence?

You can see the ISS with a telescope.  You can even see it without a telescope sometimes!  Check out Lola's thread if you have any genuine interest in how to do this.

Are we in that thread?  No?  Then please, try to keep up with the conversation.

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Cat Earth Theory

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #38 on: June 12, 2012, 08:28:18 PM »
So you have zero evidence that the ISS is fake, and I have direct sensorial evidence that it does exist, yet you don't even consider changing your position.

It's odd how all that stuff about keeping an open mind goes straight out the window.
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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #39 on: June 12, 2012, 08:58:19 PM »
First of all, CET, I don't know why you insist that every thread in this forum is a debate.  People ask questions and want to know answers and it is hard to answer their questions with you constantly butting in and wanting to turn it into a debate.  Are we in the debate forums?  No.  We are in Q&A.

Secondly, where in this thread did I day the ISS did not exist?  You are so overly jealous and eager to debate someone that you make stuff up just to stir up trouble.  I can only imagine how many legitimate posters you have scared off because they are afraid their innocent question is going to turn into a debate.

If you want to debate, then post something in the debate forum and if I feel like it is worth debating, then I will be happy to help you get your rocks off.  Until then, please stop shitting up real threads with your "Defender of the Round Earth" persona. 

And finally, even when someone does engage you in debate, you just repeat your self over and over until they quit posting and you claim an RE win.  Why don't you grow up?  How old are you, anyway?

There are other people who use these forums besides you, CET.  Please respect them and let them ask questions.

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Cat Earth Theory

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #40 on: June 12, 2012, 09:13:45 PM »
So is this you conceding that the ISS does indeed exist?
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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #41 on: June 12, 2012, 09:16:45 PM »
No, this is me telling you to STFU or GTFO.

Please and thank you.   ;D

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Cat Earth Theory

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #42 on: June 12, 2012, 09:18:36 PM »
You're not a moderator, and you're a fairly poor troll.

This appears to be your way of conceding so I'll congratulate you on seeing the light.
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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #43 on: June 12, 2012, 09:22:22 PM »
Who is the Troll?  I am not the one who loggs into The Round Earth Society everyday just to tell them how wrong they are. 

By the way, I did say please and thank you.

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Cat Earth Theory

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #44 on: June 12, 2012, 09:29:17 PM »
Who is the Troll?  I am not the one who loggs into The Round Earth Society everyday just to tell them how wrong they are. 

I suppose this is how a child would view criticism.

I don't say you're wrong to be a meanie-head, I'd just like to see models and arguments that weren't insultingly stupid.
If you focus on the cloud, and conceive of it just as you would a dream you are trying to interpret, with practice its meanings and memories will be revealed to you.

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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #45 on: June 12, 2012, 09:34:57 PM »
I suppose this is how a child would view criticism.

By repeating something over and over until someone gives you attention?  Yes, that is the way a child would act.

I don't say you're wrong to be a meanie-head, I'd just like to see models and arguments that weren't insultingly stupid.

Then post your own question threads.  Don't hijack other's.  But, then again, your questions have been answered over and over, yet you won't take your fingers out of your ears to hear the answers, so you ask again.

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Cat Earth Theory

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #46 on: June 12, 2012, 09:39:01 PM »
I posted here to share a link with mizuki that sounded like what s/he was looking for.  I hardly see how that's thread hijacking.
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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #47 on: June 12, 2012, 09:42:04 PM »
Hey CET, you have your own thread to shit up now.

http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=54874.0

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Cat Earth Theory

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #48 on: June 12, 2012, 09:45:25 PM »
So I notice you still haven't answered whether or not they're reusing footage on the ISS live feed.  Something which would at least be slightly more on-topic than your foaming-at-the-mouth antics.
If you focus on the cloud, and conceive of it just as you would a dream you are trying to interpret, with practice its meanings and memories will be revealed to you.

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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #49 on: June 12, 2012, 09:50:07 PM »
You are very observant, in a child like way.  It reminds me of a child just learning to speak, saying. "That's a tree.  That's bird.  That's a rock.".

