AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God

  • 167 Replies
  • 20548 Views
?

AbdulAziz

  • 613
  • Slave Of Allah
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #150 on: July 14, 2011, 01:35:22 AM »
Quote
So, in proving the existence of God, what is, in your opinion, the most compelling argument for his existence? Or for his existence as described by the Quran? (I already believe in God, so in debating with me, your opposition is not in fact arguing that God does not exist)  I apologize if you've said it, and I've probably already read it, but it's a difficult task deciding which arguments to consider first.  I hope to keep this discussion as efficient as possible.

Finally another one besides ﮎingulaЯiτy who I feel want to really discuss this. Well since we have discussed this many times on many different topics I will just quotes our arguments at least form the Muslim perspectives:

Quote
What does it mean to exist? Philosophers, theologians and even scientists have debated this question for millennia and have come up with a variety of responses. Ultimately, all of us try to give meaning to our lives by looking to experience happiness, peace and tranquility. The only difference is in the mode in which we try to achieve this. Are we just a collection of molecules obeying our biological makeup? Does this make us any different from a shoal of fish or a herd of sheep? Are not the struggles of the politician to achieve peace in the world or the endeavours of molecular biologists to help find a cure for cancer meaningless and amount to nothing if our ends are the same? To try and address these questions, pondering on the nature of our existence may aid in finding answers.

The First Principle – Nothing cannot create something.
A nonentity which does not have an existence is unable to create something given that it itself does not exist. If we examine things that come to life on a daily basis, and ponder on all that occurs: the blowing of the winds, rainfall, the alternation of night and day; and if we examine the periodic events such as the orderly orbital travels of the planets, it is irrational to conclude that all of this is the work of nothing.

The Second Principle – what has been created reveals characteristics of its maker.
Everything inherently portrays either the ability, or a characteristic, of its creator. It is impossible to find within a created object something beyond the realm of the creator or his ability to engineer, for example, if you see a wooden door that has been made to perfection you will know that its creator possessed wood, that this creator can piece together the material in an orderly manner, that he is able to make the wood smooth by sanding it, and that he has experience in the making of doors.

“‘Indeed, within the heavens and earth are signs for the believers. And in your creation and what He disperses of moving creatures are signs for people who are certain [in faith]. And [in] the alternation of night and day and [in] what God sends down from the sky of provision [i.e., rain] and gives life thereby to the earth after its lifelessness and [in His] directing of the winds are signs for a people who reason. These are the verses of Allah which We recite to you in truth. Then in what statement after God and His verses will they believe?”
 Qur’an 45:3-6

The All-Knowing
If analyzing the embryos of animals it is important to note that eyes have been created within the wombs where it is pitch black, although eyes cannot see without light. This indicates that the one who creates eyes in the womb knows very well that these embryos will emerge in a world where there is light; its formation in the embryonic stage has been specifically prepared to be suitable for its life. Another point to ponder is the balance between the number of males and females - you will always see the numbers equal.

“Does He who created not know, while He is the Subtle, the Acquainted?”
Qur’an 67:14

The Provider
In the depths and darkness of the womb the Provider brings us our provision ripe and broken down from the umbilical cord. Once the baby is born and the cord is cut, the Provider brings about nourishment for the newborn through the breast of the child’s mother. He gives the baby the intuition to extract that nourishment by sucking, and yet it cannot see, hear or understand.Thereafter Allah provides his servants with all manner of vegetation and trees that yield fruits from water, soil and air. Allah facilitates the Sun for vegetation so that it can complete the making of its fruit and crops that are required by humans and animals.Such provision would not be available if God had not delivered fresh water, prepared fertile land for seeding, and caused the right atmospheric conditions and climate to enable the yield of vegetation. So, when food is eaten and digested, the Provider delivers its nutrients to every part of the body, whether it is the centre of the brain, the surface of one's skin, or deep within the bone marrow.Indeed the Provider has assumed the task of securing provision. He delivers the necessary nutrients for fish to the depths of the oceans; he delivers the necessary nutrients for insects to the insides of rocks; he delivers the necessary nutrients for embryos to the darkness of the wombs and He delivers the provision of baby plants to the inside of seeds. God says

“And there is no creature on earth but that upon God is its provision, and He knows its place of dwelling and place of storage. All is in a clear register.”
Qur’an 11:6
The Guide
If you examine your eyelashes, you will notice that you upper eye lashes reach upwards and your lower eye lashes extend downwards. If the matter was opposite it would have disturbed one's vision. Who is it that guides every eye lash of every human being or animal other than God ? Who is it who guides the teeth of the upper jaw to extend downwards and the teeth of the lower jaw to extend upwards? Who is that guides the Sun, the Moon and stars along their orbits, and the birds on their distant migratory travels? God says,

“…who created and proportioned, and who destined and [then] guided.” Qur’an 87:2-3

The Protector
The One who guarded you from peril and danger while you were in the womb of your mother is the same one who protects your fragile brain with the strong case of bone. He is the One who protects the eyes with the surrounding bone, nose and cheeks; who protects the heart and lungs with the ribs. He is the One who does not task you with having to inhale and exhale, for were He to do that, you would not be able to achieve anything other than inhaling and exhaling, and if you were to be overcome by sleep you would stop breathing and die.

