Atheism and other issues

Quote from: Tom Bishop on April 05, 2011, 02:32:32 PM

Quote from: New Earth on April 05, 2011, 02:18:38 PM

Let's assume that an earth is an infinite plain as described in John Davis model. Our known continents are just a tiny section of this infinite slab. Surrounding our known world is of course the ice wall. How far do you think the ice wall extends?

If we're assuming that the earth is an infinite plane then the answer is obvious.

Quote

How far away do you think are other worlds of this infinite plain beyond the ice wall?

Who says that there are other worlds?

To assume that there are no other worlds is the same reasoning as assuming that earth is the only planet that can sustain life in a spherical model.

No the answer is not obvious. There is no evidence that the ice wall is infinite and there is nothing beyond it. That makes no sense unless of course you are an atheist.

Actually, an atheist is much more likely to think there may be something more than a creationist would.  It is not logical for the atheist to assume that we are unique, special, and alone in the universe.

Wrong. True creationists believe in life elsewhere, because we believe in creator God. Since he is a creator we assume he created many worlds. The Christian church is very dogmatic and narrow minded and even thou they claim to believe in creator God in reality they don't because in every church I been to, pastor said there is only one world, our world.

Atheists on the other hand do not believe in creator, so for them an infinite lifeless tundra makes sense, since there is no God and everything is accidental such endless wasteland might as well be a reality.

However to a person who truly believes in creator, infinite ice with no life is unacceptable, because that would specify the lack of creativity, not the creator God.

Atheists on the other hand do not believe in creator, so for them an infinite lifeless tundra makes sense, since there is no God and everything is accidental such endless wasteland might as well be a reality.

sorry, just because there is no creator, given the extrordinary amount of places life can occur, we are pretty sure there is life elsewhere

Quote from: New Earth on April 05, 2011, 08:35:09 PM

Atheists on the other hand do not believe in creator, so for them an infinite lifeless tundra makes sense, since there is no God and everything is accidental such endless wasteland might as well be a reality.

sorry, just because there is no creator, given the extrordinary amount of places life can occur, we are pretty sure there is life elsewhere

Then why does Tom Bishop think that beyond the ice wall is endless sunless tundra?

Quote from: vhu9644 on April 05, 2011, 09:00:33 PM

Quote from: New Earth on April 05, 2011, 08:35:09 PM

Atheists on the other hand do not believe in creator, so for them an infinite lifeless tundra makes sense, since there is no God and everything is accidental such endless wasteland might as well be a reality.

sorry, just because there is no creator, given the extrordinary amount of places life can occur, we are pretty sure there is life elsewhere

Then why does Tom Bishop think that beyond the ice wall is endless sunless tundra?

he just states:

Quote from: New Earth on April 05, 2011, 02:18:38 PM

Let's assume that an earth is an infinite plain as described in John Davis model. Our known continents are just a tiny section of this infinite slab. Surrounding our known world is of course the ice wall. How far do you think the ice wall extends?

Who says that there are other worlds?

he questions if there are any

Wrong. True creationists believe in life elsewhere, because we believe in creator God. Since he is a creator we assume he created many worlds. The Christian church is very dogmatic and narrow minded and even thou they claim to believe in creator God in reality they don't because in every church I been to, pastor said there is only one world, our world.

Atheists on the other hand do not believe in creator, so for them an infinite lifeless tundra makes sense, since there is no God and everything is accidental such endless wasteland might as well be a reality.

However to a person who truly believes in creator, infinite ice with no life is unacceptable, because that would specify the lack of creativity, not the creator God.

Atheists do not believe in anything. That is the point of Atheism.

Observational evidence indicates that there are many planets like our own in our Galaxy, some of which are quite close. There is no belief in this, it is through simple observation that it has been deduced. Given the size of the Universe, it is extremely irrational to propose that life only exists here.

You claim the Church does not believe in a God because their concept of a creator disagrees with yours? No.

