First they came for the Internet

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First they came for the Internet
« on: April 19, 2010, 03:16:40 AM »
And I didn't speak up, because I don't want my children seeing that.

Then they came for the television news
And I didn't speak up, because I don't watch television news.

Then they came for the newspapers
And I didn't speak up, because nobody told me.

Then they came for my rights
And by that time, there was no way left for me to speak up.



I'm against censorship of everything other than the big 2, Child Porn and How To Make A Bomb.
When I was 5 years old my mum always told me that happiness was the key to life.
When I went to school they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up.
I wrote down "happy."
They told me I didn't understand the assignment.

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Parsifal

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2010, 03:38:41 AM »
Why censor bomb-making? Then governments will be the only ones with bombs, and they have the biggest ones of all.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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frozen_berries

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2010, 03:41:55 AM »
What is the big 2?

Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2010, 03:47:45 AM »
What is the big 2?
He explained that in the very same sentence, lmao.
Books don't lie...the people that write them do.

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Chris Spaghetti

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2010, 04:15:47 AM »
Why censor bomb-making? simple bombs can be constructed with a rudimentry understanding of explosives while more complex bombs are going to be taught by terrorist groups with or without the 'net.

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frozen_berries

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2010, 04:20:02 AM »
What is the big 2?
He explained that in the very same sentence, lmao.

oh LOL.  :D

Censorship is impossible.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2010, 04:21:55 AM by frozen_berries »

Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2010, 08:34:12 AM »
I think all violence-provoking information should be censored as well, but the guidelines for what is considered "violence-provoking" should be very specific and strictly maintained so that no loose interpretations are used for unnecessary censorship.

Why censor bomb-making? simple bombs can be constructed with a rudimentry understanding of explosives while more complex bombs are going to be taught by terrorist groups with or without the 'net.

Yes this is mostly true, and its with similar reasoning that people wish for more strict rules on gun regulation. The only thing is that bomb making really has almost no other purpose than for killing innocent peoples (and maybe just fucking around with dangerous shit), so why not censor it for the sake of making it just that much harder for terrorists to get the information themselves?
"So now we know. Pigs are horses. Girls are boys. War is peace." -Arundhati Roy

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Benjamin Franklin

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2010, 07:44:52 PM »
All censorship is wrong.

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Lorddave

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2010, 07:56:17 PM »
Child porn is illegal.  It's not something you can censor.  How do you censor something illegal?

I would support only one type of censorship: The Opinion of the Stupid.  Allow me to explain.

Everyone has an opinion.  Everyone.  You don't even have to understand the subject, you can have an opinion.  Unfortunately it seems that the opinions of those who don't understand the subject carry more weight than those who do.  I ask you, how can a society function when the majority of Americans would vote for a presidential candidate who says they'll lower taxes when, legally, that person could NEVER lower taxes: only congress can.

The idiots should be allowed to speak, but their opinions should not be given any weight.  Of course, the news media caters to the people and the people like controversy.  Thus, those with loud, radical opinions on something they don't understand (the louder you scream, the less you understand) the more it's showed in the news.  The more it's showed in the news, the more it's assumed to be the majority and thus correct opinion.

YAY for mob mentality!
I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2010, 01:52:16 AM »
The idiots should be allowed to speak, but their opinions should not be given any weight.  Of course, the news media caters to the people and the people like controversy.  Thus, those with loud, radical opinions on something they don't understand (the louder you scream, the less you understand) the more it's showed in the news.  The more it's showed in the news, the more it's assumed to be the majority and thus correct opinion.

The real problem is when the people in power actually think that this is what the public wants. That's why we should have a system where you are promoted into a position of power not elected. That way the people who become leaders are the smart, savvy people and they can make contreversial decisions because they don't need a vote.
When I was 5 years old my mum always told me that happiness was the key to life.
When I went to school they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up.
I wrote down "happy."
They told me I didn't understand the assignment.

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Parsifal

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2010, 02:15:05 AM »
The real problem is when the people in power actually think that this is what the public wants. That's why we should have a system where you are promoted into a position of power not elected. That way the people who become leaders are the smart, savvy people and they can make contreversial decisions because they don't need a vote.

That would be a regression back into monarchy, a system which we've only just managed to escape from in recent times. I fail to see how that would help our current situation in any way at all.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2010, 09:09:45 PM »
Didn't you get the order a bit wrong there?

Television has always been censored.

Your rights have been stepped on for many years prior to the internet.

Many would say that the internet is, so to say, the final frontier.

There is no context where censorship is ever a good idea. Protecting people from information is just as dumb as it always was.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2010, 09:13:50 PM by HamsterMan »

Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2010, 02:23:13 AM »
The real problem is when the people in power actually think that this is what the public wants. That's why we should have a system where you are promoted into a position of power not elected. That way the people who become leaders are the smart, savvy people and they can make contreversial decisions because they don't need a vote.

That would be a regression back into monarchy, a system which we've only just managed to escape from in recent times. I fail to see how that would help our current situation in any way at all.

But it wouldn't be hereditary and it would be a constitutional monarchy.
When I was 5 years old my mum always told me that happiness was the key to life.
When I went to school they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up.
I wrote down "happy."
They told me I didn't understand the assignment.

