Book of Enoch

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AbdulAziz

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Book of Enoch
« on: September 27, 2008, 09:12:45 PM »
After some researches I really found this book to be an interesting book. Because I never thought that Enoch was meant to be Prophet (Idrees) in Islam we call Enoch Idrees I always thought Punisher was speaking of someone else. In Quran Allah said that Idrees/Enoch was raised a high place. I also realized that the name of Satan was Azazel, according to some historians said that one of Prophet Mohammed's companion said that Eblees real name was Azazel but we cannot confirm if this is the historian word or really the companion's words. I ask my friend Punisher to give me some details and information about this book.

What is the position of this book?

Who wrote the book?

What the book says about the Creation?  How the creation started?

What does the book say about Qabeel and Habeel (The two sons of Adam, one of them killed the other because he felt jelous I think something like that)

What is the attributes of the God in this book?

What God wants from Humans in this Book?

The relation between this Book and old Jewish scriptures?

What does it say about Jews, Christians, Muslims?

What is the greatest sin in the Book?

I need full details about the following:

Angel Gabrial
Azazel /Eblees/Satan
Enoch  (To whom he was sent? what is his position now...etc)
Adam
And the supposed coming prophet or the savior or the last prophet?

Can I read this book anywhere online?

I will be waiting because after some research I found it's hard and complicated to get the information I want so I am asking someone who knows well about this book and I guess that's you Punisher. Thanks in advance ^_^
« Last Edit: September 27, 2008, 09:17:37 PM by AbdulAziz »
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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Sexual Harassment Panda

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Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2008, 11:35:30 PM »
After some researches I really found this book to be an interesting book. Because I never thought that Enoch was meant to be Prophet (Idrees) in Islam we call Enoch Idrees I always thought Punisher was speaking of someone else. In Quran Allah said that Idrees/Enoch was raised a high place. I also realized that the name of Satan was Azazel, according to some historians said that one of Prophet Mohammed's companion said that Eblees real name was Azazel but we cannot confirm if this is the historian word or really the companion's words. I ask my friend Punisher to give me some details and information about this book.

What is the position of this book?

Who wrote the book?

What the book says about the Creation?  How the creation started?

What does the book say about Qabeel and Habeel (The two sons of Adam, one of them killed the other because he felt jelous I think something like that)

What is the attributes of the God in this book?

What God wants from Humans in this Book?

The relation between this Book and old Jewish scriptures?

What does it say about Jews, Christians, Muslims?

What is the greatest sin in the Book?

I need full details about the following:

Angel Gabrial
Azazel /Eblees/Satan
Enoch  (To whom he was sent? what is his position now...etc)
Adam
And the supposed coming prophet or the savior or the last prophet?

Can I read this book anywhere online?

I will be waiting because after some research I found it's hard and complicated to get the information I want so I am asking someone who knows well about this book and I guess that's you Punisher. Thanks in advance ^_^
dont you have a library or are those banned in muslim worlds
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New Flat Earth FAQ: http://theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=30512.0

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2008, 07:59:31 AM »
Hi Panda

Well if your talking about my own Library yeah I already have two libraries but the problem is most of them are Arabic Books and so far I didn't find this book in our libraries here in the Arabic Section, and in the English Section the only book that there are like the Bible, Bhagvavita...etc but not this one, I admit I didn't search much because just now I've come to realize that a book that exists.

As for my question, because after searching I realized that the book matches some of the information in the Quran and it's not conflicting as much as the Bible or other scriptures, that's why I asked some question that is considered important to us Muslims and want to know the answers to these question from that book to compare ^_^

I guess to some this topic might not be interesting because as usual I will be focusing on Islam and the Book of Enoch which both are not well known around here. However instead of ruining all other topics asking about this book I preferred to create and topic and ask any question I have here ^_~
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2008, 04:50:50 PM »

I will be waiting because after some research I found it's hard and complicated to get the information I want so I am asking someone who knows well about this book and I guess that's you Punisher. Thanks in advance ^_^

Finally, brother, you have seen the light and now you shall embrace it, prepare to meet your Maker.

Begin with this version, they're all the same, but I prefer this one.
http://reluctant-messenger.com/1enoch01-60.htm

I will answer and assist you through-out all your questions and trials, oh yah, you will be tried....

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Space Cowgirl

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Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2008, 04:53:33 PM »
The Book of Enoch from the Dead Sea Scrolls?
http://www.ibiblio.org/expo/deadsea.scrolls.exhibit/Library/enoch.html

Or are you talking about Enoch in Genesis?