Quote from: New Earth on April 05, 2011, 08:35:09 PM

Wrong. True creationists believe in life elsewhere, because we believe in creator God. Since he is a creator we assume he created many worlds. The Christian church is very dogmatic and narrow minded and even thou they claim to believe in creator God in reality they don't because in every church I been to, pastor said there is only one world, our world.

Atheists on the other hand do not believe in creator, so for them an infinite lifeless tundra makes sense, since there is no God and everything is accidental such endless wasteland might as well be a reality.

However to a person who truly believes in creator, infinite ice with no life is unacceptable, because that would specify the lack of creativity, not the creator God.

 



Atheists do not believe in anything. That is the point of Atheism.

Observational evidence indicates that there are many planets like our own in our Galaxy, some of which are quite close. There is no belief in this, it is through simple observation that it has been deduced. Given the size of the Universe, it is extremely irrational to propose that life only exists here.

You claim the Church does not believe in a God because their concept of a creator disagrees with yours? No.

First of all Atheism is still a belief. It is a belief in no God. Since the existence of God hasn't been disproven, it requires somewhat of a faith in his non existence. Therefore Atheism serves as a religion for non religious.

Church's concept of a creator is extremely narrow minded and humanistic. They simplify God, attributing human standards to a non human entity. They base all their knowledge off a one book called the bible and if something is not in the bible they don't want to hear it. I believe in an all mighty creator of the universe. I also fully realize that his ways are beyond my understanding. Unlike the church I will never tell you what God wants you to do, to say such things would be ignorant and unwise. And unlike church my God created many worlds. My God is an artist and a craftsman and I have never seen any any great artist that only painted one painting, likewise the God that I believe in created many universes and many worlds. The conventional church teachings will tell you that he only created one. The church does not disagree with me, the church disagrees with God.

Quote from: Vindictus on April 05, 2011, 10:46:49 PM

Quote from: New Earth on April 05, 2011, 08:35:09 PM

Wrong. True creationists believe in life elsewhere, because we believe in creator God. Since he is a creator we assume he created many worlds. The Christian church is very dogmatic and narrow minded and even thou they claim to believe in creator God in reality they don't because in every church I been to, pastor said there is only one world, our world.

Atheists on the other hand do not believe in creator, so for them an infinite lifeless tundra makes sense, since there is no God and everything is accidental such endless wasteland might as well be a reality.

However to a person who truly believes in creator, infinite ice with no life is unacceptable, because that would specify the lack of creativity, not the creator God.

 
Well I guess this site already argues for the second most riddiculous and logically/scientifically flawed theory out there as it's primary function so I guess i shouldn't be suprised to find people using the most riddicuouls and scentifically/logically flawed theory to support the first argument.


Atheists do not believe in anything. That is the point of Atheism.

Observational evidence indicates that there are many planets like our own in our Galaxy, some of which are quite close. There is no belief in this, it is through simple observation that it has been deduced. Given the size of the Universe, it is extremely irrational to propose that life only exists here.

You claim the Church does not believe in a God because their concept of a creator disagrees with yours? No.

First of all Atheism is still a belief. It is a belief in no God. Since the existence of God hasn't been disproven, it requires somewhat of a faith in his non existence. Therefore Atheism serves as a religion for non religious.

Church's concept of a creator is extremely narrow minded and humanistic. They simplify God, attributing human standards to a non human entity. They base all their knowledge off a one book called the bible and if something is not in the bible they don't want to hear it. I believe in an all mighty creator of the universe. I also fully realize that his ways are beyond my understanding. Unlike the church I will never tell you what God wants you to do, to say such things would be ignorant and unwise. And unlike church my God created many worlds. My God is an artist and a craftsman and I have never seen any any great artist that only painted one painting, likewise the God that I believe in created many universes and many worlds. The conventional church teachings will tell you that he only created one. The church does not disagree with me, the church disagrees with God.

Edit: somhow my text dissappeared

Arguing for the second most riddiculous and Illogical/Unscientific theory using the most riddiculous and Illogical/Unscientific theory is and excercise in pointless.

