My reason(s) for the world being Round

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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« on: May 23, 2006, 08:41:07 AM »
The world is round because,

1. Flights from The west coast of the United States to the Orient are possible and fly in straight lines

Same with New York - London Flights

2. There's been expeditions to thei so-called, imaginary continent as far back as 1910.

3. There is no motive for the world to preform such a cover up,
Nor the resources to do so.
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Re: My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #1 on: May 23, 2006, 12:14:43 PM »
Quote from: "Scruffy"
1. Flights from The west coast of the United States to the Orient are possible and fly in straight lines

That's funny, I was under the impression that if you flew in a "striaght line" on a spheroid earth, you would fly tengentially off into outer space.

Surely this is not the case.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #2 on: May 23, 2006, 01:08:12 PM »
By Straight Line,

I mean around the curvature of the Earth.


To Fly from San Francisco to the Beijing on a Flat Earth,


Would require you to do a 180 degree turn and go the other side of the flat earth.
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #3 on: May 23, 2006, 01:41:03 PM »
Oh, well then I guess our definitions of "Straight line" are all relative.

On the flat earth you could fly due west in a "straight" line and get from California to China, no problem. Circumnavigation has never been an issue with flat earth, and probably never will be.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #4 on: May 23, 2006, 01:52:16 PM »
Allow me to please further explain myself.
Pardon my previous posts.


A country near the "ice wall", It is possible to fly from a location in that area to another country, on the other side of the "flat earth" without doing a 180.

You can just go straight the entirity of the trip without ever colliding with this wall or changing direction.



Pardon me not being specific.

Just nobody has ever said which countries are where on this flat earth.
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2006, 07:39:51 PM »
if you flew in straight line a flat earth you would go off into space

its called gravity
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EnragedPenguin

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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2006, 07:51:37 PM »
Quote from: "crunchybear"

its called gravity

 
What does that have to do with flying off into space?
A different world cannot be built by indifferent people.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2006, 08:50:53 PM »
Quote from: "Scruffy"
Just nobody has ever said which countries are where on this flat earth.

Look at the top of your browser page at the FES logo. It isn't high resolution, but you can clearly see where the major continents are located. The north pole is in the center.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2006, 08:36:45 PM »
I can't tell what continents are what, but my point is still valid.


and so far, unchallenged (intelligently at least)
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2006, 09:05:26 PM »
Quote from: "Scruffy"
A country near the "ice wall", It is possible to fly from a location in that area to another country, on the other side of the "flat earth" without doing a 180.

You can just go straight the entirity of the trip without ever colliding with this wall or changing direction.

Ok let's look at a specific example. Let's say you want to fly from Brazil to Australia. Here are the ways you could do that on the round earth:

1) You could fly due east. You would travel around to the opposite side of the earth, and land in Australia.

2) You could fly due west. You would travel around to the opposite side of the earth, and land in Australia.

3) You could fly due north until you reach the north pole, at which point you would have to fly south (because you can't get any more "north" than the north pole). Once you got to the north pole, you'd fly south in the direction of Australia, and you'd get there eventually.

4) You could fly due south until you reached the south pole. Since you can't go any further south, you'd have to start flying north. You'd fly north in the direction of Australia, and eventually you'd get there.

Now here's the kicker:
Every one of those scenarios is, with the exception of number 4, exactly the same for a flat earth. What about #4? Well, pilots don't do that, so I'm not worried about it. Then again they don't do #3 either, but that still works.

Here's what you're saying:
"Based on the assumption that the earth is a sphere, you could fly south from Brazil over antarctica and then north to Australia".

The problem is that this is based on the assumption that the Earth is spheroid, which obviously cannot be taken as given. The only things you can argue are, for example, what commercial planes do, or if I wanted to get picky, what you've done yourself. Commercial jets don't fly over antarctica. They might fly due east, due west, north then south, or anything else, and all of those scenarios fit perfectly with the idea of a flat earth.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2006, 09:20:48 PM »
Let me rephrase myself, Yet Again.


