So much for the separation of church and state.

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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #60 on: September 16, 2008, 09:27:28 PM »
What about people that switch, and then back again sometimes?  Is that not choosing?

Or bisexuals isn't that not choosing one way or the other?

What about men who just aren't attracted to women, or women who just aren't attracted to men?

What about them?  And that has nothing to do with my question.

So you were just trying to derail the thread by changing the subject?

I'm asking, if men are attracted to other men but not to women, how can you possibly consider it a choice?
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?

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WardoggKC130FE

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #61 on: September 16, 2008, 09:34:02 PM »
What about people that switch, and then back again sometimes?  Is that not choosing?

Or bisexuals isn't that not choosing one way or the other?

What about men who just aren't attracted to women, or women who just aren't attracted to men?

What about them?  And that has nothing to do with my question.

So you were just trying to derail the thread by changing the subject?

I'm asking, if men are attracted to other men but not to women, how can you possibly consider it a choice?

I was not derailing the thread I was just furthering the current discussion.

Because they choose to go against the norm and be attracted to the SAME sex instead of the OPPOSITE sex.  If same sex was supposed to be the norm we would have "evolved" into a unisex species and found other ways to procreate.

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Raist

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #62 on: September 16, 2008, 09:36:52 PM »
What about people that switch, and then back again sometimes?  Is that not choosing?

Or bisexuals isn't that not choosing one way or the other?

What about men who just aren't attracted to women, or women who just aren't attracted to men?

What about them?  And that has nothing to do with my question.

So you were just trying to derail the thread by changing the subject?

I'm asking, if men are attracted to other men but not to women, how can you possibly consider it a choice?

I was not derailing the thread I was just furthering the current discussion.

Because they choose to go against the norm and be attracted to the SAME sex instead of the OPPOSITE sex.  If same sex was supposed to be the norm we would have "evolved" into a unisex species and found other ways to procreate.
Actually, we would have died out, 1 generation isn't enough to evolve a new sexual system.

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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #63 on: September 16, 2008, 09:39:24 PM »
What about people that switch, and then back again sometimes?  Is that not choosing?

Or bisexuals isn't that not choosing one way or the other?

What about men who just aren't attracted to women, or women who just aren't attracted to men?

What about them?  And that has nothing to do with my question.

So you were just trying to derail the thread by changing the subject?

I'm asking, if men are attracted to other men but not to women, how can you possibly consider it a choice?

I was not derailing the thread I was just furthering the current discussion.

Because they choose to go against the norm and be attracted to the SAME sex instead of the OPPOSITE sex.  If same sex was supposed to be the norm we would have "evolved" into a unisex species and found other ways to procreate.

So some homosexuals repress their tendencies to the point where they become suicidal because--?

Obviously it's not the norm, but that doesn't mean it's not natural.  Just because it's an aberration doesn't mean there's any choice involved.
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?

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beast

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #64 on: September 16, 2008, 09:39:44 PM »
Because they choose to go against the norm and be attracted to the SAME sex instead of the OPPOSITE sex.  If same sex was supposed to be the norm we would have "evolved" into a unisex species and found other ways to procreate.

Evolution doesn't work like that.

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Robbyj

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #65 on: September 16, 2008, 09:39:52 PM »
Regardless of the reason, should we change every institution to fit society in every way, like making college curriculems easier so mentally retarded people can graduate?
So gay people getting married, is the same as allowing a retard to build your house?

Strawman
Your statement was a strawman. Mine simplified yours. It did not reduce it at all.

I wasn't comparing gay to retard, I was asking if structured institutions should be changed to be all inclusive for every lifestyle choice, genetic trait, etc that comes along.
Why justify an illegitimate attack with a legitimate response?

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Raist

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #66 on: September 16, 2008, 09:41:59 PM »
Regardless of the reason, should we change every institution to fit society in every way, like making college curriculems easier so mentally retarded people can graduate?
So gay people getting married, is the same as allowing a retard to build your house?

Strawman
Your statement was a strawman. Mine simplified yours. It did not reduce it at all.

I wasn't comparing gay to retard, I was asking if structured institutions should be changed to be all inclusive for every lifestyle choice, genetic trait, etc that comes along.
A college isn't an institution in the same way a marriage is. A college is a learning facility. A marriage is two people pledging themselves to each other. So a retard going to a college sounds impossible because he has a mental deficiency. Do gays have a deficiency in commitment? Or love?