Only reason Creationism gets more scientific exposure than round earth is because far more morons are exposed to it at a younger age than FET

First of all Atheism is still a belief. It is a belief in no God. Since the existence of God hasn't been disproven, it requires somewhat of a faith in his non existence. Therefore Atheism serves as a religion for non religious.

Exactly. You claimed Atheists believe in 'Science', or an 'empty Universe'. That's wrong.

Church's concept of a creator is extremely narrow minded and humanistic. They simplify God, attributing human standards to a non human entity. They base all their knowledge off a one book called the bible and if something is not in the bible they don't want to hear it. I believe in an all mighty creator of the universe. I also fully realize that his ways are beyond my understanding. Unlike the church I will never tell you what God wants you to do, to say such things would be ignorant and unwise. And unlike church my God created many worlds. My God is an artist and a craftsman and I have never seen any any great artist that only painted one painting, likewise the God that I believe in created many universes and many worlds. The conventional church teachings will tell you that he only created one. The church does not disagree with me, the church disagrees with God.

You're still claiming your God is the real one, as opposed to the Christian God.

I believe in an all mighty creator of the universe. I also fully realize that his ways are beyond my understanding.

If His ways are beyond your understanding, why do you then immediately start describing Him?

And unlike church my God created many worlds. My God is an artist and a craftsman and I have never seen any any great artist that only painted one painting, likewise the God that I believe in created many universes and many worlds.

Atheists do not believe in anything. That is the point of Atheism.

Observational evidence indicates that there are many planets like our own in our Galaxy, some of which are quite close. There is no belief in this, it is through simple observation that it has been deduced. Given the size of the Universe, it is extremely irrational to propose that life only exists here.

Quote from: New Earth on April 05, 2011, 11:22:39 PM

First of all Atheism is still a belief. It is a belief in no God. Since the existence of God hasn't been disproven, it requires somewhat of a faith in his non existence. Therefore Atheism serves as a religion for non religious.

Exactly. You claimed Atheists believe in 'Science', or an 'empty Universe'. That's wrong.

Technically, by definition, Atheists believe specifically in the non-existence of a supernatural or higher god-like power.  Although they may have other 'beliefs' not related to religion or theology.

It is the agnostic who reserves judgment and does not side as they admit that such concepts are inherently unknowable.  As a practicing agnostic who has regular discussions with a practicing atheist at my work, I'm well aware of the differences.

Wrong. True creationists believe in life elsewhere, because we believe in creator God. Since he is a creator we assume he created many worlds. The Christian church is very dogmatic and narrow minded and even thou they claim to believe in creator God in reality they don't because in every church I been to, pastor said there is only one world, our world.

Atheists on the other hand do not believe in creator, so for them an infinite lifeless tundra makes sense, since there is no God and everything is accidental such endless wasteland might as well be a reality.

However to a person who truly believes in creator, infinite ice with no life is unacceptable, because that would specify the lack of creativity, not the creator God.

Church's concept of a creator is extremely narrow minded and humanistic. They simplify God, attributing human standards to a non human entity. They base all their knowledge off a one book called the bible and if something is not in the bible they don't want to hear it. I believe in an all mighty creator of the universe. I also fully realize that his ways are beyond my understanding. Unlike the church I will never tell you what God wants you to do, to say such things would be ignorant and unwise. And unlike church my God created many worlds. My God is an artist and a craftsman and I have never seen any any great artist that only painted one painting, likewise the God that I believe in created many universes and many worlds. The conventional church teachings will tell you that he only created one. The church does not disagree with me, the church disagrees with God.

You just contradicted yourself, conventional creationists believe they are special and unique in the eyes of God, this is contradictory to the belief that life exists elsewhere other than this planet.  As for the Atheist,
"since there is no God and everything is accidental", then there is a high probability of there actually being life somewhere else in the universe... if it happened once, it is likely to happen again in an almost limitless environment, no matter how remote the odd if it happening in the specific instance.

The conventional church teachings will tell you that he only created one. The church does not disagree with me, the church disagrees with God.

