Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.

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Lorddave

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #120 on: June 27, 2010, 06:41:46 PM »
I can attest:
There is no visible distortions from airplane windows.
Proof or go home.

Ok.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v303/Lord_dave/?action=view&current=IMG_0204.jpg

Picture of Norway's landscape, taken from about 35,000 feet early in the Morning, local time.  In fact, that shot was taken about an hour after sunrise.

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EireEngineer

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #121 on: June 27, 2010, 07:37:30 PM »
Johannes, prove to me that the windows even bend.  Fly in to KBJC and we will take the Citation up for you to have a look see.
If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate.

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #122 on: June 27, 2010, 08:02:59 PM »
I'm still a little disappointed with the "it's all a conspiracy" thing Jo pulled after he was shown to be wrong.
Boy, this conspiracy sure covered all its bases!  They even manipulated data on the properties of glass.

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Johannes

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #123 on: June 27, 2010, 08:11:44 PM »
I'm still a little disappointed with the "it's all a conspiracy" thing Jo pulled after he was shown to be wrong.
Boy, this conspiracy sure covered all its bases!  They even manipulated data on the properties of glass.
There are other materials in the glass that could flow to great a bulge. There could be inherent window manufacturing flaws that create imperfections in the windows that lead to the bulge.

It is also possible that the atmolayer is convex, creating the illusion of a curved horizon.

The major air travel sites do not recognize KBJC, or BJC, so it is unlikely I will be able to meet you there EireEngineer.

What needs to be done is someone to inspect a commercial airliner, unfortunately, not many companies will let a FE'er inspect a multi-million dollar investment to prove the earth is flat.

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #124 on: June 27, 2010, 08:31:35 PM »
There are other materials in the glass that could flow to great a bulge.

Straw 1.  Have any evidence?

There could be inherent window manufacturing flaws that create imperfections in the windows that lead to the bulge.

Straw 2.  In every single window of every single passenger plane?  Evidence?

It is also possible that the atmolayer is convex, creating the illusion of a curved horizon.

Straw 3.  Evidence?

Well, since you've grasped at all of them with sheer conjecture and have pretty much given up on actually demonstrating or proposing anything substantial, I have one more question; could you please explain to me why I felt no bend in the window whatsoever in either time I've flown across the Atlantic?  Your "convex atmolayer" thing seems to be all that's left, but you've yet to back it up or even explain the principle behind how it could be functional.  I already destroyed the trolling OP.  The least an FEer could do here is come up with an alternative.

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Johannes

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #125 on: June 27, 2010, 09:16:10 PM »
You "felt" no bending?

Highly viscous liquids still flow... I am not making this up...

It is quite common for manufacturing processes to have error tolerances of a few millimeters. Ask an industrial engineer.

Some flat earthers here say that the atomolayer is a dome. This would certainly account for above cloud level pictures of the horizon showing a curve horizon.

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #126 on: June 27, 2010, 09:30:41 PM »
You "felt" no bending?

That's right.  I put my hand against the window and felt no bend.  I didn't see one either.

Highly viscous liquids still flow... I am not making this up...

I'm not arguing against that.  What I argued against was Levee's idea that plane windows bending due to air pressure was the cause for an apparently curved horizon, which failed on multiple levels.

Some flat earthers here say that the atomolayer is a dome. This would certainly account for above cloud level pictures of the horizon showing a curve horizon.

Some flat earthers say the moon is alive.  It's a fun story, but until there's something to back it up, that's all it is.  If someone can show how a dome-shaped atmosphere would affect the path of light from numerous directions, they're in business, though still with most of their work still ahead of them.  Until they can make consistent accurate predictions that stand to scrutiny, a story is all it will be.

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markjo

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #127 on: June 27, 2010, 10:29:21 PM »
It is quite common for manufacturing processes to have error tolerances of a few millimeters.

Not in the aerospace industry. 

Ask an industrial engineer.

Better yet, ask an aerospace engineer.  Unless you suspect that they may be in on the conspiracy.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Johannes

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #128 on: June 27, 2010, 10:38:00 PM »
It is quite common for manufacturing processes to have error tolerances of a few millimeters.

Not in the aerospace industry. 

Ask an industrial engineer.

Better yet, ask an aerospace engineer.  Unless you suspect that they may be in on the conspiracy.
Are you an aerospace engineer?

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EireEngineer

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #129 on: June 27, 2010, 10:44:09 PM »


It is quite common for manufacturing processes to have error tolerances of a few millimeters. Ask an industrial engineer.



A few milimeters....no. Not these days. This is why my QC people have micrometers and calipers....because we look for errors measured in tenths and hundredths of millimeters, and all we are making are electronics.  Aviation grade machining is far more accurate than almost any other industry, because it has to be.

Oh, and if you cant figure out how to take a cab from DIA to Jeffco airport, you really cant be taken seriously.
If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the precipitate.

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Crustinator

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #130 on: June 28, 2010, 04:41:18 AM »
Glass is part of window.

