how is this flat?

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how is this flat?
« on: November 14, 2011, 09:28:15 AM »
Earth time lapse


Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2011, 09:48:19 AM »
what you are seeing is video of circling the disc.
thank you for sharing.

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2011, 09:54:53 AM »
Earth time lapse



How very appropriate. The view of our sphere is quite beautiful.
You, sir, can't comprehend the idea of bottoms.

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Tom Bishop

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2011, 10:44:23 AM »
It's a high altitude video taken with a fisheye lens (or post-processed with a fisheye). The curvature isn't an arc of a circle. Watch the curvature carefully.



« Last Edit: November 14, 2011, 10:54:18 AM by Tom Bishop »

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2011, 11:00:24 AM »
I agree, there's a deformation. The horizon is not a circle.

Does it prove something? Not really.

Look closely at the film. Sometimes you really have the impression of flying over a globe.
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

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Archibald

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2011, 11:17:08 AM »
I agree, there's a deformation. The horizon is not a circle.

Does it prove something? Not really.

Look closely at the film. Sometimes you really have the impression of flying over a globe.


There is an alleged slight bulge at the  equator but not nearly enough to produce such deformation of an ellipsoid.
For whatever reason you allow Clocktower to derail any thread Archibald posts in.

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2011, 11:38:18 AM »
The deformation can be caused by the camera.
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2011, 11:49:43 AM »
Yeah, i kinda noticed the bulge too, but it's really only in one or two shots.  It could be a problem with the lense.  But, there is a lot more proof of rotundity in that video than proof of a flat Earth.

First... and, I know that distances farther away appear to be smaller... but, they decrease in height more than they decrease in width.  Which tells me that the Earth is getting shorter at the ends than it is getting more narrow.  Which, to me... suggest that it's curving downward as it goes. 

Second, when the stars breach the horizon, they breach AT the horizon.  If the rotundity was an illusion that came from a "reverse solar eclipse," the stars would be breaching above the real, darkened horizon of the flat earth.  So, there would be a dark (and a fairly large one) margin between where the horizon appears to be and where the stars are coming up. 
...does anyone find it funny that the Flat Earth model is actually round?

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Tom Bishop

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2011, 06:44:32 PM »
I agree, there's a deformation. The horizon is not a circle.

Does it prove something? Not really.

It's enough for us to dismiss the video callously.

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2011, 07:01:48 PM »
I agree, there's a deformation. The horizon is not a circle.

Does it prove something? Not really.

It's enough for us to dismiss the video callously.

That's funny. It was dismissed by you the moment you realized it was video showing anything other than a flat Earth.
You, sir, can't comprehend the idea of bottoms.

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Archibald

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2011, 10:49:37 PM »
I agree, there's a deformation. The horizon is not a circle.

Does it prove something? Not really.

It's enough for us to dismiss the video callously.

That's funny. It was dismissed by you the moment you realized it was video showing anything other than a flat Earth.

Clearly Mr. Bishop dismissed it after concluding it was faulty at best.
For whatever reason you allow Clocktower to derail any thread Archibald posts in.

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2011, 12:22:28 AM »
I agree, there's a deformation. The horizon is not a circle.

Does it prove something? Not really.

It's enough for us to dismiss the video callously.

How convenient!
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

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Zogg

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2011, 01:09:22 AM »
It's enough for us to dismiss the video callously.

May I ask why you dismiss the video ?

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2011, 07:14:18 AM »
It's enough for us to dismiss the video callously.

May I ask why you dismiss the video ?

Because if the video proved the earth was round, he would have to admit he was wrong.  He's not looking at the video objectively.  Far be it for me to question Mr. Bishop's motives, but I'm not 100% sure HE dismisses the video, either.  Judging by that video, clearly the earth is round, bulge or no bulge.
...does anyone find it funny that the Flat Earth model is actually round?

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Tom Bishop

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2011, 12:00:18 PM »

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #15 on: November 15, 2011, 12:02:57 PM »
You dismiss the video because it shows a RE slightly distorted by a camera lens or a ISS window?
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #16 on: November 15, 2011, 12:08:17 PM »
...does anyone find it funny that the Flat Earth model is actually round?

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #17 on: November 15, 2011, 12:09:09 PM »
You dismiss the video because it shows a RE slightly distorted by a camera lens or a ISS window?

I'm not really sure how the distortion proves the earth is flat...
...does anyone find it funny that the Flat Earth model is actually round?

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Vongeo

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #18 on: November 15, 2011, 12:13:26 PM »
Isn't that video computer generated?

Vongeo is a wanker, he wears a wanker hat; he always smells like urine and he thinks the Earth is flat.

No longer is this sentence is cut in half. Jekra!