Which church is this 'conventional church' anyway? Is it the Catholics? Because the Pope has already stated that the possibility of alien life is compatible with the Catholic faith.

Quote from: New Earth on April 05, 2011, 11:22:39 PM

The conventional church teachings will tell you that he only created one. The church does not disagree with me, the church disagrees with God.

Which church is this 'conventional church' anyway? Is it the Catholics? Because the Pope has already stated that the possibility of alien life is compatible with the Catholic faith.

The pope has also stated that the earth is round and orbits the sun.  So what does he know?

Quote from: fluffycornsnake on April 06, 2011, 11:27:08 AM

Quote from: New Earth on April 05, 2011, 11:22:39 PM

The conventional church teachings will tell you that he only created one. The church does not disagree with me, the church disagrees with God.

Which church is this 'conventional church' anyway? Is it the Catholics? Because the Pope has already stated that the possibility of alien life is compatible with the Catholic faith.

The pope has also stated that the earth is round and orbits the sun.  So what does he know?

Certainly, Brother Markjo. I completely agree with you that the Vatican's support of RET is unacceptable. But nevertheless, in the absence of any Catholics to defend themselves, I was greatly compelled by a sense of British fair play to correct New Earth's baseless accusations.

Technically, by definition, Atheists believe specifically in the non-existence of a supernatural or higher god-like power.  Although they may have other 'beliefs' not related to religion or theology.

It is the agnostic who reserves judgment and does not side as they admit that such concepts are inherently unknowable.  As a practicing agnostic who has regular discussions with a practicing atheist at my work, I'm well aware of the differences.

That's what I said.

The Agnostic says: "I don't know"
The Atheist says: "I don't believe"

I for one, though have no real prompted reason to, beleive somewhere beyond the ice wall there could be another sun like object. Not that we could get there, and not that if would be liveable perhaps. Its more of a hope I guess.

I for one, though have no real prompted reason to, beleive somewhere beyond the ice wall there could be another sun like object. Not that we could get there, and not that if would be liveable perhaps. Its more of a hope I guess.

And I assure you it is a greatly justified hope. The chance of there being only one sun above this infinite plane is infinitesimal. I have hope that humankind may one day discover similar habitats to our own beyond the ice barrier.

Those tears were about something else just so you know.

They could be though an infinite distance away.

Those tears were about something else just so you know.

They could be though an infinite distance away.

Most undeniable, but not insurmountable: we must hope that a far-future generation shall develop the technological keys which unlock infinity.

Those tears were about something else just so you know.

They could be though an infinite distance away.

No they are not. If our current earth is an infinite plain (which of course its not) then just beyond the ice wall are Atlantis and Lemuria. I remember Sandakhan posted some article (forgot exactly where) about Admiral Bird's expedition and that due south of south pole, Bird encountered unexplored land, with pleasant climate. If this is true that means that Admiral Bird passed the ice wall and soon after was flying over a new continent.

Now to address what Fluffy Corn was saying; Yes God's ways are unknown to us, however certain things can be easily observed. The most easily observable trait of God is his creativity and his creation.

Do we have solid evidence that he made many worlds and many planets? Yes we do, unfortunately its been classified by world's governments.

Now to address what Fluffy Corn was saying; Yes God's ways are unknown to us, however certain things can be easily observed. The most easily observable trait of God is his creativity and his creation.

This does not infer that God created more than one Earth. Perhaps one degenerate, corrupted world was enough.

Do we have solid evidence that he made many worlds and many planets? Yes we do, unfortunately its been classified by world's governments.

And you have seen this evidence, have you?

Do we have solid evidence that he made many worlds and many planets? Yes we do, unfortunately its been classified by world's governments.

Of course. And the only civilian who knows about the evidence is a little kid who tells people he's gangsta.

Quote from: New Earth on April 06, 2011, 02:15:19 PM

Now to address what Fluffy Corn was saying; Yes God's ways are unknown to us, however certain things can be easily observed. The most easily observable trait of God is his creativity and his creation.

