Acceleration causes gravitational effect?

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Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« on: August 16, 2008, 03:01:54 PM »
Lets see if I got this right. I bet I dont.. :)

The earth is accelerated. This means its moving. Because it has been accelerating with around 9.8 meters per second for a very long time it means it now moves really fast. It cant move faster than light. So it moves almost as fast as light. Moving mass affects spacetime and warps it. So earth warps spacetime. A lot.

Does this mean that we on earth experience; Both the acceleration, AND the massive gravitational effect from the warped spacetime? What is the total effect?
« Last Edit: August 16, 2008, 03:05:28 PM by Josef »
Ooompa ooompa

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #1 on: August 16, 2008, 03:05:21 PM »
gravitation is acceleration.
Imagine rolling a ball down a hill that gets steeper and steeper
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #2 on: August 16, 2008, 03:12:36 PM »
gravitation is acceleration.
Imagine rolling a ball down a hill that gets steeper and steeper

What does that change? The ball would eventually go near lightspeed..
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WardoggKC130FE

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #3 on: August 16, 2008, 03:15:04 PM »
Whats wrong with a ball going lightspeed?  You have something against balls?

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2008, 03:17:32 PM »
Whats wrong with a ball going lightspeed?  You have something against balls?

:)
Ooompa ooompa

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2008, 03:48:56 PM »
Whats wrong with a ball going light speed?  You have something against balls?

errr... because an object cannot hit light speed

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2008, 04:01:16 PM »
It would go near lightspeed alright but as it got closer and closer to lightspeed its mass would increase so it would need more and more energy to continue to accelerate
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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sokarul

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2008, 04:31:49 PM »
gravitation is acceleration.
Imagine rolling a ball down a hill that gets steeper and steeper
Sorry, gravitation is not acceleration.  That argument was owned. 

Also, people are starting to not like this statment.
It would go near lightspeed alright but as it got closer and closer to lightspeed its mass would increase so it would need more and more energy to continue to accelerate
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It's no slur if it's fact.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2008, 04:35:20 PM »
gravitation is acceleration.
Imagine rolling a ball down a hill that gets steeper and steeper
Sorry, gravitation is not acceleration.  That argument was owned. 

Also, people are starting to not like this statment.
It would go near lightspeed alright but as it got closer and closer to lightspeed its mass would increase so it would need more and more energy to continue to accelerate

Just because they do not like it does not make it any less true. And gravitation is acceleration, but acceleration is not gravitation
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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sokarul

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2008, 04:39:23 PM »
gravitation is acceleration.
Imagine rolling a ball down a hill that gets steeper and steeper
Sorry, gravitation is not acceleration.  That argument was owned. 

Also, people are starting to not like this statment.
It would go near lightspeed alright but as it got closer and closer to lightspeed its mass would increase so it would need more and more energy to continue to accelerate

Just because they do not like it does not make it any less true. And gravitation is acceleration, but acceleration is not gravitation
here

E=gmc^2
g=gamma

I can rearrange the equation to

E=mgc^2
now as velocity increases, the speed of light squared increases, mass stays the same. 

Seriously, gravitation is not acceleration.  Gravitation causes objects to accelerate. 
ANNIHILATOR OF  SHIFTER

It's no slur if it's fact.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2008, 04:49:18 PM »
gravitation is acceleration.
Imagine rolling a ball down a hill that gets steeper and steeper
Sorry, gravitation is not acceleration.  That argument was owned. 

Also, people are starting to not like this statment.
It would go near lightspeed alright but as it got closer and closer to lightspeed its mass would increase so it would need more and more energy to continue to accelerate

Just because they do not like it does not make it any less true. And gravitation is acceleration, but acceleration is not gravitation
here

E=gmc^2
g=gamma

I can rearrange the equation to

E=mgc^2
now as velocity increases, the speed of light squared increases, mass stays the same. 