Gen 5:21 And Enoch lived sixty and five years, and begat Methuselah:

Gen 5:22 And Enoch walked with God after he begat Methuselah three hundred years, and begat sons and daughters:

Gen 5:23 And all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty and five years:

Gen 5:24 And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.

Also mentioned in:

Hebrews 11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

Here's the prophesy part, I think.
Jude 1:14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

Jude 1:15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

Jude 1:16 These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

Jude 1:17 But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;

Jude 1:18 How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.

Jude 1:19 These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.

Jude 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

Jude 1:21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

Jude 1:22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:

Jude 1:23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

Jude 1:24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

Jude 1:25 To the only wise God our Savior, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.
I'm sorry. Am I to understand that when you have a boner you like to imagine punching the shit out of Tom Bishop? That's disgusting.

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2008, 05:08:22 PM »
Punisher:
Thanks man for the link I really appreciate it, but I don't want to go through all this, I will be reading but would you please answer the question I asked for shortcuts n_n thanks again man for the website. But I don't need to embrace anything because I have my own path which is the truth that has no contradiction at all (Islam & The Quran) I would have gladly been embracing your truth if mine had errors. But didn't Allah say in the Quran this >>>

"Such is ALLAH, your True Lord. So what is there other than the truth but error ? How then are you being turned away from the truth ? "

but I don't mind learning ^_~

Space Cowgirl:
I am talking about the Book of Enoch which was banned from the Bible I guess and was given to prophet Enoch as described by our friend Punisher.
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2008, 06:46:39 PM »

Because I never thought that Enoch was meant to be Prophet (Idrees) in Islam we call Enoch Idrees I always thought Punisher was speaking of someone else. In Quran Allah said that Idrees/Enoch was raised a high place.
I should have said so, but maybe this way was better.


I also realized that the name of Satan was Azazel, according to some historians said that one of Prophet Mohammed's companion said that Eblees real name was Azazel but we cannot confirm if this is the historian word or really the companion's words. I ask my friend Punisher to give me some details and information about this book.

Satan's real name is Satanail, Azazel is one of his leaders within the troop that rebelled against GOD

2Enoch.29:[2]And from the rock I cut off a great fire, and from the fire I created the orders of the incorporeal ten troops of Angels, and their weapons are fiery and their raiment a burning flame, and I commanded that each one should stand in his order. [3]And one from out the order of Angels, having turned away with the order that was under him, conceived an impossible thought, to place his throne higher than the clouds above the earth, that he might become equal in rank to MY power. [4]And I threw him out from the height with his angels, and he was flying in the air continuously above the bottomless.

9 is the number of Satan: Judaism (tithing 10%) 1/tenth = 1 out of 10: Satanic Church 9 sin/statements: the 9 planets of satanic science. It is highly probable that it was the 9th troop to have rebelled against GOD and HIS creation, Jesus gave little hints here and there that he was part of that Rebellion.

[3]And they said to me: These are the Grigori, who with their prince Satanail rejected the LORD of Light, and after them are those who are held in great darkness on the second Heaven, and three of them went down on to earth from the LORD'S throne, to the place Ermon, and broke through their vows on the shoulder of the hill Ermon and saw the daughters of men how good they are, and took to themselves wives, and befouled the earth with their deeds, who in all times of their age made lawlessness and mixing, and giants are born and marvellous big men and great enmity.

The prince of Darkness, the three stars who fell are the 3 upside/down stars of the republican party logo (elephant).
http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message600968/pg1


What is the position of this book?

It is the Covenant GOD made with Mankind written by Enoch put inside Noah's ark to protect the Ark.

ENOCH.64:[1]In those days Noah saw that the earth became inclined, and that destruction approached. [2]Then he lifted up his feet, and went to the ends of the earth, to the dwelling of his great-grandfather Enoch. ENOCH.67.[1]After this he gave me the characteristical marks of all the secret things in the book of my great-grandfather Enoch, and in the parables which had been given to him; inserting them for me among the words of the book of parables.

CHARACTERISTICAL MARKS.

Who you are is represented within the Book Of Enoch provided you obtain a copy and believe the Guarantor to be the True Living GOD

I'd download a copy in 8.5 x 14 to make it legal.


Who wrote the book?

The righteous scribe. The Blesseth Holy Enoch.


