Gravity??? WHat about that??

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ClockTower

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #60 on: July 06, 2010, 08:45:07 AM »
Do you have any evidence of the Holocaust happening?
Yes.
Present it or it is assumed non-existent.
Really? You need to see proof of something that's in every high school history text in the last 20 years, really? Then I direct you to visit the http://www.ushmm.org/ in person.
I've been there, it was very touching. As was The Lion King.
So why do waste the Forum's time if you've already seen the evidence in person?
Because I've also seen evidence that lions and monkeys talk.
So what does that have to do with asking for evidence that you've already since in person? Why do you waste the Forum's time like this?
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #61 on: July 06, 2010, 08:48:08 AM »
So what does that have to do with asking for evidence that you've already since in person? Why do you waste the Forum's time like this?
I was hoping you had actual legitimate evidence.

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ClockTower

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #62 on: July 06, 2010, 08:55:10 AM »
So what does that have to do with asking for evidence that you've already since in person? Why do you waste the Forum's time like this?
I was hoping you had actual legitimate evidence.
Again, why do you waste the Forum's time like this?
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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bowler

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #63 on: July 06, 2010, 09:58:04 AM »
Wow, this is stimulating. I have no first hand evidence that Brazil exists, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Just means I have to use intelligence to decide what I think of the evidence.....wait I think i've just found the problem.

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ClockTower

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #64 on: July 06, 2010, 10:13:33 AM »
Wow, this is stimulating. I have no first hand evidence that Brazil exists, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Just means I have to use intelligence to decide what I think of the evidence.....wait I think i've just found the problem.
You aren't implying that only intelligent individuals can discern the quality of the source of the evidence? Let's see know, I watch a Broadway Musical of a folktale where I see theatric effects, should I treat what I see as evidence? Probably not. I see in a national museum verified, objective evidence of a historic event, reported in the news of the day, should I treat what I see as evidence? Yep. Does BF waste the Forum's time? Yep.
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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PizzaPlanet

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #65 on: July 06, 2010, 12:12:36 PM »
Does BF waste the Forum's time? Yep.
I had noticed before that you like to refer to yourself as "us'. Now it's "the Forum". I believe this is a result of confusion. The words you're looking for are: "I", "me", "my time".
hacking your precious forum as we speak 8) 8) 8)

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #66 on: July 06, 2010, 12:16:15 PM »
Again, why do you waste the Forum's time like this?
Markjo, a RE'er, made the claim that the Holocaust happened. I simply want him to support his statements with evidence.

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ClockTower

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #67 on: July 06, 2010, 12:21:21 PM »
Again, why do you waste the Forum's time like this?
Markjo, a RE'er, made the claim that the Holocaust happened. I simply want him to support his statements with evidence.
Why do you waste time asking for evidence you already have by first-hand account?
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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bowler

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #68 on: July 06, 2010, 12:24:51 PM »
Is this thread some kind of joke? I think its a trap. If someone posts a link here then you could argue (incorrectly) that tertiary evidence becomes quaternary evidence, thus presumeably making it less reliable. Though in the binary definition used in this thread of primary or fictitious then whats the point in posting any evidence as it won't be first hand evidence.

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #69 on: July 06, 2010, 12:29:04 PM »
Again, why do you waste the Forum's time like this?
Markjo, a RE'er, made the claim that the Holocaust happened. I simply want him to support his statements with evidence.
Why do you waste time asking for evidence you already have by first-hand account?
wat. I never said I say the holocaust happen.

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markjo

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #70 on: July 06, 2010, 12:30:38 PM »
I have a friend that will testify to controlling Saturn with his mind.
Does your friend have any evidence that he can control Saturn with his mind?
He has first hand accounts of controlling Saturn with his mind. You implied this was acceptable evidence.
No.  You asked for evidence of the holocaust and I asked you if first hand accounts were acceptable.  Tom Bishop seems to think that first hand accounts are valid evidence.  Well, at least when it supports FET.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
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Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
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It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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ClockTower

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #71 on: July 06, 2010, 12:31:35 PM »
Again, why do you waste the Forum's time like this?
Markjo, a RE'er, made the claim that the Holocaust happened. I simply want him to support his statements with evidence.
Why do you waste time asking for evidence you already have by first-hand account?
wat. I never said I say the holocaust happen.
Nor did I. Why do you waste time asking for evidence you already have by first-hand account?
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #72 on: July 06, 2010, 12:37:23 PM »
Nor did I. Why do you waste time asking for evidence you already have by first-hand account?
Because the legitimacy of that what I observed is questionable.

