A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #30 on: October 27, 2010, 03:56:22 PM »
The question is how the conspirators figured out the true shape of the Earth while humanity's greatest scientists didn't.

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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #31 on: October 28, 2010, 04:23:09 PM »
Apply that to a rocket and the continual thrust can power it up to a point where UA can take over. 

Assuming RE dynamics the rocket does not continue to accelerate at a rate greater than 9.8m/s/s because it would not need to. The goal as alleged is to reach an established velocity not acceleration. To continue to accelerate to sufficient altitude to interact with the UA would involve more force than the RE model. 
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #32 on: October 28, 2010, 04:27:37 PM »
So, you do know that these people had a motive and a means to support their conspiracy during those centuries. Why don't you illuminate us about that motive and that means of support?

The motive for a conspiracy of this magnitude is power. The means follows the acquisition.
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #33 on: October 28, 2010, 04:53:11 PM »
So, you do know that these people had a motive and a means to support their conspiracy during those centuries. Why don't you illuminate us about that motive and that means of support?

The motive for a conspiracy of this magnitude is power. The means follows the acquisition.

You still haven't explained HOW the conspirators knew about the "true" shape of the Earth when humanity's greatest scientists didn't.

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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #34 on: October 28, 2010, 05:12:43 PM »
So, you do know that these people had a motive and a means to support their conspiracy during those centuries. Why don't you illuminate us about that motive and that means of support?

The motive for a conspiracy of this magnitude is power. The means follows the acquisition.

You still haven't explained HOW the conspirators knew about the "true" shape of the Earth when humanity's greatest scientists didn't.

Flat earth cosmology hardly began in the 15th century  ???
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #35 on: October 28, 2010, 05:14:39 PM »
So, you do know that these people had a motive and a means to support their conspiracy during those centuries. Why don't you illuminate us about that motive and that means of support?

The motive for a conspiracy of this magnitude is power. The means follows the acquisition.

You still haven't explained HOW the conspirators knew about the "true" shape of the Earth when humanity's greatest scientists didn't.

Flat earth cosmology hardly began in the 15th century  ???

Then how do you know that the conspirators are right when humanity's greatest scientists aren't?  If satellites aren't real and part of the conspiracy, as are the Moon landing supposed "hoax" conspiracy, how would the conspirators know any better?

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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #36 on: October 28, 2010, 08:33:17 PM »
Perhaps you could rephrase your question, as I don't think I comprehend it (and don't want to be accused of having ignored or misdirected the issue in my answer).
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

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trig

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #37 on: October 29, 2010, 07:08:15 AM »
So, you do know that these people had a motive and a means to support their conspiracy during those centuries. Why don't you illuminate us about that motive and that means of support?

The motive for a conspiracy of this magnitude is power. The means follows the acquisition.
You have a tentative, although laughable, claim to a power source for the Conspiracy in the billions of dollars that are assigned tfor space exploration to NASA. What is the claimed source of power during the previous 550 years? Maybe the scientists were easily out of their lunch money, and that was enough for a worldwide conspiracy? Maybe the few coins that the governments and monarchies gave to pure science were enough to fuel a conspiracy that was greater than the Roman Catholic Church?

If you understand anything about humanity it should be that power is expensive. If you do not have a means to make that power produce its own resources, money will run out in years, or maybe in months.

Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #38 on: October 29, 2010, 12:58:48 PM »
Perhaps you could rephrase your question, as I don't think I comprehend it (and don't want to be accused of having ignored or misdirected the issue in my answer).

Galileo said that the world is round.
Newton said that the world is round.
Einstein said that the world is round.
Stephen Hawkings says that the world is round.
Today's top scientists say that the world is round.

The conspirators apparently secretly say that the world is flat.

Tell me; how do the conspirators know that the world is supposedly flat?  Did god come down and tell them?  Did aliens come to them and tell them?

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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #39 on: October 29, 2010, 02:12:06 PM »
You have a tentative, although laughable, claim to a power source for the Conspiracy in the billions of dollars that are assigned tfor space exploration to NASA. What is the claimed source of power during the previous 550 years? Maybe the scientists were easily out of their lunch money, and that was enough for a worldwide conspiracy? Maybe the few coins that the governments and monarchies gave to pure science were enough to fuel a conspiracy that was greater than the Roman Catholic Church?

If you understand anything about humanity it should be that power is expensive. If you do not have a means to make that power produce its own resources, money will run out in years, or maybe in months.