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Parsifal

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #67 on: September 16, 2008, 09:42:32 PM »
I wasn't comparing gay to retard, I was asking if structured institutions should be changed to be all inclusive for every lifestyle choice, genetic trait, etc that comes along.

Homosexuality is a private decision that only impacts the individual who makes it. Intellectual ability, when applied to opportunities in the workforce, has enormous potential to affect the clients of whatever service is being provided. That is what makes the difference, in my opinion.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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Robbyj

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #68 on: September 16, 2008, 09:48:47 PM »
Do gays have a deficiency in commitment? Or love?

Absolutely not, but marriage was set up by society to protect the family unit, a family unit being a man, a woman, and their children.  I guess, under the pretenses of the definition of marriage, I don't fully understand why homosexuals would want to get married in the first place.
Why justify an illegitimate attack with a legitimate response?

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WardoggKC130FE

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #69 on: September 16, 2008, 09:51:22 PM »
So some homosexuals repress their tendencies to the point where they become suicidal because--?

Obviously it's not the norm, but that doesn't mean it's not natural.  Just because it's an aberration doesn't mean there's any choice involved.

Honestly I have no idea why anyone commits suicide.(slight strawman)  I also have no pity for them either.  Shit ain't that bad.

So you say its not the norm, and it's an aberration but it's ok for the courts to sanction the marriage.  Why don't we start letting brothers and sisters get married then?(possible strawman)

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Parsifal

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #70 on: September 16, 2008, 09:52:29 PM »
Why don't we start letting brothers and sisters get married then?

I don't have a problem with that, actually, as long as they're consenting adults. I would have a problem with them procreating, however, since that could negatively impact the child.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #71 on: September 16, 2008, 09:55:34 PM »
So some homosexuals repress their tendencies to the point where they become suicidal because--?

Obviously it's not the norm, but that doesn't mean it's not natural.  Just because it's an aberration doesn't mean there's any choice involved.

Honestly I have no idea why anyone commits suicide.(slight strawman)  I also have no pity for them either.  Shit ain't that bad.

I agree.  That doesn't change the fact that it happens.  It makes no logical sense that someone would intentionally make the choice to be something that depresses them.

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So you say its not the norm, and it's an aberration but it's ok for the courts to sanction the marriage.

I never did say that.  Total straw man.
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?

Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #72 on: September 16, 2008, 09:56:31 PM »
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that could negatively impact the child.
How can you harm something that doesn't exist?

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Parsifal

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #73 on: September 16, 2008, 09:58:18 PM »
How can you harm something that doesn't exist?

In certain states of existence, nonexistence is preferable. Therefore, bringing something from nonexistence into such a state of existence would impact it negatively.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #74 on: September 16, 2008, 09:59:15 PM »
I guess, under the pretenses of the definition of marriage, I don't fully understand why homosexuals would want to get married in the first place.
I agree with you, but the point is, gays do want to get married.

Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #75 on: September 16, 2008, 10:00:13 PM »
You want to make a conditionality of a chance illegal?

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Parsifal

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #76 on: September 16, 2008, 10:02:29 PM »
You want to make a conditionality of a chance illegal?

Assuming this is directed at me, yes, when the probability of damaging the offspring is increased beyond what is natural. For this reason, I also think that people with serious genetic disorders should not be permitted to reproduce.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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Robbyj

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #77 on: September 16, 2008, 10:02:32 PM »
I guess, under the pretenses of the definition of marriage, I don't fully understand why homosexuals would want to get married in the first place.
I agree with you, but the point is, gays do want to get married.

Along the same lines, why can't civil unions be the answer?  It would allow the same benefits without violating the sanctity of marriage.  Why marriage specifically?  I can only think of a few reasons.
Why justify an illegitimate attack with a legitimate response?

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Parsifal

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #78 on: September 16, 2008, 10:03:44 PM »
Along the same lines, why can't civil unions be the answer?  It would allow the same benefits without violating the sanctity of marriage.  Why marriage specifically?  I can only think of a few reasons.

Because if people want to get married, the State should not be able to stand in their way.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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WardoggKC130FE

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #79 on: September 16, 2008, 10:06:03 PM »

So some homosexuals repress their tendencies to the point where they become suicidal because--?
Obviously it's not the norm, but that doesn't mean it's not natural.  Just because it's an aberration doesn't mean there's any choice involved.
Quote
So you say its not the norm, and it's an aberration but it's ok for the courts to sanction the marriage.

