Questions about The Conspiracy

Could someone answer a few questions on The Conspiracy for me?

Presumably, at some point in the past (say, the 18th century) the leading astronomers and philosophers believed in a spheroidal Earth, together with a spheroidal Sun and Moon, with the Earth orbiting the Sun, and the Moon orbiting the Earth.

Is that right?


Then, more recently, it was discovered that the Earth was flat, and that the Sun and Moon are flat discs suspended above the Earth.

Who made this discovery, and when did it occur?

It was believed to be flat before it was believed to be round, then those who thought it was round were mistaken while the conspiracy continued to make people believe it was round as it was popular belief. If the conspiracy had changed it's stance on the earth shape, people would have realised they were lying as they have already committed to lying about moon landings and satellite launches, which aren't possible on a flat earth.

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I don't belive in this, but it's the answer you're looking for in terms of a Flat Earth.

The earth was known to be flat since before the beginning of recorded history.  It wasn't until later that people like Copernicus suggested a heliocentric solar system (not to mention various Greeks and Roman's before him).  Not until around the 18th century did people started rewriting history and portraying them as 'freethinkers' or 'heroes'.  This is clearly nothing more then people trying to push an anti-Roman agenda.  I'm not trying to get religious, but you have to understand that Rome was a huge economical power with influence in every industrial nation.  To attack the seat in Rome, one would have to attack the very history it was built on.

As nations began to silently fight the oppressive power of the papacy so that they may flourish under a banner of free-trade out of the way of religious persecution, the conspiracy was born.  Nations had to collaborate with cover-ups and lies.  They couldn't very well let these facts escape after just defaming Rome (and thus gaining more power) for it's 'lies'.  

From here the conspiracy snowballed into that multibillion dollar cover-up that it is today.  From guards posted in various military bases on the 'ice' wall yet being told they are on the front lies of a war zone to selling GPS systems that read information from towers and output your location as if you were on globe.

I hope this has cleared some things up for you.

The earth was known to be flat since before the beginning of recorded history.  It wasn't until later that people like Copernicus suggested a heliocentric solar system (not to mention various Greeks and Roman's before him).  Not until around the 18th century did people started rewriting history and portraying them as 'freethinkers' or 'heroes'.  This is clearly nothing more then people trying to push an anti-Roman agenda.  I'm not trying to get religious, but you have to understand that Rome was a huge economical power with influence in every industrial nation.  To attack the seat in Rome, one would have to attack the very history it was built on.

As nations began to silently fight the oppressive power of the papacy so that they may flourish under a banner of free-trade out of the way of religious persecution, the conspiracy was born.  Nations had to collaborate with cover-ups and lies.  They couldn't very well let these facts escape after just defaming Rome (and thus gaining more power) for it's 'lies'.  

From here the conspiracy snowballed into that multibillion dollar cover-up that it is today.  From guards posted in various military bases on the 'ice' wall yet being told they are on the front lies of a war zone to selling GPS systems that read information from towers and output your location as if you were on globe.

I hope this has cleared some things up for you.

Any evidence of that?

GPS systems that read information from towers and output your location as if you were on globe.

This is where I have an issue. Can you explain how such a system would work with that accuracy of GPS systems today?

And where are these towers?

Do they broadcast satellite TV too?

The earth was known to be flat since before the beginning of recorded history.  It wasn't until later that people like Copernicus suggested a heliocentric solar system (not to mention various Greeks and Roman's before him).  Not until around the 18th century did people started rewriting history and portraying them as 'freethinkers' or 'heroes'.  This is clearly nothing more then people trying to push an anti-Roman agenda.  I'm not trying to get religious, but you have to understand that Rome was a huge economical power with influence in every industrial nation.  To attack the seat in Rome, one would have to attack the very history it was built on.

As nations began to silently fight the oppressive power of the papacy so that they may flourish under a banner of free-trade out of the way of religious persecution, the conspiracy was born.  Nations had to collaborate with cover-ups and lies.  They couldn't very well let these facts escape after just defaming Rome (and thus gaining more power) for it's 'lies'.  

From here the conspiracy snowballed into that multibillion dollar cover-up that it is today.  From guards posted in various military bases on the 'ice' wall yet being told they are on the front lies of a war zone to selling GPS systems that read information from towers and output your location as if you were on globe.

I hope this has cleared some things up for you.

So every scientist that has been involved in this conspiracy is more motived by money rather than curiousity?

From here the conspiracy snowballed into that multibillion dollar cover-up that it is today.  From guards posted in various military bases on the 'ice' wall yet being told they are on the front lies of a war zone to selling GPS systems that read information from towers and output your location as if you were on globe.

I hope this has cleared some things up for you.

oh yeah clears everything up

ps: how do you just write all of this as fact without feeling like a total asshat... no offence...