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Cat Earth Theory

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #50 on: June 12, 2012, 09:54:53 PM »
I can see you've devolved into a mindless spammer.  How unfortunate.

mizuki, if you're still interested in the ISS live stream it's been showing the earth for hours without that static screen.  You might want to give it another chance.
If you focus on the cloud, and conceive of it just as you would a dream you are trying to interpret, with practice its meanings and memories will be revealed to you.

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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #51 on: June 12, 2012, 10:03:14 PM »
Now you say I am a spammer?  Earlier you accused me of trolling.  Well, which one is it?

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MrT

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #52 on: June 13, 2012, 04:37:31 AM »

I am not sure exactly how far one could see through the atmosplane, but I doubt it is anywhere close to 130,000 km.  Moisture, dust, pressure differences, pollution, etc. would keep light from traveling that distance.

Also, there is no evidence that the sun's light would make it that far, much less bounce back to your eye.  After all, the known world is not all lit up at once.

Finally, if by some magical chance, you could see 130,000 km through the atmosplane, how would you know how far you are seeing?

This seems a bit pedantic.

First, the original question was about whether going into orbit and seeing a round Earth would convince you it was round.  When you insinuated that it wouldn't convince you, but may merely make you consider the possibility that it might not be flat, he then simply said if he went up there and saw it not being round, but simply stretching out in every direction it would certainly all but convince him that what he thought was wrong, and asked what would prevent you from accepting what you were seeing (a question in the question forum) if you saw it as round.  You seem to be trying to debate the validity of his hypothetical situation by assuming he is seeing into infinity, that his numbers are exact, rather than simple examples, etc., etc.

Second, since you brought it up; if he is in orbit in a rocket in the hypothetical situation, why should he be looking through the atmolayer since he is above it?  He would be looking down at the atmolayer.  Even if he was unable to make out ground features, he should be able to see the top of the atmolayer illuminated by the Sun, even if the light isn't reaching the surface of the Earth beyond a certain distance from him.  Also, you say you aren't even certain how far you would be able to see through the atmolayer, and only that you doubt he could see that far.  Instead of answering his question you are saying his hypothetical situation is somehow invalid because of a some characteristic of the atmolayer that you don't even claim to fully understand. 

Considering you accused CET of turning this into a debate thread, rather than a Q&A thread, you seem stubbornly unwilling to answer a single question, despite many that have been put to you.  You either debate the validity of the question (despite it be ing a hypothetical) or simply say something like "you tell me". 

This thread is going nowhere fast.
The above is not meant to be an attack or inflammatory, it's just what I think.

Quote from: Tom Bishop
I don't understand

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Son of Orospu

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #53 on: June 13, 2012, 05:06:20 AM »
I am sorry that I allowed CET to get under my skin.  Let's try to get this thread back on track, if that is OK with you.

The original question was asking what would make me change my mind about my beliefs.  I answered it as best I could.  I seriously do not know what would change my mind, because it has not been changed yet.  I am open to to all evidence; however, I will scrutinize it.  That is just the way I am.

You bring up the rocket ship question again, and I am glad.  I did not really get the chance to explain my position on this question earlier.  I understand exactly what the OP is going for, and I will not disagree with him/her.  If I were in a rocket blasting away from the Earth, and I saw that the place I left was definitely a sphere, then I would drop my beliefs and turn to the dark side.  However, since I doubt that anyone here has ever been in a rocket while observing the Earth, I fail to see how that would be a convincing testimony.

Oh, and since you brought it up, about CET, you tell me.   ;D
« Last Edit: June 13, 2012, 05:29:08 AM by jroa »

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Mizuki

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #54 on: June 14, 2012, 09:15:04 AM »
I can see you've devolved into a mindless spammer.  How unfortunate.

mizuki, if you're still interested in the ISS live stream it's been showing the earth for hours without that static screen.  You might want to give it another chance.

I am interested, CET. I"m going to haue another look later.

