Questions about the Flat Earth model(take 2)

Please stop bumping dead topics.

PLEASE NOTE: This means that pictures confirming the roundness or flatness of the Earth DO NOT CONSTITUTE VALID PROOF.

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Please stop bumping dead topics.

How is the topic dead?

This topic is good. It deserves some replies from FET's, but they are just too scared to face reality

-What is your reason for believing the earth is flat(other than because it looks that way to us-Both RET and FET predict the way it looks out of your bedroom window)? From what I can find, Rowbotham's experiments were flawed and the results could not be repeated.
Observational and experimental evidence. ENaG is an example.
-How does the sun generate light? How does the moon generate light?
Chemical reactions.
-How do you know NASA is in on a conspiracy? What evidence of a conspiracy do you have?
FAQ
-How can you be sure the "shadow object" exists(because even to the naked human eye, you can clearly see what is blocking the sun in eclipses)? What is it made of, how big is it, why is it not detectable? Why does it block out only light from the sun when other stars emit light of similar frequencies and wavelengths?
Basic observations and the search function will answer these.
-How do you know there is an ice wall if you have never been there and NASA kills you if you get too close?
Who said NASA kills touse who get too close. I think that many people have seen the ice wall,and thought it was just an ice shelf.
-If the force acting as *gravity* is the universal acceleration then I am already moving at this speed. Assuming air resistance is negligible, if I jump I will be artificially increasing my speed such that I should be traveling faster than the UA. Should I not fly away from or above the Earth if there is no force pulling me back down?
Do you understand how UA works? The earth is constantly increasing in speed.
-How does the dark energy field work? You cannot simply assume the existence of some force and provide no physical explanation for it.
What is the dark energy field?
-Are you really about to tell me that every single one of the TENS OF THOUSANDS of photos and videos of Earth from space have been faked? If so, what about every other photo and video in existence? Why are photos and videos accepted as court evidence?
This website is not a court. We have different scientific standards that the legal system.
-Followup of the previous question:

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PLEASE NOTE: This means that pictures confirming the roundness or flatness of the Earth DO NOT CONSTITUTE VALID PROOF.

Indeed it is possible that pictures can be faked. But in reality, what is the probability that every single one is a fake?
Rather high,assuming the earth is flat.
-If NASA indeed has the resources and willingness to deceive the entire human race and has faked thousands upon thousands of photos and videos, surely they can make one small website disappear without arousing suspicion. If they have the resources you claim they do then they are as close to god as any human being or organization will ever be. If what you say about their size and power is true this website should have been shut down long ago.
It would raise suspicion no matter how strong NASA is. Strength does not give you the ability to wipe memories. Also, the website would be put back up.

"They have been unanswered." No.

Quote from: NEEMAN on May 28, 2009, 07:44:19 PM

'Have been' is used in the first instance as an auxiliary, and it cannot serve two functions at the same time.

It can and it does.

From what I can find, Rowbotham's experiments were flawed and the results could not be repeated.

-How do you know NASA is in on a conspiracy? What evidence of a conspiracy do you have?

-How can you be sure the "shadow object" exists(because even to the naked human eye, you can clearly see what is blocking the sun in eclipses)? What is it made of, how big is it, why is it not detectable? Why does it block out only light from the sun when other stars emit light of similar frequencies and wavelengths?

-How do you know there is an ice wall if you have never been there and NASA kills you if you get too close?

-If the force acting as *gravity* is the universal acceleration then I am already moving at this speed. Assuming air resistance is negligible, if I jump I will be artificially increasing my speed such that I should be traveling faster than the UA. Should I not fly away from or above the Earth if there is no force pulling me back down?

-How does the dark energy field work? You cannot simply assume the existence of some force and provide no physical explanation for it.

Why are photos and videos accepted as court evidence?

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-How does the dark energy field work? You cannot simply assume the existence of some force and provide no physical explanation for it.

How does Dark Energy work in RE dynamics?

What is the difference between Dark Energy and Dark Matter; aren't they considered the same thing?


