Autism and the brain

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babsinva

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Autism and the brain
« on: August 30, 2010, 01:24:27 PM »
Temple Grandin is a:
* professor,
* inventor,
* author
* and public speaker,

and has her PhD in animal science, which goes to show that not everyone with Autism acts like Dustin Hoffman in "Rainman".  She is a very highly functioning autistic person, and she feels more autistic people could be if they were engaged early enough.  Many people just do not know how to work with people like this, and a movie on her life shows it is possible. 

Autism runs the spectrum from not social/ verbal to very high functioning and these people are further broken down in 3 categories:
1)  visual thinkers - in pictures:  minds work like google pictures, virtual reality, etc examples: Tesla, Edison
2)  pattern thinkers:  chess, origami, music composition, and math
3)  verbal:  which know every fact on everything - human walking encyclopedias

Many people thought she was a nut, then they learned she was brilliant.  Here is an invention of hers (the one for people - not cattle). >>


Here is how here mind works >>
http://blog.ted.com/2010/02/24/the_world_needs/
OR see ...


For any mod that thinks this should be moved to R&P, feel free.

Quote from Big Giant Head:  "Considered fictitious or phantom does not quantify its non-existence."

Quote from Soze:  "We cannot escape perception, but we can't assume reality doesn't exist outside of perception."

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Crustinator

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2010, 01:47:09 PM »
examples: Tesla, Edison

I'm always extremely wary of peoples attempts to define historical figures as "autistic".

For example I found this crap written about Tesla:

"Given his great capacity for original thought and ability to mentally visualize mechanisms in extreme detail, it's likely that Tesla was autistic"

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babsinva

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #2 on: August 30, 2010, 01:57:29 PM »
examples: Tesla, Edison

I'm always extremely wary of peoples attempts to define historical figures as "autistic".

For example I found this crap written about Tesla:

"Given his great capacity for original thought and ability to mentally visualize mechanisms in extreme detail, it's likely that Tesla was autistic"

Keep in mind that it was not my words about Tesla, and I was re-quoting from someone else.  Also an autistic person (Temple) who knows she is autistic and thinks in pictures, also thought perhaps Tesla was, but it was not a negative comment she made, for she herself has autism.  She was simply linking the fact that the autistic brain is different.

The videos I supplied along with seeing the movie might help.  They were great.

Good to see you though Crusty !

Quote from Big Giant Head:  "Considered fictitious or phantom does not quantify its non-existence."

Quote from Soze:  "We cannot escape perception, but we can't assume reality doesn't exist outside of perception."

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Mykael

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2010, 02:53:50 PM »
In b4 "Vaccines cause Autism"

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Space Cowgirl

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2010, 04:04:07 PM »
The Temple Grandin movie was very interesting.  I had no idea she designed the slaughterhouse system.
I'm sorry. Am I to understand that when you have a boner you like to imagine punching the shit out of Tom Bishop? That's disgusting.

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EireEngineer

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2010, 05:09:06 PM »
As the parent of an Autistic child.....I just cant wait to see the craziness that will be posted in this thread.
If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate.

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BOGWarrior89

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2010, 05:10:45 PM »
I personally believe (?know) Albert Einstein was schizophrenic.

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2010, 07:50:34 PM »
For the record, autism is not a binary condition, it's a spectrum disorder. Everyone exhibits some number of symptoms, and to some degree. That's how they can get away with labeling historical figures as "somewhat autistic", even though there was no one capable of actually diagnosing if that person hit the level of goofiness to be formally diagnosed as autistic.

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EireEngineer

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2010, 08:09:54 PM »
Funny, I have never heard of "goofiness" as a diagnostic tool.
If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate.

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2010, 08:12:48 PM »
Funny, I have never heard of "goofiness" as a diagnostic tool.
I found it more fun to say than "matching enough symptoms to a high enough degree".

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EireEngineer

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2010, 08:14:35 PM »
Definately
If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate.