I never did say that.  Total straw man.


You totally did say that.

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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #80 on: September 16, 2008, 10:09:36 PM »
I guess, under the pretenses of the definition of marriage, I don't fully understand why homosexuals would want to get married in the first place.
I agree with you, but the point is, gays do want to get married.

Honestly, I don't understand why some heterosexuals have a problem with it.  Atheists get married, so it's not a religious institution; it's pure homophobia, and by that I don't even mean hatred of homosexuals as the term is normally used, but real fear about the fact that homosexuality is becoming more and more accepted.  If it's legal to be homosexual, what legitimate problem could you possibly have with allowing homosexuals to marry?

It's kind of silly, in my opinion.  That's Christianity for ya.  ::)


Quote
So you say its not the norm, and it's an aberration but it's ok for the courts to sanction the marriage.

I never did say that.  Total straw man.


You totally did say that.

Please point out where (before this post) I said that it's okay for the courts to sanction the marriage.
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?

Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #81 on: September 16, 2008, 10:11:26 PM »
Assuming this is directed at me, yes, when the probability of damaging the offspring is increased beyond what is natural.
There are thousands of things that could increase probability of damage.

For this reason, I also think that people with serious genetic disorders should not be permitted to reproduce.
And what ethnic group has more genetic disorder then any other? I think Osama knows the answer.

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WardoggKC130FE

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #82 on: September 16, 2008, 10:12:41 PM »


Quote
So you say its not the norm, and it's an aberration but it's ok for the courts to sanction the marriage.

I never did say that.  Total straw man.


You totally did say that.

Please point out where (before this post) I said that it's okay for the courts to sanction the marriage.

Ahh yes.  You are correct you never said that.  I thought you were referring to the bolded parts of the post.



And on another note.  What about interspecies erotica?  Choice or no?  Can a man and his donkey get married?



« Last Edit: September 16, 2008, 10:14:52 PM by WardoggKC130FE »

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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #83 on: September 16, 2008, 10:13:49 PM »
And on another note.  What about interspecies erotica?  Choice or no?  Can a man and his donkey get married?

If the man and the donkey really love each other, and their relationship is consensual, sure, why not?  ::)
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?

Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #84 on: September 16, 2008, 10:14:18 PM »
It's kind of silly, in my opinion.  That's Christianity for ya.  ::)
Projecting the actions of a few onto an entire group, that's bigotry for ya.

Quote
Because if people want to get married, the State should not be able to stand in their way.
Children.

Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #85 on: September 16, 2008, 10:15:07 PM »
I guess, under the pretenses of the definition of marriage, I don't fully understand why homosexuals would want to get married in the first place.
I agree with you, but the point is, gays do want to get married.

Along the same lines, why can't civil unions be the answer?  It would allow the same benefits without violating the sanctity of marriage.  Why marriage specifically?  I can only think of a few reasons.
I personally wouldn't care, but many homosexuals are quite insistent on it being marriage. Given that the church handed the keys of that institution over to the government a long time ago, the protesters don't really have a leg to stand on in a secular state. It is rather pedantic since civil unions provide the exact same rights, but it's the symbolism I guess is what's important.

And on another note.  What about interspecies erotica?  Choice or no?  Can a man and his donkey get married?
Have you conceded the homosexual issue at least? ::)

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Parsifal

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #86 on: September 16, 2008, 10:15:16 PM »
There are thousands of things that could increase probability of damage.

Of course there are.


And what ethnic group has more genetic disorder then any other? I think Osama knows the answer.

I don't, actually. I don't think it's relevant, either.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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Parsifal

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #87 on: September 16, 2008, 10:15:54 PM »
Quote
Because if people want to get married, the State should not be able to stand in their way.
Children.

 ???
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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WardoggKC130FE

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Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #88 on: September 16, 2008, 10:16:10 PM »
And on another note.  What about interspecies erotica?  Choice or no?  Can a man and his donkey get married?

If the man and the donkey really love each other, and their relationship is consensual, sure, why not?  ::)

Ok but is it a choice?

Re: So much for the separation of church and state.
« Reply #89 on: September 16, 2008, 10:17:54 PM »
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I don't, actually.
Jews.

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???
So if i can convince an eight year old to marry me it should be legal?