The Answer
Dark Energy appears to be, based on the brightness of the most distant type-Ia supernovae, a mysterious force that is accelerating the expansion of the universe. These recent discoveries have provided good evidence that there is such an outward force on the universe (variously called the cosmological constant, "quintessence," or "dark energy").
Data about the rotation of galaxies shows us that the outer parts rotate as fast as the inner parts. This only makes sense if there is a spherical distribution of matter in each galaxy, which is not what we see. Therefore we infer that there is a certain amount of Dark Matter in each galaxy. This could be some exotic particles, or just lots of stars too small to have ignited.

Aside from this, there is also the Dark Matter that we think is there, based on theoretical arguments. This is something we can measure by looking at the cosmic microwave background and distant supernovae. These are the measurements (recently made) that imply the existence of both Dark Matter and Dark Energy.

You can read a bit about these recent results at

http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/news/


And more detail than you probably want at

http://panisse.lbl.gov/public/

Hope that helps.

One hardly has to be a flat earth believer to notice the conspiracy that is NASA. A simple Google search of "NASA conspiracy" will yield over a million results.

I don't believe in a "shadow object" though I don't mock those who do.

How does Dark Energy work in RE dynamics?

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Why are photos and videos accepted as court evidence?

Splendid question. I'd ask a lawyer.

-How does the sun generate light? How does the moon generate light?
Chemical reactions.

-How can you be sure the "shadow object" exists(because even to the naked human eye, you can clearly see what is blocking the sun in eclipses)? What is it made of, how big is it, why is it not detectable? Why does it block out only light from the sun when other stars emit light of similar frequencies and wavelengths?
Basic observations and the search function will answer these.

-How do you know there is an ice wall if you have never been there and NASA kills you if you get too close?
Who said NASA kills touse who get too close. I think that many people have seen the ice wall,and thought it was just an ice shelf.

-If the force acting as *gravity* is the universal acceleration then I am already moving at this speed. Assuming air resistance is negligible, if I jump I will be artificially increasing my speed such that I should be traveling faster than the UA. Should I not fly away from or above the Earth if there is no force pulling me back down?
Do you understand how UA works? The earth is constantly increasing in speed.

-How does the dark energy field work? You cannot simply assume the existence of some force and provide no physical explanation for it.
What is the dark energy field?

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PLEASE NOTE: This means that pictures confirming the roundness or flatness of the Earth DO NOT CONSTITUTE VALID PROOF.

Indeed it is possible that pictures can be faked. But in reality, what is the probability that every single one is a fake?
Rather high,assuming the earth is flat.[/b]

-If NASA indeed has the resources and willingness to deceive the entire human race and has faked thousands upon thousands of photos and videos, surely they can make one small website disappear without arousing suspicion. If they have the resources you claim they do then they are as close to god as any human being or organization will ever be. If what you say about their size and power is true this website should have been shut down long ago.
It would raise suspicion no matter how strong NASA is. Strength does not give you the ability to wipe memories. Also, the website would be put back up.

I did the google search and found no credible evidence. I did however end up getting reminded that NASA brought down "moon rocks"(800lbs of them) and they have been studied for more than 30 years by geologists with no affiliation to NASA. The compounds existent in moon rocks are not present on Earth. The rocks could not have been faked.

Explain eclipses. I thought that explanation was the whole reason for the shadow object in FET.

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How does Dark Energy work in RE dynamics?

Dark Energy is theorized to be energy left over from the big bang.

Textbook example of dodging a question. Photographic and video evidence is accepted in court because it IS possible to analyze pictures and videos to see if they were faked. More often than not, pictures and videos are legitimate and were not faked. Unless the FES has someone who is qualified to review pictures and videos to determine legitimacy you are really in no position to say that ALL pictures and videos can be (and therefore are) fake.

You cannot simply imply that if the possibility for something to be true exists then it is undeniably true.

This is the exact logic you have applied to all photographs(I present you with a picture of a spherical Earth, you claim it has the possibility of being fake and therefore, it is fake).

Implying that possibility equals truth (ie. It is possible a picture of the round Earth has been faked, therefore it is a fake picture) is a logical fallacy.

