Stars and Constellations - Explain?

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Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« on: January 09, 2010, 02:32:27 PM »
i've thouroughly read your FAQ and find no answer to explain, or rather fault aristotles findings of Travelers going south seeing southern constellations rise higher above the horizon. And also, why is the southern cross constellation only visible mainly in the southern hemisphere of earth?
I live in australia and see it every night, so i know it exists. And have travelled to the northern hemisphere numerous times, and have been unable to find the constellation. For a round earth, this occurs since the constellation, in relation to earth, is situated in a southerly direction, and thus is not visible in the northern vicinties of earth, as a direct line of sight is obstucted by earth. This also supports aristotles work, in relation to proving the earth is round.
For a FE, how does this occur?
How is a constellation visible near the horizon in one country, while being directly above others in a different country? If the light does bend to produce this phenomenon, then where is the constellation

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Parsifal

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2010, 05:47:58 AM »
How is a constellation visible near the horizon in one country, while being directly above others in a different country? If the light does bend to produce this phenomenon, then where is the constellation

The constellation would be directly above the location where it is observed to be directly overhead, since vertical light does not bend according to EA theory. As you travel further away, the bend becomes more extreme as the light coming from the star gets closer to horizontal, and eventually it bends so much that it appears to be on the horizon. As you move still further, the bend required for the light to reach you would take the starlight underground (or under the ocean), which blocks the light so you don't see it at all.
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Mookie89

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2010, 01:29:19 PM »
How is a constellation visible near the horizon in one country, while being directly above others in a different country? If the light does bend to produce this phenomenon, then where is the constellation

The constellation would be directly above the location where it is observed to be directly overhead, since vertical light does not bend according to EA theory. As you travel further away, the bend becomes more extreme as the light coming from the star gets closer to horizontal, and eventually it bends so much that it appears to be on the horizon. As you move still further, the bend required for the light to reach you would take the starlight underground (or under the ocean), which blocks the light so you don't see it at all.

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2010, 04:29:40 PM »
"since vertical light does not bend"

Why does vertical light not bend? And also, how come can astronomers create accurate star maps, if the light from all stars is not directly overhead from a specific observatory, this would mean their exact position would be distorted to a different degree from observatory to observatory, meaning the position of the stars from star map to star map would be not be consistent. However this is not the case, countless astronomers have all created their own star maps, and their determined positions and distances all match up with each other, meaning the stars position can be consistently calculated on earth from varying observatories, since the light given off from stars does not bend, which would prevent them from calculating accurate distances and locations.

Is every single astronomer on earth in on this conspiracy? Or does the government control the distribution of star maps?

http://www.fourmilab.ch/yoursky/ (this website can provide you a accurate star map regardless of where you are, you can look up at night and confirm it too)
http://www.skymaps.com/

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Parsifal

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2010, 06:19:28 PM »
Why does vertical light not bend?

Because light bends up. Vertical light is either already travelling straight up, or travelling directly down so that no one direction of bend is favoured over any other.

And also, how come can astronomers create accurate star maps, if the light from all stars is not directly overhead from a specific observatory, this would mean their exact position would be distorted to a different degree from observatory to observatory, meaning the position of the stars from star map to star map would be not be consistent. However this is not the case, countless astronomers have all created their own star maps, and their determined positions and distances all match up with each other, meaning the stars position can be consistently calculated on earth from varying observatories, since the light given off from stars does not bend, which would prevent them from calculating accurate distances and locations.

Is every single astronomer on earth in on this conspiracy? Or does the government control the distribution of star maps?

I don't see why relative positions would be distorted. It would simply make a flat celestial plane look like a celestial sphere.
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SupahLovah

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2010, 10:58:35 AM »
Why does vertical light not bend?

Because light bends up. Vertical light is either already travelling straight up, or travelling directly down so that no one direction of bend is favoured over any other.
Wouldn't it just accelerate in the "upward" direction?
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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2010, 11:39:50 AM »
Please enlighten me, this photo undoubtedly proves light travels straight, it does no bend to such a degree as all of you FE's claim it too. Have a look at this photo, and try explaining to me that light does not travel straight. What proof, either written or photographic can you show me, to make me think otherwise...



don't say this photo proves nothing, as you have done with every other photo presented. It perfectly shows the shadow the cloud has cast, and how the light surrounding the shadow is travelling in a straight line.

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SupahLovah

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2010, 11:41:43 AM »
That photo would also show that line doesn't come to earth in anywhere NEAR parallel lines, so eratosthenes' experiment was useless and the sun must be much closer to earth. Thanks!
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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2010, 12:01:49 PM »
i'm not exactly sure what you're saying there, but from what i read. Have you heard of perspective? the shadow looks larger since it is closer to you, and smaller as the distance increases. Can you not comprehend this phenomena? A 2d image can not accurately represent a 3d landscape, and that is why the photo is distorted. And also, it can be seen that the sun is setting, so the cloud and the sun are almost level, that is why the shadow is cast almost parallel to the ground

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SupahLovah

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2010, 12:15:18 PM »

"Study Gravitation; It's a field with a lot of potential!"