“Indeed my Lord is, over all things, Guardian.” Qur’an 11:57

The One and Only
The whole of existence bears witness that everything is the work of the only One True God. You will see that your food requires the work of your stomach and intestines. Doctors say that the function of the intestines requires the function of blood. The role of blood is dependent on air and respiration. Wholesome air is dependent on the function of plants and the plants are dependent on the presence of the Sun. The presence of the Sun is dependent on the presence of other planets and stars around it and so on. Hence the function of one thing is dependent on another, all the way back to one supreme cause. God said,

“God has not taken any son, nor has there ever been with Him any deity. [If there had been], then each deity would have taken what it created, and some of them would have sought to overcome others. Exalted is Allah above what they describe [concerning Him].” Qur’an 23:91

If there were other gods besides Allah, there would be a contest between them to command creation which would result in chaos among the heavens and earth. God says,“Had there been within the heavens and earth gods besides Allah they both would have been ruined.

So exalted is Allah, Lord of the Throne, above what they describe.” Qur’an 21:22

The Third Principle - One who lacks a thing cannot provide that thing, thus knowledge does not come from one who is ignorant because one who lacks a thing cannot present it.

Those who believe that nature created them contradict the intellect and reject the truth because the universe bears witness that its Creator is all-wise, all-knowing, all-acquainted, all-guiding, all-providing, all-protecting, all-merciful and the one and only.Who is the one who is characterized with attributes?We may thus conclude that if we reflect upon the universe and the creatures around us we find that everything testifies that a Creator made all of these. Just at the universe bears witness to all these indications, the Muslim bears witness along with creation and repeats this declaration with  knowledge and certainty, and so proclaims, “I bear witness that none has the right to be worshipped but God. 

The belief in Prophets
God has sent His messengers to guide people to him, inviting them to worship Allah alone and to disbelieve in any other deities that people worship. God says,

“And verily, We have sent among every Ummah (community) a Messenger (proclaiming):"Worship God(Alone), and avoid all false deities.”“And We did not send any Messenger before you but We inspired him (saying): There is no God but God.” Qur’an 43:45

All the messengers are humans and do not have the qualities of God, this fact is stressed in the Qur’an where God says,

“The Messiah, son of Mary, was nothing but a messenger; (other) messengers have passed on before him. And his mother was a supporter of truth. They both used to eat food! Look how We make clear to them the signs; then look how they are deluded.” Qur’an 5:75

Why did God send messengers?
God sent the messengers to establish and maintain the truth and to warn people against sectarianism in religions.  God says,

“He (God) has ordained for you the same religion (submission to Him, or “al-Islâm”) which He ordained for Noah, and that which We have inspired in you (Muhammad), and that which We ordained for Abraham, Moses and Jesus saying you should establish religion, and make no sects out of it.” Qur’an 26:13
He sent Prophets to give the believers glad-tidings of everlasting contentment and pleasure in paradise, all as a reward for their obedience to God. They were also sent to warn the disbelievers of the consequence of their disbelief, to show them that their disbelief will not be excused, and   that they (the messengers) will set a plea against them on the Day of Judgment. God says,

“Messengers as bearers of good news as well as of warning in order that mankind should have no plea against Allâh after the Messengers. And God is Ever All ¬Powerful, All¬ Wise.” Qur’an 4:165
God has sent them to be the perfect example of higher morals, and to show the people the correct way to worship, which should guide them to the straight way of God. He sent them to save the believers from differing about the prescribed fundamentals that guide their lives to the way of truth. God says,

“And We have not sent down the Book (the Qur'an) to you, except that you may explain clearly to them those things in which they differ, and as a guidance and mercy for people who believe.”The noble Qur’an 816:

Messengers are also sent to show people the good deeds that purify human souls and to instill goodness and righteousness in their hearts. How do we know that they are true prophets? Each Prophet has produced miracles that his nation was witness to, indeed, the Prophet Muhammad, the last of all prophets, was given a universal message whereas all the other prophets before him were bestowed messages in the form of scripture that were confined to their nations and era. Unlike the other Holy Scriptures, the Qur’an, God’s last word and testament to humanity has never been changed; the Qur’an presents accurate scientific verses which are supported by modern science although it was revealed 1400 years ago. A key example would be that of embryology - long before the microscopic telescope was invented, the Qur’an refers to the different stages of embryonic development. says,

“And certainly We created man of an extract of clay, Then We made him a small seed in a firm resting-place, Then We made the seed a clot, then We made the clot a lump of flesh, then We made (in) the lump of flesh bones, then We clothed the bones with flesh, then We caused it to grow into another creation, so praised be Allah, the best of the creators. Then after that you will most surely die.” Qur’an 23:12-15

The Qur’an also gives a brief and wonderful account of the different stages of the universe’s creation, something scientists call the big-bang. God says,

“Have those who disbelieved not considered that the heavens and Earth were joined entity, and we separated them and made from water every living thing? Then will they not believe?” Qur’an 21:30

The presence of accurate scientific statements in the holy Qur’an is conclusive evidence that this book is of a divine nature sent by God who is fully aware of the secrets of creation, especially in light of the fact that the Prophet Muhammad was an illiterate man who lived in the mountainous desert, as well as there being no such scientific discussions at the time.  Dr. Alfred Kroner from the Johannes Gutenberg University said, “Thinking about where Muhammad came from, it is almost impossible that he could have known about things like the common origin of the universe, because scientists have only found that out within the last few years, and with very complicated and advanced technological methods.”

Hope this answered your question Noel, if you are still having questions or need further explanation or more arguments please feel free to let me know.