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I did the google search and found no credible evidence. I did however end up getting reminded that NASA brought down "moon rocks"(800lbs of them) and they have been studied for more than 30 years by geologists with no affiliation to NASA. The compounds existent in moon rocks are not present on Earth. The rocks could not have been faked.

I find it unlikely you looked at the information contained in those links in toto. Nor do I think your idea of "credible evidence" is less biased than mine. The discovery of new and rare minerals is not a spartan occurrence. There is no evidence beyond the claims of the Soviets and NASA these rocks are from the moon.

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Explain eclipses. I thought that explanation was the whole reason for the shadow object in FET.

A solar eclipse occurs when the moon interposes itself between the sun and the observer on earth. A lunar eclipse is the result of destructive interference. We know the lunar eclipse is not caused by the earth's shadow as the sun and moon have been observed in the sky at the same time during a lunar eclipse.

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How does Dark Energy work in RE dynamics?

Dark Energy is theorized to be energy left over from the big bang.

How does DE work?

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Textbook example of dodging a question. Photographic and video evidence is accepted in court because it IS possible to analyze pictures and videos to see if they were faked. More often than not, pictures and videos are legitimate and were not faked. Unless the FES has someone who is qualified to review pictures and videos to determine legitimacy you are really in no position to say that ALL pictures and videos can be (and therefore are) fake.

But I never claimed all pictures and videos are fake. 

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This is the exact logic you have applied to all photographs(I present you with a picture of a spherical Earth, you claim it has the possibility of being fake and therefore, it is fake).

I claimed that observation shows the earth is flat. Therefore, photos showing a sphere are fake. This is a far cry from your claim. If your friend has brown hair, and I show you a convincing picture showing him with a medusa's coif, you will dismiss the picture no matter how convincingly I have crafted the snakes.

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Implying that possibility equals truth (ie. It is possible a picture of the round Earth has been faked, therefore it is a fake picture) is a logical fallacy.

And again, that was never my argument. I claimed it was fake because it was impossible.

My idea of credible evidence is that it stands up to scrutiny and comes from a believably reputable source.
There are the claims of countless geologists who have studied the moon rocks. Rocks from the moon can be compared to rocks known to be asteroids to confirm that they are in fact, not from Earth.

The definition of a lunar eclipse is that the moon has been obscured by the sun.

If you saw the moon then it wasn't a total lunar eclipse.

I'm no physicist myself so I won't claim to know exactly what I'm talking about when it comes to things like Dark Energy. I choose to believe that vast number of trained, professional physicists rather than the small number of people studying the flat Earth.

Everybody else here does  If you don't believe they are all fake then some of them must be at least partially true. How do you explain a "true" picture of a spherical Earth?

My point is that you have not been in space and thus cannot know for certain whether or not the Earth is flat or round.

Quote from: echa on May 29, 2009, 08:42:15 PM

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My idea of credible evidence is that it stands up to scrutiny and comes from a believably reputable source.
There are the claims of countless geologists who have studied the moon rocks. Rocks from the moon can be compared to rocks known to be asteroids to confirm that they are in fact, not from Earth.

I have a hard time agreeing that NASA and the Soviet Union are "believably reputable source(s)"?  Rare or unknown minerals are not defacto extraterrestrial minerals.

I wasn't referring to NASA or the USSR, I was referring to the thousands of physicists and geologists who have confirmed that the rocks are from the moon or some extraterrestrial origin.

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The definition of a lunar eclipse is that the moon has been obscured by the sun.

I've never seen the sun obscure the moon.

Obscured by the Earth rather.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_eclipse

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If you saw the moon then it wasn't a total lunar eclipse.

Even during a total lunar eclipse the location of the moon is known.

Its position is know, it just can't be seen because it has been obscured by the Earth's "shadow".

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I'm no physicist myself so I won't claim to know exactly what I'm talking about when it comes to things like Dark Energy. I choose to believe that vast number of trained, professional physicists rather than the small number of people studying the flat Earth.

At least you've admitted your bias.

Have you admitted yours? 

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Everybody else here does  If you don't believe they are all fake then some of them must be at least partially true. How do you explain a "true" picture of a spherical Earth?

High altitude photos may depict the curved edge of the disc or the boundary of the lit portion of the surface.

