Proof of Conspiracy

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #120 on: October 27, 2008, 04:35:46 PM »
It speaks more about yours that you put such blind faith into a theory with no evidence to back it up whatsoever.

No its shows how much a mug you are to beleive in something that doesnt exist. Like god for instance.

Prove to me the earth is flat please even though in my work i see the curve all the time and have done for years.

Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #121 on: October 27, 2008, 04:36:50 PM »
The FAA is in charge of approving flight control systems and it would be illegal to fly without the FAA approval. The government is controlling this one by telling manufactures how the systems must work. The FAA has engineers that work to set standards. Another victory for FE!

What about when i fly manually?

No victory at all. Just more utter bullshit.

Proof plox.

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markjo

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #122 on: October 27, 2008, 07:11:13 PM »
The FAA is in charge of approving flight control systems and it would be illegal to fly without the FAA approval. The government is controlling this one by telling manufactures how the systems must work. The FAA has engineers that work to set standards. Another victory for the conspiracy!

Fixed that for you.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #123 on: October 27, 2008, 08:07:13 PM »
The FAA is in charge of approving flight control systems and it would be illegal to fly without the FAA approval. The government is controlling this one by telling manufactures how the systems must work. The FAA has engineers that work to set standards. Another victory for FE!

Maybe, but those engineers are not the same engineers who work for companies that actually design these devices.  My father was an electrical engineer who worked on commercial planes years ago.  If he was ever paid off to keep his mouth shut, it doesn't show, because the man is not rich.  You would have to pay me a bundle to keep me quiet.
Did he design the software and the hardware to trick the pilots? No because each airline/plane contractor engineer makes only small parts of the final product. FAA makes specifications so that no one can really tell that the electronics are wrong.

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #124 on: October 27, 2008, 08:08:45 PM »
The government knows the true layout in the earth then programs the electronics on planes to guide pilots in a was that leads the observer to think the earth is round. In reality though, the electronics are displaying lies.

People will believe whatever they are told. Especially when they cannot confirm it for themselves. People are conformers.

It means people are being led around in a circle by maps.

Hahahahahaha  ;D

Best post ever!!!! So when i'm flying in a straight line to another country i'm being deceived and actually being led round in circles  ;D

Do you actually have any proof of this utter bullshit you speak of at all?
Airlines don't claim to fly in straight lines.

Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #125 on: October 28, 2008, 03:38:49 AM »
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FAA makes specifications so that no one can really tell that the electronics are wrong.

So how do you know that the electronics are wrong?

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markjo

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #126 on: October 28, 2008, 05:15:26 AM »
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FAA makes specifications so that no one can really tell that the electronics are wrong.

So how do you know that the electronics are wrong?

Because the electronics make you think that you are navigating a round earth when the earth is actually flat.  Duh!   ::)
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Marcus Aurelius

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #127 on: October 28, 2008, 09:09:53 AM »
Did he design the software and the hardware to trick the pilots? No because each airline/plane contractor engineer makes only small parts of the final product. FAA makes specifications so that no one can really tell that the electronics are wrong.

The government does not make the software, a contractor does!!!  Everything is done by contractors, the government makes two things, jack and shit.  I guess you have never worked in a government office before or met a government employee.

I'll let you in on something, there are four reasons why a person will take a civilian job in the government.

1.  They will hire you out of college for a well paid internship and give you good training so later you can go to private industry and make loads of money.
2.  The Benefits are far greater than private industry, though the pay may be lower.
3.  They know that government employees don't have to do anything except making sure that damned contractor down the hall is doing their job, and the delivery dates will be met.
4.  Job security, once your in, it literally takes an act of congress to get rid of you. 

Hence why government employees are the laziest workforce on the planet.  Everybody is all but guaranteed the same raise every year, therefore there is no reason to bust your ass for your boss, it won't get you anywhere any faster.

In conclusion, in order for software to be designed to fake flightpath and distances not only on a single plane, but to make sure these fake readings don't cause midair collisions with other planes and miscalculations of how much fuel to put in the plane (how can that be faked!? they know exactly how much extra fuel they need for the distance they are traveling), the government would still have to let contracting engineers that design the software and the electronics in on the conspiracy because THEY are the ones designing these things, not the government. 