"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

?

AbdulAziz

  • 613
  • Slave Of Allah
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #151 on: July 14, 2011, 01:35:54 AM »
Quote
AbdulAziz have you watched the "A Universe From Nothing" lecture by lawrence Krauss?

It is an hour long but worth it if you want to understand where we are coming from in regards to matter from nothing and quantum fluctuations.



If you can't be bothered watching it let me know so I don't assume you have.

Thanks for the link Demouse, sadly youtube doesn’t work in my work place and at home I barely use the net, however the name is familiar, but I need to be sure if I saw it or not, but anyway to save my time, can you please give me the summary of the video if you don’t mind?

Quote
While I agree that religious people generally don't question their god, I openly admit I don't have faith. How does that answer the question?

The second part does answer the question if I understood your question well otherwise I wish if you could explain what you mean by question exactly.
Quote
The problem here is that wisdom is assumed on god's behalf when all appearances suggest otherwise.
Sorry again I didn’t understand your point.

Quote
And not siding with god doesn't have to mean siding with the devil.

Well besides truth there is nothing but falsehood so if one believes in God and yet he is not siding with God then too bad he was hunted by the devil.

Quote
So god wanted atheists to dismiss him as fantasy?

I can’t tell exactly I just told you the wisdoms that appeared to me, but once we Muslims see atheists we really feel grateful to god that we believe in his existence, it might be also that even atheists who learned a lot yet failed to accept the existence of God, as if God want to let us learn that no matter how much a human learns, if God didn’t guide him he cannot be guided.

Quote
Couldn't god have made our minds appreciate absolute value instead of relative value?

What gives you more pleasure, to win normally or to win after hard work? I guess most human being recognize the difference. I understand your point of view, but if God have made us appreciate absolute value, that means many of the great qualities we have will be useless, there will no need for struggling ourselves to achieve goals, have hope, never give up….etc we wouldn’t appreciate the medicine if we are always healthy, but if we get sick its when we appreciate health, medicine…etc

Quote
God can't teach us his name?
Education is the devil's work?

No I guess you didn’t get me, as mentioned above what has been created reveals characteristics of its maker. Everything inherently portrays either the ability, or a characteristic, of its creator. It is impossible to find within a created object something beyond the realm of the creator or his ability to engineer, for example, if you see a wooden door that has been made to perfection you will know that its creator possessed wood, that this creator can piece together the material in an orderly manner, that he is able to make the wood smooth by sanding it, and that he has experience in the making of doors.

Quote
A kingdom benefits the king because he profits off his servants (power is a means to self benefit). A painter gains self-respect by having many followers (external recognition strengthens his positive perception of himself). Both strike me as lowly human psychological needs. If god needs to be reaffirmed, he is not self confident. If he benefits, he is not all powerful.

That’s why when I explained to LordDave [without the drawback] one of Allah’s name is Al-Ghani, the one who doesn’t need anyone to be completed, he is already complete. I don’t know if I translated the name correctly, but if you are still having difficulty please read my topic: “Allah’s Names & Attributes”.

Quote
I was talking about nature killing and torturing innocent children. Consider fatal and rampant diseases that inflict pain before killing newborn babies. This is not an act of man.

Yeah I can give you like my previous posts many wisdoms behind such acts, however am not sure if that’s what you want?

Quote

Do you acknowledge that the scientific community is as unanimous as it can possibly get when it is including the whole world?

Again I didn’t understand, care to rephrase it so an Arab like me can understand?

Quote
It agrees with most facts and all known ones? Wat.

Scientific theory has a scientific meaning and a layman's meaning. Scientists use theory to describe something that has been confirmed. The theory of gravity has been confirmed or it would not be a theory. Laymen generally use the word "theory" when they should say "hypothesis", which means it is unconfirmed.

As I said before, if the theory is tested, proved and established then it’s a fact, so what’s the problem?

Quote
God pretends not to exist perfectly. He can't be physically seen, he can't be physically felt, he can't be physically heard, he can't be physically smelled, he can't be physically tasted, he's never violated his own laws of nature, he doesn't respond to prayer (at least not when humans are conducting statistical studies), he doesn't do anything to make us think he is there.

I guess I need to post a detailed post about Allah’s names and Attributes and hopefully then all the confusion or the questions you are having will be answered, because your comments, LordDave and some others questions rise because some ignorance about Allah’s names & Attributes. I will try to write a detailed post when I get free time.

Until then I will leave you with few verses from the Quran. I really wish you all read it carefully without inner-intent to refuse it and ignore for some of you might benefit from them.

"And that those on whom knowledge has been bestowed may learn that the (Qur'an) is the Truth from thy Lord, and that they may believe therein, and their hearts may be made humbly (open) to it: for verily God is the Guide of those who believe, to the Straight Way. Those who reject Faith will not cease to be in doubt concerning (Revelation) until the Hour (of Judgment) comes suddenly upon them, or there comes to them the Penalty of a Day of Disaster."

078.006 Have We not made the earth as a wide expanse,
078.007 And the mountains as pegs?
078.008 And (have We not) created you in pairs,
078.009 And made your sleep for rest,
078.010 And made the night as a covering,
078.011 And made the day as a means of subsistence?
078.012 And (have We not) built over you the seven firmaments,
078.013 And placed (therein) a Light of Splendour?
078.014 And do We not send down from the clouds water in abundance,
078.015 That We may produce therewith corn and vegetables,

Say: See ye? If God were to make the night perpetual over you to the Day of Judgment, what god is there other than God, who can give you enlightenment? Will ye not then hearken?

