Why religion makes sense

This is a hypothesis of mine regarding why religion makes sense - that is to say, why it is self-consistent and, if one accepts the fact that God can violate the laws of nature, a sensible belief system. I say nothing of its truth here, although if it is true this hypothesis becomes unnecessary.

Throughout recorded history, people have believed in various Gods and practised various religions. However, people would tend to reject those religions that sounded like total nonsense, and accept those which were (comparatively) sensible, in general terms. Thus, by a process of memetic evolution, we have ended up with lots of small cults believing in highly irrational things, and a few mainstream religions which are comparatively mild and reasonable.

Advocates of religion often mistake its self-consistency for truth, but now we see a way in which a false religion may become more self-consistent than any story written over the course of just a few years, simply by evolving over several millenia.

um can you please state your hypothesis

This is a hypothesis of mine regarding why religion makes sense - that is to say, why it is self-consistent and, if one accepts the fact that God can violate the laws of nature, a sensible belief system. I say nothing of its truth here, although if it is true this hypothesis becomes unnecessary.

Throughout recorded history, people have believed in various Gods and practised various religions. However, people would tend to reject those religions that sounded like total nonsense, and accept those which were (comparatively) sensible, in general terms. Thus, by a process of memetic evolution, we have ended up with lots of small cults believing in highly irrational things, and a few mainstream religions which are comparatively mild and reasonable.

Advocates of religion often mistake its self-consistency for truth, but now we see a way in which a false religion may become more self-consistent than any story written over the course of just a few years, simply by evolving over several millenia.

Old.

Throughout recorded history, people have believed in various Gods and practised various religions. However, people would tend to reject those religions that sounded like total nonsense, and accept those which were (comparatively) sensible

Untrue. Look up the aztecs for a brilliant example.

you confuse me

So... religion is self regulating and biased against the most ludicrous forms. Reducing the most fanatical religion drives religions to evolve into more acceptable beliefs?
I suppose I agree to a limited degree, but religion never made rational sense to me other than the 'feelings of justness' or  'control' it exhibits.

Religion exists because people are scared of dying alone. Nothing more.

Religion exists because people are scared of dying alone. Nothing more.

I disagree, there are many other reasons. The fear of cosmic loneliness is only one factor.

CON...TROL!

Religion exists because people are scared of dying alone. Nothing more.

I'm not postulating about its existence, but about why it would make more sense than you would expect a made-up story to make.

I'm not sure you can justify that ridiculousness is a selection factor.

I'm not sure you can justify that ridiculousness is a selection factor.

For a religion to catch on, it must be significantly more plausible than its predecessor. At least, in most cases you would expect that. There would always be exceptions, but they aren't a significant factor in memetic selection.

I think you'd have to justify the claim that there exists a universal progression from absurd to the rational, in a religious context.

I think you'd have to justify the claim that there exists a universal progression from absurd to the rational, in a religious context.

I would, as well, but the opposite is true.  Magic predates religion by at least 5,000 years, but is much more rational.  Most early magic was representational in nature.  Cave paintings are a perfect example.  You see many examples of cave drawings depicting early men hunting game.  The idea was, if we focus on catching the animal while drawing our specific methods and techniques, we can help make this a reality.  The funniest part is, we know from such psychological phenomena as affirmations and hypnosis that they were probably right.

I believe that religion as we know it is a tool of subjugation, not an inherent need.  I believe that were it not for the continuous indoctrination, it would be long gone.  The basic premise of all religions has been ridiculous for a thousand years or more, and becomes more ridiculous the more we discover about our universe.  If we ever do work out a unified field theory, god will be truly dead.

And none too soon.

Why!? Well if you ask me because in my religion there is nothing against the goods of the humanity as whole. All religions basically teach followers to do good deeds, however some religions try to do that in a wrong way which doesn't make any sense at all or doesn't have any benefit. I kindly ask you to watch the video ^_^

I just picked up on "self-consistent". In what way is it self consistent? in the Bible for instance there are so many inconsistancies and contradictions that it is a running joke!

Why!? Well if you ask me because in my religion there is nothing against the goods of the humanity as whole. All religions basically teach followers to do good deeds, however some religions try to do that in a wrong way which doesn't make any sense at all or doesn't have any benefit. I kindly ask you to watch the video ^_^

Really, 'Slave of Allah'?  Doesn't Islam mean Submission?  Doesn't it's dogma include a bunch of crap about how women are supposed to cover their skin and not have sex?  These are social constructs designed to motivate men to produce more so they are more attractive to women so that women will marry and fuck them.  Without the religious nonsense, there's nothing telling all these women that there is something wrong with fucking.  And be perfectly clear - there is nothing wrong with fucking.

Good deeds?  Like jihad, stoning apostates, or disfiguring women's genetalia?

Fuck your video.

Sadly you people throw words against Islam without knowledge, I have nothing against you personally but I have things against your way of thinking, just because you misunderstood or having a misconception about Islam it doesn't mean Islam is wrong. I don't need to explain again because I've been explaining this to people here for a long time. However, with your current knowledge about Islam your really in no position to post against Islam. If I post against Christianity for example I post with full knowledge about that topic so a learned Christian wouldn't laugh when he reads my posts, I am not saying am laughing on your post in fact I just feel you have much to learn and inshallah (If God Wills) if you learned about Islam such misconception your having will be cleared.