The earth was known to be flat since before the beginning of recorded history.  It wasn't until later that people like Copernicus suggested a heliocentric solar system (not to mention various Greeks and Roman's before him).  Not until around the 18th century did people started rewriting history and portraying them as 'freethinkers' or 'heroes'.  This is clearly nothing more then people trying to push an anti-Roman agenda.  I'm not trying to get religious, but you have to understand that Rome was a huge economical power with influence in every industrial nation.  To attack the seat in Rome, one would have to attack the very history it was built on.

As nations began to silently fight the oppressive power of the papacy so that they may flourish under a banner of free-trade out of the way of religious persecution, the conspiracy was born.  Nations had to collaborate with cover-ups and lies.  They couldn't very well let these facts escape after just defaming Rome (and thus gaining more power) for it's 'lies'.  

From here the conspiracy snowballed into that multibillion dollar cover-up that it is today.  From guards posted in various military bases on the 'ice' wall yet being told they are on the front lies of a war zone to selling GPS systems that read information from towers and output your location as if you were on globe.

I hope this has cleared some things up for you.

You do realize that Heliocentric and Geocentric both are Round Earth right?  The roundness of the Earth was well known by mariners as far back as the 14th century.  Columbus staked his life on the idea that you could travel around the whole planet to reach India instead of going all the way around Africa.  He would have succeed too, if it wasn't for the Americas being in the way.
The Roman Empire was long gone in the 18th century.  It died in the 5th century.  The Byzantine Empire endured for another millennium but that's about it.  So I fail to see how it was an anti-roman agenda.  Unless you mean anti-Church.  Then you have some accuracy.  But then again, it was the Church who lifted the Ban on the books and, in essence, accepted such knowledge as true.

You do realize that Heliocentric and Geocentric both are Round Earth right?  The roundness of the Earth was well known by mariners as far back as the 14th century. 

Actually, the ancient Greeks figured out that the earth is round over 2000 years ago.

Columbus staked his life on the idea that you could travel around the whole planet to reach India instead of going all the way around Africa.  He would have succeed too, if it wasn't for the Americas being in the way.

Everyone already knew that the earth was round in 1492.  Columbus just chopped a few thousand miles off of the accepted (and fairly accurate) circumference of the the earth in order to make the trip seem more practical.

Quote from: Lorddave on April 15, 2010, 01:14:52 PM

You do realize that Heliocentric and Geocentric both are Round Earth right?  The roundness of the Earth was well known by mariners as far back as the 14th century. 

Actually, the ancient Greeks figured out that the earth is round over 2000 years ago.

Quote from: Lorddave on April 15, 2010, 01:14:52 PM

Columbus staked his life on the idea that you could travel around the whole planet to reach India instead of going all the way around Africa.  He would have succeed too, if it wasn't for the Americas being in the way.

Everyone already knew that the earth was round in 1492.  Columbus just chopped a few thousand miles off of the accepted (and fairly accurate) circumference of the the earth in order to make the trip seem more practical.

I know, but I don't think he can think that far back.

I know, but I don't think he can think that far back.

Perpetuating a myth is never a good strategy when trying to reveal the truth.

Quote from: Lorddave on April 15, 2010, 04:26:19 PM

I know, but I don't think he can think that far back.

Perpetuating a myth is never a good strategy in a scientific debate.

I don't think I was perpetuating a myth.  I just left out that they knew about it even further back.

Quote from: Pongo on April 15, 2010, 01:38:26 AM

GPS systems that read information from towers and output your location as if you were on globe.

This is where I have an issue. Can you explain how such a system would work with that accuracy of GPS systems today?

Yes.  Towers can triangulate a position using the same geometric calculations that alleged satellites could.  Where most people get confused is that you are receiving data based on your location on a flat earth, yet the GPS device does the calculations necessary to convert that into appearing like you are on a globe.  It's truly deplorable, and in some cases GPS devices go so far as to show you which 'satellites' are overhead.

Yes.  Towers can triangulate a position using the same geometric calculations that alleged satellites could.  Where most people get confused is that you are receiving data based on your location on a flat earth, yet the GPS device does the calculations necessary to convert that into appearing like you are on a globe.  It's truly deplorable, and in some cases GPS devices go so far as to show you which 'satellites' are overhead.

Except towers don't work when the user is in, say, a valley.

Quote from: 2fst4u on April 15, 2010, 02:07:41 AM

Quote from: Pongo on April 15, 2010, 01:38:26 AM

GPS systems that read information from towers and output your location as if you were on globe.

This is where I have an issue. Can you explain how such a system would work with that accuracy of GPS systems today?