Plane window is not glass.
Plane window is not lens.

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #131 on: June 28, 2010, 04:49:52 AM »
Let's examine the "bowing hypothesis".

Bowing Hypothesis (BH): The bowing of the vehicle due to atmospheric pressure effects causes the curvation of the horizon seen at high altitudes.

Alternative Earth-as-Sphere Hypothesis (EaSH): The spherical nature of the Earth causes the curvature.

Consider these three points:
1) The curvature is constistent in direction, with edges down and central area up. The BH fails to predict this. The EaSH does.
2) The curvature increases in a calculable and consistent way with altitude. The bowing hypothesis fails to predict this as well. The EaSH does.
3) Cameras not in a pressurized vessel consistently record on private and government ballons, various nation's space projects, and even private space launches. The BH in no way predicts these observations. The EaSH does.

Hence, I for parsimony and predictive results accept EaS hypothesis over the bowing hypothesis.
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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markjo

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #132 on: June 28, 2010, 06:40:29 AM »
It is quite common for manufacturing processes to have error tolerances of a few millimeters.

Not in the aerospace industry. 

Ask an industrial engineer.

Better yet, ask an aerospace engineer.  Unless you suspect that they may be in on the conspiracy.
Are you an aerospace engineer?
Are you?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #133 on: June 28, 2010, 06:50:48 AM »
It is quite common for manufacturing processes to have error tolerances of a few millimeters.

Not in the aerospace industry. 

Ask an industrial engineer.

Better yet, ask an aerospace engineer.  Unless you suspect that they may be in on the conspiracy.
Are you an aerospace engineer?
Are you?

A good friend of mine is. But he's not an idiot, therefore he thinks FE is nonsense.

So he'll tell you the truth, but being FE'ers, you won't like it, and will therefore proclaim him to be a liar.

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The Question1

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #134 on: June 28, 2010, 10:32:24 AM »
I'm still a little disappointed with the "it's all a conspiracy" thing Jo pulled after he was shown to be wrong.
Boy, this conspiracy sure covered all its bases!  They even manipulated data on the properties of glass.
I take it this is your first encounter with Johannes?

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General Disarray

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #135 on: June 28, 2010, 10:36:46 AM »
I'm still a little disappointed with the "it's all a conspiracy" thing Jo pulled after he was shown to be wrong.
Boy, this conspiracy sure covered all its bases!  They even manipulated data on the properties of glass.
I take it this is your first encounter with Johannes?

Johannes is terrible.
You don't want to make an enemy of me. I'm very powerful.

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The Question1

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #136 on: June 28, 2010, 10:43:49 AM »
I'm still a little disappointed with the "it's all a conspiracy" thing Jo pulled after he was shown to be wrong.
Boy, this conspiracy sure covered all its bases!  They even manipulated data on the properties of glass.
I take it this is your first encounter with Johannes?

Johannes is terrible.
Just terrible.

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #137 on: June 28, 2010, 10:48:54 AM »
just a guess but it could be something to do with the curvature of space?  >:(

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markjo

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #138 on: June 28, 2010, 11:06:43 AM »
Johannes is terrible.
Just terrible.
He really is.  But that's beside the point, irrelevant and off topic.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Johannes

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #139 on: June 28, 2010, 12:56:42 PM »
Glass is part of window.

Plane window is not glass.
Plane window is not lens.
Source?

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #140 on: June 28, 2010, 01:10:46 PM »
Glass is part of window.

Plane window is not glass.
Plane window is not lens.
Source?
Did you mean for us to provide the source for your claim that "Glass is part of window."? I'll assume that you can back up your claim. To speed things up though, here's a reference with citation that opposes your claim: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_materials_are_used_to_make_airplane_windows


Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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Johannes

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #141 on: June 28, 2010, 01:55:23 PM »
Glass is part of window.

Plane window is not glass.
Plane window is not lens.
Source?
Did you mean for us to provide the source for your claim that "Glass is part of window."? I'll assume that you can back up your claim. To speed things up though, here's a reference with citation that opposes your claim: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_materials_are_used_to_make_airplane_windows



Use google, you will see glass is part of most airplane window deployments.

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #142 on: June 28, 2010, 02:58:01 PM »
Glass is part of window.

Plane window is not glass.
Plane window is not lens.
Source?
Did you mean for us to provide the source for your claim that "Glass is part of window."? I'll assume that you can back up your claim. To speed things up though, here's a reference with citation that opposes your claim: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_materials_are_used_to_make_airplane_windows
Use google, you will see glass is part of most airplane window deployments.
I use Google regularly. I don’t see anything to substantiate your claim. Do you have a source or not?
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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Johannes

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #143 on: June 28, 2010, 03:16:33 PM »
Glass is part of window.

Plane window is not glass.
Plane window is not lens.
Source?
Did you mean for us to provide the source for your claim that "Glass is part of window."? I'll assume that you can back up your claim. To speed things up though, here's a reference with citation that opposes your claim: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_materials_are_used_to_make_airplane_windows
Use google, you will see glass is part of most airplane window deployments.
I use Google regularly. I don’t see anything to substantiate your claim. Do you have a source or not?