Seriously, gravitation is not acceleration.  Gravitation causes objects to accelerate. 
Mass does indeed increase: m= m0/[sqrt(1-v2/c2)]=(lambda)m0
Where m0 is the rest mass

the only equation that I can think of off the top of my head that would use gamma is the formula for calculating the Kinetic energy of an object, but the reason that the mass does not change in that equation is because you only use the rest mass in it

And to keep it simple gravitation is acceleration if people want to nitpick that is up to them but I will stick with what is simple to think about
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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sokarul

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2008, 05:02:23 PM »
gravitation is acceleration.
Imagine rolling a ball down a hill that gets steeper and steeper
Sorry, gravitation is not acceleration.  That argument was owned. 

Also, people are starting to not like this statment.
It would go near lightspeed alright but as it got closer and closer to lightspeed its mass would increase so it would need more and more energy to continue to accelerate

Just because they do not like it does not make it any less true. And gravitation is acceleration, but acceleration is not gravitation
here

E=gmc^2
g=gamma

I can rearrange the equation to

E=mgc^2
now as velocity increases, the speed of light squared increases, mass stays the same. 

Seriously, gravitation is not acceleration.  Gravitation causes objects to accelerate. 
Mass does indeed increase: m= m0/[sqrt(1-v2/c2)]=(lambda)m0
Where m0 is the rest mass

the only equation that I can think of off the top of my head that would use gamma is the formula for calculating the Kinetic energy of an object, but the reason that the mass does not change in that equation is because you only use the rest mass in it

And to keep it simple gravitation is acceleration if people want to nitpick that is up to them but I will stick with what is simple to think about
The equation you quoted is from E=gammamc^2.  Some people use M to equal gamma*m. 
gamma= 1/sqr(1-(v^2/C^2) which is what you posted.
ANNIHILATOR OF  SHIFTER

It's no slur if it's fact.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2008, 05:06:34 PM »
not what I posted but you are getting closer to calculating the KE of an object, just add in the rest mass multiplied by c2 before you divide and you are most of the way there
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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sokarul

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2008, 05:20:43 PM »
not what I posted but you are getting closer to calculating the KE of an object, just add in the rest mass multiplied by c2 before you divide and you are most of the way there
KE is not total energy.  KE=1/2mv^2.   No rest mass involved. 

What you stated is what I said it was, relativistic mass. 
« Last Edit: August 16, 2008, 05:23:30 PM by sokarul »
ANNIHILATOR OF  SHIFTER

It's no slur if it's fact.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2008, 05:41:44 PM »
not what I posted but you are getting closer to calculating the KE of an object, just add in the rest mass multiplied by c2 before you divide and you are most of the way there
KE is not total energy.  KE=1/2mv^2.   No rest mass involved. 

What you stated is what I said it was, relativistic mass. 
So you are out to prove that an objects rest mass stays the same? why go to the trouble
And check your substitutions there

You should end up with E=gc2
Which says the same thing, mass increases. You are just now using the relativistic mass term instead of the rest mass where is the confusion?
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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sokarul

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #15 on: August 16, 2008, 06:48:11 PM »
not what I posted but you are getting closer to calculating the KE of an object, just add in the rest mass multiplied by c2 before you divide and you are most of the way there
KE is not total energy.  KE=1/2mv^2.   No rest mass involved. 

What you stated is what I said it was, relativistic mass. 
So you are out to prove that an objects rest mass stays the same? why go to the trouble
And check your substitutions there

You should end up with E=gc2
Which says the same thing, mass increases. You are just now using the relativistic mass term instead of the rest mass where is the confusion?

What????????

E=gammamc^2 is the equation.  For low speeds, gamma is 1.  1*2=2*1 so I can rearrange it to E=mgc^2 if I wanted.  E=gc^2 isn't an equation. 

ANNIHILATOR OF  SHIFTER

It's no slur if it's fact.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #16 on: August 16, 2008, 07:11:08 PM »
not what I posted but you are getting closer to calculating the KE of an object, just add in the rest mass multiplied by c2 before you divide and you are most of the way there
KE is not total energy.  KE=1/2mv^2.   No rest mass involved. 