This does not infer that God created more than one Earth. Perhaps one degenerate, corrupted world was enough.

Quote from: New Earth on April 06, 2011, 02:15:19 PM

Do we have solid evidence that he made many worlds and many planets? Yes we do, unfortunately its been classified by world's governments.

And you have seen this evidence, have you?

And where is your evidence that the world is flat? You believe that government conspiracy is hiding the true shape of the earth, by that logic, don't you think they can also hide the continents that they discovered beyond the ice wall? 

By the way admins, Tausami is harassing me.

Quote from: fluffycornsnake on April 06, 2011, 02:50:16 PM

Quote from: New Earth on April 06, 2011, 02:15:19 PM

Do we have solid evidence that he made many worlds and many planets? Yes we do, unfortunately its been classified by world's governments.

And you have seen this evidence, have you?

And where is your evidence that the world is flat? You believe that government conspiracy is hiding the true shape of the earth, by that logic, don't you think they can also hide the continents that they discovered beyond the ice wall? 

The evidence is all around me. Yes, they can. Are you going to answer my question?

No of course I didn't see such evidence. I don't have top secret clearance.

Quote from: Oracle on April 06, 2011, 11:15:24 AM

Technically, by definition, Atheists believe specifically in the non-existence of a supernatural or higher god-like power.  Although they may have other 'beliefs' not related to religion or theology.

It is the agnostic who reserves judgment and does not side as they admit that such concepts are inherently unknowable.  As a practicing agnostic who has regular discussions with a practicing atheist at my work, I'm well aware of the differences.

That's what I said.

The Agnostic says: "I don't know"
The Atheist says: "I don't believe"

You might consider it a matter of semantics, or perhaps I'm being just a bit pedantic... however there is a distinct difference between:

"I don't believe" and "I believe there is not"

One is a solid belief that something does not exist, while the other implies a lack of belief which is more agnostic than it is atheistic "I don't believe because I don't know".

Do we have solid evidence that he made many worlds and many planets? Yes we do, unfortunately its been classified by world's governments.

No of course I didn't see such evidence. I don't have top secret clearance.

Please explain your knowledge of the solid evidence which you have never seen before.

Quote from: New Earth on April 06, 2011, 02:15:19 PM

Do we have solid evidence that he made many worlds and many planets? Yes we do, unfortunately its been classified by world's governments.

Quote from: New Earth on April 06, 2011, 07:19:16 PM

No of course I didn't see such evidence. I don't have top secret clearance.

Please explain your knowledge of the solid evidence which you have never seen before.

I think it may be the same sort of solid evidence that many FE'ers have of the NASA conspiracy.  ie.

"I believe the world is flat" therefore "NASA is lying to us".
"I believe extra-terrestrial aliens have visited the earth from other worlds" therefore "the government is covering it up".

Quote from: New Earth on April 06, 2011, 02:15:19 PM

Do we have solid evidence that he made many worlds and many planets? Yes we do, unfortunately its been classified by world's governments.

Quote from: New Earth on April 06, 2011, 07:19:16 PM

No of course I didn't see such evidence. I don't have top secret clearance.

Please explain your knowledge of the solid evidence which you have never seen before.

Even you told me that you believe that there are other worlds on an infinite plain, and now you are putting me on the spot with this BS? Come on.

Quote from: fluffycornsnake on April 07, 2011, 03:48:13 AM

Quote from: New Earth on April 06, 2011, 02:15:19 PM

Do we have solid evidence that he made many worlds and many planets? Yes we do, unfortunately its been classified by world's governments.

Quote from: New Earth on April 06, 2011, 07:19:16 PM

No of course I didn't see such evidence. I don't have top secret clearance.

Please explain your knowledge of the solid evidence which you have never seen before.

Even you told me that you believe that there are other worlds on an infinite plain, and now you are putting me on the spot with this BS? Come on.

Having direct knowledge in something and knowing it as fact is vastly different that believing that something may be true.  You claimed the former, not the latter and presented it as if it were a solid provable fact.