What the book says about the Creation?  How the creation started?

With a Big Bang. Science used the Book Of GOD to learn about the cosmos, about the Sun, the Moon, and so much more. But also the theory of Creation.

2Enoch.24:[2]And I bowed down to the Lord, and the Lord spoke to me: Enoch, beloved, all that you see, all things that are standing finished I tell to you even before the very beginning, all that I created from non-being, and visible things from invisible.

2Enoch.25:[1]I commanded in the very lowest parts, that visible things should come down from invisible, and Adoil came down very great, and I beheld him, and lo! He had a belly of great light. [2]And I said to him: Become undone, Adoil, and let the visible come out of you. [3]And he came undone, and a great light came out. And I was in the midst of the great light, and as there is born light from light, there came forth a great age, and showed all creation, which I had thought to create. BANG!!!!!!!

and visible things from invisible.
and visible things from invisible.

GOD is the most intelligent Being, and created this very Universe with a Big Bang.


What does the book say about Qabeel and Habeel (The two sons of Adam, one of them killed the other because he felt jelous I think something like that)

Your gonna like this one AbdulAziz.

Enoch has a dream and sees all that is to come in the world, in His dream He sees people interchange with animal role play.

Chapter 84:

[1]After this I saw another dream, and explained it all to you, my son. Enoch arose and said to His son Mathusala, To you, my son, will I speak. Hear my word; and incline your ear to the visionary dream of your father. Before I married your mother Edna, I saw a vision on my bed;

[2]And behold, a cow sprung forth from the earth; [3]And this cow was white. [4]Afterwards a female heifer sprung forth; and with it another two heifer: one of them was black, and one was red. [5]The black heifer then struck the red one, and pursued it over the earth. [6]From that period I could see nothing more of the red heifer; but the black one increased in bulk, and a female heifer came with him.

The white cow = Adam
Female heifer = Eva
Black heifer = Cain
Red heifer = Abel

The black one (evil) increased in numbers, this is true in today's standards, while the red one (good) there are less of, having said this, "Red Bull gives you Wings!"     


What is the attributes of the God in this book?

You mean of GOD, and you should read His Book to find this out, this part is special, because, this is the part where you meet GOD


What God wants from Humans in this Book?

What GOD has always wanted, contrite hearts. Book 2 Chapter 45:[3] When the Lord demands bread, or candles, or the flesh of beasts, or any other sacrifice, then that is nothing; but God demands pure hearts, and with all that only tests the heart of man.


The relation between this Book and old Jewish scriptures?

This Book predicted the Temple burning in 70 AD, it also predicted its removal from the Synagogue and Church. They first removed the Book in 90 AD at the Council of Jamnia (Jewish), and later in 364 A.D at the Council of Laodicea (Christian), that's why the sheep are asleep.

1Enoch.92:[10]After that, in the sixth week, all those who are in it shall be darkened, the hearts of all of them shall be forgetful of wisdom, and in it shall a Man arise and come forth. [11]And during its completion He shall burn the house of dominion with fire, and all the race of the elect root shall be dispersed.

The Book Of Enoch speaks of a 10 Week calender assigned to mankind that coincides with our own Gregorian calendar, each week consists of 777 years, (0) of our calender reflects the top verse of the 6th Week and is also the time Jesus walked the Earth.

The Calender.
http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message550546/pg1

The Timeline.
http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message550561/pg1


What does it say about Jews, Christians, Muslims?

They are all misled, because of the above reply.


What is the greatest sin in the Book?

All sin kill, but don't start to feel guilty about what you have done, GOD forgives so much, because much of what you did was imposed on you.
http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message548865/pg1

But in regards to your question, the soulless.

Book 2 Chapter 60: He who does injury to the soul of another man, does injury to his own soul. [1]He who works the killing of a man’s soul, kills his own soul, and kills his own body, and there is no cure for him for all time. [2]He who puts a man in any snare, shall stick in it himself, and there is no cure for him for all time. [3]He who puts a man in any vessel, his retribution will not be wanting at the great judgment for all time. [4]He who works crookedly or speaks evil against any soul, will not make justice for himself for all time.

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2008, 07:56:05 PM »
Punisher your really amazing  :D guess why, because the more I read the more I realize that it's going according to the Quran :) does it mean the book of Enoch wasn't changed as much as the Old Testament and the New Testament?

You might be surprised but guess what, as I've been reading it seemed to me that Satan was created from fire.

