Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!

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Thork

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #60 on: October 23, 2011, 03:45:31 AM »
So show me a map which represents the FE as you see it.

Pick any published map you like. It is a projection of earth. A flat earth!

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #61 on: October 23, 2011, 03:46:29 AM »
Show me just one!
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #62 on: October 23, 2011, 05:41:46 AM »
It then depends what you want the map to be accurate for. Equal distance maps, equal area maps, true bearing maps, scale maps etc.

Your trolling is slipping Thork.  On a flat earth map, there is no need to adjust maps for area and distance, because they will already be accurate.  If the earth is flat, there is no need of projections.
First human spacewalker, Cosmonaut Alexei Leonov: “Lifting my head I could see the curvature of the Earth's horizon. ’So the world really is round,’ I said softly to myself, as if the words came from somewhere deep in my soul. "

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PizzaPlanet

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Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #63 on: October 23, 2011, 05:45:10 AM »
On a flat earth map, there is no need to adjust maps for area and distance, because they will already be accurate.
It is impossible to produce an accurate map to any other scale than 1:1.
hacking your precious forum as we speak 8) 8) 8)

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #64 on: October 23, 2011, 06:39:08 AM »
On a flat earth map, there is no need to adjust maps for area and distance, because they will already be accurate.
It is impossible to produce an accurate map to any other scale than 1:1.
Nice misdirection there pizzaplanet. 

You don't need to change the shapes of continents, you certainly don't need to stretch the North Pole out into a ribbon, just to accurately represent the distances and areas of a mapped location.

If you really are arguing that there is some kind of purpose for the mercator projection in flat earth scenario then you probably need to go back and study up exactly what the mercator projection is and why it was introduced.


re: Thork's statement:
Quote
The map has isn't 1:1,000,000 etc all over. Its a PROJECTION!
The mercator exists purely to allow some areas of a globular planet to be described on a flat surface.  You might have all kinds of needs for maps in a FE world, but you WILL NOT need a map with different distance scales on different parts of the map.
First human spacewalker, Cosmonaut Alexei Leonov: “Lifting my head I could see the curvature of the Earth's horizon. ’So the world really is round,’ I said softly to myself, as if the words came from somewhere deep in my soul. "

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #65 on: October 23, 2011, 06:40:52 AM »
It is impossible to produce an accurate map to any other scale than 1:1.

Why is that so?
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

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Thork

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #66 on: October 23, 2011, 07:03:27 AM »
You don't need to change the shapes of continents, you certainly don't need to stretch the North Pole out into a ribbon, just to accurately represent the distances and areas of a mapped location.
Then you can safely assume that is not the purpose of that type of map. They stretched it out to best illustrate the distributions of buoys in the oceans. They happen to all be away from the poles so a Mercator is a great choice.

If you really are arguing that there is some kind of purpose for the mercator projection in flat earth scenario then you probably need to go back and study up exactly what the mercator projection is and why it was introduced.
Why can it only be a projection of a ball? Not a flat plate? You still have a zombie like acceptance of all things round. Different projections allow the information in maps to be easily accessible and act as a pictorial overview of a situation. You don't always want a large round map. Square ones are easier to fold for example or you may only be interested in a particular region.

The mercator exists purely to allow some areas of a globular planet to be described on a flat surface.  You might have all kinds of needs for maps in a FE world, but you WILL NOT need a map with different distance scales on different parts of the map.
Of course you will, if you stretch a north pole out to the same length as the equator you cannot have the same scales and distances. You don't seem to understand how maps work.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2011, 07:05:02 AM by Thork »

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #67 on: October 23, 2011, 09:40:39 AM »
Of course you will, if you stretch a north pole out to the same length as the equator you cannot have the same scales and distances. You don't seem to understand how maps work.
Yes, but the only time you would need to stretch out the north pole, is when you are attempting to represent a curved surface as a 2 dimensional map.

re: Bouys, why the need to stretch everything out onto a rectangular piece of paper? The corners of a square sheet of paper with a circular map on it would actually be quite useful for legends and other information.  And the beauty of it would be, the whole map would be useful not just that section a few thousand  miles above or below the equator.
First human spacewalker, Cosmonaut Alexei Leonov: “Lifting my head I could see the curvature of the Earth's horizon. ’So the world really is round,’ I said softly to myself, as if the words came from somewhere deep in my soul. "

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #68 on: October 23, 2011, 11:04:52 AM »
Why can it only be a projection of a ball? Not a flat plate? You still have a zombie like acceptance of all things round.

