If God exists, would Islam be the perfect response from the devil?

It is irrelevant anyway.

Do you admit the Crusades were not in self-defense then?

Creating a buffer zone to protect against a defeated invaded is delf defence.

...and how is that relevant?

It wasn't as bad as you think it was.

Aheheh.

I take it you admit I am right.

Actually, we can. We've just been discussing the negative influences. You are yet to show any positive influences brought about solely by the religion.

You are yet to show any negative influences brought about solely by the religion.

Creating a buffer zone to protect against a defeated invaded is delf defence.

They were "liberating" the Holy Land. Any buffer zone created was incidental.

It wasn't as bad as you think it was.

But it was still bad, right?

I take it you admit I am right.

Niet.

You are yet to show any negative influences brought about solely by the religion.

The Inquisition.

And the crusades.

I'm trying to get him to admit that one.

Stubborn little theist, ain't he?

And the crusades.

The crusades were neither horrible or motivated solely by Christianity. They were an appropriate response to the military actions of Muslim nations.

Quote

I take it you admit I am right.

Niet.

Why not?

Quote

You are yet to show any negative influences brought about solely by the religion.

The Inquisition.

Xenophobia, greed.

The crusades were neither horrible or motivated solely by Christianity. They were an appropriate response to the military actions of Muslim nations.

The Crusades led to the slaughter and deportation of thousands of innocent civilians for religiously motivated purposes.

What about that is not horrible?

Why not?

Because you are not.

Xenophobia, greed.

You're supposed to be naming positive things that could have only have been provided by Christianity now.

Quote

The crusades were neither horrible or motivated solely by Christianity. They were an appropriate response to the military actions of Muslim nations.

The Crusades led to the slaughter and deportation of thousands of innocent civilians for religiously motivated purposes.

What about that is not horrible?

Quote

Why not?

Because you are not.

Quote

Xenophobia, greed.

You're supposed to be naming positive things that could have only have been provided by Christianity now.

Xenophobia wasn't inspired by religion. Religion was simply the excuse.

Xenophobia wasn't inspired by religion.

I never said it was.

Quote

The crusades were neither horrible or motivated solely by Christianity. They were an appropriate response to the military actions of Muslim nations.

The Crusades led to the slaughter and deportation of thousands of innocent civilians for religiously motivated purposes.

That wasn't caused by Christianity.

Quote

Why not?

Because you are not.

So even thought the vast majority of contemporary historians say that the dark ages were a fabrication, you for some reason disagree. Typical atheist.

Quote

Xenophobia, greed.

You're supposed to be naming positive things that could have only have been provided by Christianity now.

Those were other causes of the Inquisition.

The Crusades were horrible.  Jerusalem had been under the rule of Muslims for centuries, so I don't see how this could be in retaliation for any Muslim actions.  The Catholic Church launched The Crusades in an effort to reunite with Eastern Christians. Thousands of Jews were slaughtered as enemies of Christianity.  

The Crusades were horrible.  Jerusalem had been under the rule of Muslims for centuries, so I don't see how this could be in retaliation for any Muslim actions.

Spain had been under Christian rule for centuries.

That wasn't caused by Christianity.

There would have been no Crusades without it.

So even thought the vast majority of contemporary historians say that the dark ages were a fabrication, you for some reason disagree. Typical atheist.

You are yet to provide any evidence to support your claim.

Those were other causes of the Inquisition.

Christianity still remains the uniting factor. You cannot escape it.

Still waiting on those positive influences...

Quote from: Space Cowgirl on November 02, 2008, 04:14:04 PM

The Crusades were horrible.  Jerusalem had been under the rule of Muslims for centuries, so I don't see how this could be in retaliation for any Muslim actions.

Spain had been under Christian rule for centuries.

Are you sure about that?  Muslim's conquered the Iberian peninsula in 711, and ruled there until 1492.

Quote from: Althalus on November 02, 2008, 04:15:11 PM

Spain had been under Christian rule for centuries.

Are you sure about that?  Muslim's conquered the Iberian peninsula in 711, and ruled there until 1492.

The southern Iberian had been Christian since before 300 AD.

Quote from: Space Cowgirl on November 02, 2008, 04:24:43 PM

Quote from: Althalus on November 02, 2008, 04:15:11 PM

Spain had been under Christian rule for centuries.

Are you sure about that?  Muslim's conquered the Iberian peninsula in 711, and ruled there until 1492.

The southern Iberian had been Christian since before 300 AD.

We're talking about the time of Crusades. They were several centuries too late for "self-defense".

Better late then never, especially when it comes to being freed by Muslim domination.

Muslims back then were generally much more tolerant than Christians.

I guess the Crusades v2.0 are underway.

Actually the Muslim's conquered Spain kinda effortlessly.  I don't think the people of Spain were all too happy living under the Visigoths.  

Quote from: Althalus on November 02, 2008, 04:29:52 PM

Quote from: Space Cowgirl on November 02, 2008, 04:24:43 PM

Quote from: Althalus on November 02, 2008, 04:15:11 PM

Spain had been under Christian rule for centuries.

Are you sure about that?  Muslim's conquered the Iberian peninsula in 711, and ruled there until 1492.

The southern Iberian had been Christian since before 300 AD.

We're talking about the time of Crusades. They were several centuries too late for "self-defense".

We're not talking about ethical justification, but about cause and effect - no matter how delayed. If Islam had never been created, there would have been no need for the Crusades.

They would have still wanted the "Holy Land". 

Well, of course. If those pesky sand niggers hadn't used their ability to think freely or excercize their human rights, we could've skipped this whole ordeal.

Muslims used to be cool

Muslims used to be cool

Back before one broke up with you right?

Muslims back then were generally much more tolerant than Christians.

This statement still makes me lawl.

Quote from: The Anarchist on November 02, 2008, 04:37:55 PM

Muslims back then were generally much more tolerant than Christians.

This statement still makes me lawl.

Although I don't think they were "much more tolerant" I think they were a little more tolerant. Of course, back then both religions were generally a lot less tolerant than they are now.

True dat.

Quote from: Raist on November 07, 2008, 09:17:08 PM

Quote from: The Anarchist on November 02, 2008, 04:37:55 PM

Muslims back then were generally much more tolerant than Christians.

This statement still makes me lawl.

Although I don't think they were "much more tolerant" I think they were a little more tolerant. Of course, back then both religions were generally a lot less tolerant than they are now.

If Islam was less tolerant back then....

They would probably do what christianity did. Go out and kill some infidels. Islam is actually rather peaceful right now. Islamist fundies are not, but that's a whole other story.