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Crustinator

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2010, 07:07:02 AM »
For the record, autism is not a binary condition, it's a spectrum disorder. Everyone exhibits some number of symptoms, and to some degree. That's how they can get away with labeling historical figures as "somewhat autistic", even though there was no one capable of actually diagnosing if that person hit the level of goofiness to be formally diagnosed as autistic.

I know. And having a rainbow spectrum is part of the problem. It's what lets shitty little emo kids say "I'm a little bit autistic because I like buttons and only drink Coke Zero"

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babsinva

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #12 on: August 31, 2010, 08:21:02 AM »
I personally believe (?know) Albert Einstein was schizophrenic.

Wat?  No one mentioned Einstein or schizophrenia.  Schizophrenia is entirely another condition.

The Temple Grandin movie was very interesting.  I had no idea she designed the slaughterhouse system.
Well she didn't design the first, but the more modern-day better efficient ones ranchers use today.  She also designed better dip-vats.

Funny, I have never heard of "goofiness" as a diagnostic tool.
I found it more fun to say than "matching enough symptoms to a high enough degree".
Goofiness?  Temple Grandin called hers a gift.

For the record, autism is not a binary condition, it's a spectrum disorder. Everyone exhibits some number of symptoms, and to some degree. That's how they can get away with labeling historical figures as "somewhat autistic", even though there was no one capable of actually diagnosing if that person hit the level of goofiness to be formally diagnosed as autistic.

I know. And having a rainbow spectrum is part of the problem. It's what lets shitty little emo kids say "I'm a little bit autistic because I like buttons and only drink Coke Zero"

That goes with ^ above:  the so-called goofiness; it's more than what they like - it's a disorder.  Temple for example, did not speak until she was four, and could not find a way to engage her brain to communicate with what society feels is communication, but she heard, processed, and understood things without others knowing it, but could not verbalize it, so others just thought she needed to be institutionalized.  Some are sensitive to sound, others are sensitive to light; oversensitivity makes them nervous or have panic attacks.  Some do not like to be touched, while others will tolerate a tactile prompt - prompting them to give a response by illiciting action, but without telling them the answer.  That's partially because quite often they are so focused or zero-in on repetitive tasks, and you must prompt them, which breaks the cycle.  Another reason can be not enough stimulation or not challenged, or engaged.  Many are highly skilled at some things and more like specialists, but find it hard to do other tasks, sometimes simple ones. 

Even those that speak do not engage in small-talk or chit chat, but prefer people with like interests, because being sociable is difficult for they don't understand people and can not express the full range of emotions.  They do of course have feelings, but sometimes they act inappropriately, which others find them to be weird or "goofy". 

For those that are mostly non-verbal, they get hung up on simple words like "quick" particularly if said without using an adverb or adjective.  If one was to say go quick or quickly go, - it would be more understood by them, otherwise they may associate quick with "Nestle's Quick" - the chocolate powder used to flavor white milk.  Their brain has a hard time making the proper word associations.

Yet they are brilliant - the old term idiot savants (idiot-savants), which is a bit of an oxymoron itself, since savant in french means wise.

Quote from Big Giant Head:  "Considered fictitious or phantom does not quantify its non-existence."

Quote from Soze:  "We cannot escape perception, but we can't assume reality doesn't exist outside of perception."

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EireEngineer

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #13 on: August 31, 2010, 09:14:06 PM »
Good overview, Babs, but remember....autism generally does not convey special gifts, but is usually at lease a mildly debilitating condition.
If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate.

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #14 on: August 31, 2010, 09:18:44 PM »
Good overview, Babs, but remember....autism generally does not convey special gifts, but is usually at lease a mildly debilitating condition.
This. I find that people often attribute a natural talent for a field as a trait of autism. For example, I have a younger cousin with autism, and he is also excelling in basic number skills (He's going in the 3rd grade). I believe that were he not autistic, he'd still have those number skills. That's not to say autism doesn't have academic consequences, it's just that it's rarely as prevalent or strong as most seem to think.