Government merely provides the requirements.  For example when Lockeed was contracted for the F-22 raptor.  There was a government requirement for supercruise (being able to go supersonic without the use of afterburners), and certain stealth requirements, as well as cost requirements (each fighter must cost less than x), sensor requirements (detect enemies at x range, etc).  They did not tell Lockeed what material to make the plan from, or exactly what its wingspan should be (though they may say, no bigger than x).  They also do not mitigate which engineers/programmers at Lockeed gets to work on which part.

They do not provide code to be used for the software.  They may ask for certain modifications of the software if something does not meet the requirements (or if there is a change in requirements).  Again, this would require the engineer to be informed of the requested change and they will probably start asking questions (to themselves or others) if they are told to have software give false readings!  We are talking thousands maybe millions of engineers AROUND THE WORLD that would have to be in some way aware of the conspiracy.

The top execs of any company or government agency are not qualified to engineer or design these devices, they need engineers and programmers, rocket scientists etc.  They are also not qualified to even understand how they could split the project up in a way that each person only works on a small part.  Not even a project manager would know that, especially in the government. 

Break down the task as far as you want, somewhere somehow somebody is going to see that what they are coding is doing something different than what the product advertises it is supposed to do.  Most engineers are smart enough to figure that out, especially since it is their profession.


« Last Edit: October 28, 2008, 09:11:29 AM by ragnarr »

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #128 on: October 28, 2008, 04:49:42 PM »
What about when i fly manually?

Yeah I asked this before. No answers really. Surprised?
north is hubwards, south is rimwards, east is turnwise, and west is widdershins.

The navigation system is rigged to give you the illusion you are flying straight.

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #129 on: October 28, 2008, 04:51:33 PM »
Quote
FAA makes specifications so that no one can really tell that the electronics are wrong.

So how do you know that the electronics are wrong?
How do you know they are right?

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #130 on: October 28, 2008, 04:56:41 PM »
Did he design the software and the hardware to trick the pilots? No because each airline/plane contractor engineer makes only small parts of the final product. FAA makes specifications so that no one can really tell that the electronics are wrong.

The government does not make the software, a contractor does!!!  Everything is done by contractors, the government makes two things, jack and shit.  I guess you have never worked in a government office before or met a government employee.

I'll let you in on something, there are four reasons why a person will take a civilian job in the government.

1.  They will hire you out of college for a well paid internship and give you good training so later you can go to private industry and make loads of money.
2.  The Benefits are far greater than private industry, though the pay may be lower.
3.  They know that government employees don't have to do anything except making sure that damned contractor down the hall is doing their job, and the delivery dates will be met.
4.  Job security, once your in, it literally takes an act of congress to get rid of you. 

Hence why government employees are the laziest workforce on the planet.  Everybody is all but guaranteed the same raise every year, therefore there is no reason to bust your ass for your boss, it won't get you anywhere any faster.

In conclusion, in order for software to be designed to fake flightpath and distances not only on a single plane, but to make sure these fake readings don't cause midair collisions with other planes and miscalculations of how much fuel to put in the plane (how can that be faked!? they know exactly how much extra fuel they need for the distance they are traveling), the government would still have to let contracting engineers that design the software and the electronics in on the conspiracy because THEY are the ones designing these things, not the government. 

Government merely provides the requirements.  For example when Lockeed was contracted for the F-22 raptor.  There was a government requirement for supercruise (being able to go supersonic without the use of afterburners), and certain stealth requirements, as well as cost requirements (each fighter must cost less than x), sensor requirements (detect enemies at x range, etc).  They did not tell Lockeed what material to make the plan from, or exactly what its wingspan should be (though they may say, no bigger than x).  They also do not mitigate which engineers/programmers at Lockeed gets to work on which part.

They do not provide code to be used for the software.  They may ask for certain modifications of the software if something does not meet the requirements (or if there is a change in requirements).  Again, this would require the engineer to be informed of the requested change and they will probably start asking questions (to themselves or others) if they are told to have software give false readings!  We are talking thousands maybe millions of engineers AROUND THE WORLD that would have to be in some way aware of the conspiracy.

The top execs of any company or government agency are not qualified to engineer or design these devices, they need engineers and programmers, rocket scientists etc.  They are also not qualified to even understand how they could split the project up in a way that each person only works on a small part.  Not even a project manager would know that, especially in the government. 

Break down the task as far as you want, somewhere somehow somebody is going to see that what they are coding is doing something different than what the product advertises it is supposed to do.  Most engineers are smart enough to figure that out, especially since it is their profession.



Planes use fictitious technologies like "GPS" to navigate. That allows the military to mislead the FAA. Engineers think they are working on a RE based navigation system but in realities they are using a faux navigation system.