Quote from: Ski
In the late 15th century cartography was entering an exciting new time. New lands were being found. Previously uncharted islands, indeed even continents, were being added to world maps. The BGMG found a splendid way to find massive amounts of Royal funding (commissions). If you convince burgeoning world powers that their maps are completely inadequate and only a globe can accurately depict the earth, you're in for a lot of commissioned work. Add to that the fact globes became a status symbol in vogue among the wealthy of the period and you have an enormous cash cow.
But this ignores (or only scrapes) the actual depth of the plan. The goal of the BGMG was not map-making or wealth from it. The goal was power. To gain influence at court led to all sorts of potential for abuse of such power. This was an age where the court was the center of power; "scientists" vied to have their ideas heard. The difference between living in obscurity and becoming a household name was a "discovery" away. Further, it was the Age of Discovery, where untold wealth might be a ship's journey away for a kingdom -- indeed this was the genesis of European imperialism. Map makers invented islands and continents to attain funding for expeditions. The closer you find yourselves to the strings of power, the more opportunity for corruption.
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #40 on: October 29, 2010, 02:13:57 PM »
Galileo, et al. said that the world is round.

The conspirators apparently secretly say that the world is flat.

Tell me; how do the conspirators know that the world is supposedly flat?  Did god come down and tell them?  Did aliens come to them and tell them?

Flat earth cosmology predates the conspirators. They weren't inventing a new truth.
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #41 on: October 29, 2010, 02:36:00 PM »
Galileo, et al. said that the world is round.

The conspirators apparently secretly say that the world is flat.

Tell me; how do the conspirators know that the world is supposedly flat?  Did god come down and tell them?  Did aliens come to them and tell them?

Flat earth cosmology predates the conspirators. They weren't inventing a new truth.

Then what reason is there to believe that the conspirators know more than the scientists I listed?  Maybe the conspirators really did pull off such a hoax to try and deceive us into thinking that the world is round when it is, according to them, really flat - but in reality the world actually IS round!  Get it?

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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #42 on: October 29, 2010, 02:48:39 PM »
The true shape of the earth is independent of the opinion held by scientists, conspirators, you or I.  I can just as easily state  -- "in reality the world actually IS flat!"  It gets us nowhere.
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #43 on: October 29, 2010, 02:56:03 PM »
The true shape of the earth is independent of the opinion held by scientists, conspirators, you or I.  I can just as easily state  -- "in reality the world actually IS flat!"  It gets us nowhere.

That isn't my point, and your post is completely irrelevant to the topic.  In fact, it actually proves it false.  Maybe the conspirators are actually wrong and the Earth actually is indeed round.

How would the conspirators know the true shape of the Earth?  And don't say "flat Earth cosmology" because how would the conspirators know that this is the "true" cosmology and why didn't humanity's greatest scientists know this too?

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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #44 on: October 29, 2010, 03:09:17 PM »
  Maybe the conspirators are actually wrong and the Earth actually is indeed round.

Perhaps. But I don't hold my beliefs because of the beliefs of the conspirators.


Quote
And don't say "flat Earth cosmology" because how would the conspirators know that this is the "true" cosmology

How would I divine the reasons they held or chose their beliefs?
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

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markjo

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #45 on: October 29, 2010, 04:22:33 PM »
Tell me; how do the conspirators know that the world is supposedly flat?  Did god come down and tell them?  Did aliens come to them and tell them?

Rowbotham told them.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #46 on: October 29, 2010, 04:39:19 PM »
Tell me; how do the conspirators know that the world is supposedly flat?  Did god come down and tell them?  Did aliens come to them and tell them?

Rowbotham told them.

Zetetic, doctor, philosopher, author, ... time traveler?
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

?

trig

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #47 on: October 29, 2010, 04:42:32 PM »
You have a tentative, although laughable, claim to a power source for the Conspiracy in the billions of dollars that are assigned tfor space exploration to NASA. What is the claimed source of power during the previous 550 years? Maybe the scientists were easily out of their lunch money, and that was enough for a worldwide conspiracy? Maybe the few coins that the governments and monarchies gave to pure science were enough to fuel a conspiracy that was greater than the Roman Catholic Church?

If you understand anything about humanity it should be that power is expensive. If you do not have a means to make that power produce its own resources, money will run out in years, or maybe in months.

