The Big Bang

The funny thing is that even here, the "matter everywhere" argument looks completely retarded. Look up in the sky for a bit at night, and it becomes apparent that there is matter, but there are vast stretches of nothingness in between those massive specks.

Quote from: KingMan on February 24, 2009, 10:47:14 AM

Quote from: Robosteve on February 24, 2009, 10:18:27 AM

Quote from: Hara Taiki on February 24, 2009, 10:17:04 AM

I still want my question answered. If the universe in the sense that before the big bang existed in the form of a singularity or other mass could not have always been, then what created God? You cannot argue that the universe couldn't have always been without accepting that, by proxy, your god must have been created by something as well, or secede that both could have always been.

Yes he can. He's a Christian, his arguments don't need to be logical.

You're an Atheist. None of your Arguments are logical.

Come on, stop being retarded.

"Invisible man in the sky did it. Also, there's a part of your body that's not really there, but it's eternal and very real etc." < "Physics and chemistry did it"

on a scale of lack of logic.

Your trying to tell me to stop being retarded is quite funny, when in the next sentence you say something retarded. And we can see very few of the stars with the naked eye. Use Google sky and let me know if you can find a stretch that has no stars in it.

Use Google sky and let me know if you can find a stretch that has no stars in it.

Does Google Sky show up as plain white for you?

Your trying to tell me to stop being retarded is quite funny, when in the next sentence you say something retarded.

I bet a considerable amount of money and one spare of every organ which I have two of that you are the only one on here who sees it that way.

Quote from: KingMan on February 24, 2009, 10:52:46 AM

Your trying to tell me to stop being retarded is quite funny, when in the next sentence you say something retarded.

I bet a considerable amount of money and one spare of every organ which I have two of that you are the only one on here who sees it that way.

Only because you know nothing about my religion.

KingMan, will you please stop ignoring the posts you know you have no answer to? It just makes you look like that much more of an idiot.

KingMan, will you please stop ignoring the posts you know you have no answer to? It just makes you look like that much more of an idiot.

You look like an idiot yourself.

Quote from: Wendy on February 24, 2009, 10:56:21 AM

Quote from: KingMan on February 24, 2009, 10:52:46 AM

Your trying to tell me to stop being retarded is quite funny, when in the next sentence you say something retarded.

I bet a considerable amount of money and one spare of every organ which I have two of that you are the only one on here who sees it that way.

Only because you know nothing about my religion.

Actually not, I know a lot about christianity since I technically am a christian myself.

You look like an idiot yourself.

Then how about pointing out what about my responses to your points is so idiotic, instead of just skipping over the posts that make an attempt at reasoned debate and flaming people instead?

Quote from: KingMan on February 24, 2009, 11:01:57 AM

You look like an idiot yourself.

Then how about pointing out what about my responses to your points is so idiotic, instead of just skipping over the posts that make an attempt at reasoned debate and flaming people instead?

If it continues, there will be consequences (for KingMan).

Kingman, could you just write down a quick list of your objections to the big bang? It would be much easier to debate with you if you were a little more comprehensive. And didn't assume we are all ignorant.

Kingman, could you just write down a quick list of your objections to the big bang? It would be much easier to debate with you if you were a little more comprehensive. And didn't assume we are all ignorant.

This stems from his own ignorance, it's to be expected.

Kingman, could you just write down a quick list of your objections to the big bang? It would be much easier to debate with you if you were a little more comprehensive. And didn't assume we are all ignorant.

This.

Well, this thread has certainly descended into faggotry and idiocy.  Kingman, I'm more than happy to answer your doubts about the Big Bang theory in a civil way if you will treat me the same.

Much like its subject, this thread was over before it began.

For that you deserve a dumbass medal. Matter is so evenly dispersed over the Universe that it baffles Scientists.

Not true. In fact, if anything the exact opposite is true. Scientists have had trouble explaining why there would be large-scale structures rather than a more even distribution. One reason the inflationary hypothesis was created was to try to explain this.

Quote from: KingMan on February 24, 2009, 10:58:53 AM

Quote from: Wendy on February 24, 2009, 10:56:21 AM

Quote from: KingMan on February 24, 2009, 10:52:46 AM

Your trying to tell me to stop being retarded is quite funny, when in the next sentence you say something retarded.

I bet a considerable amount of money and one spare of every organ which I have two of that you are the only one on here who sees it that way.

Only because you know nothing about my religion.

Actually not, I know a lot about christianity since I technically am a christian myself.

No you're not.

So, what do I have to do to be a christian?

So, what do I have to do to be a christian?

Believe the Bible is Gods word, Jesus was his son, he died on a cross, rose 3 days later, ascended to heaven, and you must accept Christ as your savior. So ae you still Christian?

Well, I guess. Although, I also believe in the flying spaghetti monster.

Well, I guess. Although, I also believe in the flying spaghetti monster.

I ate him.

I doubt it. Anyway:

Kingman, could you just write down a quick list of your objections to the big bang? It would be much easier to debate with you if you were a little more comprehensive. And didn't assume we are all ignorant.

I doubt it. Anyway:

Quote from: Wendy on February 24, 2009, 11:15:00 AM

Kingman, could you just write down a quick list of your objections to the big bang? It would be much easier to debate with you if you were a little more comprehensive. And didn't assume we are all ignorant.

I don't get why it expanded. What was the force behind it? If gravity did not exist before it, why was all the matter collecting together? I will come up with some more later, but my class is done so I might not be back on till tomorrow.

Quote from: Wendy on February 25, 2009, 11:43:07 AM

I doubt it. Anyway:

Quote from: Wendy on February 24, 2009, 11:15:00 AM

Kingman, could you just write down a quick list of your objections to the big bang? It would be much easier to debate with you if you were a little more comprehensive. And didn't assume we are all ignorant.