The FAA mandates standards that engineers have to implement but the standards are inheritantly flawed because of the fake infrastructure around.

The avionics are just conspiracy propaganda....
« Last Edit: October 28, 2008, 04:58:23 PM by Johannes Kepler »

Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #131 on: October 28, 2008, 05:56:57 PM »
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How do you know they are right?

I don't. I'm asking how you know they are wrong when you said 'FAA makes specifications so that no one can really tell that the electronics are wrong.'

Quote
The FAA mandates standards that engineers have to implement but the standards are inheritantly flawed because of the fake infrastructure around.

How are they flawed? Besides, I don't see why following a couple of safety guidelines would make a plane waltz off onto a completely different course.

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markjo

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #132 on: October 28, 2008, 07:58:24 PM »
Planes use fictitious technologies like "GPS" to navigate. That allows the military to mislead the FAA. Engineers think they are working on a RE based navigation system but in realities they are using a faux navigation system.

Umm...  You do realize that GPS is a relatively recent technology, don't you?  There has been around 50 years or more of old fashioned celestial, compass and dead reckoning navigation techniques that seem to have worked (for the most part).  None of which could possibly hide the discrepancies between FE and RE distances, especially in the southern hemiplane.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Marcus Aurelius

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #133 on: October 29, 2008, 07:26:31 AM »
Planes use fictitious technologies like "GPS" to navigate. That allows the military to mislead the FAA. Engineers think they are working on a RE based navigation system but in realities they are using a faux navigation system.

The FAA mandates standards that engineers have to implement but the standards are inheritantly flawed because of the fake infrastructure around.

The avionics are just conspiracy propaganda....

To your first point, you need to think more about what you are saying.  If one were to design a device that pinpoints a location and calculates distance under the assumption of a round earth, but the earth was not round, then the device would be inaccurate.  The longer the flight, the more off course you would be.

Second, what fake infrastructure? People fly all the time. 

Third, you are making things up just to support your point of view.  That goes against Rowbatham and Zetetic beliefs.

From ENAG:
Quote
None can doubt that by making special experiments, and collecting manifest and undeniable facts, arranging them in logical order, and observing what is naturally and fairly deducible therefrom, the result must be more consistent and satisfactory than the contrary method of framing a theory or system--assuming the existence and operation of causes of which there is no direct and practical evidence, and which is only claimed to be "admitted for the sake of argument," and for the purpose of giving an apparent and plausible, but not necessarily truthful explanation of phenomena. All theories are of this character. "Supposing, instead of inquiring, imagining systems instead of learning from observation and experience the true constitution of things.

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rcpilot

Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #134 on: October 29, 2008, 12:20:57 PM »
The FAA is in charge of approving flight control systems and it would be illegal to fly without the FAA approval. The government is controlling this one by telling manufactures how the systems must work. The FAA has engineers that work to set standards. Another victory for FE!
Except for the fact that this whole 'government GPS conspiracy' argument is ridiculous considering pilots used to do their own calculations which corrected for the spherical nature of the earth.  Is every pilot prior to the advent of GPS part of the RE conspiracy?

There are so many ways you personally could go out and dispute RE 'theory'.  Have you attempted to use basic trig to figure out your position relative to objects in the sky?  Have you looked at the way that you can see cloud tops in relatively small cracks of cloud cover of an overcast day?  Have you done anything beyond try to come up with oddball theories as to why huge numbers of people are lying to you for no good reason?  Are the adventurers who circumnavigate the southern ocean all part of this conspiracy too?  Is everyone in the southern hemisphere part of the conspiracy?  (Surely they'd notice if our knowledge of the earth and the maps they used to take part in trade, travel etc. don't match up in the least when it comes to distance.)

This sounds like the intelligent design argument but stranger.  'There are small holes in this theory that don't affect it as a whole, so this other theory which has no plausible explanation or science behind it is right.'
« Last Edit: October 29, 2008, 12:45:20 PM by rcpilot »

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #135 on: October 29, 2008, 01:31:53 PM »
The navigation system is rigged to give you the illusion you are flying straight.

Yes, and so what happens if you don't use any navigation system? That was my question in the thread I linked. Did you even read it?
Your plane gets shot down when it come close to the ice wall or you run out of fuel.

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Marcus Aurelius

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #136 on: October 29, 2008, 01:42:48 PM »
The navigation system is rigged to give you the illusion you are flying straight.

