Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth

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zork

  • 3319
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #30 on: September 17, 2010, 01:59:43 AM »
Honestly Zork, you need to do some homework.

If I cut a flat section out of the sea bed to make it flat, would the sea be flat on top?

Even if you made your glass bath cut into a flat bit of earth, the liquid would bulge up at the centre to follow the curvature of the earth. You are barking up the wrong tree.
Take a look at your floating process video -
There is no half a mile glass panels there. And yes, if you would make the sea bed flat then the surface is also flat. Or do you think that if you cut the Earth half and pour some water to the flat side then the water would form the another half of the sphere?
Rowbotham had bad eyesight
-
http://thulescientific.com/Lynch%20Curvature%202008.pdf - Visually discerning the curvature of the Earth
http://thulescientific.com/TurbulentShipWakes_Lynch_AO_2005.pdf - Turbulent ship wakes:further evidence that the Earth is round.

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Lorddave

  • 16635
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #31 on: September 17, 2010, 02:09:57 AM »
I love this. In some threads RE'ers say there should be curvature, and now in this one they are saying there isn't any.

You guys need to figure out your theories.

 Take a wooden ball, shave off a little bit in random place and there you are, object with a curvature and a flat area.
Or take a wooden ball and put a flat piece of wood knit.

What is a wood knit? Everything I am finding doesn't look very flat...  :P




My phone doesn't like this forum. I can't see what I type and it auto corrects so it should be on it not knit.
I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

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EnglshGentleman

  • Flat Earth Editor
  • 9548
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #32 on: September 17, 2010, 02:22:30 AM »
I love this. In some threads RE'ers say there should be curvature, and now in this one they are saying there isn't any.

You guys need to figure out your theories.

 Take a wooden ball, shave off a little bit in random place and there you are, object with a curvature and a flat area.
Or take a wooden ball and put a flat piece of wood knit.

What is a wood knit? Everything I am finding doesn't look very flat...  :P

http://www.finniwig.com/images2/knitloom4.jpg

http://s5.thisnext.com/media/largest_dimension/2742FB19.jpg
My phone doesn't like this forum. I can't see what I type and it auto corrects so it should be on it not knit.

Oh ok. I was getting extremely confused what you meant. "Chopsticks prove RE?  ???"

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zork

  • 3319
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #33 on: September 17, 2010, 03:34:43 AM »

The bottom surface makes no difference to the upper surface. Where there are mountain chains under the sea, the sea does not rise up. Where there are valleys under the sea, the sea does not dip.

Even if you made your glass bath cut into a flat bit of earth, the liquid would bulge up at the centre to follow the curvature of the earth. You are barking up the wrong tree.

  I guess you must decide what point you want to make. In the first you say that the surface of the liquid doesn't follow the bottom area but in the second you say that if the bottom is curved then the surface must be curved. What it is then?
Rowbotham had bad eyesight
-
http://thulescientific.com/Lynch%20Curvature%202008.pdf - Visually discerning the curvature of the Earth
http://thulescientific.com/TurbulentShipWakes_Lynch_AO_2005.pdf - Turbulent ship wakes:further evidence that the Earth is round.

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Kira-SY

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Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #34 on: September 17, 2010, 04:04:36 AM »
But the surface of a liquid doesn't follow the form of the bottom... Is this conversation serious? Take a coke bottle, it has like a "star" form on the bottom, but the liquid is flat on the surface. 
Some types of glasses for drinking have the bottom curved, but the liquid is always flat. Because the liquid is free enough to be affected by the force of gravity, so all the molecules are attracted with the same force, so they.. align. Ok I can't explain myself very well, but I'm totally surprised of such a discussion...
The surface of a liquid is independent of the shape of its bottom... You can see that at any second.
Signature under building process, our apologies for the inconveniences

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Vindictus

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Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #35 on: September 17, 2010, 05:52:55 AM »
Quote
Or do you think that if you cut the Earth half and pour some water to the flat side then the water would form the another half of the sphere?

No I do not believe this to be the case because I am a FE. If you summise that the earth is round, this is exactly what you and RE physicists say would happen.

And thank you Kira. You are correct. However, you too are suggesting the earth is flat, if the Coke surface is flat. RE theory suggests it slightly curves with the surface of the earth, as does the swimming pool as does the sea and as does this glass. But as this small curve would be undectable to the human eye, I will let you go with this one.  ;D

RE theorists would suggest a one and a half inch bulge in a liquid half a kilometre long. Whatever size you cut the glass to, the curve will still be there and British Glass do not shave all their glass for earth curvature. That is a fact - vastly expensive and wasteful. Feel free to e-mail them. The refinement process is only to remove imperfections such as un-melted grains of sand and bubbles etc. So the mystery still stands to RE theorists. How do you make perfectly flat glass using a liquid base?