And the jinn WE have created before of the fire of hot wind. And remember when thy Lord said to the angels, I am about to create man of dry ringing clay, of black mud wrought into shape:  So when I fashioned him in perfection and have breath into him of MY spirit, fall ye down in submission to him.' So the angels submitted, all of them together. But Iblis did not; he refused to be among those who submit."

"And the jinn HE created of the flame of Fire."

As for the creation I think he created his throne before everything, he said in the Quran

"And HE it is who created the heavens and the earth in six periods, - and HIS throne rest on water - that HE might try you which of you is best in conduct. And if you sayest, `You shall surely be raised after death,' those who disbelieve will certainly say, `This is naught but clear deception.'"

I am sure the Book of Enoch would have something regarding the above verse

As for the origins of the Universe it's is described in the Quran in the following verse

He is the Originator of the heavens and the earth.

This information given in the Qur’an is in full agreement with the findings of contemporary science. The conclusionthat astrophysics has reached today is that the entire universe, together with the dimensions of matter and time, came into existence as a result of a great explosion that occurred in no time. This event, known as “The Big Bang” produced the entire universe about 15 billion years ago, creating it from nothingness as the result of the explosion of a single point. Modern scientific circles are in agreement that the Big Bang is the only rational and provable explanation of the beginning of the universe and of how the universe came into being.

Before the Big Bang, there was no such thing as matter. From a condition of non-existence in which neither matter, nor energy, nor even time existed and which can only be defined metaphysically, matter, energy, and time were all created. This fact, only recently discovered by modern physics, was announced to us in the Qur’an 1,400 years ago.


The sensitive sensors on board the COBE space satellite which was launched by NASA in 1992, captured evidentiary remnants of the Big Bang. This discovery served as evidence for the Big Bang, which is the scientific explanation of the fact that the universe was created from nothing.

As for the Big Bang, I really would like you to read this, please read it

http://www.55a.net/firas/english/?page=show_det&id=78&select_page=3

As for the expansion of the Universe

In the Quran, which was revealed 14 centuries ago at a time when the science of astronomy was still primitive, the expansion of the universe was described like this:

And it is We who have constructed the heaven with might, and verily, it is We who are steadily expanding it.

The word “heaven”, as stated in this verse, is used in various places in the Qur’an with the meaning of space and universe. Here again, the word is used with this meaning. In other words, in the Quran, it is communicated that the universe “expands”.

And this is the very conclusion that science has reached today.

Until the dawn of the 20th century, the only view prevailing in the world of science was that “the universe has a constant nature and it has existed since infinite time”. The research, observations, and calculations carried out by means of modern technology, however, revealed that the universe in fact had a beginning and that it constantly expands.

At the beginning of the 20th century, the Russian physicist Alexander Friedmann and the Belgian cosmologist Georges Lemaitre theoretically calculated that the universe is in constant motion and that it is expanding.

From the moment of the big bang, the universe has been constantly expanding at a great speed. Scientists compare the expanding universe to the surface of a balloon that is inflated.

This fact was proved also by observational data in 1929. While observing the sky with a telescope, Edwin Hubble, the American astronomer, discovered that the stars and galaxies were constantly moving away from each other. A universe where everything constantly moves away from each other implied a constantly expanding universe. The observations carried out in the following years verified that the universe constantly expands. This fact was explained in the Quran when it was yet unknown by anyone. This is because the Quran is the word of God, the Creator, and the Ruler of the entire universe.

As for the greatest sin, I think here is the only difference between Quran and the Book Of Enoch, because in Quran Allah made it clear, that the greatest sin is associating another god with him, meaning worshiping another besides Allah!

The other thing is that God said he created humans to worship him isn't that mentioned in the Book of Enoch?

what does the Book of Enoch say about Abraham?

About the last prophet?

About Heaven and Hell?

BTW, why you think the Quran is mislead when there is not even 1 contradiction or mistake in that book?

About the creation of Adam? from what he was created, how and what happened exactly? Please I would really appreciate if you could answer my other question, I really thank you for all of your efforts, your cool  8)
« Last Edit: September 28, 2008, 08:01:35 PM by AbdulAziz »
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2008, 10:27:42 PM »

Punisher your really amazing because the more I read the more I realize that it's going according to the Quran  does it mean the book of Enoch wasn't changed as much as the Old Testament and the New Testament?