No.  You asked for evidence of the holocaust and I asked you if first hand accounts were acceptable.  Tom Bishop seems to think that first hand accounts are valid evidence.  Well, at least when it supports FET.
First hand observations are, seconds hand accounts start to become questionable.

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bowler

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #73 on: July 06, 2010, 12:40:05 PM »
and you have decided that all secondary sources regarding the holocaust are suitably inconsistent as to reject the hypothesis?

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #74 on: July 06, 2010, 12:46:07 PM »
and you have decided that all secondary sources regarding the holocaust are suitably inconsistent as to reject the hypothesis?
Those who care about reason and logic do not accept hypothesis.

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ClockTower

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #75 on: July 06, 2010, 01:15:52 PM »
Nor did I. Why do you waste time asking for evidence you already have by first-hand account?
Because the legitimacy of that what I observed is questionable.
How so? And again why do you ask for evidence that you already have by first-hand account? If you have the evidence already, you waste our time in providing it again. If you wish to challenge the evidence you saw, please do, but chose the proper forum. The legitimacy of the evidence in the Holocaust Museum is not on top and irrelevant to this debate. Please stop wasting our time.
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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bowler

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #76 on: July 06, 2010, 01:30:15 PM »
I wouldn't agree with that. Its true that a hypothesis can never be entirely rejected or accepted. Instead we assign levels of confidence to our hypotheses. Its a problem thats plagued the social sciences, how do you quantify inherently qualitative data. Indeed as I type im working on a non-parametric hypothesis test in 3D data (cumulative freq. distributions don't work well in greater than 1D). Fortunately for me physics is my thing and my data tends to be lots of numbers so the idea of assigning probabilities and likelihoods is natural. Its harder in 'real life' but the principle is the same. I largely agree with your statement,
"Those who care about reason and logic do not accept hypothesis."
I would simply add the clause; 'or reject them'. Instead we assign some kind of subjective confidence. This can be based on many things, simple things like number of independent sources or clarity and consistency. A lot of incoherent sources maybe less convincing then a few independent but consistent ones. Theres always an element of subjectivity, we always weight our personal confidence level with an element of personal experience.

Oh and one thing you never hear "those who care about reason and logic" do, is make an absolutionist statement like 'do not accept hypothesis', event my modification is probably still to absolute.

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #77 on: July 06, 2010, 02:07:33 PM »
Nor did I. Why do you waste time asking for evidence you already have by first-hand account?
Because the legitimacy of that what I observed is questionable.
How so? And again why do you ask for evidence that you already have by first-hand account? If you have the evidence already, you waste our time in providing it again. If you wish to challenge the evidence you saw, please do, but chose the proper forum. The legitimacy of the evidence in the Holocaust Museum is not on top and irrelevant to this debate. Please stop wasting our time.
Because that evidence was not, by my standards, valid. The person who made the claimmust either further support it's validity, or introduce new, valid evidence.