RE isn't a theory. Stop calling it that. We have a society based upon a round Earth and it works perfectly, and all evidence that exists regarding the Earth's shape says it is round. Flat Earth is a theory.

The difference in small sheets of glass is unnoticeable.

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Vindictus

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Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #36 on: September 17, 2010, 06:26:42 AM »
British Glass make large sheets too.

Define Perfect for me. Define flaw-free.

Perfectly flat, flaw-free glass.

IE - with no imperfection. with no flaws. - With no curving.

So my beliefs have to be called theories but yours are facts? It wasn't so long ago (1990's) that Physicists claimed 90% of the universe was anti-matter. Now they say all the anti-matter was destroyed in the big bang, there was 0.1% more matter in the bang and that is the stuff the universe is made of. This year alone Darwin's theories are back under the spot light and not all of his survival of the fittest claims hold true.  Just because Round Earth is the commonly held belief right now, doesn't mean it will be that way forever. The good research of people on this site may well change that.  ;)

No, Thork, that's not the same thing at all.

You're talking about anti matter and evolution. Those are things we cannot understand or prove beyond a doubt due to various reasons. A more suitable example for this argument would be an attempt at proving if your left hand has 5 fingers. You can SEE it does.

There is no reasonable thinking behind the Earth being flat, there is no evidence to believe such a thing. The fact is, the matter was laid to rest when we actually sent camera's and people up there, proving the Earth to be spherical. The sheer amount of technology and math that exists in support of a round Earth proves, beyond a doubt, that it is round and not flat.

I am not insulting you or your beliefs, you're free to believe what you want. However, due to the amount of evidence that exists for a round Earth, it has ceased to be a theory and become fact. Flat Earth is a theory because it has no solid evidence, as much as some trolls on this forum insist that it does.

As for your glass question; I have no strong answer. My guess is that the differences at any length short of kilometers will be completely minimal, however, I have a feeling I am wrong. I would hazard another guess being that the liquid the glass floats on is in a "flat" container, to which it will adhere to and become flat, regardless of the shape of the Earth. I am tired. Hopefully someone infinitely more intelligent than me comes along and provides a reasonable answer. Maybe I can in the morning when I'm not feeling as stupid.

Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #37 on: September 17, 2010, 06:28:00 AM »
British Glass make large sheets too.

Define Perfect for me. Define flaw-free.

Perfectly flat, flaw-free glass.

IE - with no imperfection. with no flaws. - With no curving.

So my beliefs have to be called theories but yours are facts? It wasn't so long ago (1990's) that Physicists claimed 90% of the universe was anti-matter. Now they say all the anti-matter was destroyed in the big bang, there was 0.1% more matter in the bang and that is the stuff the universe is made of. This year alone Darwin's theories are back under the spot light and not all of his survival of the fittest claims hold true.  Just because Round Earth is the commonly held belief right now, doesn't mean it will be that way forever. The good research of people on this site may well change that.  ;)

Wow you really are showing your religious stance here lol.. And btw, Darwin's theories are merely the tip of the iceberg when it comes to evolution, and you apparently have very little knowledge base on the subject. I had gone into many deep discussions about this before, but you can save some time by going on youtube and look up "why do creationists get laughed at". If you want we can start a whole thread on the subject. Survival of the fittest isn't all there is to evolution lol.

And sorry Round Earth is a fact, learn how to circumnavigate using spherical coordinate system. That won't work on a FE model LOL.. But we don't expect FE religious people to deal with reality here.  ::)

FE T-shirts = Profit = conspiracy = ideological cult in the making = teaching stupid = paranoia = nut case. Any questions?

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zork

  • 3319
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #38 on: September 17, 2010, 06:31:50 AM »
Quote
Or do you think that if you cut the Earth half and pour some water to the flat side then the water would form the another half of the sphere?

No I do not believe this to be the case because I am a FE. If you summise that the earth is round, this is exactly what you and RE physicists say would happen.

And thank you Kira. You are correct. However, you too are suggesting the earth is flat, if the Coke surface is flat. RE theory suggests it slightly curves with the surface of the earth, as does the swimming pool as does the sea and as does this glass. But as this small curve would be undectable to the human eye, I will let you go with this one.  ;D

