Ham Radio and Moonbounce

Until then, the earth is flat.

When I look at the night sky it is clearly and obviously spherical therefore The Earth cannot be flat.

Therefore any photographs which suggest that it is flat must be fake.

I will believe my senses over your Photoshopped pictures any day.

The sky is not the earth. A night sky which surrounds you says nothing about the shape of the earth, only that the night sky surrounds you.

Direct evidence of the earth's shape can be readily seen in direct experimentation with the material world to see whether it really curves in the manner predicted by Round Earth Theory. As we can see from the Toronto beach, it does not.

Except that was not a controlled experiment using the scientific method, so it must be ignored. Remember that was the reason you decided to ignore astronomy and star-trails. You are using a photograph taken "from the beach" as documented evidence that the earth is flat, while there are photographs taken under controlled conditions (elevation) which clearly indicate otherwise in a thread that is actually relevant.

Quote

Except that was not a controlled experiment using the scientific method, so it must be ignored. Remember that was the reason you decided to ignore astronomy and star-trails. You are using a photograph taken "from the beach" as documented evidence that the earth is flat, while there are photographs taken under controlled conditions (elevation) which clearly indicate otherwise in a thread that is actually relevant.

Th elevation in the Ontario images is provided. The photographer is taking the image right from the beach. And the Lake Ontario Beach clearly doesn't ascend to 200 feet in altitude.

For all we know Toronto could sit atop a 500 foot cliff which is being obscured by the "mound of water" that a Round Earth predicts.

Quote

For all we know Toronto could sit atop a 500 foot cliff which is being obscured by the "mound of water" that a Round Earth predicts.

Then it's a good thing that it doesn't.

Quote from: Tom Bishop on June 21, 2009, 12:28:10 PM

Quote

For all we know Toronto could sit atop a 500 foot cliff which is being obscured by the "mound of water" that a Round Earth predicts.

Then it's a good thing that it doesn't.

But you can't prove that because you don't have any photos taken from higher than beach-level.

The experiment is flawed and not worthy of further discussion.

But you can't prove that because you don't have any photos taken from higher than beach-level.

The experiment is flawed and not worthy of further discussion.

The sky is not the earth. A night sky which surrounds you says nothing about the shape of the earth, only that the night sky surrounds you.

As has been said, your disdain for astronomy - where no control over experimental variables can be exercised - combined with your promotion of this this experiment - where no control over experimental variables has been exercised - betrays an astounding level of hypocrisy and unfairness

With the stars one cannot go out to stars to see how far away they are.

When I look at the night sky in the UK the stars rotate in a sphere around a star that is due north.

When I go to the USA and I look at the night sky the stars also rotate in a sphere around a star that is due north.

That can only make sense if the Earth is a sphere too.

My senses and my intelligence don't lie.

Toronto doesn't sit on a 500 foot high cliff.

We can know how far away it is

Spinning star systems say nothing about the shape of the earth, only that spinning star systems exist.

Quote from: Tom Bishop on June 21, 2009, 12:40:33 PM

Toronto doesn't sit on a 500 foot high cliff.

Prove it!

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Toronto_Beach.JPG

Quote from: Tom Bishop on June 21, 2009, 12:52:33 PM

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Toronto_Beach.JPG

As you have said so often:

Wikipedia is not a valid reference work.

Quote from: 3 Tesla on June 21, 2009, 12:57:20 PM

Quote from: Tom Bishop on June 21, 2009, 12:52:33 PM

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Toronto_Beach.JPG

As you have said so often:

Wikipedia is not a valid reference work.

Here are some more photos of the Toronto coast. Please tell me where you see some 500 foot cliffs.

Oh man - everyone knows that Google Maps is part of the Flat Earth Conspiracy!

Quote from: 3 Tesla on June 21, 2009, 01:00:20 PM

Oh man - everyone knows that Google Maps is part of the Flat Earth Conspiracy!

Would that be the Toronto cliff conspiracy, or the international curvature-chopping photoshop conspiracy?

http://www.toronto.ca/waterfront/tour/scarborough_bluffs.htm
Scarborough Bluffs just outside Toronto.  Maybe not 500 feet, but not lake level either.

Also, there are no or few buildings on top of those bluffs.

Spinning star systems say nothing about the shape of the earth, only that spinning star systems exist.

Sorry to be off topic here, but I must protest.

The Devil's in the detail (as ever).  It's the way the stars spin (as a "dome", not a plane) that can tell us about the shape of the earth.  -Far more compelling than a view out of a window.

Quote

Sorry to be off topic here, but I must protest.

The Devil's in the detail (as ever).  It's the way the stars spin (as a "dome", not a plane) that can tell us about the shape of the earth.  -Far more compelling than a view out of a window.

Stars ascending from one horizon, passing overhead, and then descending to the other does nothing to demonstrate that the earth is a globe.

Flocks of birds and airplanes also do that.

Tom, I'm not going to post on this again because it's OT.

You are wrong, because birds and aircraft generally do NOT pass overhead with a constant angular velocity (e.g. degrees per second) in the sky.  Because birds and aircraft tend to fly at a constant altitude (like the FE stars), their angular velocity decreases as it gets closer to the horizon.

Stars DO have a constant angular velocity (irrespective of their position in the sky).  Any astral tracking platform is designed with this in mind.  Stars do this at any position on the globe, which is a strong reason for a spherical earth.

Angular velocity becomes more constant the higher the altitude the body is. The higher the body, the longer it will take to reach the horizon. A body at a higher altitude is making a broader perspective line into the horizon.

For example, it will take much longer for a jet airplane to reach the horizon than a flock of birds. This is because it's approaching the horizon at a broader angle.

The stars are at such an altitude that they are making the broadest angle possible into the horizon: 45 degrees.