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Tom Bishop

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #19 on: November 15, 2011, 03:23:44 PM »
I'm not really sure how the distortion proves the earth is flat...

Distortion invalidates the video as evidence for a globe earth, it doesn't prove that the earth is any particular shape.

You dismiss the video because it shows a RE slightly distorted by a camera lens or a ISS window?

Yes, the video is dismissed because it shows distorted curvature.

The curvature we are seeing of the earth is artificial and does not reflect reality, and therefore cannot be provided as evidence of a globe earth. We don't know how much the earth's curvature is being distorted, only that it is distorted.

If a math teacher knows that her student Sam cheated on his final exam, but doesn't know whether he cheated a little bit or a lotta bit, what happens? Sam is given an F, regardless of whether he cheated on 1 question or 100 questions. The same concept applies here. We know that what we are seeing does not reflect reality. Therefore the entire video is summarily dismissed as invalid.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2011, 03:38:15 PM by Tom Bishop »

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #20 on: November 15, 2011, 03:40:58 PM »
I'm not really sure how the distortion proves the earth is flat...

Distortion invalidates the video as evidence for a globe earth, it doesn't prove that the earth is any particular shape.

You dismiss the video because it shows a RE slightly distorted by a camera lens or a ISS window?

Yes, the video is dismissed because it shows distorted curvature.

The curvature we are seeing of the earth is artificial and does not reflect reality, and therefore cannot be provided as evidence of a globe earth. We don't know how much the earth's curvature is being distorted, only that it is unquestionably distorted.

If a math teacher knows that her student Sam cheated on his final exam, but doesn't know whether he cheated a little bit or a lotta bit, what happens? Sam is given an F, regardless of whether he cheated on 1 question or 100 questions. The same concept applies here. We know that what we are seeing does not reflect reality. Therefore the entire video is summarily dismissed as invalid.

How very unzetetic of you, rushing to conclusions before seeing the evidence. How do you know the curvature in the video doesn't reflect reality? The video contradicts both RET and FET, so perhaps the a new theory needs to be created to explain the reality shown in the video. We shall call is Curved Earth Theory, or CET.
You, sir, can't comprehend the idea of bottoms.

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Tom Bishop

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #21 on: November 15, 2011, 04:09:11 PM »
How very unzetetic of you, rushing to conclusions before seeing the evidence. How do you know the curvature in the video doesn't reflect reality? The video contradicts both RET and FET, so perhaps the a new theory needs to be created to explain the reality shown in the video. We shall call is Curved Earth Theory, or CET.

Feel free to use that video as evidence for "Egg Earth Theory" or whatever. It cannot be used in favor of the Globe Earth Theory because it does not depict a globe. It is invalid for that purpose.

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Zogg

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #22 on: November 15, 2011, 04:23:13 PM »
The curvature of the horizon might or might not come from the lense - but the video shows more than that. It shows the continents appearing at the horizon (thus it's not the border of the earth disk). It shows polar light from below near the horizon - something that wouldn't be the case if the earth was flat. And last but not least, it shows a frickin' SPACE STATION actually doing sustended space flight - something that is impossible due to FEers!

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Tausami

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #23 on: November 15, 2011, 04:37:19 PM »
It's enough for us to dismiss the video callously.

May I ask why you dismiss the video ?

Because if the video proved the earth was round, he would have to admit he was wrong.  He's not looking at the video objectively.  Far be it for me to question Mr. Bishop's motives, but I'm not 100% sure HE dismisses the video, either.  Judging by that video, clearly the earth is round, bulge or no bulge.

Go away. The adults are talking.

It's clearly another poorly made video from the Conspiracy (NASA, KFC). They do this all the time.

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Zogg

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #24 on: November 15, 2011, 05:03:33 PM »
It's clearly another poorly made video from the Conspiracy (NASA, KFC). They do this all the time.

So, the argumentation is that this video doesn't show what you would expect according to FET, hence - as FET is true - it must be fabricated, hence it confirms the conspiracy theory, hence it indirectly confirms FET?

What a flawless logic!

P.S.: I didn't know Kentucky Fried Chicken is involved, as well. I'm shocked.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2011, 05:05:40 PM by Zogg »

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markjo

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #25 on: November 15, 2011, 06:53:31 PM »
How very unzetetic of you, rushing to conclusions before seeing the evidence. How do you know the curvature in the video doesn't reflect reality? The video contradicts both RET and FET, so perhaps the a new theory needs to be created to explain the reality shown in the video. We shall call is Curved Earth Theory, or CET.

Feel free to use that video as evidence for "Egg Earth Theory" or whatever. It cannot be used in favor of the Globe Earth Theory because it does not depict a globe. It is invalid for that purpose.