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ClockTower

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #78 on: July 06, 2010, 05:19:49 PM »
Nor did I. Why do you waste time asking for evidence you already have by first-hand account?
Because the legitimacy of that what I observed is questionable.
How so? And again why do you ask for evidence that you already have by first-hand account? If you have the evidence already, you waste our time in providing it again. If you wish to challenge the evidence you saw, please do, but chose the proper forum. The legitimacy of the evidence in the Holocaust Museum is not on top and irrelevant to this debate. Please stop wasting our time.
Because that evidence was not, by my standards, valid. The person who made the claimmust either further support it's validity, or introduce new, valid evidence.
Again, you already had evidence and still asked for it. You wasted our time. You should not ask someone who makes a claim to provide evidence you already have. It's a waste of time.
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #79 on: July 06, 2010, 05:26:37 PM »
Nor did I. Why do you waste time asking for evidence you already have by first-hand account?
Because the legitimacy of that what I observed is questionable.
How so? And again why do you ask for evidence that you already have by first-hand account? If you have the evidence already, you waste our time in providing it again. If you wish to challenge the evidence you saw, please do, but chose the proper forum. The legitimacy of the evidence in the Holocaust Museum is not on top and irrelevant to this debate. Please stop wasting our time.
Because that evidence was not, by my standards, valid. The person who made the claimmust either further support it's validity, or introduce new, valid evidence.
Again, you already had evidence and still asked for it. You wasted our time. You should not ask someone who makes a claim to provide evidence you already have. It's a waste of time.
Please refrain from posting in threads until you understand how to read the posts others have made. Thank you.

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ClockTower

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #80 on: July 06, 2010, 05:33:46 PM »
Nor did I. Why do you waste time asking for evidence you already have by first-hand account?
Because the legitimacy of that what I observed is questionable.
How so? And again why do you ask for evidence that you already have by first-hand account? If you have the evidence already, you waste our time in providing it again. If you wish to challenge the evidence you saw, please do, but chose the proper forum. The legitimacy of the evidence in the Holocaust Museum is not on top and irrelevant to this debate. Please stop wasting our time.
Because that evidence was not, by my standards, valid. The person who made the claimmust either further support it's validity, or introduce new, valid evidence.
Again, you already had evidence and still asked for it. You wasted our time. You should not ask someone who makes a claim to provide evidence you already have. It's a waste of time.
Please refrain from posting in threads until you understand how to read the posts others have made. Thank you.
Right, about that... You really need to stop wasting our time. Please contribute to the debate or don't post. The issue again is Cavendish and his experiment that challenges that FET requirement that earth (vice Earth) is special and has no attractive 'gravity'. Do join the debate already in progress. Thank you.
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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dell

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #81 on: July 09, 2010, 11:28:06 AM »
Well, one thing that disputed does not mean is disproven.
Irrelevant. No one claimed it did.
Great, then discussing that something has been disputed is equally irrelevant. So Cavendish stands as an experiment that disproves FET. Thanks.
lolwat. Disputed does also not mean that it is inherently true, nor inherently false.
As far as I know, who ever said it didn't. But still: So Cavendish stands as an experiment that disproves FET. Thanks.
False. Cavendish has been disputed.
Disputing Cavendish does not make it, or its implications, false.
I never claimed such a thing.
But you keep implying it.
You inferring incorrect statements is no the fault of I, or FET.
Then stop saying that Cavendish has been disputed as if it means something.
It does mean something. It means Cavendish has been disputed.
And what exactly does Cavendish having been disputed mean in the context of this discussion?
It means that Cavendish is not universally accepted by all, namely, those who dispute it.
It is disputed by some neo nazis, that the holocaust never happened. Does that mean we can't use it as evidence for the evils of Hitler?
Do you have any evidence of the Holocaust happening?

Do you know it's illegal to deny the holocaust?

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #82 on: July 09, 2010, 12:39:55 PM »
Do you know it's illegal to deny the holocaust?
Not only am I not European, I'm not denying the Holocaust. Nice double fail.

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dell

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #83 on: July 09, 2010, 12:43:05 PM »
It's just a question... nice fail :) i was never accusing you of denying it, just posing an interesting fact :D

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ClockTower

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #84 on: July 09, 2010, 01:10:28 PM »
It's just a question... nice fail :) i was never accusing you of denying it, just posing an interesting fact :D
Nice... BF hoisted by his own petard.
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: Gravity??? WHat about that??
« Reply #85 on: July 09, 2010, 02:42:12 PM »
It's just a question... nice fail :) i was never accusing you of denying it, just posing an interesting fact :D
It's just a question... nice fail :) i was never accusing you of denying it, just posing an interesting fact :D
Nice... BF hoisted by his own petard.
ITT: REers use rhetorical questions, don't realize it.