RE theorists would suggest a one and a half inch bulge in a liquid half a kilometre long. Whatever size you cut the glass to, the curve will still be there and British Glass do not shave all their glass for earth curvature. That is a fact - vastly expensive and wasteful. Feel free to e-mail them. The refinement process is only to remove imperfections such as un-melted grains of sand and bubbles etc. So the mystery still stands to RE theorists. How do you make perfectly flat glass using a liquid base?
Sigh, you are not FE, you are just plain stupid. There are no half km long glass sheet in your floating process and you don't know anything about this flaoting glass process. And not one RE physicist would say that the water would form half sphere. It's your fantasy. And I quoted your saying recently where you stated two contradicting points of view. One that the surface follows the bottom ground of the liquid and the other which states that surface doesn't follow the bottom ground of the liquid. So, what is your point actually?
« Last Edit: September 17, 2010, 09:04:24 AM by zork »
Rowbotham had bad eyesight
-
http://thulescientific.com/Lynch%20Curvature%202008.pdf - Visually discerning the curvature of the Earth
http://thulescientific.com/TurbulentShipWakes_Lynch_AO_2005.pdf - Turbulent ship wakes:further evidence that the Earth is round.

Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #39 on: September 17, 2010, 07:35:08 AM »
RE theorists would suggest a one and a half inch bulge in a liquid half a kilometre long. Whatever size you cut the glass to, the curve will still be there and British Glass do not shave all their glass for earth curvature. That is a fact - vastly expensive and wasteful. Feel free to e-mail them. The refinement process is only to remove imperfections such as un-melted grains of sand and bubbles etc. So the mystery still stands to RE theorists. How do you make perfectly flat glass using a liquid base?
What is the longest piece of flat glass that was made all at once? What were the engineering requirements for its flatness. It seems to me you've shown nothing about the shape of the Earth until you provide answers to both questions. No engineering requirement is 'perfectly' flat, but rather no more than eight inches per mile. If each smaller segment is made flat with the last in a continous process than your premise is wrong.

By the way, learn to stay consistent: "one and a half inch bulge in a liquid half a kilometre long"
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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trig

  • 2240
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #40 on: September 17, 2010, 09:00:32 AM »
In summation, their glass would bend 3 inches over the half kilometre molten bath and not be "perfectly flat, flaw-less glass".

What gives round-earthers?
With such poor reading skills, it is no wonder you find "evidence" of a flat Earth everywhere.

There may be a continuous 500 meter production line, but there is no single piece of glass 500 or even 100 meters long in that production line. And the guarantee of perfection that so amazed the OP is not for 500 meter long pieces of glass. It is for, at most, 10 meter long pieces.

And even if this factory sold 500 meter long glass pieces, they are very flexible. The typical 6 mm thick glass window of 2 meters by 2 meters or so flexes by more than one millimeter with a gust of wind. It is so difficult to have rigid glass that the main mirror of a typical 3 meter telescope has to be made with several tons of glass. The Hale telescope in Palomar has 5 meters in diameter and weighs 20 tons.

The real issues to look at in the OP are:
  • If someone says "perfect" it usually does not mean mathematically perfect, it means good enough so that the usual observer will not see a defect.
  • The size of the factory is not the size of the finished product.
  • The issues concerning the production of a flat glass are a lot more significant than the curvature of the Earth over a distance of 10 meters
  • Making an object with a straight side to within the curvature of the Earth is a really impressive undertaking. Nobody even tries unless it is absolutely necessary, and in the case of the glass factory it is not.
  • The OP does not even try to give the physical properties of the glass that is supposed to be straight to within millimeters over a distance of half a kilometer. This is truly the mark of the arrogant ignorant.

Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #41 on: September 17, 2010, 09:02:04 AM »
In summation, their glass would bend 3 inches over the half kilometre molten bath and not be "perfectly flat, flaw-less glass".

What gives round-earthers?
With such poor reading skills, it is no wonder you find "evidence" of a flat Earth everywhere.

There may be a continuous 500 meter production line, but there is no single piece of glass 500 or even 100 meters long in that production line. And the guarantee of perfection that so amazed the OP is not for 500 meter long pieces of glass. It is for, at most, 10 meter long pieces.

And even if this factory sold 500 meter long glass pieces, they are very flexible. The typical 6 mm thick glass window of 2 meters by 2 meters or so flexes by more than one millimeter with a gust of wind. It is so difficult to have rigid glass that the main mirror of a typical 3 meter telescope has to be made with several tons of glass. The Hale telescope in Palomar has 5 meters in diameter and weighs 20 tons.

The real issues to look at in the OP are:
  • If someone says "perfect" it usually does not mean mathematically perfect, it means good enough so that the usual observer will not see a defect.
  • The size of the factory is not the size of the finished product.
  • The issues concerning the production of a flat glass are a lot more significant than the curvature of the Earth over a distance of 10 meters
  • Making an object with a straight side to within the curvature of the Earth is a really impressive undertaking. Nobody even tries unless it is absolutely necessary, and in the case of the glass factory it is not.
  • The OP does not even try to give the physical properties of the glass that is supposed to be straight to within millimeters over a distance of half a kilometer. This is truly the mark of the arrogant ignorant.
Well posted. Thanks.
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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EnglshGentleman

  • Flat Earth Editor
  • 9548
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #42 on: September 17, 2010, 10:12:31 AM »
In summation, their glass would bend 3 inches over the half kilometre molten bath and not be "perfectly flat, flaw-less glass".