028.072 Say: See ye? If God were to make the day perpetual over you to the Day of Judgment, what god is there other than God, who can give you a night in which ye can rest? Will ye not then see?
028.073 It is out of His Mercy that He has made for you Night and Day,- that ye may rest therein, and that ye may seek of his Grace;- and in order that ye may be grateful.
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

?

AbdulAziz

  • 613
  • Slave Of Allah
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #152 on: July 14, 2011, 02:39:25 AM »
"Or, lest it should say, when it sees the punishment, `Would that there were for me a return to the world, I would then be among those who do good.' He will be told, `Aye, there came to thee MY Signs, but thou didst treat them as lies, and thou wast arrogant, and thou wast of the disbelievers.

Quote
ANIMALS AND PLANTS

Millions of plant and animal types present in the world stand out as evidence that prove the existence and might of our Creator. All of these living beings, a limited number of which will be described as examples here, deserve to be examined individually. They all have different body systems, diverse defence tactics, unique ways of feeding, and interesting reproduction methods. Unfortunately, it is not possible to describe all living beings with all their features in a single book. Encyclopaedias of many volumes would not be enough for this task. However, even the few examples we will discuss here will be sufficient to prove that life on earth can in no way be explained by coincidences or accidental happenings.

From Caterpillar to Butterfly
If you had 450-500 eggs and if you had to preserve them outside, what would you do? The wisest course for you would be to take precautions to prevent them from being scattered around, say, by the wind, or other environmental factors. Being one of the animals that lay the most eggs at one time (450-500), the silkworms use a very intelligent way to protect their eggs: they unite the eggs with a viscous substance (thread) they secrete to prevent them from being scattered around.

The caterpillars that pop out of their eggs firstly find a safe branch for themselves and then get tied to this branch with the same thread. Later, to promote their own development, they start to spin a cocoon for themselves with the thread they secrete. It takes 3-4 days for a caterpillar that has opened its eyes very recently to life to complete this process. During this period, the caterpillar makes thousands of turns and produces a thread an average of 900-1,500 metres long.At the end of this process, it starts a new task through which it undergoes a metamorphosis to become an elegant butterfly.

Neither the action taken by the mother silkworm to protect its eggs, nor the behaviour of a tiny caterpillar devoid of any awareness, education or knowledge can be explained by evolution. First of all, the ability of the mother to produce the thread it uses to secure its eggs is miraculous. The newly-born caterpillar's knowing the most suitable environment for itself, its spinning a cocoon in accordance with it, its undergoing a metamorphosis, and its coming through this metamorphosis without any problem are beyond human comprehension. Hence, we can simply say that each caterpillar is born into the world with a foreknowledge of what to do, which means that it was 'taught' all of these things before it was born.

Let us explain this with an example. What would you think if you saw a new-born baby standing up a few hours after his birth, getting together the things he needs to make his bed (like quilt, pillow, mattress), and later putting all these together neatly, making his bed and lying down on it? After you recover from the shock of the event, you would probably think that the baby must have been taught in an extraordinary way in his mother's womb to perform such a process. The case of the caterpillars is no different from the baby in this example.

This again leads us to the same conclusions: these living creatures come into life, behave and live in the way determined by Allah Who has created them. The Qur'anic verse stating that Allah has inspired the honeybee and commanded it to make honey (Chapter Al-Nahl, 68-69) provides an example of the great secret of the world of living beings. This secret is that all living beings have bowed to Allah's will and follow the fate determined by Him. This is why the honeybee makes honey and the silkworm produces silk.

The Symmetry in Wings
When we look at the butterfly wings in the pictures, we see a perfect symmetry prevailing over them. These lace-like wings are so adorned with patterns, spots and colours that each of them is like a work of art.
When you look at the wings of these butterflies, you notice that the patterns and colours on both sides are fully identical, no matter how intricate they may seem. Even the smallest dot is present on both wings, thereby introducing a flawless order and symmetry.

In addition, none of the colours on these thin wings mixes with the other, each being sharply set apart from the other. Actually, these colours are formed by the amassing of tiny scales clustered one on top of another. Isn't it a wonder how these small scales that are easily dispersed with your hand's slightest touch can be arranged in both wings without any mistake in their disposal so as to produce exactly the same pattern. Even the replacement of a single scale would destroy the symmetry in the wings and impair their aesthetics. However, you never see any muddle in the wings of any butterfly on the earth. They are as neat and elegant as if made by an artist. And they are indeed made by an Exalted Creator.

The Animal with the Longest Neck: The Giraffe
Giraffes have many amazing characteristics. One of these is that their neck stands on 7 vertebrae, just like that of all other mammals, even though it is so long. Another amazing fact about giraffes is that they do not have any problem pumping blood up to their brain on top of their long neck. A little thinking would make one notice how difficult it must be to have the blood pumped so high. But giraffes do not have any problem about this, because their hearts are equipped with features to pump blood as high as necessary. This enables them to carry on with their lives effortlessly. Yet they still face another problem while they drink water. Essentially, giraffes should have died of high blood pressure every time they bent down to drink water. However, the perfect system in their necks completely eliminates this risk. When they bend down, the valves in their neck vessels are shut down and they prevent excess blood from flowing to the brain.