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babsinva

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2010, 09:49:26 AM »

Good overview, Babs, but remember....autism generally does not convey special gifts, but is usually at lease a mildly debilitating condition.

This. I find that people often attribute a natural talent for a field as a trait of autism. For example, I have a younger cousin with autism, and he is also excelling in basic number skills (He's going in the 3rd grade). I believe that were he not autistic, he'd still have those number skills. That's not to say autism doesn't have academic consequences, it's just that it's rarely as prevalent or strong as most seem to think.

To both of you:  I understand most of what you are saying OR should I say I somewhat agree, but I was just trying to show that not everyone that truly has autism acts like Dustin Hoffman in "Rainman".  Alot of times it's a matter of parents, teachers, neighbors etc don't know HOW to communicate with the child, and so their abilities go undeveloped.  Even Ray (Hoffman) did have special abilities even though they were not very useful in his everyday life.  He was a human calculator, yet did not have any concept of money.  Candy bars cost $100 and so do cars, according to Ray. 

In a documentary (not the HBO movie), that explains autism, they featured a teacher that found a way to break through to these kids, whereas everyone else just gave up because they either did not have the skills to work with the kids OR misunderstood their child's disorder and thought, ... well that's the way it is - what can I do.  Literally within hours the teacher had the child responding and within days had the child spelling while their parents watched through the glass in the back room.  Each parent was amazed that their child not only was responding but could spell whole sentences by pointing to letters with a pencil on a plastic hand-held stencil.  Could it be the kids understood more than the parents had realized?  The answer is yes.

BF said " ... it's just that it's rarely as prevalent or strong as most seem to think."  It has been said for years that many people that have mental disabilities are actually very smart, and/ or talented.  Leslie Lemke is said by some to be autistic but by others said to be retarded, and he is also blind, has cerebal palsy, and yet speaks 4 languages and sings and plays piano beautifully after only hearing a song only once.  I believe he was the one that TV did a story on in the 80's with Cloris Leechman starring as his mother.  Edgar Allen Poe is said to have had bi-polar, and Van Gogh is said to have done fantastic work only after he went insane.  Later it was the opinion of many that what he really had was bi-polar.  John Nash, a schizophrenic, was a brilliant mathematician and Nobel Prize winner.  These people and many others had disabilities and yet managed to deal with them quite well.  It is possible to not only deal with it, but be successful.  It is also very possible (as shown above) that those with disabilities are not necessarily dumb.  They understand more than you think they do, just like those with autism.

Quote from Big Giant Head:  "Considered fictitious or phantom does not quantify its non-existence."

Quote from Soze:  "We cannot escape perception, but we can't assume reality doesn't exist outside of perception."

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Space Cowgirl

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2010, 04:31:42 PM »


The Temple Grandin movie was very interesting.  I had no idea she designed the slaughterhouse system.
Well she didn't design the first, but the more modern-day better efficient ones ranchers use today.  She also designed better dip-vats.




I know, I watched the movie too  ;)
I'm sorry. Am I to understand that when you have a boner you like to imagine punching the shit out of Tom Bishop? That's disgusting.

?

EireEngineer

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2010, 07:22:16 PM »
Well, the guy that "Rainman" was based off of wasnt really autistic either.
If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate.

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2010, 08:45:19 PM »
Oh, babs, I'm not saying that people with mental disabilities can't be successful, and that they can't be intelligent, I'm saying it's not any more or less common than those without mental disabilities.

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Raist

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #19 on: September 07, 2010, 07:10:52 PM »
Temple Grandin is a:
* professor,
* inventor,
* author
* and public speaker,

and has her PhD in animal science, which goes to show that not everyone with Autism acts like Dustin Hoffman in "Rainman".  She is a very highly functioning autistic person, and she feels more autistic people could be if they were engaged early enough.  Many people just do not know how to work with people like this, and a movie on her life shows it is possible. 