Yes, and so what happens if you don't use any navigation system? That was my question in the thread I linked. Did you even read it?
Your plane gets shot down when it come close to the ice wall or you run out of fuel.

Before GPS, that is how everyone navigated.  See the list of people who have circumnavigated the world here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_circumnavigations

Just to add, there are people who have circumnavigated the southern oceans.  The distances are known.


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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #137 on: October 29, 2008, 03:52:01 PM »
The navigation system is rigged to give you the illusion you are flying straight.

Yes, and so what happens if you don't use any navigation system? That was my question in the thread I linked. Did you even read it?
Your plane gets shot down when it come close to the ice wall or you run out of fuel.

Before GPS, that is how everyone navigated.  See the list of people who have circumnavigated the world here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_circumnavigations

Just to add, there are people who have circumnavigated the southern oceans.  The distances are known.


These maps are designed to appear spherical but they are really just a loop.

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #138 on: October 29, 2008, 03:55:40 PM »
The navigation system is rigged to give you the illusion you are flying straight.

Yes, and so what happens if you don't use any navigation system? That was my question in the thread I linked. Did you even read it?
Your plane gets shot down when it come close to the ice wall or you run out of fuel.

Ha! Now I know you're an alt. Imagine that we're not flying near the ice wall. Because we're scared of the killer robot penguins and their lizard masters.

Say we start at London and point our plane east. Then turn off navigation. What towns do we fly over?
You follow a route that is significantly different than the one predicted in RE theory. OF course the difference might only be noticable after a few hundred miles...
« Last Edit: October 29, 2008, 04:38:02 PM by Johannes Kepler »

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Marcus Aurelius

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #139 on: October 29, 2008, 04:29:00 PM »
The navigation system is rigged to give you the illusion you are flying straight.

Yes, and so what happens if you don't use any navigation system? That was my question in the thread I linked. Did you even read it?
Your plane gets shot down when it come close to the ice wall or you run out of fuel.

I mentioned nothing about maps.  Do you agree if the earth was a disk with the north pole in the middle that circumnavigating the southern hemisphere would take much longer than the northern?

My point was there are people who have done this in the list I provided, the distance is known.  If the earth was a disk then circumnavigation of the southern hemisphere would take much longer than in the northern hemisphere.

Before GPS, that is how everyone navigated.  See the list of people who have circumnavigated the world here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_circumnavigations

Just to add, there are people who have circumnavigated the southern oceans.  The distances are known.


These maps are designed to appear spherical but they are really just a loop.

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #140 on: October 29, 2008, 04:36:18 PM »
Maps - calculations - both really tell you the same. Many early "circumnavigators" came out with maps anyway.

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Marcus Aurelius

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #141 on: October 29, 2008, 04:52:53 PM »
If the earth was a disk then circumnavigation of the southern hemisphere would take much longer than in the northern hemisphere.

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #142 on: October 29, 2008, 04:55:03 PM »
How many airlines offer flights around Antarctica?  ;D

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Marcus Aurelius

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #143 on: October 29, 2008, 05:38:03 PM »
How many airlines offer flights around Antarctica?  ;D

Not many, but if you read my previous post, and did a little research, you would see that there have been people that have circumnavigated the earth in both the northern and southern hemispheres.  Here is a picture of a southern hemisphere route in red.




Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #144 on: October 30, 2008, 03:58:14 PM »
As we move out closer to the edge of the disk, or south if you will, there is a greater concentration of dark energy.  Dark energy acts on the acceleration of planes, boats or any other body in movement.

Due to the greater concentration of dark energy, boats and planes actually move faster than the ones closer to the north pole - this difference in acceleration, which is not simply evident from observing navigational instruments, is directly proportional to the added distance it takes to circumnavigate the globe as me move further south.

Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #145 on: October 30, 2008, 04:00:30 PM »
The burden of proof is on the RE'ers because they're the ones making the claim that NASA can land men on the moon, send robots to mars, and send probes to explore the solar system. We've never claimed any of that stuff. They made the claim, so the burden is on them to prove it.

Its the REer's responsibility to prove their outlandish sci-fi claims.
   The burden of proof is on both sides. Not one or the other. You can't honestly think that we're expected to believe whatever you say until we have proof, while we can't expect you to believe whatever we say until you find proof. But anyways, if you ever want to try and convince us that the Earth is flat, then yea, you're going to need proof... or at least enough evidence to outweigh the evidence of a round Earth.