There is no doubt that the giraffes did not acquire these traits by planning them in accordance with their needs. It is even more implausible to say that all these vital features were shaped over time through a gradual evolutionary process. In order for a giraffe to stay alive, it is vital for it to have a pumping system to transmit blood to the brain and a valve system to prevent high blood pressure the minute it bends down. If any one of these characteristics did not exist or did not function properly, then it would be impossible for the giraffe to go on living. The conclusion to be derived from all this is that the giraffe species was born into the world with all the characteristics vital for its living. It is impossible for a non-existent being to master its body and acquire essential traits consciously. So, giraffes unquestionably prove that they are created by a conscious creation, that is by Allah.


Sea Turtles
Sea turtles living in the oceans surge in crowds towards the beach when it is time for them to reproduce. This is no ordinary beach though. The beach they arrive at to reproduce has to be the one where they were born.15 Sometimes sea turtles have to travel as far as 800 kilometres to arrive there. But a long and tough journey does not change the situation. They arrive at the beach where they were born to give birth to their offspring, no matter what.
It is quite unaccountable how a living being can find its way back to the very same beach 20-25 years after its departure from there.16 It is all the more extraordinary that it can find the direction of its birthplace in the depths of the ocean where so little light penetrates, and then spot it from among numerous similar beaches. Finally, thousands of travellers with no compass meet on the same beach at the same time. Initially a mystery, the reasons underlying this insistent meeting came as a great surprise when finally revealed. Since turtles know that their offspring cannot survive in sea conditions, they bury their eggs under the sand on the beach. But why do all of them meet on the same beach, at the same time? Would not the hatchlings survive if they did the same thing at different times and on different beaches? Those who did research on this topic were faced with a very interesting situation. Thousands of offspring under the sand have to overcome a number of formidable obstacles after breaking their eggs with the hard lump on their head. The hatchlings of an average of 31 grams cannot dig the earth layer above them on their own and they all help each other. When thousands of hatchlings on the beach start to dig the earth, they make it to the sand surface in a few days. Yet before they appear on the surface, they wait for a while for nightfall. For in the day time, there is the danger of falling a prey to predators. In addition, it would be quite difficult for them to proceed by crawling on sands scorched by the sunlight. When night falls, they go up to the surface after completing the digging process. Although it is dark, they rush to the sea and depart from the beach to return there as much as 20-25 years later.

It is impossible for these hatchlings to know that they have to dig their way up after they pop out of their eggs and wait for a while at a certain distance from the sea. It is by no means possible for them to know, when they are still buried in the earth, whether it is day or night, that predators exist outside and that they could fall a prey to them, that the sand is scorching because of the sun, that this could harm them, and that they must rush to the sea. So, how does this conscious conduct come about? The only answer to this question is that these hatchlings have been somehow 'programmed' to behave in this way, which means that their Creator has inspired in them the instinct that helps them protect their lives.

Bombardier Beetle
The bombardier beetle is an insect on which an enormous amount of research has been done. The trait that renders this insect so popular is that it uses chemical methods to protect itself from its enemies.  In moments of danger, the insect squirts hydrogen peroxide and hydroquinone stored in its body towards the enemy to protect itself. Prior to battle, specialised structures called secretory lobes make a very concentrated mixture of these two chemicals. The mixture is stored in a separate compartment called the storage chamber. This compartment is connected to a second one called the explosion chamber. The two compartments are kept separate from one another by a sphincter muscle. The moment the insect senses danger, it squeezes the muscles surrounding the storage chamber while simultaneously relaxing the sphincter muscle, and the chemical in the storage chamber is transferred to the explosion chamber. A large quantity of heat is released and a vaporisation occurs. The released vapour and the oxygen gas exert pressure on the walls of the explosion chamber and this chemical is squirted at the enemy through a channel leading outward from the beetle's body.

It is still a great mystery to researchers how an insect can harbour inside itself a powerful system potent enough to trigger a chemical reaction that could easily cause it harm while also isolating itself from the effects of that system. No doubt, the existence and working of this system is too complicated to be attributed to the insect itself. It is still a matter of discussion how the bombardier beetle makes such a system work within its tiny body measuring about 2 cm in length, when human experts can perform it only in laboratories. The only apparent truth here is that this insect is a concrete example completely refuting the theory of evolution, because it is impossible for this complex chemical system to have been shaped by a series of coincidental variations and passed on to future generations. Even a minor deficiency or 'defect' in a single piece of the system would leave the animal defenceless, so that it would soon be killed or it would cause it to blow itself up. Therefore, the only explanation is that the chemical weapon in the insect's body had come into being with all its parts all at once and without any defect.


Termite Nests
No one can help feeling surprised at the sight of a termite nest erected on the ground by termites. These nests are architectural wonders, rising as high as 5 or 6 metres. When you compare the size of a termite and its nest, you will see that the termite has successfully completed an architectural project about 300 times bigger than itself. But what is even more astonishing is that the termites are blind. A person who has never seen the huge nests built by blind termites would probably think that they are made up of sand piles heaped upon each other. However, a termite nest proves to be of a marvellous design incomprehensible to the human mind: inside there are intersecting tunnels, corridors, ventilation systems, special fungus production yards and safety exits.

If you assemble thousands of blind people and give them all kinds of technical tools, you can never make them set up a nest similar to the one made by the termite colony. So, just think:
- How could a termite measuring 1-2 cm. in length have learnt the architectural and engineering information needed to make such a subtle design?