Quote from: Ski
In the late 15th century cartography was entering an exciting new time. New lands were being found. Previously uncharted islands, indeed even continents, were being added to world maps. The BGMG found a splendid way to find massive amounts of Royal funding (commissions). If you convince burgeoning world powers that their maps are completely inadequate and only a globe can accurately depict the earth, you're in for a lot of commissioned work. Add to that the fact globes became a status symbol in vogue among the wealthy of the period and you have an enormous cash cow.
But this ignores (or only scrapes) the actual depth of the plan. The goal of the BGMG was not map-making or wealth from it. The goal was power. To gain influence at court led to all sorts of potential for abuse of such power. This was an age where the court was the center of power; "scientists" vied to have their ideas heard. The difference between living in obscurity and becoming a household name was a "discovery" away. Further, it was the Age of Discovery, where untold wealth might be a ship's journey away for a kingdom -- indeed this was the genesis of European imperialism. Map makers invented islands and continents to attain funding for expeditions. The closer you find yourselves to the strings of power, the more opportunity for corruption.
So, the Conspiracy lived off the stipends that the princes and kings gave to a few scientist (or proto-scientists) but even so it became strong enough to obliterate each and every dissenting voice for 450 years or so, until Rowbotham was the only whistle blower. You sure think a worldwide conspiracy is dirt cheap.

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markjo

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #48 on: October 29, 2010, 04:43:16 PM »
Tell me; how do the conspirators know that the world is supposedly flat?  Did god come down and tell them?  Did aliens come to them and tell them?

Rowbotham told them.

Zetetic, doctor, philosopher, author, ... time traveler?

His words are immortal.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

?

sillyrob

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #49 on: October 29, 2010, 06:27:44 PM »
Tell me; how do the conspirators know that the world is supposedly flat?  Did god come down and tell them?  Did aliens come to them and tell them?

Rowbotham told them.

Zetetic, doctor, philosopher, author, ... time traveler?
How about just say that he was a medical doctor and I guess since he wrote a book that makes him an author. Other than that though, he was just crazy.

Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #50 on: October 29, 2010, 06:32:06 PM »
Tell me; how do the conspirators know that the world is supposedly flat?  Did god come down and tell them?  Did aliens come to them and tell them?

Rowbotham told them.

Zetetic, doctor, philosopher, author, ... time traveler?
How about just say that he was a medical doctor and I guess since he wrote a book that makes him an author. Other than that though, he was just crazy.
He was not even a medical doctor, just a quack.
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #51 on: October 29, 2010, 10:57:40 PM »
So, the Conspiracy lived off the stipends that the princes and kings gave to a few scientist (or proto-scientists) but even so it became strong enough to obliterate each and every dissenting voice for 450 years or so, until Rowbotham was the only whistle blower. You sure think a worldwide conspiracy is dirt cheap.

I doubt the geographical connection between the House of Welf, the BGMG and the later Illuminati is coincidental.
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

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trig

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #52 on: October 30, 2010, 05:17:41 AM »
So, the Conspiracy lived off the stipends that the princes and kings gave to a few scientist (or proto-scientists) but even so it became strong enough to obliterate each and every dissenting voice for 450 years or so, until Rowbotham was the only whistle blower. You sure think a worldwide conspiracy is dirt cheap.

I doubt the geographical connection between the House of Welf, the BGMG and the later Illuminati is coincidental.
You are still avoiding the question of power. Silencing the good scientists, lobbying the powerful to accept what the Conspiracy says, maybe taking violent action against opposition, all of that is expensive. And doing it so well that there is not even one person that ever denounced them is even more expensive. And doing so when the poor communications and travel possibilities is again expensive beyond the imaginable.

And the above is true for each of the organizations you mention. Is BGMG the Berlin Society for Mission History? And the House of Welf had power only around western Europe, it is far and away too small to organize a worldwide Conspiracy. And for the Illuminati... well... get some evidence and then we can talk.

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Kira-SY

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #53 on: October 30, 2010, 06:57:04 AM »
I wonder why this site keeps existing, and the FE'ers keep posting and "showing" the truth, while any scientific, writer, or individual is silenced by the Conspirators...
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Ski

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Re: A question that FEers can't seem to answer about the conspiracy
« Reply #54 on: October 30, 2010, 01:41:49 PM »
And the House of Welf had power only around western Europe, it is far and away too small to organize a worldwide Conspiracy.

Surely you jest. The House of Welf has reigned in Bavaria almost uninterrupted throughout modern history, many times as a sovereign nation and through the branches of Hannover and Estes has contributed several monarchs to Germany and England, neither of which I consider "far and away too small" to organize a conspiracy which centers around European powers.


Quote
And for the Illuminati... well... get some evidence and then we can talk.
I'm sure you can google Illuminati as well as anyone else.
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."