Thought Experiment for you Theists

Imagine a hypothetical universe, where people exist but God doesn't. People would be dependent on the notion that their lives have purpose; that their existence has a higher reason behind it. Emotions would control their reasoning (especially in undeveloped civilizations) and concepts of god or gods would emerge. There are countless religions in this world all varying from each other. For any religion, they believe they are right and everyone else is wrong. Those other religions are proof of these delusional fantasies emerging. Without a god, one would be invented. Those who have to believe in the religion would brainwash their children into the same religion (indoctrination). Countless generations would follow the same patterns blindly oblivious and uncaring that they couldn't be rationally supported. They are taught that science applies to EVERYTHING except religion and they believe it blindly. Why should religion be exempt from scientific study? Because it reveals to them that their religions are actually erroneous and incorrect. Unfortunately, emotion is almost always the driving factor behind an individual's actions. They reject it and continue believing in God or Gods without any justification... aka faith.

How do you know this hypothetical universe isn't the same as ours?

It is, though.

Stop putting religion and gods together.

Stop pretending they shouldn't be.

It is, though.

Yeah. It's only in the form of a question to guide their thinking. Socratic method. 

Stop putting religion and gods together.

I'm appealing to the majority of religions for my convenience.

Isn't a religion without a God redundant? Surely the lack of belief in a god is atheism.

Isn't a religion without a God redundant? Surely the lack of belief in a god is atheism.

I'm not familiar with all religions so I can't make that claim...
Isn't Buddhism one though? I'm pretty sure its like a paradigm of thought. Someone who knows more about it, please answer. 

I wouldn't call Buddhism a religion, it's a lifestyle.

Perhaps, but how does Buddhism not qualify?

"A religion is a set of tenets and practices, often centered upon specific supernatural and moral claims about reality, the cosmos, and human nature, and often codified as prayer, ritual, or religious law."

• http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion

Buddhism can fit under a guise of religion, but traditionally, I wouldn't consider it one either.

"specific supernatural and moral claims about reality, the cosmos, and human nature, and often codified as prayer, ritual, or religious law" That's where Buddhism deviates from religion.

"specific supernatural and moral claims about reality, the cosmos, and human nature, and often codified as prayer, ritual, or religious law" That's where Buddhism deviates from religion.

Perhaps, but how does Buddhism not qualify?

"A religion is a set of tenets and practices, often centered upon specific supernatural and moral claims about reality, the cosmos, and human nature, and often codified as prayer, ritual, or religious law."

• http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion

In either case, Wikipedia doesn't really mean much in this regard as this definition seems flexible.

Buddhism can fit under a guise of religion, but traditionally, I wouldn't consider it one either.

So we should keep looking for a counter example?

Wikipedia only says that because most people call Buddhism religion, but don't want to contradict themselves.

Perhaps, but how does Buddhism not qualify?

"A religion is a set of tenets and practices, often centered upon specific supernatural and moral claims about reality, the cosmos, and human nature, and often codified as prayer, ritual, or religious law."

• http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion

Because in a fundamental way, Buddhism does not try to tell you how to live.  The four pillars of Buddhism are:

To live is to suffer (suffering in this context means the human condition, essentially - fear of death and loss)
Suffering comes from attachment
To end suffering, you must end attachment
To end attachment, you must follow the eight-fold path.

The eight-fold path, though, doesn't give specifics, either.  It speaks of right thought, right action, right consciousness - not do not do this, do not do that.

Keep in mind, these are concepts fundamental to Buddhism, like the resurrection in christianity.  Different sects may have different practices and/or beliefs about dogma.

Quote from: ﮎingulaЯiτy on October 24, 2008, 04:05:30 PM

"A religion is a set of tenets and practices, often centered upon specific supernatural and moral claims about reality, the cosmos, and human nature, and often codified as prayer, ritual, or religious law."

• http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion

Because in a fundamental way, Buddhism does not try to tell you how to live.

Not that I disagree, but don't tenets and practices include how to think? Buddhism is like a philosophy glorifying introspect.

How do you know this hypothetical universe isn't the same as ours?

Because God exists.

The question is whether it's possible for such a universe to exist.  I would imagine that if the theists are right, it isn't.

Quote from: ﮎingulaЯiτy on October 24, 2008, 03:42:02 PM

How do you know this hypothetical universe isn't the same as ours?

Because God exists.

What makes you think that? Blind faith is not being open minded, nor scientifically constructive.

I have considered the God perspective and questioned if I am wrong. You obviously have not questioned your own beliefs.

You obviously have not questioned your own beliefs.

Wrong.

He questioned them; he just asked, "are you true?" And he responded to himself with, "yes."

You want me to lie?

Quote from: ﮎingulaЯiτy on October 24, 2008, 08:02:27 PM

You obviously have not questioned your own beliefs.

Wrong.

I meant truly objectively.

You want me to lie?

Not really. Do you want to?

Oh jeez more of this bullshit "We atheists are truly logical and everyone else are flaming retards."

Kill yourselves.

Oh jeez more of this bullshit "We atheists are truly logical and everyone else are flaming retards."

Kill yourselves.

Your kind are the ones who hang people on crosses with nails through their wrists and feet. What kind of fucked up bullshit is that?

I recommend the .50 special for you, tonight.

You kind are the ones who hang people on crosses with nails through their wrists and feet. What kind of fucked up bullshit is that?

I'm Roman now?

Quote

You kind are the ones who hang people on crosses with nails through their wrists and feet. What kind of fucked up bullshit is that?

I'm Roman now?

By your kind, I mean any religion that focuses around the Judaic God. That includes Islam, Catholicism, Roman Catholic, Baptist, etc...

By your kind, I mean any religion that focuses around the Judaic God. That includes Islam, Catholicism, Roman Catholic, Baptist, etc...

What is the difference between Catholicism and Roman Catholic?

Althalus, do you seriously want someone else to take responsibility for your sins via human sacrifice?