What gives round-earthers?
With such poor reading skills, it is no wonder you find "evidence" of a flat Earth everywhere.

There may be a continuous 500 meter production line, but there is no single piece of glass 500 or even 100 meters long in that production line. And the guarantee of perfection that so amazed the OP is not for 500 meter long pieces of glass. It is for, at most, 10 meter long pieces.

And even if this factory sold 500 meter long glass pieces, they are very flexible. The typical 6 mm thick glass window of 2 meters by 2 meters or so flexes by more than one millimeter with a gust of wind. It is so difficult to have rigid glass that the main mirror of a typical 3 meter telescope has to be made with several tons of glass. The Hale telescope in Palomar has 5 meters in diameter and weighs 20 tons.

The real issues to look at in the OP are:
  • If someone says "perfect" it usually does not mean mathematically perfect, it means good enough so that the usual observer will not see a defect.
  • The size of the factory is not the size of the finished product.
  • The issues concerning the production of a flat glass are a lot more significant than the curvature of the Earth over a distance of 10 meters
  • Making an object with a straight side to within the curvature of the Earth is a really impressive undertaking. Nobody even tries unless it is absolutely necessary, and in the case of the glass factory it is not.
  • The OP does not even try to give the physical properties of the glass that is supposed to be straight to within millimeters over a distance of half a kilometer. This is truly the mark of the arrogant ignorant.



Sounds to me like a whole lot of conjecture. Where is your proof any of this is true?

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Part of the Problem

  • 385
  • The Liberal
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #43 on: September 17, 2010, 10:48:45 AM »
In summation, their glass would bend 3 inches over the half kilometre molten bath and not be "perfectly flat, flaw-less glass".

What gives round-earthers?
With such poor reading skills, it is no wonder you find "evidence" of a flat Earth everywhere.

There may be a continuous 500 meter production line, but there is no single piece of glass 500 or even 100 meters long in that production line. And the guarantee of perfection that so amazed the OP is not for 500 meter long pieces of glass. It is for, at most, 10 meter long pieces.

And even if this factory sold 500 meter long glass pieces, they are very flexible. The typical 6 mm thick glass window of 2 meters by 2 meters or so flexes by more than one millimeter with a gust of wind. It is so difficult to have rigid glass that the main mirror of a typical 3 meter telescope has to be made with several tons of glass. The Hale telescope in Palomar has 5 meters in diameter and weighs 20 tons.

The real issues to look at in the OP are:
  • If someone says "perfect" it usually does not mean mathematically perfect, it means good enough so that the usual observer will not see a defect.
  • The size of the factory is not the size of the finished product.
  • The issues concerning the production of a flat glass are a lot more significant than the curvature of the Earth over a distance of 10 meters
  • Making an object with a straight side to within the curvature of the Earth is a really impressive undertaking. Nobody even tries unless it is absolutely necessary, and in the case of the glass factory it is not.
  • The OP does not even try to give the physical properties of the glass that is supposed to be straight to within millimeters over a distance of half a kilometer. This is truly the mark of the arrogant ignorant.



Sounds to me like a whole lot of conjecture. Where is your proof any of this is true?

Where's the proof that this thing spits out perfectly flat half kilometer long glass pieces?
By eliminating all present contradicting possibilities you would arrive at the present truth. It's impossible to arrive at a future truth.

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EnglshGentleman

  • Flat Earth Editor
  • 9548
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #44 on: September 17, 2010, 11:09:49 AM »
In summation, their glass would bend 3 inches over the half kilometre molten bath and not be "perfectly flat, flaw-less glass".

What gives round-earthers?
With such poor reading skills, it is no wonder you find "evidence" of a flat Earth everywhere.

There may be a continuous 500 meter production line, but there is no single piece of glass 500 or even 100 meters long in that production line. And the guarantee of perfection that so amazed the OP is not for 500 meter long pieces of glass. It is for, at most, 10 meter long pieces.

And even if this factory sold 500 meter long glass pieces, they are very flexible. The typical 6 mm thick glass window of 2 meters by 2 meters or so flexes by more than one millimeter with a gust of wind. It is so difficult to have rigid glass that the main mirror of a typical 3 meter telescope has to be made with several tons of glass. The Hale telescope in Palomar has 5 meters in diameter and weighs 20 tons.