Mizuki x
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Pongo

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #55 on: June 18, 2012, 02:27:46 PM »
I'm going to come out and say that I'm not an FET proponent. I'm a physicist and it flies in the face of, well, basically everything I know. I'm not here to make fun, I'm not here to incite anger, I'm here to ask what specific evidence would you, personally, accept that would shun your beliefs in FET? If someone proved to you that the moon were actually ~240000 miles away instead of 3000, would that do it? If someone were to take you into orbit and you personally saw that you could only see ~1/2 of the planet's landmass in one go, would that do it? If neither of those, what would?

Thanks for your time.

I think that a trip into space would do it for me.

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #56 on: June 22, 2012, 06:23:56 AM »
I'm going to come out and say that I'm not an FET proponent. I'm a physicist and it flies in the face of, well, basically everything I know. I'm not here to make fun, I'm not here to incite anger, I'm here to ask what specific evidence would you, personally, accept that would shun your beliefs in FET? If someone proved to you that the moon were actually ~240000 miles away instead of 3000, would that do it? If someone were to take you into orbit and you personally saw that you could only see ~1/2 of the planet's landmass in one go, would that do it? If neither of those, what would?

Thanks for your time.
If the proponents of Round Earth Theory could provide me with any proper, verifiable evidence for their theory I would consider it. Unfortunately, I've been asking RE'ers for years and I've yet to get any evidence.

Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #57 on: June 22, 2012, 05:50:29 PM »
I'm going to come out and say that I'm not an FET proponent. I'm a physicist and it flies in the face of, well, basically everything I know. I'm not here to make fun, I'm not here to incite anger, I'm here to ask what specific evidence would you, personally, accept that would shun your beliefs in FET? If someone proved to you that the moon were actually ~240000 miles away instead of 3000, would that do it? If someone were to take you into orbit and you personally saw that you could only see ~1/2 of the planet's landmass in one go, would that do it? If neither of those, what would?

Thanks for your time.
If the proponents of Round Earth Theory could provide me with any proper, verifiable evidence for their theory I would consider it. Unfortunately, I've been asking RE'ers for years and I've yet to get any evidence.
There is plenty but it always gets ignored. Th ISS live stream is an example. And many topics in the debate section.

Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #58 on: June 23, 2012, 02:25:16 AM »
First of all, CET, I don't know why you insist that every thread in this forum is a debate.  People ask questions and want to know answers and it is hard to answer their questions with you constantly butting in and wanting to turn it into a debate.  Are we in the debate forums?  No.  We are in Q&A.

Secondly, where in this thread did I day the ISS did not exist?  You are so overly jealous and eager to debate someone that you make stuff up just to stir up trouble.  I can only imagine how many legitimate posters you have scared off because they are afraid their innocent question is going to turn into a debate.

If you want to debate, then post something in the debate forum and if I feel like it is worth debating, then I will be happy to help you get your rocks off.  Until then, please stop shitting up real threads with your "Defender of the Round Earth" persona. 

And finally, even when someone does engage you in debate, you just repeat your self over and over until they quit posting and you claim an RE win.  Why don't you grow up?  How old are you, anyway?

There are other people who use these forums besides you, CET.  Please respect them and let them ask questions.

Yeah, so can you please answer my question as to how satellites can orbit around a flat earth? There's obviously enough proof to say for certain that there are actually satellites, and please don't come up with a half-assed answer or write a retardedly long comment bashing my question or simply meaning "umm... I don't know"?
« Last Edit: June 23, 2012, 02:32:20 AM by flamen0d »

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Re: What would it take to make you stop believing in FET?
« Reply #59 on: August 12, 2012, 07:35:11 PM »
I'm going to come out and say that I'm not an FET proponent. I'm a physicist and it flies in the face of, well, basically everything I know. I'm not here to make fun, I'm not here to incite anger, I'm here to ask what specific evidence would you, personally, accept that would shun your beliefs in FET? If someone proved to you that the moon were actually ~240000 miles away instead of 3000, would that do it? If someone were to take you into orbit and you personally saw that you could only see ~1/2 of the planet's landmass in one go, would that do it? If neither of those, what would?

Thanks for your time.

I think that a trip into space would do it for me.
how far to space?
would a mig travel be enough?
for 10-15k, you can have your answer...