It Is possible to fly around the earth without adjusting your altitude, bearing or speed (if you had sufficient fuel)

I'm not a pilot but I have the basic idea. Don't take me to literally because you have to understand the basic concept I'm trying to get across.


Because this is true, The Earth is by nature round, and not flat.

A Flat Earth would require you to turn completely around when flying around the world, else it would result in your death. (I.e. Space, Ice Wall, Etc)
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2006, 02:28:01 PM »
Quote from: "Scruffy"
It Is possible to fly around the earth without adjusting your altitude, bearing or speed (if you had sufficient fuel)

I'm not a pilot but I have the basic idea. Don't take me to literally because you have to understand the basic concept I'm trying to get across.

Again you say "bearing", which is almost always refering to a compass.

But I understand what you're saying.

You're claiming that if you fly in a perfectly straight line - "straight as an arrow" - you would be able to fly all the way around the earth and end up back where you started.

The problem is that you're basing this claim on the assumption that the earth is a sphere. If the earth isn't a sphere, your claim is quite simply wrong. Since your claim is dependant on the earth being a sphere, you can't use it to prove that the earth is, in fact, a sphere. You'd have to verify your claim some other way - probably by actually doing it - and that's really not possible.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2006, 02:46:10 PM »
Quote from: "Scruffy"
It Is possible to fly around the earth without adjusting your altitude, bearing or speed (if you had sufficient fuel)


I'm nitpicking a bit here, but you'll have to further refine your statement, because it is still not true:  Even if fuel is not a problem, due to local wind direction and/or imperfections in the airplane, no airplane flies in a perfectly straight line.

It's like driving: you have to keep your hands on the steering wheel, even while driving on a perfectly straight section of the highway, because even if your wheels are perfectly balanced (which they rarely are), sooner or later small bumps in the road will send you off to one side or the other.  Also, a driver can use objects in the distance for directions since they are at least a few hours away and presumably stationary.

Airplane pilots have no such markers in the air (sun, moon, and the stars all move relatively fast when your travel time is counted in hours), nor can they rely on their plane to fly straight for hours without drifting.  They have to use a compass or ground signals (or the ground itself) to orient themselves.

Of course, if pilots do that, then the plane will simply fly in a circle around the North pole on a Flat Earth, but think that the plane has circumscribed the Earth.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2006, 12:44:49 AM »
Quote from: "flyingleaf"
Quote from: "Scruffy"
It Is possible to fly around the earth without adjusting your altitude, bearing or speed (if you had sufficient fuel)


I'm nitpicking a bit here, but you'll have to further refine your statement, because it is still not true:  Even if fuel is not a problem, due to local wind direction and/or imperfections in the airplane, no airplane flies in a perfectly straight line.

It's like driving: you have to keep your hands on the steering wheel, even while driving on a perfectly straight section of the highway, because even if your wheels are perfectly balanced (which they rarely are), sooner or later small bumps in the road will send you off to one side or the other.  Also, a driver can use objects in the distance for directions since they are at least a few hours away and presumably stationary.

Airplane pilots have no such markers in the air (sun, moon, and the stars all move relatively fast when your travel time is counted in hours), nor can they rely on their plane to fly straight for hours without drifting.  They have to use a compass or ground signals (or the ground itself) to orient themselves.

Of course, if pilots do that, then the plane will simply fly in a circle around the North pole on a Flat Earth, but think that the plane has circumscribed the Earth.


He doesn't need to refine it, you get it. Thing about it like this, if you draw the flat earth, and draw a straight line going say, left, it would go off the end of the earth.
And if you started on a RE equator going east, you could go east infinitly, as long as your hand doesn't get tired :)

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Chaltier

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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #14 on: May 26, 2006, 04:57:26 AM »
Quote from: "Conspiracy"
Thing about it like this, if you draw the flat earth, and draw a straight line going say, left, it would go off the end of the earth. And if you started on a RE equator going east, you could go east infinitly, as long as your hand doesn't get tired :)


Both of these are true, but entirely non-related. Let's not use "straight" lines on the FE model and cardinal directions on the RE.

If you go perfectly straight on the flat Earth, you will fly off the edge and into oblivion. If you go perfectly straight on the round Earth, you will fly off into space.