Yes.  Towers can triangulate a position using the same geometric calculations that alleged satellites could.  Where most people get confused is that you are receiving data based on your location on a flat earth, yet the GPS device does the calculations necessary to convert that into appearing like you are on a globe.  It's truly deplorable, and in some cases GPS devices go so far as to show you which 'satellites' are overhead.

1. Satellites and cellphone towers use completely different parts of the electromagnetic spectrum

2. because of discrepancies, the accuracy of such a system would be inferior compared to GPS that we sue every day.

Fail harder.

1. Satellites and cellphone towers use completely different parts of the electromagnetic spectrum

Can you demonstrate this first hand?  Or can you only link links and cite cites from those in control of the alleged satellites or other such unconfirmable sources?

Quote from: 2fst4u on April 16, 2010, 03:00:42 AM

1. Satellites and cellphone towers use completely different parts of the electromagnetic spectrum

Can you demonstrate this first hand?  Or can you only link links and cite cites from those in control of the alleged satellites or other such unconfirmable sources?

I certainly can. And so can you, if you'd bother to do anything to help yourself.

Quote from: 2fst4u on April 16, 2010, 03:00:42 AM

1. Satellites and cellphone towers use completely different parts of the electromagnetic spectrum

Can you demonstrate this first hand?  Or can you only link links and cite cites from those in control of the alleged satellites or other such unconfirmable sources?

Each GPS satellite transmits two carrier signals in the microwave range, designated as L1 and L2 (frequencies located in the L-Band between 1000 and 2000 MHz).
Civil GPS receivers use the L1 frequency with 1575.42 MHz (wavelength 19.05 cm). The L1 frequency carries the navigation data as well as the SPS code (standard positioning code). The L2 frequency (1227.60 MHz, wavelength 24.45 cm) only carries the P code and is only used by receivers which are designed for PPS (precision positioning code). Mostly this can be found in military receivers.

Frequency bands used in the United States Current / Planned Technologies    Band    Frequency (MHz) SMR iDEN 800 806-824 and 851-869 AMPS, GSM, IS-95 (CDMA), IS-136 (D-AMPS), 3G     Cellular     824-849, 869-894, 896-901, 935-940 GSM, IS-95 (CDMA), IS-136 (D-AMPS), 3G     PCS     1850–1910 and 1930–1990 3G, 4G, MediaFlo, DVB-H     700 MHz     698-806 Unknown     1.4 GHz     1392–1395 and 1432–1435 3G, 4G     AWS     1710–1755 and 2110–2170 4G     BRS/EBS     2500–2690

As you can see, there is no overlap between GPS and cellular signals so all one has to do is point a signal analyzer at a cell tower and at a GPS satellite to verify the signal origin and structure.

Owned. I didn't want to look up figures because he just said they'd be unverified but whatevs.

That's not a first hand demontration.  It looks to me like the results of a first handed google search.

That's not a first hand demontration.  It looks to me like the results of a first handed google search.

I wonder how many here have done first hand demonstrations?

What?  NO first hand Bendy Light demonstration?
No First Hand Celestial Gears demonstration?

Choose your arguments carefully for they apply to both.

That's not a first hand demontration.  It looks to me like the results of a first handed google search.

Perhaps you missed the part where I invited the skeptic to collect their own data.  After all, I might be a member of the conspiracy.

As you can see, there is no overlap between GPS and cellular signals so all one has to do is point a signal analyzer at a cell tower and at a GPS satellite to verify the signal origin and structure.

Quote from: Pongo on April 20, 2010, 03:26:08 PM

That's not a first hand demontration.  It looks to me like the results of a first handed google search.

Perhaps you missed the part where I invited the skeptic to collect their own data.  After all, I might be a member of the conspiracy.

Quote from: markjo on April 20, 2010, 07:24:42 AM

As you can see, there is no overlap between GPS and cellular signals so all one has to do is point a signal analyzer at a cell tower and at a GPS satellite to verify the signal origin and structure.

Clearly the signal analyzer also knows the supposed location of satellites and outputs what you want to see when pointing in the general direction of a 'known' satellite.

Quote from: markjo on April 20, 2010, 04:07:13 PM

Quote from: Pongo on April 20, 2010, 03:26:08 PM

That's not a first hand demontration.  It looks to me like the results of a first handed google search.

Perhaps you missed the part where I invited the skeptic to collect their own data.  After all, I might be a member of the conspiracy.

Quote from: markjo on April 20, 2010, 07:24:42 AM

As you can see, there is no overlap between GPS and cellular signals so all one has to do is point a signal analyzer at a cell tower and at a GPS satellite to verify the signal origin and structure.

Clearly the signal analyzer also knows the supposed location of satellites and outputs what you want to see when pointing in the general direction of a 'known' satellite.

I'd love to know how big this conspiracy is if even things like signal analyzers have to be modified to pick up dummy signals.