Have you ever witnessed an earth size globe from a space station at an altitude of approximately 220 miles?  If not, then how do you know what it should or shouldn't look like?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #26 on: November 15, 2011, 08:05:05 PM »
Distortion invalidates the video as evidence for a globe earth, it doesn't prove that the earth is any particular shape.

Really?  That's your story and you're sticking to it?  The video is invalidated because the camera lense is a funny shape?  Or... is the video invalidated because it proves something you choose not to believe?  So, if it's a flat earth, what about the stars breaching the horizon AT the lighted portion and there not being a gap between the lighted portion and the real edge of the Earth?
...does anyone find it funny that the Flat Earth model is actually round?

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Tom Bishop

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #27 on: November 16, 2011, 12:04:17 PM »
The curvature of the horizon might or might not come from the lense - but the video shows more than that. It shows the continents appearing at the horizon (thus it's not the border of the earth disk).

The horizon on a flat earth is caused by perspective. The continents appear on the horizon because they are coming into perspective as the craft approaches them.

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It shows polar light from below near the horizon - something that wouldn't be the case if the earth was flat.

Perspective. The sun and stars descend into the horizon due to perspective.

Quote
And last but not least, it shows a frickin' SPACE STATION actually doing sustended space flight - something that is impossible due to FEers!

We don't deny that the ISS exists. We question whether it is truly in orbit around the earth. It may very well be that the ISS is in the upper atmosphere, buoyant through helium or some other means, and NASA warped the video to make the earth seem more curvy.

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So, if it's a flat earth, what about the stars breaching the horizon AT the lighted portion and there not being a gap between the lighted portion and the real edge of the Earth?

The sun and stars set into the earth due to perspective. Please read Earth Not a Globe on the topic.

Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #28 on: November 16, 2011, 01:07:53 PM »
The sun and stars set into the earth due to perspective. Please read Earth Not a Globe on the topic.

No, I don't think that's right.  I made another post explaining why Rowbatham's theories on perspective are flawed... but, let me show you a diagram I made that shows why his theory doesn't answer my question:


The above shows a side perspective of a single point of vision (like a satellite camera) looking at a hypothetical flat Earth with a single lighted portion.  The big dot on the far left represents an eye.  The green and yellow line represents the earth, and the little dots on the right represent stars (of course not to scale). 

The white areas represent what you can see, and the grey areas represent what is either blocked by the earth or what is out of your field of vision.

On the green and yellow line, the yellow indicates a certain lit portion of flat earth.  The green is not lit, and therefore dark.  Now, when looking at the Earth from such a high elevation, the stars in the areas labeled C and E would be blocked by the darkened portion of the Earth, just as the stars in the area labeled D are blocked by the part of the earth you see in space.  The stars in portion A (and F, if the picture was big enough) ARE visible because there's nothing to block that line of sight.

In space, the lines of perspective that Rowbentham attempted to explain don't apply.  Perspective doesn't really come to a fixed point like lines of perspective in artwork... vision goes on for equal distances in every direction within that field of vision, limited only by a fixed distance and/or a blocking object (in this case, the earth).

So, given the diagram above, if the Earth were flat, this is what you would see from space:

If the green represented the lit portion of flat Earth from space, it should be a part of a massive disk that still blocks the stars behind it because it's still in your line of sight, but invisible because it isn't lighted.  So, what you would see is a lit portion of the earth, surrounded by a black invisible mass, followed THEN by stars in the background. 

Instead, what you see is this:

This indicates the lit portion of the earth with stars on all sides directly at the horizon.  This is possible because the unlit portions of the earth are on the other side of it, and thus not blocking the stars.

Please remember, Rowbentham's theories of perspective in ENaG are artistic in nature, and don't accurately represent the laws of human perspective.  When you look straight ahead, the earth appears to come to a horizon because a (seemingly) flat, visible surface (the ground) is being introduced.  The sky, on the otherhand, stretches on for infinity.  If the ground were not there, every direction in your field of vision would stretch on for infinity.  This is why you see stars at night from a billion light years away rather than a black sky slanting down to a fixed point in space.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2011, 01:18:19 PM by KristaGurl »
...does anyone find it funny that the Flat Earth model is actually round?

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Tausami

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Re: how is this flat?
« Reply #29 on: November 16, 2011, 01:33:53 PM »
It's clearly another poorly made video from the Conspiracy (NASA, KFC). They do this all the time.

So, the argumentation is that this video doesn't show what you would expect according to FET, hence - as FET is true - it must be fabricated, hence it confirms the conspiracy theory, hence it indirectly confirms FET?

What a flawless logic!

P.S.: I didn't know Kentucky Fried Chicken is involved, as well. I'm shocked.

We have plenty of evidence for it.

Yep. They kill dinosaurs and serve them to us because they know the truth. I can find you some literature on the subject if you want.[/quote]