   You'll never win a debate relying on the other side giving proof, mostly because you're just avoiding even trying to convince us that your theory is true. It's like trying to win a war only by defense, it can't be done, unless the other side surrenders. But you know that RE'rs won't ever give up to their theory, because they've yet to have practical evidence as to believe the FET.

   FE'rs did a good job on proving that it's POSSIBLE that the Earth is flat. But I've yet to see any practical reasons, evidence, or proof as to why the Earth is flat. I have a good reason to believing why the Earth is round. And fairly practical if you ask me. The theory is globally accepted and taught in schools. By now, compared to how much we've advanced and moved on from the ages, we're definitely capable of knowing the shape of the planet we live on. There's countless instruments that we use everyday in which either wouldn't work on a Flat Earth, or directly shows us the shape of the Earth. The government has few reasons as to hiding this, even money is a impractical reason as to why they'd want to hide the shape of the planet from the people who live on it. Even IF they had a good reason for hiding it, this would have to go through a VERY complicated process, involving having to silence hundreds, thousands, even millions of people who were to potentially, or already know that the Earth is truly flat.

   I believe in Gravitation as well. But some of you just won't realize that we don't know why gravitation exists. We only know that it DOES exists, only because it's a phenomenon (which by definition, means unexplained) that is observed in ALL mass. Whether it be planets and galaxies or atoms and molecules. It happens, and gravitation is what we call it.

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #146 on: October 30, 2008, 06:14:57 PM »
Say we start at London and point our plane east. Then turn off navigation. What towns do we fly over?
You follow a route that is significantly different than the one predicted in RE theory. OF course the difference might only be noticable after a few hundred miles...

Christ. That's a bit of a bombshell. You mean that we'd be able to figure out within a couple of hours that our maps were totally wrong? Makes the conspiracy a bit implausable doesn't it?
Pilots do not fly straight for long distances.

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Marcus Aurelius

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #147 on: October 31, 2008, 06:15:53 AM »
As we move out closer to the edge of the disk, or south if you will, there is a greater concentration of dark energy.  Dark energy acts on the acceleration of planes, boats or any other body in movement.

Due to the greater concentration of dark energy, boats and planes actually move faster than the ones closer to the north pole - this difference in acceleration, which is not simply evident from observing navigational instruments, is directly proportional to the added distance it takes to circumnavigate the globe as me move further south.

BWAHAHA how convenient.  Even nature is conspiring to hide the fact that the earth is flat eh?  *Cough* Win for RE *Cough*.

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IHOP

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #148 on: October 31, 2008, 10:16:52 AM »
This is part of an article from the BBC on what the world thinks of you and some of their proof

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/7540427.stm

If the earth was flat as suggested by these "theorists", a plane flying from Santiago (Chile) to Sydney (Australia) would have to cross Mexico and California before reaching its destination. Having spent many hours on that route, I can assure the world that it doesn't. The world is not a flat disc. Period.
Alex Williams, London

The flat-earth theory of the planet being a disc can be proven false quite easily. Simply get a satellite photo of the South Pole showing Antarctica as one landmass surrounded by water.

Oh wait, they don't trust satellite photos. But they do trust aircraft. The reason planes fly routes in arcs is because this is the shortest and most efficient route on a curved sphere. Simply show that the distance/fuel consumption between two points in the Northern Hemisphere is roughly the same as between two points in the Southern Hemisphere.

For example, the distance between Rio de Janeiro and Cape Town is 3775 miles, and the distance from New York to London is 3470 miles. If the disc theory was correct, it would be something like 4x as far between the Southern Hemisphere cities, since you'd have to traverse the two points further from the center of the disc (ie the North Pole). Mr Davis can even fly the plane if he wants!

But, I forgot, logic has already failed these people. Why should this be any different?
Matt, NYC, US
Anal leakage is the result of the relaxation of the anal sphinctor

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Johannes

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Re: Proof of Conspiracy
« Reply #149 on: October 31, 2008, 01:30:48 PM »
As we move out closer to the edge of the disk, or south if you will, there is a greater concentration of dark energy.  Dark energy acts on the acceleration of planes, boats or any other body in movement.

Due to the greater concentration of dark energy, boats and planes actually move faster than the ones closer to the north pole - this difference in acceleration, which is not simply evident from observing navigational instruments, is directly proportional to the added distance it takes to circumnavigate the globe as me move further south.
Excellent theory, I will have to research this on my trip to Argentina next week.