The real issues to look at in the OP are:
  • If someone says "perfect" it usually does not mean mathematically perfect, it means good enough so that the usual observer will not see a defect.
  • The size of the factory is not the size of the finished product.
  • The issues concerning the production of a flat glass are a lot more significant than the curvature of the Earth over a distance of 10 meters
  • Making an object with a straight side to within the curvature of the Earth is a really impressive undertaking. Nobody even tries unless it is absolutely necessary, and in the case of the glass factory it is not.
  • The OP does not even try to give the physical properties of the glass that is supposed to be straight to within millimeters over a distance of half a kilometer. This is truly the mark of the arrogant ignorant.



Sounds to me like a whole lot of conjecture. Where is your proof any of this is true?

Where's the proof that this thing spits out perfectly flat half kilometer long glass pieces?

Read the OP. If you can prove that they don't please do so.

?

Part of the Problem

  • 385
  • The Liberal
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #45 on: September 17, 2010, 11:18:11 AM »
In summation, their glass would bend 3 inches over the half kilometre molten bath and not be "perfectly flat, flaw-less glass".

What gives round-earthers?
With such poor reading skills, it is no wonder you find "evidence" of a flat Earth everywhere.

There may be a continuous 500 meter production line, but there is no single piece of glass 500 or even 100 meters long in that production line. And the guarantee of perfection that so amazed the OP is not for 500 meter long pieces of glass. It is for, at most, 10 meter long pieces.

And even if this factory sold 500 meter long glass pieces, they are very flexible. The typical 6 mm thick glass window of 2 meters by 2 meters or so flexes by more than one millimeter with a gust of wind. It is so difficult to have rigid glass that the main mirror of a typical 3 meter telescope has to be made with several tons of glass. The Hale telescope in Palomar has 5 meters in diameter and weighs 20 tons.

The real issues to look at in the OP are:
  • If someone says "perfect" it usually does not mean mathematically perfect, it means good enough so that the usual observer will not see a defect.
  • The size of the factory is not the size of the finished product.
  • The issues concerning the production of a flat glass are a lot more significant than the curvature of the Earth over a distance of 10 meters
  • Making an object with a straight side to within the curvature of the Earth is a really impressive undertaking. Nobody even tries unless it is absolutely necessary, and in the case of the glass factory it is not.
  • The OP does not even try to give the physical properties of the glass that is supposed to be straight to within millimeters over a distance of half a kilometer. This is truly the mark of the arrogant ignorant.



Sounds to me like a whole lot of conjecture. Where is your proof any of this is true?

Where's the proof that this thing spits out perfectly flat half kilometer long glass pieces?

Read the OP. If you can prove that they don't please do so.

Read the OP.  It states that the production line can be up to half a kilometer long.  Doesn't say how long the finished pieces are.

I can't find anything that states how long the finished pieces are, but did find a site that says their cut down to sheets up to 6000mm x 3210mm.
http://www.glass-resource.com/sneakpeek/sample15.htm

Also wondering how "perfect" the flatness is after reading this:
"If molten glass is poured onto a bath of clean molten tin, the glass will spread out in the same way that oil will spread out if poured onto a bath of water. In this situation, gravity and surface tension will result in the top and bottom surfaces of the glass becoming approximately flat and parallel."
http://www.tangram.co.uk/TI-Glazing-Float%20Glass.html



By eliminating all present contradicting possibilities you would arrive at the present truth. It's impossible to arrive at a future truth.

*

EnglshGentleman

  • Flat Earth Editor
  • 9548
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #46 on: September 17, 2010, 12:16:28 PM »
In summation, their glass would bend 3 inches over the half kilometre molten bath and not be "perfectly flat, flaw-less glass".

What gives round-earthers?
With such poor reading skills, it is no wonder you find "evidence" of a flat Earth everywhere.

There may be a continuous 500 meter production line, but there is no single piece of glass 500 or even 100 meters long in that production line. And the guarantee of perfection that so amazed the OP is not for 500 meter long pieces of glass. It is for, at most, 10 meter long pieces.

And even if this factory sold 500 meter long glass pieces, they are very flexible. The typical 6 mm thick glass window of 2 meters by 2 meters or so flexes by more than one millimeter with a gust of wind. It is so difficult to have rigid glass that the main mirror of a typical 3 meter telescope has to be made with several tons of glass. The Hale telescope in Palomar has 5 meters in diameter and weighs 20 tons.

The real issues to look at in the OP are:
  • If someone says "perfect" it usually does not mean mathematically perfect, it means good enough so that the usual observer will not see a defect.
  • The size of the factory is not the size of the finished product.
  • The issues concerning the production of a flat glass are a lot more significant than the curvature of the Earth over a distance of 10 meters
  • Making an object with a straight side to within the curvature of the Earth is a really impressive undertaking. Nobody even tries unless it is absolutely necessary, and in the case of the glass factory it is not.
  • The OP does not even try to give the physical properties of the glass that is supposed to be straight to within millimeters over a distance of half a kilometer. This is truly the mark of the arrogant ignorant.