If you were to go due east on the round Earth, you could indeed continue to fly in that direction infinitely. If you were to go due east on the flat Earth, you could also continue to fly in that direction infinitely. (Both, of course, provided the means of propulsion are in infinite supply.)


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Demosthenes

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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #15 on: May 26, 2006, 05:33:52 AM »
There is a way to prove both of these, and I will start off with the FE version

Let's say your flying to Beijing from London, on the flat earth map you could draw a straight line to and back. This would make a 180 degrees turn a necessity, as you can't go over the ice wall to get back. This would all be possible. One thing is wrong with all of this though, the FE's acceleration. If you take off at a regular take off speed (I'm sorry I don't know all of my facts about airplanes), but as soon as you're in the air you are already (relative to the earth) decelerating. the only way you could actually fly on flat earth is to maintain a constant upward velocity of at least 9.9m/s. Landing would be difficult, but all you need to do is coast at a velocity of 9.75 in the direction to wherever you will land. Because air is obviously made up by the government, flight would be impossible anyways.

RE is much more simple. Because of gravity you are constanly being pulled downwards with a force of 9.8 newtons. You do not need to do much to fight the force of gravity (we can overcome it by simply jumping). After take off, your plane (if designed correctly) constantly pushes air downwards and upwards giving it stability. You can't really travel in a straight line on earth, but an arc.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2006, 07:53:44 AM »
I really don't want to be mean, but pretty much everything you said is wrong.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #17 on: May 26, 2006, 01:05:56 PM »
As for going left/east...



Just draw imaginary lines in circles on the FE design.

Therefore, you can fly 'around the world', in both FE and RE.

Fools.
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #18 on: May 26, 2006, 01:08:05 PM »
Quote from: "Unimportant"
Quote from: "Scruffy"
It Is possible to fly around the earth without adjusting your altitude, bearing or speed (if you had sufficient fuel)

I'm not a pilot but I have the basic idea. Don't take me to literally because you have to understand the basic concept I'm trying to get across.

Again you say "bearing", which is almost always refering to a compass.

But I understand what you're saying.

You're claiming that if you fly in a perfectly straight line - "straight as an arrow" - you would be able to fly all the way around the earth and end up back where you started.

The problem is that you're basing this claim on the assumption that the earth is a sphere. If the earth isn't a sphere, your claim is quite simply wrong. Since your claim is dependant on the earth being a sphere, you can't use it to prove that the earth is, in fact, a sphere. You'd have to verify your claim some other way - probably by actually doing it - and that's really not possible.


Bearing to my understanding can refer to the direction someone is heading.

The problem is,

You can circumnavigate the globe. It is possible.
It has been done.

Therefore I am correct, and the Earth is in fact not flat.
(Not necesarily a sphere, but definely some sort of shape similar to a Sphere)

Heading due east in any applicable form of transportation for a long enough time will put you back in the same general area (if you don't run into any land masses)

You don't need to do any crazy half-assed experiment which isn't applicable to finding the shape of this planet, or you can just agree to give up your simply baffling beliefs and go with logic.

Specifically based on the fact that people have/are/will go completely around the Earth.

So it's not flat.
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #19 on: May 26, 2006, 01:10:38 PM »
Mattz,

Read the first damn post which states the situation as flying in a straight line.


Thats the simplest way to put it.

Though the line is not Technically "straight"

Remaining at the same altitude and going in the same direction will result in your death in the FE model


and you curcumnavigation of the globe in the RE model
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #20 on: May 26, 2006, 01:18:18 PM »
Quote from: "Scruffy"
Remaining at the same altitude and going in the same direction will result in your death in the FE model

Incorrect. If you stay at the same altitude and keep going in the same cardinal direction on a flat earth, you will end up right back where you started.

Quote
You can circumnavigate the globe. It is possible.
It has been done.

This is an interesting factoid, but it is not proof of the earth's shape Since circumnavigation is just as feasable on a flat earth as a round one, it can't be evidence for either.

Quote
Heading due east in any applicable form of transportation for a long enough time will put you back in the same general area (if you don't run into any land masses)

Again, this is 100% true for both flat earth and round earth, and so cannot be evidence for either.