I don't get why it expanded. What was the force behind it? If gravity did not exist before it, why was all the matter collecting together? I will come up with some more later, but my class is done so I might not be back on till tomorrow.

Matter has an effect on space-time, even on the smallest of scales. But you might just as well think of it as an act of God in an utter bout of creative boredom.

Quote from: Wendy on February 25, 2009, 11:43:07 AM

I doubt it. Anyway:

Quote from: Wendy on February 24, 2009, 11:15:00 AM

Kingman, could you just write down a quick list of your objections to the big bang? It would be much easier to debate with you if you were a little more comprehensive. And didn't assume we are all ignorant.

I don't get why it expanded. What was the force behind it? If gravity did not exist before it, why was all the matter collecting together? I will come up with some more later, but my class is done so I might not be back on till tomorrow.

Because there was no space for the matter to spread out to. Space was a singularity so all the matter also had to be a singularity.

Quote from: Wendy on February 25, 2009, 11:29:46 AM

So, what do I have to do to be a christian?

Believe the Bible is Gods word, Jesus was his son, he died on a cross, rose 3 days later, ascended to heaven, and you must accept Christ as your savior. So ae you still Christian?

To be a Christian, do you have to believe the Bible in a literal sense?

Quote from: KingMan on February 25, 2009, 11:34:40 AM

Quote from: Wendy on February 25, 2009, 11:29:46 AM

So, what do I have to do to be a christian?

Believe the Bible is Gods word, Jesus was his son, he died on a cross, rose 3 days later, ascended to heaven, and you must accept Christ as your savior. So ae you still Christian?

To be a Christian, do you have to believe the Bible in a literal sense?

In order to be a Christin you need to agree with the Christin you are talking with at the time. If you disagree apparently you are not a true Christin.

I don't get why it expanded. What was the force behind it?

There are various theories on this. Do not make the mistake of thinking that the Big Bang theory has only one possible answer to every question, nor that every non-religious person believes it to have happened.

Personally, my favourite theory is that the concepts of space, time and matter as we know them ceased to have any meaning before a certain point - when the Universe was small enough that quantum uncertainties meant everything. In such a state, it would be in turmoil; and in order to leave such a state, it would need to expand past a certain point. Once it was liberated from quantum effects, it just kept expanding because it was then subject to the physics with which we are familiar.

Also, don't use the word "force" to describe the expansion of space. Forces act on mass-energy, not space.

If gravity did not exist before it, why was all the matter collecting together?

When was all the matter was collecting together? Where the hell did you get that idea from? You just admitted in your previous question that it was expanding.

Quote from: KingMan on February 25, 2009, 11:34:40 AM

Quote from: Wendy on February 25, 2009, 11:29:46 AM

So, what do I have to do to be a christian?

Believe the Bible is Gods word, Jesus was his son, he died on a cross, rose 3 days later, ascended to heaven, and you must accept Christ as your savior. So ae you still Christian?

To be a Christian, do you have to believe the Bible in a literal sense?

one word answer: NO

Quote from: KingMan on February 25, 2009, 11:50:07 AM

I don't get why it expanded. What was the force behind it?

There are various theories on this. Do not make the mistake of thinking that the Big Bang theory has only one possible answer to every question, nor that every non-religious person believes it to have happened.

Personally, my favourite theory is that the concepts of space, time and matter as we know them ceased to have any meaning before a certain point - when the Universe was small enough that quantum uncertainties meant everything. In such a state, it would be in turmoil; and in order to leave such a state, it would need to expand past a certain point. Once it was liberated from quantum effects, it just kept expanding because it was then subject to the physics with which we are familiar.

Also, don't use the word "force" to describe the expansion of space. Forces act on mass-energy, not space.

Quote from: KingMan on February 25, 2009, 11:50:07 AM

If gravity did not exist before it, why was all the matter collecting together?

When was all the matter was collecting together? Where the hell did you get that idea from? You just admitted in your previous question that it was expanding.

Also there is the fact the matter was super compressed and without gravity to hold it together why would it not "explode"

Oh... Oh... I missed this thread...

Please someone tell me why they feel the background temperature of space is proof of a big bang. To my knowledge Georgy Porgie made several attempts to guess the temperature radiation of the event.

He was never looking for evidence but rather proof. ( as you science types like to put it ). I believe this idea alone is a perversion in the search for the truth.

Never mind the fact that Arthur Eddington made a much more accurate calculation many years before him when simply trying to understand how much heat should be radiated from the stars.

Here's a good paper on it.

"In a region of space not in the neighbourhood of any
star this constitutes the whole field of radiation, and a
black body, e. g. a black bulb thermometer, will there
take up a temperature of 3 18o.  so that its emission
may balance the radiation falling on it and absorbed
by it. This is sometimes called the ?temperature of in-
terstellar space."

http://redshift.vif.com/JournalFiles/Pre2001/V02NO3PDF/V02N3ASS.PDF

There are various theories on this. Do not make the mistake of thinking that the Big Bang theory has only one possible answer to every question, nor that every non-religious person believes it to have happened.

Also do not make the mistake of thinking the lack of a solid explanation for first cause means the Big Bang didn't happen at all.  There is strong evidence suggesting the Universe expanded from a highly dense state in the past.  You are completely ignoring this evidence in your arguments.

And I'm also unsure why you find the Big Bang so repulsive anyway.  I don't see how it contradicts any Christian dogma.  Rather I find the idea of the Universe being created in a primordial singularity very appealing.

If gravity did not exist before it, why was all the matter collecting together?

You are thinking of the Big Bang entirely wrong.  Don't think of it as watching a giant explosion from a single point in space where all matter is collected together.  It's not like that at all.