Sounds to me like a whole lot of conjecture. Where is your proof any of this is true?

Where's the proof that this thing spits out perfectly flat half kilometer long glass pieces?

Read the OP. If you can prove that they don't please do so.

Read the OP.  It states that the production line can be up to half a kilometer long.  Doesn't say how long the finished pieces are.

I can't find anything that states how long the finished pieces are, but did find a site that says their cut down to sheets up to 6000mm x 3210mm.
http://www.glass-resource.com/sneakpeek/sample15.htm

Also wondering how "perfect" the flatness is after reading this:
"If molten glass is poured onto a bath of clean molten tin, the glass will spread out in the same way that oil will spread out if poured onto a bath of water. In this situation, gravity and surface tension will result in the top and bottom surfaces of the glass becoming approximately flat and parallel."
http://www.tangram.co.uk/TI-Glazing-Float%20Glass.html


Read the OP and the article. They'll make it as long ass you ask. If you also read it, you'd see that take every precaution to ensure that the glass is perfectly flat.

Please actually read the material before responding to it. You are only making yourself look silly.

?

Part of the Problem

  • 385
  • The Liberal
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #47 on: September 17, 2010, 12:22:58 PM »
In summation, their glass would bend 3 inches over the half kilometre molten bath and not be "perfectly flat, flaw-less glass".

What gives round-earthers?
With such poor reading skills, it is no wonder you find "evidence" of a flat Earth everywhere.

There may be a continuous 500 meter production line, but there is no single piece of glass 500 or even 100 meters long in that production line. And the guarantee of perfection that so amazed the OP is not for 500 meter long pieces of glass. It is for, at most, 10 meter long pieces.

And even if this factory sold 500 meter long glass pieces, they are very flexible. The typical 6 mm thick glass window of 2 meters by 2 meters or so flexes by more than one millimeter with a gust of wind. It is so difficult to have rigid glass that the main mirror of a typical 3 meter telescope has to be made with several tons of glass. The Hale telescope in Palomar has 5 meters in diameter and weighs 20 tons.

The real issues to look at in the OP are:
  • If someone says "perfect" it usually does not mean mathematically perfect, it means good enough so that the usual observer will not see a defect.
  • The size of the factory is not the size of the finished product.
  • The issues concerning the production of a flat glass are a lot more significant than the curvature of the Earth over a distance of 10 meters
  • Making an object with a straight side to within the curvature of the Earth is a really impressive undertaking. Nobody even tries unless it is absolutely necessary, and in the case of the glass factory it is not.
  • The OP does not even try to give the physical properties of the glass that is supposed to be straight to within millimeters over a distance of half a kilometer. This is truly the mark of the arrogant ignorant.



Sounds to me like a whole lot of conjecture. Where is your proof any of this is true?

Where's the proof that this thing spits out perfectly flat half kilometer long glass pieces?

Read the OP. If you can prove that they don't please do so.

Read the OP.  It states that the production line can be up to half a kilometer long.  Doesn't say how long the finished pieces are.

I can't find anything that states how long the finished pieces are, but did find a site that says their cut down to sheets up to 6000mm x 3210mm.
http://www.glass-resource.com/sneakpeek/sample15.htm

Also wondering how "perfect" the flatness is after reading this:
"If molten glass is poured onto a bath of clean molten tin, the glass will spread out in the same way that oil will spread out if poured onto a bath of water. In this situation, gravity and surface tension will result in the top and bottom surfaces of the glass becoming approximately flat and parallel."
http://www.tangram.co.uk/TI-Glazing-Float%20Glass.html


Read the OP and the article. They'll make it as long ass you ask. If you also read it, you'd see that take every precaution to ensure that the glass is perfectly flat.

Please actually read the material before responding to it. You are only making yourself look silly.

Feel free to post a quote and make me look silly.  How flat is perfectly flat?
By eliminating all present contradicting possibilities you would arrive at the present truth. It's impossible to arrive at a future truth.

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EnglshGentleman

  • Flat Earth Editor
  • 9548
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #48 on: September 17, 2010, 12:27:09 PM »
How flat is perfectly flat?

You just said it. Perfect flat.

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Part of the Problem

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Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #49 on: September 17, 2010, 12:50:06 PM »
How flat is perfectly flat?

You just said it. Perfect flat.

So there are absolutely no tolerances?  Just wondering because the other article I read has conflicting information.

Could point me to where it says "They'll make it as long ass you ask"?
By eliminating all present contradicting possibilities you would arrive at the present truth. It's impossible to arrive at a future truth.