- How could thousands of blind termites manage to work in harmony to build this construction which is an artistic wonder?

-If you divide a termite nest into two during the first stages of its construction, and then reunite it, you will see that all passage-ways, canals and roads fit each other. How can this miraculous event be explained?

The conclusion to be derived from this example is that Allah has created all living beings uniquely and without any prior example. Even one termite nest is enough for a person to comprehend Allah and believe that He is the One Who created all.

Harun Yahya

"Has not the time yet arrived for those who believe that their hearts should feel humbled at the remembrance of ALLAH and at the truth which has come down to them"
:)
« Last Edit: July 14, 2011, 03:08:17 AM by AbdulAziz »
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

?

AbdulAziz

  • 613
  • Slave Of Allah
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #153 on: July 14, 2011, 03:06:45 AM »
From the book Good Known Through Reason

Quote
STARS AND PLANETS
Let us first look at what is meant by the word "star" in the Qur'an. The stars denoted by the words "najm" (star) and "kandil" (lamp) in the Qur'an have two main functions as implied in the verses. They are a source of light and they are used for navigation. Particularly in the verses depicting the resurrection day, it is stressed that the lights of the stars are put out and become dim. When the sun, which is a star as well is referred to, the word "kandil "is used. The word "kandil" is also used when referring to the stars adorning the sky. Yet a very important distinction is made where the word "nur" (light) is used for the moon. In this way, the stars and the objects that are not stars are distinguished from one another. This fact, which could not have been known 14 centuries ago, is one of the miracles of the Qur'an. We had mentioned that the second function of the stars as they are referred to in the verses is as a guide to navigation. These verses make it plain that people can determine the right direction by the help of the stars in the sky. In all of these verses, the word "najm" is used. Indeed, before the invention of the compass, which has a very significant role at the outset of the geographical discoveries in the Middle Ages, navigation was only possible with the help of the stars on night voyages.

How is it possible that the stars show direction? It is possible only if they are arranged in an observable order in their fixed places. If a star appeared in one place one night, and in another the next, it would be impossible to find one's way by it. In this context, the particular places where the stars appear in the sky have great importance. In the Qur'an, Allah says: Nay, I swear by the places of the stars And behold! that verily is a tremendous oath, if you but knew. (Surat al-Waqia, 75-76)


 THE SUN AND THE MOON
There are many verses in the Qur'an that make mention of the sun and the moon. An interesting property is revealed when their Arabic wording is investigated. In the verses, the words "siraj" (lamp) and "wahhaj" (brightly-burning) are used for the sun. For the moon, the word "muneer" (enlightening, shiny) is used. Indeed, while the sun produces an enormous amount of heat and light as a result of the nuclear reactions inside, the moon merely reflects the light it receives from the sun. The verses make reference to this distinction as follows:

Do you not see how God has created seven heavens in full harmony with one another, and has made the moon a light therein, and made the sun a (radiant) lamp? (Surah Nuh, 15-16)

We have built above you seven strong heavens, and have placed (therein the sun), a lamp full of blazing splendour. (Surat an-Naba, 12-13)

Blessed Is He Who has set up in the skies constellations, and has placed among them a (radiant) lamp and a light-giving moon. (Surat al-Furqan, 61)

The difference between the sun and the moon is quite evident in the verses. One is depicted as a source of light and the other as a light-reflecting agent. It is impossible for such a detail to have been known at that time. It was not until centuries later that men came into possession of this knowledge. Therefore, the fact that this information was already given in the Qur'an is one of the proofs that the Qur'an was revealed by God. Now, let us turn our attention to another magnificent characteristic of the heavenly bodies - which is their movements in space.

ORBITS DESCRIBED IN THE QUR'AN
Above, we have stated that the heavenly bodies are in motion in space. These movements are fully controlled and all bodies move in a computed orbit. In the Qur'an, certain verses referring to the sun and the moon run as follows: "The sun and the moon follow courses (exactly) computed". (Surat ar-Rahman, 5) "It is not for the sun to catch up the moon, nor does the night outstrip the day. Each (just) swims along in (its own) orbit." (Surah Yasin, 40) Another verse to the same effect declares:

It is He Who created the night and the day, and the sun and the moon. They swim along, each in an orbit. (Surat al-Anbiya, 33)

According to a currently acknowledged theory, massive and voluminous bodies in the universe exert a gravitational force on smaller bodies. For example, the moon makes an orbit around the earth, which has a bigger volume. The earth and other planets in the solar system move in an orbit around the sun. There exists a still bigger system around which the solar system makes an orbit. The most critical point in all these details is that none of the stars, planets and other bodies in space make an uncontrolled move, cut across each other's orbit, or hit one another. The Qur'an signifies the harmonious movement of these bodies as follows:

By the sky full of paths and orbits. (Surat adh-Dhariyat, 7)

The sun, as one of the billions of stars in the universe, travels more than 17 million kilometers a day in space. This journey of the sun is referred to by Allah as follows:

And the sun runs on unto a resting-place for him. That is the decree of (Him), the Exalted in Might, the All-Knowing. (Surah Yasin, 38)