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markjo

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SupahLovah

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2010, 03:15:26 PM »
Why did you have to ruin that guy's homework assignment I just gave him?
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markjo

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #12 on: January 11, 2010, 03:17:34 PM »
Because I'm a spoilsport.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
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It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2010, 05:37:44 PM »
Those photos don't show that the sun is close to the earth at all.  Those rays of light, especially in the first image, may appear to be travelling downwards towards the ground, but this is not the case.  Each ray is actually travelling at a surprisingly sharp angle towards the ground, and the reason you cannot see this is due to the angle of the photograph.  The photographer has positioned themselves so that they are taking a photograph towards the sun's rays, looking along their length.  This means that even though the rays of light are almost parallel, we are seeing these lines move off into the distance, allowing perspective to take effect.  It's like looking up at a tall skyscraper.  The edges of the skyscraper are parallel, but if we are standing at the base of the building looking up, the sides of the building appear to converge together towards a point at the top. 

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skeptical scientist

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2010, 07:26:17 PM »
Projective geometry. It's a simple perspective effect, the same one that causes the appearance of a "vanishing point" in all pictures of geometric objects with many parallel lines (for example, a long hallway, or railroad tracks).
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Parsifal

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #15 on: January 11, 2010, 08:09:44 PM »
Wouldn't it just accelerate in the "upward" direction?

No.

All constellations are "directly above"?

Well, yes. Every constellation is directly above some area on the surface of the Earth at any particular time. This is true in both RET and FET.
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SupahLovah

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2010, 01:21:24 AM »
Wouldn't it just accelerate in the "upward" direction?
No.
And what exactly makes EA not effect downward traveling light? If light traveling to the left is accelerated upwards, and light traveling to the right is accelerating upward, that leads me to believe there's a constant, universal force accelerating it upward. If you accelerate something moving downward upward, you begin to slow it until it hits 0 velocity and begins traveling in the opposite direction.
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skeptical scientist

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #17 on: January 12, 2010, 01:43:11 AM »
Wouldn't it just accelerate in the "upward" direction?
No.
And what exactly makes EA not effect downward traveling light? If light traveling to the left is accelerated upwards, and light traveling to the right is accelerating upward, that leads me to believe there's a constant, universal force accelerating it upward. If you accelerate something moving downward upward, you begin to slow it until it hits 0 velocity and begins traveling in the opposite direction.
Except that acceleration affects light differently, since it always travels at the same rate, depending only on the medium through which it is traveling (c for vacuum). An acceleration normal to its direction of motion causes it to change direction without changing speed, while an acceleration parallel its direction of motion doesn't change its speed at all, but instead causes it to redshift or blueshift (depending on whether the acceleration is in the opposite direction or the same direction).
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SupahLovah

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #18 on: January 12, 2010, 02:12:38 AM »
So at noon everything should be red?
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Parsifal

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #19 on: January 12, 2010, 03:06:01 AM »
So at noon everything should be red?

No.
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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #20 on: January 12, 2010, 04:36:51 AM »
Well, yes. Every constellation is directly above some area on the surface of the Earth at any particular time. This is true in both RET and FET.

It might surprise you to know that constallations consist of stars spread throughout the heavens, both directly overhead and on the horizon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draco_%28constellation%29

Lame troll is lame. Good to have you back ParsiSteve. I'm guessing you've decided to give up on higher education and focus on trolling here.

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Parsifal

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #21 on: January 12, 2010, 04:38:31 AM »
It might surprise you to know that constallations consist of stars spread throughout the heavens, both directly overhead and on the horizon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draco_%28constellation%29

Lame troll is lame. Good to have you back ParsiSteve. I'm guessing you've decided to give up on higher education and focus on trolling here.

Are you telling me that there is no point on the surface of the Earth from which part of Draco would appear directly overhead?
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #22 on: January 12, 2010, 06:11:23 AM »
It might surprise you to know that constallations consist of stars spread throughout the heavens, both directly overhead and on the horizon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draco_%28constellation%29

Lame troll is lame. Good to have you back ParsiSteve. I'm guessing you've decided to give up on higher education and focus on trolling here.

Are you telling me that there is no point on the surface of the Earth from which part of Draco would appear directly overhead?

NOT IF IT WAS FLAT.

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Parsifal

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #23 on: January 12, 2010, 07:08:41 AM »
NOT IF IT WAS FLAT.

We're not talking about different shapes of the Earth here. We're just talking about what has been observed.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #24 on: January 12, 2010, 07:48:28 AM »
NOT IF IT WAS FLAT.

We're not talking about different shapes of the Earth here. We're just talking about what has been observed.

Parsi-F-F-FAIL!!!!

What's been observed is completely inconsistent with Flat Earth Theory. Troll harder next time.

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Parsifal

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #25 on: January 12, 2010, 07:55:26 AM »
What's been observed is completely inconsistent with Flat Earth Theory.

This is neither relevant, nor true.
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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #26 on: January 12, 2010, 01:47:52 PM »
Evidence pl0x.

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flyingmonkey

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #27 on: January 12, 2010, 05:57:15 PM »
I'll do his job for him:

It doesn't set, and because the Earth is flat, it's possible to happen within a flat Earth.


There.

Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #28 on: January 13, 2010, 05:20:23 PM »
Are you telling me that there is no point on the surface of the Earth from which part of Draco would appear directly overhead?

You'll need help in moving those goalposts.

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Parsifal

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Re: Stars and Constellations - Explain?
« Reply #29 on: January 13, 2010, 07:25:55 PM »
You'll need help in moving those goalposts.

My claim was:

Every constellation is directly above some area on the surface of the Earth at any particular time.

You tried to tell me this is not true. I don't see what's been moved.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.