Autism runs the spectrum from not social/ verbal to very high functioning and these people are further broken down in 3 categories:
1)  visual thinkers - in pictures:  minds work like google pictures, virtual reality, etc examples: Tesla, Edison
2)  pattern thinkers:  chess, origami, music composition, and math
3)  verbal:  which know every fact on everything - human walking encyclopedias

Many people thought she was a nut, then they learned she was brilliant.  Here is an invention of hers (the one for people - not cattle). >>


Here is how here mind works >>
http://blog.ted.com/2010/02/24/the_world_needs/
OR see ...


For any mod that thinks this should be moved to R&P, feel free.



Some autistic children can't even learn speech, there are many varying degrees of autism and from what I've heard there isn't even a single agreed upon cause.

Also, did I miss something or does autism now mean any person that thinks atypically?

Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #20 on: September 09, 2010, 02:53:18 PM »
Temple Grandin is a:
* professor,
* inventor,
* author
* and public speaker,

and has her PhD in animal science, which goes to show that not everyone with Autism acts like Dustin Hoffman in "Rainman".  She is a very highly functioning autistic person, and she feels more autistic people could be if they were engaged early enough.  Many people just do not know how to work with people like this, and a movie on her life shows it is possible. 

Autism runs the spectrum from not social/ verbal to very high functioning and these people are further broken down in 3 categories:
1)  visual thinkers - in pictures:  minds work like google pictures, virtual reality, etc examples: Tesla, Edison
2)  pattern thinkers:  chess, origami, music composition, and math
3)  verbal:  which know every fact on everything - human walking encyclopedias

Many people thought she was a nut, then they learned she was brilliant.  Here is an invention of hers (the one for people - not cattle). >>


Here is how here mind works >>
http://blog.ted.com/2010/02/24/the_world_needs/
OR see ...


For any mod that thinks this should be moved to R&P, feel free.



There's no scientific evidence that autism exists.

MRI machines that view inside the brain cannot detect it.

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Crustinator

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #21 on: September 09, 2010, 02:57:18 PM »
Also, did I miss something or does autism now mean any person that thinks atypically?

Yes you missed the memo.

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Raist

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #22 on: September 09, 2010, 07:56:42 PM »
Also, did I miss something or does autism now mean any person that thinks atypically?

Yes you missed the memo.

Darn. It's good to know that every intelligent person on Earth is now labeled autistic.

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EireEngineer

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2010, 04:01:10 PM »
Perhaps you should look up the actual definition? mmm?
If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate.

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Raist

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #24 on: September 13, 2010, 04:08:28 PM »
Perhaps you should look up the actual definition? mmm?

I know the definition. I was pointing out the way they incorrectly use the term autistic by asking a question.

I know I know, you barely understand what other people are saying when they are being direct, so we probably shouldn't use sarcasm around you. In my defense though I thought you had already killed yourself.

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EireEngineer

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #25 on: September 15, 2010, 12:36:21 PM »
Perhaps you should look up the actual definition? mmm?

I know the definition. I was pointing out the way they incorrectly use the term autistic by asking a question.

I know I know, you barely understand what other people are saying when they are being direct, so we probably shouldn't use sarcasm around you. In my defense though I thought you had already killed yourself.
I guess I should have pointed out that my comment was for 3dw.  I will be more vigilant in using the quote function in the future.
If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate.

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Raist

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Re: Autism and the brain
« Reply #26 on: September 15, 2010, 07:45:20 PM »
Perhaps you should look up the actual definition? mmm?

I know the definition. I was pointing out the way they incorrectly use the term autistic by asking a question.

I know I know, you barely understand what other people are saying when they are being direct, so we probably shouldn't use sarcasm around you. In my defense though I thought you had already killed yourself.
I guess I should have pointed out that my comment was for 3dw.  I will be more vigilant in using the quote function in the future.

Cheers.