The Book Of Enoch you have never read according to your reply #5 at 05:08:22 PM, "so how do you make this
presupposition?" Does this stem from your up-bringing or your religion?


As for the creation I think he created his throne before everything, he said in the Quran

Can you find all the verses in the Koran that says that?


He is the Originator of the heavens and the earth.
This information given in the Qur’an is in full agreement with the findings of contemporary science.

Can you get all the verses in the Koran that talks about creation?


As for the greatest sin, I think here is the only difference between Quran and the Book Of Enoch, because in Quran Allah made it clear, that the greatest sin is associating another god with him, meaning worshiping another besides Allah!

The other thing is that God said he created humans to worship him isn't that mentioned in the Book of Enoch?

Don't worry so much about what the Koran says, if that which the Koran says is true its because it came from the Book Of Enoch, remember the One who writes the story first (you guessed it) He's the Author of that story.

Book 2 Chapter 34 God convicts the idolaters and sodomitic fornicators, and therefore brings down a deluge upon them.

[1]They have rejected MY commandments and MY yoke, worthless seed has come up, not fearing GOD, and they would not bow down to me, but have begun to bow down to vain gods, and denied MY unity, and have laden the whole earth with untruths, offences, abominable lecheries, namely one with another, and all manner of other unclean wickedness, which are disgusting to relate.


BTW, why you think the Quran is mislead when there is not even 1 contradiction or mistake in that book?

Well namely because you did not address my responses to you on my thread (LAWLESS) and became troubled that you could not retort with reasonable argument, and drew the attention away by starting this thread about the Book Of Enoch which you no doubt knew would interest me. So I have brought to you that last rebuttal on your thread. Now you are forced to address it, so I wait with calming patience for your answers.

LAWLESS BEGINS

My friend you like confusion, I don't. If we want to know about Jesus we must go to the source (Bible).
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Your blaming Jesus for a sin he didn't commit? suppose I lived with you 5 years back, I said: "Oh Punisher, Our God is One God" and after 20 years you wrote a book and said: "Oh Humans, AbdulAziz said There are 3 Gods, The Father, The Son and the Holy Ghost" can you say it's my fault? or it was my mistake or I am the devil because of a sin I didn't commit? MAN, at least give it some thoughts ^_^

You make no sense brother, confusion has gripped you, follow your own train of thought. You're saying Jesus didn't say the bad things in the Bible, nor the contradictions or what Islam perceives as a lie. How do you know? What if Jesus spoke nothing but the evil and the lies, and the good stuff was written in by the humans? Just like you, who would be so eager to do so. You either accept everything, or nothing of it is inspired, and you must go further back to the source until you find the original.


If Allah wasn't able to protect his Word (Bible), Allah was weak in that moment.
--------------------------------------------
That's because it was the responsibility of the people not the Almighty Allah! How many times I should repeat? I am ready to copy and paste all the time if you want to keep this going but I prefer if you stand and read carefully. If a God by any chance became a weak in any moment he doesn't deserve to be considered almighty god, but too bad my god Allah "THERE IS NOTHING LIKE HIM"

You're going to repeat it until you understand what you're saying. Your Allah did not know that the people would become irresponsible and not keep the word Holy. Only after many thousands of years did Allah understand this and decided to send the final prophet and protect that word (Koran).


Now, because it has been changed, nothing and anything that comes from that book (Bible) including the characters must be dismissed, and one must go further back to an older source for guidance not forwards.
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That's also wrong, going back to the example I gave earlier, suppose I gave you a book and in that book I said there is only god and I am his servent, then after so many years you changed this book and modified the word "His servent" to "His king" now the first part remain correct that there is only one god but the second part is wrong, does it mean there is nothing right in that book? that's why we Muslims believe that the Turah and the other books have some correct information while it has also the wrong so that's why we cannot depend on this book as a guidance.

It means that you must go further back to the source of this story, the one who write the story first is the Author of that story. Enoch is the author this story about GOD and Angels and Heaven and Satan and Adam and Noah and Judgment and Resurrection and all of it still intact and uncorrupted by the hands of humans.


So the all-knowing Allah did not know that men would corrupt scriptures until thousands of years later as the confirmation?
--------------------------------------------
No I never said this, but it's your explanation for what I said. Allah knows everything, he knows when we will all die and will be the day of judgment and all of our decisions...etc

If Allah knew that men would corrupt the Word (Jesus), why would Allah have let it happen? For we know Allah changed his mind latter on in 600 AD when he said I'll send Mohammed to write the Koran and I Allah will protect it now. Is it because Allah did not want the people who lived before Mohammed to know the ways of Allah? Or is the Koran contradicting itself?