Let's forget for one moment the bullying, and let's focus on a projection being the projection of a flat plate.

It wouldn't be a projection, but a mere copy, or a homothety of the reality. So we should be able to have a map which really represents a FE. Such is not the case with a Mercator's projection.
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

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Thork

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #69 on: October 23, 2011, 11:19:06 AM »
Why can it only be a projection of a ball? Not a flat plate? You still have a zombie like acceptance of all things round.

Let's forget for one moment the bullying, and let's focus on a projection being the projection of a flat plate.

It wouldn't be a projection, but a mere copy, or a homothety of the reality. So we should be able to have a map which really represents a FE. Such is not the case with a Mercator's projection.
What bullying? Are you trying to bully me? It is unlikely that it will work.

Of course a mercator projection represents a FE. Its a projection of one. The Zenith is above the equator on the Greenwich meridian and the North pole is stretched along the top surface of the map. On a polar azimuthal projection the zenith is moved to the north pole. The north pole remains a finite spot but the map is a circular arrangement. You can get a similar map that is a star. Its the same earth, but you have to appreciate to change from a circle to a star, a certain amount of stretching and manipulation takes place. Same with Mercators. It just depends what you are trying to show.

      

They are all the same earth, but different projections and hence different stretching has been applied. Why is this so hard for you to grasp?

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #70 on: October 23, 2011, 11:21:43 AM »
Maps, maps, maps.

None working with the FE model.
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

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Tausami

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Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #71 on: October 23, 2011, 11:23:10 AM »
Maps, maps, maps.

None working with the FE model.

[insert ClockTower reference here]

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Thork

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #72 on: October 23, 2011, 11:29:52 AM »
Maps, maps, maps.

None working with the FE model.
They are all projections of a flat earth. Is your IQ under 80 or something? Why don't you grasp what I have been saying so we can move on to the next part of the conversation. They are all projections of a flat earth. They are ways to show a flat earth in the shape of a heart or a star or a rectangle or however the cartographer best thinks the user would like it. And he manipulates the map to fit that shape. It does not mean the earth is round. It just means he has applied a distortion to it.

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #73 on: October 23, 2011, 11:32:28 AM »
Nowhere, on any map, the distances are accurate regarding the FE theory.

You can talk as long as you want about maps and projections, but the bottom line is that there is no map relevant with FE theory.
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

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Tom Bishop

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Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #74 on: October 23, 2011, 11:34:43 AM »
Nowhere, on any map, the distances are accurate regarding the FE theory.

Citation needed. Did you map out the distances between every point on earth?



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Lord Xenu

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Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #75 on: October 23, 2011, 11:35:47 AM »
Nowhere, on any map, the distances are accurate regarding the FE theory.

You can talk as long as you want about maps and projections, but the bottom line is that there is no map relevant with FE theory.
Nowhere, on any map, the distances are accurate regarding the RE theory.

You can talk as long as you want about maps and projections, but the bottom line is that there is no map relevant with RE theory.

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #76 on: October 23, 2011, 11:37:44 AM »
Nowhere, on any map, the distances are accurate regarding the FE theory.

Citation needed. Did you map out the distances between every point on earth?

Check anywhere. Atlases, internet. You'll see that there is always something wrong with the southern hemisphere with a FE map.
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

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Tom Bishop

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Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #77 on: October 23, 2011, 12:49:36 PM »
Nowhere, on any map, the distances are accurate regarding the FE theory.

Citation needed. Did you map out the distances between every point on earth?

Check anywhere. Atlases, internet. You'll see that there is always something wrong with the southern hemisphere with a FE map.

So I guess that's a "no" then.

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #78 on: October 23, 2011, 12:52:02 PM »
There's also the fact that it's, you know, a map proposing the idea that the Earth is flat.

Does it just not occur to you at any point that you are believing that the world is flat and that there is a worldwide conspiracy to hide this fact? Does it just not hit you that that is the point you are legitimately trying to defend?
Y'all be trippin'

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Tom Bishop

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Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #79 on: October 23, 2011, 02:34:28 PM »
There's also the fact that it's, you know, a map proposing the idea that the Earth is flat.

Does it just not occur to you at any point that you are believing that the world is flat and that there is a worldwide conspiracy to hide this fact? Does it just not hit you that that is the point you are legitimately trying to defend?

There isn't a worldwide conspiracy to hide the flat shape of the world.

The purpose of the conspiracy is to fake the concept of space travel. This is done for military purposes. They need to fake space travel to scare others into thinking that ICBMs can rain down on their heads at any moment.