Sadly you people throw words against Islam without knowledge, I have nothing against you personally but I have things against your way of thinking, just because you misunderstood or having a misconception about Islam it doesn't mean Islam is wrong. I don't need to explain again because I've been explaining this to people here for a long time. However, with your current knowledge about Islam your really in no position to post against Islam. If I post against Christianity for example I post with full knowledge about that topic so a learned Christian wouldn't laugh when he reads my posts, I am not saying am laughing on your post in fact I just feel you have much to learn and inshallah (If God Wills) if you learned about Islam such misconception your having will be cleared.

So explain to me, where did I get it wrong?

Does Islam translate as submission?

Does Islam teach women that they should cover most of their skin?

Does Islam teach women that pre-marital sex is wrong?

Is the stoning to death of Apostates not dictated by Sharia law in countries such as Afganistan and Pakistan?

Is female circumcision not a practice condoned in some Islamic nations?

Please, educate me - I've only read the Koran three times, and my degree in World Religion is only a Bachelor's.

I am glad your trying to learn, I guess you've spent days and months in your studies, please waste some time on reading the contents of this site, which has the basics and answers to questions by Non-Muslims and inshallah many of the misconception your having will be cleared.

http://www.islamawareness.net/

After you read and if you have still questions not answered in the site, let me know

I am glad your trying to learn, I guess you've spent days and months in your studies, please waste some time on reading the contents of this site, which has the basics and answers to questions by Non-Muslims and inshallah many of the misconception your having will be cleared.

http://www.islamawareness.net/

After you read and if you have still questions not answered in the site, let me know

WTF???!!! I didnt' ask for a link.  The questions are simple.  Can you not answer them?  Here, I'll do it for you:

1. Yes, Islam loosly translates as submission.

2. Yes, Sharia dictates that women shall cover most of their skin when in public.

3. Yes, Islam teaches that a woman who is not a virgin is not an acceptable wife, and that pre-marital sex is evil in the eyes of Allah.

4. Yes, Federal law in many islamic states mandates the death penalty for apostates, as well as for adulterers.

5. Yes, while female circumcision is technically legal in most if not all islamic states, it is a practice widely accepted by the men in the more fundamentalist islamic commmunities around the world, including the United States and England.

Don't you get it?  It's just indoctrination.  If you were not exposed to this nonsense as a child, and someone explained it all to you as an adult, you'd never buy it for a moment.  It's all just so silly.  Do you believe in Zoroaster or Ahura Mazda?  Opollo, Diana, or Allāt?  No, of course not, that would be silly, right?

To me, you are silly for not realizing that Allah is just another construct.  He is an invention of man.  Mohammed was just another bat shit crazy jackass in a cave.

When will you see the light?

Finally someone says it.

Jesus Crotch:
Is this the utmost of your knowledge ^_^

Jesus Crotch:
Is this the utmost of your knowledge ^_^

Is this your idea of discussion?  Posting links, copying scripture, and whatever '^_^' is supposed to be?  Why don't you try responding directly when someone asks you a question?  Can you contest even a single answer I provided to my own questions?

You really aren't equipped to have this discussion with me.  Either start conversing, or GTFO.

There is a big difference between someone who is wants to learn and someone who just want to prove the other side to be wrong and he is right

There is a big difference between someone who is wants to learn and someone who just want to prove the other side to be wrong and he is right

Wants to learn??!!  I spent four years at university and 15 in personal study on the religions of the world.  I have been in sweatlodges, on pilgrimages, on hallucinogens, and to revivals in search of answers.

You, after being indoctrinated as a child and blind as an adult have the audacity to tell me I don't want to learn??  You're worse than I thought.

Fuck off, luddite.

Wants to learn??!!  I spent four years at university and 15 in personal study on the religions of the world.  I have been in sweatlodges, on pilgrimages, on hallucinogens, and to revivals in search of answers.

You, after being indoctrinated as a child and blind as an adult have the audacity to tell me I don't want to learn??  You're worse than I thought.

Fuck off, luddite.

You just got trolled, buddy.

Quote from: AbdulAziz on October 15, 2008, 01:38:47 PM

There is a big difference between someone who is wants to learn and someone who just want to prove the other side to be wrong and he is right

Wants to learn??!!  I spent four years at university and 15 in personal study on the religions of the world.  I have been in sweatlodges, on pilgrimages, on hallucinogens, and to revivals in search of answers.

This is what I truly believe as a learner, without these experiences, you cannot know anything about your beliefs.

I have been on a few pilgrimages myself, a few hallucinogens, in search of some of the same answers. I found mine, in atheism, but that's besides the point. Without these experiences, I doubt I would know what to believe.

Successful troll is successful.

Quote from: Jesus Crotch on October 15, 2008, 01:41:57 PM

Quote from: AbdulAziz on October 15, 2008, 01:38:47 PM

There is a big difference between someone who is wants to learn and someone who just want to prove the other side to be wrong and he is right

Wants to learn??!!  I spent four years at university and 15 in personal study on the religions of the world.  I have been in sweatlodges, on pilgrimages, on hallucinogens, and to revivals in search of answers.

This is what I truly believe as a learner, without these experiences, you cannot know anything about your beliefs.

I have been on a few pilgrimages myself, a few hallucinogens, in search of some of the same answers. I found mine, in atheism, but that's besides the point. Without these experiences, I doubt I would know what to believe.

Wise words, Hara.  I was so clueless for so long, if I hadn't lost my faith, I never would have found my path, if that makes any sense.  I have to say, if you are as young as I think you are, I applaud you for reaching this place so young.  I was in my 30s before I stopped trying to be a pantheist/polytheist.

As long as you don't fear the persecution you may experience, I envy you a bit.

@Oscar - yes, but only a little.  I type more pissed than I actually am, sometimes.