If your vision range is limited by the availability of light shouldn't you see a gradual darkening of the Earth rather than a bright Earth contrasted by a pitch black surrounding?

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My point is that you have not been in space and thus cannot know for certain whether or not the Earth is flat or round.

Yet you persistently tell me that you know for certain it is round.

I'd say I know for certain that the Earth is round because all modern technology, engineering, and physics are based on the assumption that the Earth is a sphere. You do have a point though that I can't claim to be 100% sure...

Quote from: NEEMAN on May 29, 2009, 04:44:29 PM

I don't like going into details about myself, but believe me, I'm in a position to know.

LOL Trust me I also know. I too am a Navy Seal commander and alligator wrestler.

Seriously dude there's already enough tough guys on the internet, don't try and put your grammar nazi jackboots into me by pretending your an english teacher but can't disclose it cos you're also undercover for the CIA.

Quote from: NEEMAN on May 29, 2009, 04:44:29 PM

That is why the sentence reads poorly.

If it reads poorly then don't write it...

Quote from: NEEMAN on May 28, 2009, 01:23:30 PM

Nobody here is obliged to answer your questions. Moreover, they have been asked and asnwered countless times before.

LOL@ the most insane fail ive seen in a loooong time.

-How does the sun generate light? How does the moon generate light?
Chemical reactions.

-How can you be sure the "shadow object" exists(because even to the naked human eye, you can clearly see what is blocking the sun in eclipses)? What is it made of, how big is it, why is it not detectable? Why does it block out only light from the sun when other stars emit light of similar frequencies and wavelengths?
Basic observations and the search function will answer these.

-How do you know there is an ice wall if you have never been there and NASA kills you if you get too close?
Who said NASA kills touse who get too close. I think that many people have seen the ice wall,and thought it was just an ice shelf.

-If the force acting as *gravity* is the universal acceleration then I am already moving at this speed. Assuming air resistance is negligible, if I jump I will be artificially increasing my speed such that I should be traveling faster than the UA. Should I not fly away from or above the Earth if there is no force pulling me back down?
Do you understand how UA works? The earth is constantly increasing in speed.

It has to do with special relativity. The FAQ has a link to a better, and more detailed explanation.

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PLEASE NOTE: This means that pictures confirming the roundness or flatness of the Earth DO NOT CONSTITUTE VALID PROOF.

Indeed it is possible that pictures can be faked. But in reality, what is the probability that every single one is a fake?
Rather high,assuming the earth is flat.[/b]

What if you assume there is equal chance for the Earth to be round or flat? Remove bias from your answer and due to the sheer number of pictures (not all pictures come from NASA) it is highly likely (99.9+ %) that at least one picture/video of a round Earth is legitimate.
This point is moot on this website. We do not accept photographic evidence as proof.

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-If NASA indeed has the resources and willingness to deceive the entire human race and has faked thousands upon thousands of photos and videos, surely they can make one small website disappear without arousing suspicion. If they have the resources you claim they do then they are as close to god as any human being or organization will ever be. If what you say about their size and power is true this website should have been shut down long ago.
It would raise suspicion no matter how strong NASA is. Strength does not give you the ability to wipe memories. Also, the website would be put back up.

Could NASA not pay you or threaten to kill you or anyone else who has seen this site if you say anything? They could easily find a way to keep your mouth shut if they wanted to. This is an extremely small website on a global scale and would be relatively easy to cover up, especially if NASA is as large and powerful as stated in other threads.

Quote from: NEEMAN on May 30, 2009, 07:12:10 AM

Finally, my sentence made sense; your 'fixed' version didn't.

The fixed version used the same grammatical construct. *sigh*

Take you're fail elsewhere tough guy.

Which chemical reactions exactly, and how have the reactants lasted for so long? Even by the most conservative estimates, the Earth is at least 6000 years old. You'd be hard-pressed to find a reaction that releases light and heat and lasts for that long.
The sun in RET is any different?

I personally believe it is "protected" by a few planes and some radar. But anyway, why would someone follow, what they presume to be, an ice shelf for 50-100 miles?