[48.23] Such has been the course of Allah that has indeed run before, and you shall not find a change in Allah's course.

and you shall not find a change in Allah's course.
and you shall not find a change in Allah's course.


however the same way he created life and death to put us in trial to worship him the same he gave the book to people to test them and on the day of judgment he say: "Didn't I send you a book? didn't I ask you to protect it, didn't I sent Mohammed, Jesus, Noah....etc" why you ignored, changed their teachings...etc in Arabic we call this "Hojja" I don't know the exact English word but it's like a trial and prove.

1Enoch.89:[33]First came on the trial of the stars, which, being judged, and found guilty, went to the place of punishment.
They thrust them into a place, deep, and full of flaming fire, and full of pillars of fire. Then the seventy shepherds were judged, and being found guilty, were thrust into the flaming abyss.

Then the seventy shepherds were judged, and being found guilty, were thrust into the abyss.

These are the ones who falsified the old testament, and afterwards the last 12 shepherds, not 13, 12.

1Enoch.104:[7]Now will I point out a mystery: Many sinners shall turn and transgress against the word of uprightness. (Book Of Enoch) [8]They shall speak evil things; they shall utter falsehood; execute great undertakings; and compose books in their own words. (Bible-Koran) But when they shall write all My words correctly in their own languages, [9]They shall neither change or diminish them; but shall write them all correctly; all which from the first I have uttered concerning them.

No counterfeits, all the Books bearing the name of Enoch are governed by the Hand Of GOD. The Covenant (Book Of Enoch) consisting of 5 sections which by the way the Jews and the Muslims copied from for their Pentateuch and the five pillars of Islam (oldest Dead Sea Scrolls are Enoch‘s). Can you see it now? Its unbelievable!


Allah knew that Jesus would appear and he knew that Christians would follow him, why he would allow such a thing?
Allah gave you the ability to think, the power, the equipments to reach the truth then why you didn't try. That's why in Islam Allah would not punish the Insane

I agree that GOD gave the ability to think despite the forces of the Fallen angels (Satans) or as Islam calls them (Shaitans), but where you go wrong is that the "equipment" was only made available after 600 AD, so Allah can't Judge the people living before by saying I have given you the equipment (Koran).


they shall utter falsehood; execute great undertakings; and compose books in their own words. (Bible-Koran)
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No dear, there is nothing wrong in the Quran and no contradictions at all, your welcome to post all your "Supposed Contradiction" here in this topic http://theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=23513.0 but be sure that the words of Allah would suites you >>> " look again, and yet again, thy sight will only return unto thee confused and fatigued, having seen no incongruity."

I beg to differ, Islam says its the religion of Peace, Allah says otherwise. [21.80] And We taught him the making of coats of mail for you, that they might protect you in your wars; will you then be grateful? True GOD did not create us for wars, but to remain in unity with Him in peace. Surely Allah if he were GOD would be capable of this, and despite that there would come invaders for these would dealt harshly by Allah, for they oppose him.

[59.4] That is because they acted in opposition to Allah and His Apostle, and whoever acts in opposition to Allah, then surely Allah is severe in retributing (evil). [59.5] It is by Allah's command, and that He may abase the transgressors. These would be quickly addressed by Allah so that peace and tranquility among his people would be uninterrupted without so much as an arrow being launched, or in today's society, a bullet, fired.

[59.23] He is Allah, besides Whom there is no god; the King, the Holy, the Giver of peace, the Granter of security, Guardian over all, the Mighty, the Supreme, the Possessor of every greatness Glory be to Allah from what they set up (with Him).

the Giver of peace, the Granter of security
the Giver of peace, the Granter of security


The gospel of Jesus went forth by the sword like Islam to all nations, read your history...
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The thing is I know my history very well but at the same time I know the history of the major religions of the world including their scriptures :) the all got perished but only one truth would remain till the end of the world

That would be the Book Of Enoch, it was written during the first generation of men (Adam), and will remain unchanged like GOD and His promise, to, and up until the last generation of men.