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trig

  • 2240
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #50 on: September 17, 2010, 12:52:02 PM »
In summation, their glass would bend 3 inches over the half kilometre molten bath and not be "perfectly flat, flaw-less glass".

What gives round-earthers?
With such poor reading skills, it is no wonder you find "evidence" of a flat Earth everywhere.

There may be a continuous 500 meter production line, but there is no single piece of glass 500 or even 100 meters long in that production line. And the guarantee of perfection that so amazed the OP is not for 500 meter long pieces of glass. It is for, at most, 10 meter long pieces.

And even if this factory sold 500 meter long glass pieces, they are very flexible. The typical 6 mm thick glass window of 2 meters by 2 meters or so flexes by more than one millimeter with a gust of wind. It is so difficult to have rigid glass that the main mirror of a typical 3 meter telescope has to be made with several tons of glass. The Hale telescope in Palomar has 5 meters in diameter and weighs 20 tons.

The real issues to look at in the OP are:
  • If someone says "perfect" it usually does not mean mathematically perfect, it means good enough so that the usual observer will not see a defect.
  • The size of the factory is not the size of the finished product.
  • The issues concerning the production of a flat glass are a lot more significant than the curvature of the Earth over a distance of 10 meters
  • Making an object with a straight side to within the curvature of the Earth is a really impressive undertaking. Nobody even tries unless it is absolutely necessary, and in the case of the glass factory it is not.
  • The OP does not even try to give the physical properties of the glass that is supposed to be straight to within millimeters over a distance of half a kilometer. This is truly the mark of the arrogant ignorant.



Sounds to me like a whole lot of conjecture. Where is your proof any of this is true?
Actually, even your comment shows how you are a very arrogant ignoramus or a total troll.
  • The first point is totally evident.
  • For the second point, just read the article in reference! The 500 meter installation includes ovens that are tens of meters long, several processes that require, among other things, space.
  • If you do not believe a flat glass can bend, just look at the reflection of a brightly illuminated object while you press the center of the glass. If you cannot do even that experiment, please tell us and we will never bother you with anything scientific ever again, since you will be clearly identified as a total scientific illiterate.
  • Even the most basic course in Statics will tell you that every structure is flexible, even if made of concrete. Then put some numbers into the formulas. Nothing solid made by man is 500 meters long and does not bend.
  • And the last point is totally evident.

Have you even thought about the problem that moving a 500 meter object means? The only man made thing that comes close is an inter-oceanic boat, and they are very flexible indeed, and they have to be constructed by the ocean because there is no other way to move them after being constructed.

So, please tell us how your comment is a trolling effort gone bad and that you are not such an ignorant that has never even thought about how a 500 meter rigid object could be moved from the factory to the place where it is used. Even you have to know how moving a 10 meter mirror for a large telescope is an incredibly difficult engineering task.

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Lorddave

  • 16635
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #51 on: September 17, 2010, 02:28:16 PM »
Ok to settle this pointless debate I have created the following illustration of a flat object (the factory) on a curved surface (a ball).

I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #52 on: September 17, 2010, 02:39:31 PM »
I'll come out with it. I'm pro-flat earth. However I would like to know how the round-earthers explain the manufacture of industrial flat glass, using the float process?

http://www.britglass.org.uk/Files/form2Float_Process.pdf
Let me draw your attention to page 5, Stage 5 Inspection.
"The float process is renowned for making perfectly flat, flaw-free glass"

If the earth is round, how do you make a perfectly flat flaw-free piece of glass using a "mirror-like surface of molten tin" , especially when "A float line can be nearly half a kilometre long.". Surely a round earth would put a curve in the glass and it would not be "Perfectly flat, flaw-free glass".

Look at the lengths these guys go to to get flat glass. 100 million inspection measurements a second! Surely they would work out all their glass curved? Unless the earth was flat of course.

Some quick maths ...
1 mile = 1.609344 km
Suppose that the earth is a sphere of radius 3963 miles as claimed. If you are at a point P on the earth's surface and move tangent to the surface a distance of 1 mile then you can form a right angled triangel as in the diagram. Using the theorem of Pythagoras a2 = 39632 + 12 = 15705370 and thus a = 3963.000126 miles. Thus your position is 3963.000126 - 3963 = 0.000126 miles above the surface of the earth. 0.000126 miles = 12*5280*0.000126 = 7.98 inches. Hence the earth's surface curves at approximately 8 inches per mile.

In summation, their glass would bend 3 inches over the half kilometre molten bath and not be "perfectly flat, flaw-less glass".

What gives round-earthers?

this is really clever actually nice   argument

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Thork

Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #53 on: September 17, 2010, 05:14:03 PM »
Right, lets bounce a few more of these wild stabs in the dark away.