-If the force acting as *gravity* is the universal acceleration then I am already moving at this speed. Assuming air resistance is negligible, if I jump I will be artificially increasing my speed such that I should be traveling faster than the UA. Should I not fly away from or above the Earth if there is no force pulling me back down?
Do you understand how UA works? The earth is constantly increasing in speed.

It has to do with special relativity. The FAQ has a link to a better, and more detailed explanation.

What if you assume there is equal chance for the Earth to be round or flat? Remove bias from your answer and due to the sheer number of pictures (not all pictures come from NASA) it is highly likely (99.9+ %) that at least one picture/video of a round Earth is legitimate.
This point is moot on this website. We do not accept photographic evidence as proof.

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-If NASA indeed has the resources and willingness to deceive the entire human race and has faked thousands upon thousands of photos and videos, surely they can make one small website disappear without arousing suspicion. If they have the resources you claim they do then they are as close to god as any human being or organization will ever be. If what you say about their size and power is true this website should have been shut down long ago.
It would raise suspicion no matter how strong NASA is. Strength does not give you the ability to wipe memories. Also, the website would be put back up.

Could NASA not pay you or threaten to kill you or anyone else who has seen this site if you say anything? They could easily find a way to keep your mouth shut if they wanted to. This is an extremely small website on a global scale and would be relatively easy to cover up, especially if NASA is as large and powerful as stated in other threads.

Yes, actually the RET sun is much different. If you have a star fusing hydrogen into helium only 3000 miles above the Earth, we would all have been incinerated.

Then how has the Earth not reached close to light speed yet? If the Earth/the universe have existed for 6000 years (EXTREMELY conservative estimate) and the UA has been accelerating the earth by 9.8m/s^2 for the entire 6000 years, the earth should currently be going 1.764x10^12 m/s. The speed of light is 3.0x10^8m/s. Explain.

This is your "average" picture of a round Earth. There are 123 million of these on Google alone.

Then how has the Earth not reached close to light speed yet? If the Earth/the universe have existed for 6000 years (EXTREMELY conservative estimate) and the UA has been accelerating the earth by 9.8m/s^2 for the entire 6000 years, the earth should currently be going 1.764x10^12 m/s. The speed of light is 3.0x10^8m/s. Explain.

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Yes, actually the RET sun is much different. If you have a star fusing hydrogen into helium only 3000 miles above the Earth, we would all have been incinerated.

Only if this sun was the unbelievably large object depicted in RET.

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Then how has the Earth not reached close to light speed yet? If the Earth/the universe have existed for 6000 years (EXTREMELY conservative estimate) and the UA has been accelerating the earth by 9.8m/s^2 for the entire 6000 years, the earth should currently be going 1.764x10^12 m/s. The speed of light is 3.0x10^8m/s. Explain.

You aren't using the correct equation to ascertain the current velocity of the earth.

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This is your "average" picture of a round Earth. There are 123 million of these on Google alone.

So if there is a lot of something, it must be authentic? There are millions of people who have seen ghosts, ergo ghosts are real and scientifically valid.      

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Then how has the Earth not reached close to light speed yet? If the Earth/the universe have existed for 6000 years (EXTREMELY conservative estimate) and the UA has been accelerating the earth by 9.8m/s^2 for the entire 6000 years, the earth should currently be going 1.764x10^12 m/s. The speed of light is 3.0x10^8m/s. Explain.

Please educate yourself by reading the FAQ.

Q: "Doesn't this mean we'd be traveling faster than the speed of light, which is impossible?"

A: The equations of Special Relativity prevent an object from accelerating to the speed of light. Due to this restriction, these equations prove that an object can accelerate at a constant rate forever, and never reach the speed of light. For an in depth explanation:  Click here.

I looked at that link and it was a joke. Its entire argument is that from our reference point on Earth, the Earth is not moving. The reference point is irrelevant. Speed is still speed; if you go from point A to point B in X time your speed does not change if you are the object moving or if a planet you are standing on is moving. The speed of an object in motion is constant regardless of reference point. My point still remains that if the Earth were accelerating at 9.8m/s^2, after 6000 years the Earth would be traveling several hundred thousand meters per second FASTER than the speed of light.

The reference point is irrelevant.