Why do you call the man who made you "father" but the ONE who made ALL not?
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YOU ARE NOT SERIOUS ARE YOU!!!!!!? O_O

THE MOMENT YOU CAN COMPARE A GOD WITH ANYTHING ELSE He is not God. Because the attributes of God shouldn't be like any other, he cannot be compared with anything else if he got compared thats an insult, that's why Allah clearly states several times in the Quran that the people insulting him when they are saying he is having son or calling him father of the angels....etc

"Say `He is ALLAH, the One! ALLAH the Independent and Besought of all. HE begets not, nor, is HE begotten, And there is none like unto HIM."

I am very serious, and that you cannot call your CREATOR the "Father of all Creation" is astounding, and that even believing that the Most High would feel insulted that you cling to Him like a child does to a parent shows only that there is no love for Him, neither fear, of losing Him.


Your God Allah doesn't give you free-will
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That alone proves you didn't read the Quran, man you should read and try hard focusing while reading :) as for the verse you copied talking about the humans being bad, if he continued being bad he will rapidly be doing these things till his heart becomes black and he would never accept the right way like for example our dear friend "Athalus" :)

"Have WE not given him two eyes, And a tongue and two lips ? And WE have pointed out to him the two highways of good and evil."

There are many other verses proving that he gave us free will... Humans do have free will but it's going exactly as the Almighty God accepted. God gave humans the free will to chose the right or the bad path, he showed him the two ways, he guided humans what is write what is wrong. So now Humans can choose whatever they want and Allah because he is the Just he already gave humans what he chose. Allah already knows what every human will chose, everything about him, what he will be eating, drinking...etc and according to this knowledge before the creation of human who wrote it in the fate, according to the decisions of the human. If Allah didn't give the humans the free will he could have changed their decisions the one who created them can change their ways of life but no god wrote whatever they are choosing. For example if I did bad thing and things that angers my god, because of Allah being just he wrote what I would be doing in the future without changing it, the same thing if I did a good thing, Allah wrongs not anyone even so much as the weight of an atom. In conclusion Humans do have free will and its going according to what is written in fate thanks to Allah's knowledge and just.

The last paragraph you wrote are some nice words, you seem a to have close understanding of who GOD is, but this doesn't come from the Koran, this comes from within you, for the Koran contradicts itself and we both know GOD is consistent.

Allah gives no free-will, simply because Allah did not protect the word of Jesus so that the believers of Jesus would truly possess the Holy word and thus be able to choose between Good or Evil. But because the Word those people had was already contaminated (evil), those people had no choice according to your explanation as to why Allah allowed the bible to be contaminated, but not according to my explanation, for the Book Of Enoch was always and shall always be available so that choice (free-will) may exist.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2008, 10:39:31 PM by Punisher »

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2008, 11:11:57 PM »
LooooL c'mon man it's not that I am ignoring your other posts, believe me I will reply to what you posted in your respected topic but the problem is to reply I need to focus and spent time without doing anything else, but as you know I am always busy and when I am getting chance I log to msn, and have some other tasks it's not that I am ignoring but unlike some others when I reply I love to make my posts clear and I swear I have a reply to all of what you said but too lazy to write hahaha  ;D

I am sorry to post this again, but could you please list me all the reasons why you consider that Book of Enoch is the only book from Almighty God (Allah). I don't know for some reasons I was checking the Lawless Thread, the layout of the page had some errors so can you please list them all here. As for your last post here, I have already replied in your other topics. Regarding all the verses that talks about Creation it would consume lots of time.

I will be waiting 

Thanks
« Last Edit: October 31, 2008, 07:16:24 PM by AbdulAziz »
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2008, 07:18:33 PM »
Sorry to bump it up but instead of creating a new topic I decided to ask this here.

Can anyone describe the day of judgement in the Book of Enoch!

Who would be the judge?

Descriptions of the day of judgment in the Book Of Enoch?

What would be Enoch's role in that day?
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2008, 10:54:42 PM »
This is the most boring ass thread in history.
I hate myself for coming here

Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2008, 10:28:13 AM »
Sorry to bump it up but instead of creating a new topic I decided to ask this here.

Can anyone describe the day of judgement in the Book of Enoch!

Who would be the judge?

Descriptions of the day of judgment in the Book Of Enoch?

What would be Enoch's role in that day?

Daniel.7:[9]As I watched, Thrones were set up and the Ancient One took his throne. His clothing was snow bright, and the hair on his head as white as wool; His throne was flames of fire, with wheels of burning fire.-- [13]I was watching in the night visions, and behold, One like the Son Of Man, coming with the clouds of heaven! He came to the Ancient Of Days, and they brought Him near before Him. [14] Then to Him was given dominion and glory and a kingdom, That all peoples, nations, and languages should serve Him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion, Which shall not pass away, And His kingdom the one which shall not be destroyed.