A country with space capability is the ultimate threat. No longer do wars need to be fought with men and armies, but at the push of a button. America has dominated foreign politics since the 1960's because it has postured itself as the biggest dog. Since Hiroshima and the rise of NASA most countries now have their national reserves in USD, think that waging war with the US is suicide, and wouldn't dare embargo American companies, even giving them special breaks and special treatment. Countries do what America demands. America is the most prosperous nation on earth for the above reasons.

Claiming to have space travel is bringing a gun to a knife fight. Your enemy rolls over and surrenders, even if your gun is a fake. NASA's purpose isn't for furthering science or exploring for all mankind. It's to make others think that America can get nukes into orbit. It's not a scientific organization. It's military propaganda.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2011, 03:55:35 PM by Tom Bishop »

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #80 on: October 23, 2011, 02:42:31 PM »
i like the giant waving american flag in your avatar
Y'all be trippin'

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Tom Bishop

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Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #81 on: October 23, 2011, 02:56:03 PM »
I love my country but fear my government.

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #82 on: October 23, 2011, 03:07:01 PM »
Do you just love it platonically, or is it a C/W/B (citizens with benefits) deal going on? Florida looks like it hasn't had a handy in ages.
Y'all be trippin'

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #83 on: October 23, 2011, 03:55:13 PM »
Nowhere, on any map, the distances are accurate regarding the FE theory.

Citation needed. Did you map out the distances between every point on earth?

Check anywhere. Atlases, internet. You'll see that there is always something wrong with the southern hemisphere with a FE map.

So I guess that's a "no" then.

I guess you have a problem with simple understanding.
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

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Tom Bishop

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Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #84 on: October 23, 2011, 03:58:36 PM »
Nowhere, on any map, the distances are accurate regarding the FE theory.

Citation needed. Did you map out the distances between every point on earth?

Check anywhere. Atlases, internet. You'll see that there is always something wrong with the southern hemisphere with a FE map.

So I guess that's a "no" then.

I guess you have a problem with simple understanding.

I have perfect understanding. I asked you if you checked the distances between every point on earth and the question was ignored, instead asking me to look at some NASA maps.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2011, 04:00:27 PM by Tom Bishop »

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #85 on: October 23, 2011, 04:01:10 PM »
Well I checked enough to see that the distances on a FE map between, let's say Santiago de Chile, Capetown and sydney are utterly ridiculous.
“The Earth looks flat, therefore it is” FEers wisdom.

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #86 on: October 23, 2011, 04:47:36 PM »


      

They are all the same earth, but different projections and hence different stretching has been applied. Why is this so hard for you to grasp?
I like the heart one, it's purty....
First human spacewalker, Cosmonaut Alexei Leonov: “Lifting my head I could see the curvature of the Earth's horizon. ’So the world really is round,’ I said softly to myself, as if the words came from somewhere deep in my soul. "

Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #87 on: October 23, 2011, 04:55:55 PM »
Well I checked enough to see that the distances on a FE map between, let's say Santiago de Chile, Capetown and sydney are utterly ridiculous.
Of course you are absolutely correct.  No amount of bleating by the FE trolls can change the fact that they don't have a workable map.  Only in RE, do we need a series of projections, neither of which is 100% accurate, to represent the 3D surface two dimensionally.  FE, being flat, ought to be easily represented on a two dimensional surface, but no-one has yet been able to derive a 2D model of the Earth that accurately represents the actual distances and shapes of continents. 

The reason is that the Earth surface, being 3D, simply cannot be flattened without distortion.

Despite Thork going on about FE having a use for "projections", the fact remains the entire field of map projection only exists as a means of representing the curved surface of the earth in various 2 dimensional formats to suit various needs.  IF the earth were not a sphere, map projections would not exist.
First human spacewalker, Cosmonaut Alexei Leonov: “Lifting my head I could see the curvature of the Earth's horizon. ’So the world really is round,’ I said softly to myself, as if the words came from somewhere deep in my soul. "

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Tom Bishop

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Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #88 on: October 23, 2011, 05:07:06 PM »
Well I checked enough to see that the distances on a FE map between, let's say Santiago de Chile, Capetown and sydney are utterly ridiculous.

http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=49558.0

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PizzaPlanet

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Re: Gosh the Conspiracy has a lot to do!
« Reply #89 on: October 23, 2011, 05:47:13 PM »
It is impossible to produce an accurate map to any other scale than 1:1.
Why is that so?
Lurk, for God's bloody sake.
hacking your precious forum as we speak 8) 8) 8)