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Aerofriction

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #21 on: May 26, 2006, 01:20:24 PM »
Quote from: "Scruffy"
By Straight Line,

I mean around the curvature of the Earth.


To Fly from San Francisco to the Beijing on a Flat Earth,


Would require you to do a 180 degree turn and go the other side of the flat earth.

Gravity, my dear boy.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #22 on: May 26, 2006, 01:20:57 PM »
I didn't even mention "cardinal directions" or compasses in that last post


Your points are void.


I said if you keep going in the same direction.
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #23 on: May 26, 2006, 01:21:15 PM »
Gravity is quite irrelevent to this discussion.

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Aerofriction

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #24 on: May 26, 2006, 01:22:28 PM »
Quote from: "Unimportant"
Gravity is quite irrelevent to this discussion.

Bull Crap. You wouldnt go into space because of gravity. If you didnt go into space you could go in a straight line.

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #25 on: May 26, 2006, 01:23:30 PM »
I think that was jab at the fact that this thread has gone to hell due to various dolts and the inability to communicate every single MOTHERFUCKING parameter neccesary to give everyone the same damn picture in their head
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #26 on: May 26, 2006, 01:24:12 PM »
The reasons for you following the curvature of the earth aren't important, only the fact that you are, indeed, following the curvature of the earth and so your path is not "straight".

Never at any point did I ask WHY you don't fly off into outer space, I simply stated that you do not, and so your path does not adhere to the "true and obvious" definition of "straight".

My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #27 on: May 26, 2006, 01:29:19 PM »
Quote from: "Scruffy"
Mattz,

Read the first damn post which states the situation as flying in a straight line.


Thats the simplest way to put it.

Though the line is not Technically "straight"

Remaining at the same altitude and going in the same direction will result in your death in the FE model


and you curcumnavigation of the globe in the RE model


A 'straight' line in a RE world, for one example, would be East.

Thus, if you fly east, continuously...

Where do you get? Back to where you started.

And what have you done along the way? Gone around the world.


A 'straight' line in a FE world, for one example...is also East.

Thus, if you fly east, continuously...

Where do you get? Back to where you started.

And what have you done along the way? Gone around the world.



It's a simple diagram.

I fail to see how your lack of spatial reasoning makes me wrong.

And seriously, stop swearing. Saying 'fuck' every sentence doesn't make you cool, nor does it help prove anything. I could just go about saying you're all fucking retards because you can't accept other views and fully research them before making really fucking unfounded opinions that suck ass.

But I don't do that because I'm not a jackass.
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #28 on: May 26, 2006, 01:35:20 PM »
Quote from: "mattz1010"
Quote from: "Scruffy"
Mattz,

A 'straight' line in a FE world, for one example...is also East.

Thus, if you fly east, continuously...

Where do you get? Back to where you started.

And what have you done along the way? Gone around the world.



It's a simple diagram.

I fail to see how your lack of spatial reasoning makes me wrong.

And seriously, stop swearing. Saying 'fuck' every sentence doesn't make you cool, nor does it help prove anything. I could just go about saying you're all fucking retards because you can't accept other views and fully research them before making really fucking unfounded opinions that suck ass.

But I don't do that because I'm not a jackass.



This doesn't change the fact youre a moron.

Not adhering to cardinal direction,

Flying in a straight line in the flat earth model would put you at the edge of the Earth.

"Straight Lines" as I'm referring to them,
Aren't cardinal direction (as in on a compass)

They are Straight Lines.
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My reason(s) for the world being Round
« Reply #29 on: May 26, 2006, 01:40:50 PM »
*sigh* Once again, you fail at spatial reasoning/logic.

I'll put it this way.

Take the picture I posted, and imagine taking scissors and cutting the FE model ANYWHERE from North to South.

Now, 'unravel' the picture, and you'll see that W, E, N and S are always pointing the same direction, on all  4 times they're listed.

Now, move in a straight line (for example due left)...where do you go? Off the earth? No.

I can draw a picture if you're this stupid not to understand what I'm saying.
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