1Enoch.89:[29]And I saw a throne erected in a delectable land; [30]Upon this sat the LORD of the Sheep, who received all the sealed books; [31]Which were open before him.-- [41]Then those three, who were clothed in white, and who, holding Me by My hand, had before caused Me to ascend, while the hand of Him who spoke held Me; raised me up, and placed Me in the midst of the sheep, before the judgment took place.

1Enoch.54:[5]O you kings, O you mighty, who inhabit the world you shall behold my Elect One, sitting upon the throne of my glory. And he shall judge Azazel, all his associates, and all his hosts, in the name of the LORD of Spirits.

1Enoch.89:[34]At that time likewise I perceived, that one abyss was thus opened in the midst of the earth, which was full of fire. [35]And to this were brought the blind sheep; which being judged, and found guilty, were all thrust into that abyss of fire on the earth, and burnt.

Enoch is the Son Of Man, our messiah, the savior and Great KING yesterday, today, tomorrow, and forever, Amen!


Read Chapter 89
http://reluctant-messenger.com/1enoch61-105.htm#Chapter89

Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #13 on: November 03, 2008, 02:56:26 PM »

1 [And it shall come to pass in those days that elect and holy children will descend from the 2 high heaven, and their seed will become one with the children of men. And in those days Enoch received books of zeal and wrath, and books of disquiet and expulsion.]

And mercy shall not be accorded to them, saith the Lord of Spirits.

3 And in those days a whirlwind carried me off from the earth,

And set me down at the end of the heavens.

4 And there I saw another vision, the dwelling-places of the holy,

And the resting-places of the righteous.

5 Here mine eyes saw their dwellings with His righteous angels,

And their resting-places with the holy.

And they petitioned and interceded and prayed for the children of men,

And righteousness flowed before them as water,

And mercy like dew upon the earth:

Thus it is amongst them for ever and ever.

6a And in that place mine eyes saw the Elect One of righteousness and of faith,

7a And I saw his dwelling-place under the wings of the Lord of Spirits.

6b And righteousness shall prevail in his days,

And the righteous and elect shall be without number before Him for ever and ever.

7b And all the righteous and elect before Him shall be strong as fiery lights,

And their mouth shall be full of blessing,

And their lips extol the name of the Lord of Spirits,

And righteousness before Him shall never fail,

[And uprightness shall never fail before Him.]

8 There I wished to dwell,

Enoch is the true and righteous witness and he is the elect one but he is not the one being mentioned here.

Dude at this point Enoch is seeing (vision) into the future of the elect meaning many people who live on earth and acquire habitations in Heaven, some translation put this verse as the Elect One but it still doesn't diminish the meaning of the verse because Enoch is seeing himself also in that future and doesn't recognize himself for he still hasn't ascended there and has not gone through the "transformation."

Here the Holy archangel Micheal confirms this very fact and truth.


1Enoch.70:[4]And Michael, one of the archangels, took me by my right hand, raised me up, and brought me out to where was every secret of mercy and secret of righteousness. 1Enoch.70:[17]Then that Angel came to me, and with his voice saluted me, saying, You are the Son Of Man, who art born for righteousness, and righteousness has rested upon You. [18]The righteousness of the Ancient of Days shall not forsake You. 



3 different translations, and all, if your soul is filled with truth paints a portrait to understanding.


[39]:[6] And in that place mine eyes saw the Elect One of righteousness and of faith,

[39]:[5] At that time my eyes beheld the dwelling of the elect, of truth, faith, and righteousness.   

[39]:[6] And in those days my eyes saw the place of the chosen of justice and of faith [fidelity],



Yes!

Its true, and now you know.

Its not Jesus. Its not Mohamed. Its not HORUS.


The savior is the blesseth holy Enoch the Great KING.


« Last Edit: November 03, 2008, 07:55:59 PM by Punisher »

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britishgent

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Re: Book of Enoch
« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2008, 10:55:14 AM »
hey punisher; are there any as yet unfulfilled prophecies in the book of enoch?
Global warming: Liberal hoax
The earth is not getting warmer after all; the effect is really just the prevalence of air conditioning. It just seems warmer when we go outside.