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Lorddave

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2010, 03:23:43 AM »
The idiots should be allowed to speak, but their opinions should not be given any weight.  Of course, the news media caters to the people and the people like controversy.  Thus, those with loud, radical opinions on something they don't understand (the louder you scream, the less you understand) the more it's showed in the news.  The more it's showed in the news, the more it's assumed to be the majority and thus correct opinion.

The real problem is when the people in power actually think that this is what the public wants. That's why we should have a system where you are promoted into a position of power not elected. That way the people who become leaders are the smart, savvy people and they can make contreversial decisions because they don't need a vote.

well you'd have the issue of who to promote. Experts don't always agree with each other nor are they always good leaders. Not only that but the ignorant masses usually don't like doing things that are hard but smart. And if we have such anger now, imagine what will happen when decisions are made without deliberations.

I'm sorry to say but the only person qualified to make decisions is someone who doesn't want to.
I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

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Parsifal

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2010, 03:44:00 AM »
But it wouldn't be hereditary and it would be a constitutional monarchy.

A monarchy is still a monarchy.

Also, this:

I'm sorry to say but the only person qualified to make decisions is someone who doesn't want to.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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Lorddave

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2010, 12:38:19 PM »
But it wouldn't be hereditary and it would be a constitutional monarchy.

A monarchy is still a monarchy.

Also, this:

I'm sorry to say but the only person qualified to make decisions is someone who doesn't want to.

A Douglas Adams Fan too?
I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.

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Parsifal

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2010, 05:42:55 PM »
A Douglas Adams Fan too?

No, I was just quoting you because what you said was right.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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Lord Wilmore

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #17 on: April 22, 2010, 07:36:01 AM »
I'm sorry to say but the only person qualified to make decisions is someone who doesn't want to.

A Douglas Adams Fan too?


BTW, he borrowed that from Plato.
"I want truth for truth's sake, not for the applaud or approval of men. I would not reject truth because it is unpopular, nor accept error because it is popular. I should rather be right and stand alone than run with the multitude and be wrong." - C.S. DeFord

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Marcus Aurelius

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #18 on: April 22, 2010, 08:32:36 AM »
The whole born secret thing is bullshit.  By the very same justification, years ago the government could have made radio communication a born secret (taking away the patents ), because of the significant military advantage it would give any country over another who did not have the technology.

It actually went to the supreme court, but the government dropped their case rather than risk losing their power to declare entire subjects of information preemtively secret.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._The_Progressive

So if I invented cold fusion tomorrow (yeah I know), and tried to patent it, they could simply take it, then tell me that I am not allowed to divulge how it is done to anybody else.

Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #19 on: April 23, 2010, 04:12:27 AM »
So if I invented cold fusion tomorrow (yeah I know), and tried to patent it, they could simply take it, then tell me that I am not allowed to divulge how it is done to anybody else.

But you'd tell other people anyway?
You better...
When I was 5 years old my mum always told me that happiness was the key to life.
When I went to school they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up.
I wrote down "happy."
They told me I didn't understand the assignment.

*

John Davis

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #20 on: April 23, 2010, 05:06:30 AM »
Why censor bomb-making? simple bombs can be constructed with a rudimentry understanding of explosives while more complex bombs are going to be taught by terrorist groups with or without the 'net.

Yes this is mostly true, and its with similar reasoning that people wish for more strict rules on gun regulation. The only thing is that bomb making really has almost no other purpose than for killing innocent peoples (and maybe just fucking around with dangerous shit), so why not censor it for the sake of making it just that much harder for terrorists to get the information themselves?
Demolition.  Mining. I'm sure there are other uses.
Quantum Ab Hoc

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EnigmaZV

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #21 on: April 23, 2010, 12:42:41 PM »
Avalanche control
I don't know what you're implying, but you're probably wrong.

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Raist

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #22 on: April 23, 2010, 12:45:54 PM »
I think all violence-provoking information should be censored as well, but the guidelines for what is considered "violence-provoking" should be very specific and strictly maintained so that no loose interpretations are used for unnecessary censorship.

Why censor bomb-making? simple bombs can be constructed with a rudimentry understanding of explosives while more complex bombs are going to be taught by terrorist groups with or without the 'net.

Yes this is mostly true, and its with similar reasoning that people wish for more strict rules on gun regulation. The only thing is that bomb making really has almost no other purpose than for killing innocent peoples (and maybe just fucking around with dangerous shit), so why not censor it for the sake of making it just that much harder for terrorists to get the information themselves?

Yup, just censor violent things. And then violent porn, because that's well... violent. Then violent television. Then the "violent pictures" of what the government is doing.

Even when you people take a stand you start backpedaling immediately.

Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #23 on: April 23, 2010, 10:00:40 PM »
Obviously the demoliton companies and so would still have access to the information. What I meant was that if there is a site that says:

Here is how to make a turpentine bomb and put it in a subway!
1. Get stuff
2. etc. etc.

Then it should be pulled down.
When I was 5 years old my mum always told me that happiness was the key to life.
When I went to school they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up.
I wrote down "happy."
They told me I didn't understand the assignment.

*

Parsifal

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Re: First they came for the Internet
« Reply #24 on: April 23, 2010, 10:02:25 PM »
Obviously the demoliton companies and so would still have access to the information. What I meant was that if there is a site that says:

Here is how to make a turpentine bomb and put it in a subway!
1. Get stuff
2. etc. etc.

Then it should be pulled down.

No it shouldn't.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.