THE UNIQUENESS OF THE FINGERPRINT
The "fingerprint" which is formed on the tip of the finger by the visible pattern the skin takes is absolutely unique to its owner. Every person living on the earth has a different set of fingerprints. All the people who have lived throughout history also had different fingerprints. These prints remain unchanged throughout one's lifetime unless a great injury occurs. That is why the fingerprint is accepted as a very important identity card and used for this purpose around the world. However, two centuries ago, the fingerprint was not so important, because it was only discovered in the late 19th century that all fingerprints are different from one another. In 1880, an English scientist named Henry Faulds stated in an article published in Nature that the fingerprints of people did not change throughout their lives, and that su spects could be convicted by the fingerprints they left on surfaces such as glass.32 In 1884, for the first time a murder was solved by means of identifying fingerprints. Since then, fingerprints have become an important method of identification. Before the 19th century, however, people most probably had never thought that the wavy shapes on their fingertips had any meaning or considered them worthy of note.In the 7th century, the Qur'an pointed out that the fingertips of human beings bore an important characteristic:

Does man think that We cannot assemble his bones? Yes, We are able to put together in perfect order the very tips of his fingers. (Surat al-Qiyama, 3-4)

"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

?

Crustinator

  • 7813
  • Bamhammer horror!
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #154 on: July 14, 2011, 04:36:43 AM »
Crustinator
I already answered your question twice

No you didn't. You posted an irrelevant wall of text.

All you need to do is start your post with the following words:

"I would prove to someone else that you exist by..."

*

Tausami

  • Head Editor
  • Flat Earth Editor
  • 6767
  • Venerated Official of the High Zetetic Council
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #155 on: July 14, 2011, 04:41:02 AM »
Abdul, you just posted 5 essays. I am not going to read them. If you want to convert me, try posting smaller.

*

Lorddave

  • 18127
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #156 on: July 14, 2011, 05:12:33 AM »
You said Mohommed was a perfect person. But I think our definitions of perfection are different.

Does a perfect person have perfect timing?
Does a perfect person have perfect DNA?
Does a perfect person pass on all their perfect genes?
Is the son of a perfect person also perfect?
Does a perfect person marry a perfect woman?
Does a perfect person ever lie, even if it is to save someone's life?
Does a perfect person have a perfectly beautiful face?
Does a perfect person ever get sick?
Does a perfect person ever make a mistake?
Does a perfect person ever drink when they are not thirsty?
Does a perfect person eat when they are not hungry?
Does a perfect person ever eat or drink more than they need?
Does a perfect person ever step in mud or animal droppings?
Does a perfect person ever pet a dog?
Does a perfect person ever do something without need?
Does a perfect person ever have want?
Does a perfect person ever die of old age?
Does a perfect person always say the perfect words to sway others?
Does a perfect person understands all he learns perfectly on the first instruction? (ie. He can build a house perfectly by watching someone build a house only once)

Please answer yes or no.
You have been ignored for common interest of mankind.

I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

*

Chris Spaghetti

  • Flat Earth Editor
  • 12744
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #157 on: July 14, 2011, 05:51:33 AM »
Quote
Those who listen to the Word, and follow the best (meaning) in it: those are the ones whom God has guided, and those are the ones endued with understanding.

Translation: Those who want to believe, do believe.


Quote
Quote
Once more, the net amount of mass/energy in the universe is mathematically zero. Nothing has been 'created' or 'destroyed' merely changed states as is consistent with what we know about quantum physics (See quantum foam and vacuum energy)

Can you explain more about the quantum foam? Is it an established fact! Or it’s just idea! Plus I did found this > Quantum foam is theorized to be created by virtual particles of very high energy? Created?


In essence, in the empty vacuum of the universe, there is a constant stream of virtual particles simply appearing and destroying one another. The best way to detact this is to put two unchargde metal plates as close as possible to one another in a vacuum and measure the enrgy hitting both plates.

When I say that nothing has been created or destroyed, merely changed states, I mean it literally, if you want the mathematics behind gravity acting as a 'negative' force see here: http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/gpot.html

Quote
Just because you cannot see the signs you cannot say it’s not, just because the blind can’t see the sun he shouldn’t deny the existence of the sun :) plus What do you mean nothing is unstable


I mean that if you take an area of space, remove from it every single molecule and joule of energy, virtual particles will start popping in and out of existence. Nature really does abhor a vacuum.

Quote
Quote

Well this is awkward, because the expansion of the universe is not steady, Hubble's observations demonstrate that it is expanding and accelerating.

Can you read Arabic? Because what you said is not contradicting with the verse at all, in fact it supports it.


No, I'm reading your translation, don't blame me for crappy linguistics here!

Care to provide a better translation (with source) or do simply expect me to accept that it really says the opposite of what you have posted that it says?

Quote
Quote
Bullshit plain and simple. This is the result of a five-second google, http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2009/05/01/the-evolution-of-the-immune-system/

It seems I have to register to read the article!

You shouldn't need to, but either way there are a great number of studies on immunity and its evolutionary history. One of the evidences of evolutionary lineage is the patterns of retroviral immunity in DNA.

Quote
Quote
It would be impossible today for a city to survive for long without a fire service and look at all those trucks, men, call centres, satelite uplinks, equipment, fire alarms etc etc etc can we then conclude that New York City and London have always existed as they are today with a fully functioning fire service? Of course not, the fire service has grown in synchronisation with the city to respond to the city's needs, just as a 1940s fire service couldn't hope to keep a modern London safe, so an immune system from 10,000 years ago couldn't protect a modern human.
So are you claiming there was a beginning for the universe?


Eh? Can anybody else read Abdul's conclusion from my post?

Quote
Plus was the first human born adult or infant? How he survived?


See, this is simply evidence that you are utterly ignorant about evolution.