Yeah, http://tinyurl.com/2e729ph

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #144 on: June 28, 2010, 03:39:19 PM »
Glass is part of window.

Plane window is not glass.
Plane window is not lens.
Source?
Did you mean for us to provide the source for your claim that "Glass is part of window."? I'll assume that you can back up your claim. To speed things up though, here's a reference with citation that opposes your claim: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_materials_are_used_to_make_airplane_windows
Use google, you will see glass is part of most airplane window deployments.
I use Google regularly. I don’t see anything to substantiate your claim. Do you have a source or not?

Yeah, http://tinyurl.com/2e729ph
That was so funny!  :D The first hit was the source I gave that disproves your point. Maybe you should try reading what you find with Google—Just an idea!
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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PizzaPlanet

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #145 on: June 28, 2010, 03:58:02 PM »
Glass is part of window.

Plane window is not glass.
Plane window is not lens.
Source?
Did you mean for us to provide the source for your claim that "Glass is part of window."? I'll assume that you can back up your claim. To speed things up though, here's a reference with citation that opposes your claim: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_materials_are_used_to_make_airplane_windows
Use google, you will see glass is part of most airplane window deployments.
I use Google regularly. I don’t see anything to substantiate your claim. Do you have a source or not?

Yeah, http://tinyurl.com/2e729ph
That was so funny!  :D The first hit was the source I gave that disproves your point. Maybe you should try reading what you find with Google—Just an idea!

Quote
Jet airliner cabin windows are usually acrylic, and consist of three layers of material for redundancy and safety. Cockpit windows (which run the risk of bird strikes, hail, etc.) are made of multiple layers of glass and plastic, bonded together and with a heating element inside them to prevent ice from obscuring the view. Usually they are also coated on the outside with a material to help shed rain in flight (as the substance that used to be sprayed on them was banned about 15 years ago as an ozone-depleting substance).
Hmh.
hacking your precious forum as we speak 8) 8) 8)

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #146 on: June 28, 2010, 04:13:27 PM »
Glass is part of window.

Plane window is not glass.
Plane window is not lens.
Source?
Did you mean for us to provide the source for your claim that "Glass is part of window."? I'll assume that you can back up your claim. To speed things up though, here's a reference with citation that opposes your claim: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_materials_are_used_to_make_airplane_windows
Use google, you will see glass is part of most airplane window deployments.
I use Google regularly. I don’t see anything to substantiate your claim. Do you have a source or not?

Yeah, http://tinyurl.com/2e729ph
That was so funny!  :D The first hit was the source I gave that disproves your point. Maybe you should try reading what you find with Google—Just an idea!

Quote
Jet airliner cabin windows are usually acrylic, and consist of three layers of material for redundancy and safety. Cockpit windows (which run the risk of bird strikes, hail, etc.) are made of multiple layers of glass and plastic, bonded together and with a heating element inside them to prevent ice from obscuring the view. Usually they are also coated on the outside with a material to help shed rain in flight (as the substance that used to be sprayed on them was banned about 15 years ago as an ozone-depleting substance).
Hmh.
You are not paying attention, sigh. How does anything in your quote above lead you to J’s claim: “glass is part of most airplane window deployments.”?
Your quote says the opposite: “Jet airliner cabin windows are usually acrylic.”


Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #147 on: June 28, 2010, 06:20:26 PM »
You are not paying attention, sigh. How does anything in your quote above lead you to J’s claim: “glass is part of most airplane window deployments.”?
Your quote says the opposite: “Jet airliner cabin windows are usually acrylic.”

It was such a short reply, did you really have to copypaste it and turn it into such a headache-inducing eyesore?
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?

Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #148 on: June 28, 2010, 06:26:27 PM »
You are not paying attention, sigh. How does anything in your quote above lead you to J’s claim: “glass is part of most airplane window deployments.”?
Your quote says the opposite: “Jet airliner cabin windows are usually acrylic.”

It was such a short reply, did you really have to copypaste it and turn it into such a headache-inducing eyesore?
If you're not going to contribute to the debate, did you really have to post at all? What's next? Grammar? What octave you whine best at?
Keep it serious, Thork. You can troll, but don't be so open. We have standards

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PizzaPlanet

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Re: Why The Earth Appears Curved at a High Altitude.
« Reply #149 on: June 28, 2010, 06:27:58 PM »
You are not paying attention, sigh. How does anything in your quote above lead you to J’s claim: “glass is part of most airplane window deployments.”?
Your quote says the opposite: “Jet airliner cabin windows are usually acrylic.”

It was such a short reply, did you really have to copypaste it and turn it into such a headache-inducing eyesore?
If you're not going to contribute to the debate, did you really have to post at all? What's next? Grammar? What octave you whine best at?
Ugh, you really messed the tenses up there.
hacking your precious forum as we speak 8) 8) 8)