First, the myth that for short pieces of glass it won't make any difference. (By the way it would be nice if you guys would present some maths to the contrary, instead of me proving me right. Why don't you prove me wrong?)

So as posted above they make glass up to 3m wide. Someone else spotted they cut 6000mm x 3200mm panels from another source. So lets say the glass is only 6m long. Not a huge stretch of the imagination for a glass industry with a half kilometre bit of kit. We also know from the British Glass .pdf that they can make panels as thin as 0.4mm. This time I will do all the maths in metric so there is no imperial voodoo getting in the way.

The radius of earth (according to RE laws) is 6371km. If I move across the surface tangentially 1 kilometre I form a triangle. The hypotenuse is going to be the radius of the earth + my distance above it. I.E the error given by following the earth's curve. Or how much you guys would have them shave away.

So with Pythagoras

(6371 * 6371) + (1 * 1) = 40589642 km^2
Square rooting this will give my hypotenuse
=6371.00007848061480 km
So my error over a kilometre piece of glass is 6371.00007848061480 km - 6371 = 0.00007848061480 km
That is 0.07848061 metres
That is 7.848061 centimetres for every kilometre of glass.
That is 78.48061 mm for every kilometre of glass.

Now hopefully you agreed that a 6m piece, wasn't out of the question?
1000/6 = 166.666666
So I will divide my 1km error by 166.66666 recurring to give me 6m of glass.
so 78.48061 mm of glass divided by 166.66666666 = 0.4708836888 mm

We already know they make glass only 0.4mm thick so how can they shave 0.47mm out of it? They would have no glass left in a 6m panel. And as for tolerances? If something bends by 117.5% of its entire thickness over just 6m does that suggest 'Perfectly flat, flaw-free glass?".

The maths is all there. Please before screaming foul-play, check it for yourself. There is no trickery in it. Pick up a calculator.

Now for any flat fluid related posts. Pick up a physics book. For a round earth FLUIDS FOLLOW THE CURVATURE OF THE EARTH no matter what you put them on. You dump them on a platform and they will bend in the shape of the earth on that flat platform. They will form a bulge perfectly matching the earth's circumference. Gravity will act on them and pull them towards the centre of the earth. Not straight down below it.

Thank you for the kind words above about this being a clever post. It is a damn sight harder to prove something no one believes, than it is to just regurgitate stuff you learnt from school (albeit poorly in some of the cases above).

As for consistency, if the glass bends 3 inches over half a kilometre, that will produce a bulge of 1 and a half inches. 1 and a half inches up the parabola. One and a half down it again.  ???

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markjo

  • Content Nazi
  • The Elder Ones
  • 41919
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #54 on: September 17, 2010, 05:31:09 PM »
Apparently it hasn't occurred to anyone that of a 500m glass float line, only a fraction of the line (maybe 100m, but probably less) is actual float area.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Thork

Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #55 on: September 17, 2010, 05:40:28 PM »
read my last post! It right before yours! a 6 metre piece of glass would be severely compromised.

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markjo

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Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #56 on: September 17, 2010, 05:56:14 PM »
read my last post! It right before yours! a 6 metre piece of glass would be severely compromised.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.  The float process is a continuous process, so pieces of various sizes are simply cut from a continuously formed sheet of flat glass.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Thork

Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #57 on: September 17, 2010, 06:00:30 PM »
with a bend in, if the earth was round! its the whole point of the post. It shows for this to work the earth must be flat!


ok, so can I hide it?
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 05:20:09 PM by Thork »

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Vindictus

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  • insightful personal text
Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #58 on: September 17, 2010, 06:11:24 PM »
Your maths is incorrect because you're assuming that a small body of liquid creates the same bending difference as that of a 1km body of liquid, which it obviously doesn't, as you proved a 0.4mm sheet has a 0.47mm bend, which is impossible.

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Thork

Re: Industrial flat glass, needs a flat earth
« Reply #59 on: September 17, 2010, 06:21:02 PM »
My maths, I think you'll find is as flaw-free as British Glass' products.

That 0.47 bend is over a distance of 6m which is entirely possible. If I take a stand of hair 1mm thick, can i not deflect it 2mm down? Of course I can. It is however, impossible to shave something that thin with a bend like that, back to straight, which was the point of the maths.

The body of liquid is of infinite length if this is an infinite process. The bath tank needs only to be 6m to get the effect I just demonstrated. But it is much much longer. Hundreds of metres.

So how about you demonstrate some Maths, or come back with a hard fact? All this guess work by you guys requires me to do the leg work. But I'm already happy with the solution. The earth is flat. If you don't like that answer PROVE, not stab at wildly with a suggestion, that I am wrong.  :D