There was no 'first human.' There has been a steady change of hominids towards modern humans over the last 2 million years or so. To put a finger on when the first 'human' appeared is a little like putting your finger on the very spot when the beach becomes the sea.

Quote
Quote
It isn't 'chance' at all! We can accurately simulate golf, buildings, explosions, the movement of planets, the synthesis of protein, the splitting of cells, the movement of water, the expansion of gas, the flow of electricity etc etc because they're all beholden to the phisical proprties of the universe around us!

Before I comment I need to explain more, are you claiming your belief everything into existence came not by chance, accident or there was a cause?

Trying to word this as carefully as I can to forgo confusion. No agent consciously or deliberately caused the universe to exist. We do not know the precise conditions which created the universe we have todaybut it seems that the formation of something, rather than nothing is an inevitability.

Quote
To put it simply, can Chris come into existence and have life without being created, can another Chris come into existence without being created?  When I read such comments I don’t know why but I immediately remember what Allah said in the Quran:

I don't believe I was 'created.' I mean, I know my parents must have done the nasty but beyond that I'm pretty certain they didn't do much conscious 'creating'


?

Thork

Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #158 on: July 14, 2011, 06:17:10 AM »
This thread is full of selfish. AbdulAziz, please have some consideration for other users.

You do not need to copypasta pages of text. A simple link like this can take people to the pages you copy from.
Then users can choose to read the insane drivel of some Muslim cleric if they so please.

?

Demouse

  • 323
  • Mods don't like my haiku
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #159 on: July 14, 2011, 06:38:07 AM »
Quote
AbdulAziz have you watched the "A Universe From Nothing" lecture by lawrence Krauss?

It is an hour long but worth it if you want to understand where we are coming from in regards to matter from nothing and quantum fluctuations.



If you can't be bothered watching it let me know so I don't assume you have.

Thanks for the link Demouse, sadly youtube doesn’t work in my work place and at home I barely use the net, however the name is familiar, but I need to be sure if I saw it or not, but anyway to save my time, can you please give me the summary of the video if you don’t mind?


Here is mirror link to it.

http://www.mefeedia.com/video/24788590

I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to do it justice with a quick summary however.

He explains quantum fluctuations in a way that most people would be able to understand.

They also explain how we know the total energy of the universe is zero and therefore the big bang doesn't break the laws of entropy. It helped me to fully understand what exactly people are talking about when they throw those words around.

He explains how they know that the mass of the universe is somthing like 70% nothing and 29% dark energy and dark matter. None of which interact with real matter and energy beyond gravity.

Really tohugh it is too much for me to give a summary of that I would be satisfied with. I'll re-watch it and try however if you cannot access that second link.


____________________________________________

Oh Skycake.... Why are you so delicious?


Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #160 on: July 15, 2011, 04:06:37 PM »
1.God creates human beings
2.Gives them the power to think for themselves and come to logical conclusions
3.Sends them to hell when they think it's more logical that there is no god or if there is he probably doesn't care what humans do

Seems legit

?

Crustinator

  • 7813
  • Bamhammer horror!
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #161 on: July 16, 2011, 03:46:50 AM »
god creates dinosaurs.
god destroys dinosaurs.
god creates man.
man destroys god.
man creates dinosaurs.
man eats dinosaurs.

*

Lorddave

  • 18127
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #162 on: July 16, 2011, 10:11:15 AM »
god creates dinosaurs.
god destroys dinosaurs.
god creates man.
man destroys god.
man creates dinosaurs.
man eats dinosaurs.
PROFIT!
You have been ignored for common interest of mankind.

I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

?

Demouse

  • 323
  • Mods don't like my haiku
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #163 on: July 20, 2011, 12:48:58 AM »
god creates dinosaurs.
god destroys dinosaurs.
god creates man.
man destroys god.
man creates dinosaurs.
man eats dinosaurs.
PROFIT!

You skipped the
????????????????
step.


back to the whole god thing however. I'm still waiting to see if that link works for you and your reaction to it abdul.

Am I to assume you watched it and are searching for ways to disagree with it before you reply?


____________________________________________

Oh Skycake.... Why are you so delicious?


?

Jie

  • 234
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #164 on: July 20, 2011, 08:36:45 AM »
back to the whole god thing however. I'm still waiting to see if that link works for you and your reaction to it abdul.

Am I to assume you watched it and are searching for ways to disagree with it before you reply?

It's possible that the site may be blocked in his country.
"Yesterday is history, tomorrow, a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it's called the present" -- Master Oogway, from Kung Fu Panda

*

Lorddave

  • 18127
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #165 on: July 20, 2011, 08:38:21 AM »
I think he's given up.  After 9 pages and only hoppy agreeing that God must exist, he must be pretty depressed about us infidels.
You have been ignored for common interest of mankind.

I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

?

Jie

  • 234
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #166 on: July 20, 2011, 08:40:46 AM »
I think he's given up.  After 9 pages and only hoppy agreeing that God must exist, he must be pretty depressed about us infidels.

Could be that too.
"Yesterday is history, tomorrow, a mystery, but today is a gift. That is why it's called the present" -- Master Oogway, from Kung Fu Panda

?

Crustinator

  • 7813
  • Bamhammer horror!
Re: AbdulAziz Proving The Existence Of God
« Reply #167 on: July 25, 2011, 03:57:16 PM »
Plus Abdul could never even convince you I exist. So what hope convincing you that God exists?!