What you stated is what I said it was, relativistic mass. 
So you are out to prove that an objects rest mass stays the same? why go to the trouble
And check your substitutions there

You should end up with E=gc2
Which says the same thing, mass increases. You are just now using the relativistic mass term instead of the rest mass where is the confusion?

What????????

E=gammamc^2 is the equation.  For low speeds, gamma is 1.  1*2=2*1 so I can rearrange it to E=mgc^2 if I wanted.  E=gc^2 isn't an equation. 


How do you just add terms to one side of the equation and not to the other side?
« Last Edit: August 16, 2008, 08:17:28 PM by cbarnett97 »
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2008, 08:02:35 PM »
man the earth is round. stfu

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Dark Knight

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #18 on: August 16, 2008, 11:26:19 PM »
Ok, simple question,  Gravitation is caused by our constante Acceleration, and I read in another foram that air resistance and contact with the earth hold us in place.  Then wouldn't it be really really windy?  Or since we have a dome over us holding the air in then, if I were to let a balloon float, wouldn't it come crashing down since the earth accelerated into it?  How come we don't fly into the moon?  How did the Jap's in world war 2 use the jetstream to float high altitude balloons to fly east to drop bombs onto the US.  Was the 12 year old that sailed around the world in on this conspiricy?  Is the entire universe accelerating in the same direction and at the same speed?  What is behind us as we Fly in the direction we are going.  And my 8 year old wants to know if you have any pictures of the 150 foot Ice walls that are around the entire world and how deep do these sheets of Ice go.  Wouldn't currents cause some ice to jam up on the sides?
He who goes to bed with itchy but, wakes up with stinky finger.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #19 on: August 17, 2008, 03:39:14 AM »
It would go near lightspeed alright but as it got closer and closer to lightspeed its mass would increase so it would need more and more energy to continue to accelerate

That is my concern. Wouldn't the earths warp of timespace by now be pretty intense?
Ooompa ooompa

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Parsifal

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #20 on: August 17, 2008, 04:16:34 AM »
The idiocy in this thread is overwhelming. I think we just overtook Myspace as the dumbest place on the World Wide Web.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #21 on: August 17, 2008, 04:43:02 AM »
The idiocy in this thread is overwhelming. I think we just overtook Myspace as the dumbest place on the World Wide Web.

Wow a true statement from a FE'er..
a FE website being the dumbest place on the net...you and I do agree there Robosteve

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #22 on: August 17, 2008, 05:52:00 AM »
The idiocy in this thread is overwhelming. I think we just overtook Myspace as the dumbest place on the World Wide Web.

So why are you here?
Ooompa ooompa

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Trekky0623

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #23 on: August 17, 2008, 06:00:38 AM »
Ok, simple question,  Gravitation is caused by our constante Acceleration, and I read in another foram that air resistance and contact with the earth hold us in place.  Then wouldn't it be really really windy?  Or since we have a dome over us holding the air in then, if I were to let a balloon float, wouldn't it come crashing down since the earth accelerated into it?  How come we don't fly into the moon?  How did the Jap's in world war 2 use the jetstream to float high altitude balloons to fly east to drop bombs onto the US.  Was the 12 year old that sailed around the world in on this conspiricy?  Is the entire universe accelerating in the same direction and at the same speed?  What is behind us as we Fly in the direction we are going.  And my 8 year old wants to know if you have any pictures of the 150 foot Ice walls that are around the entire world and how deep do these sheets of Ice go.  Wouldn't currents cause some ice to jam up on the sides?

WTF?  No.

Earth accelerates and pushes everything up, including air.  FUCK.  Come on, it's not that hard.  When you're in a car, is the air inside the car windy?  NO.  As for the balloon, balloons float because of bouyancy.  The balloon will float in air and accelerate though the air upwards.  Read up on the Equivalence Principle.  Acceleration and Gravitation are indistinguishable.

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sokarul

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #24 on: August 17, 2008, 08:42:06 AM »
not what I posted but you are getting closer to calculating the KE of an object, just add in the rest mass multiplied by c2 before you divide and you are most of the way there
KE is not total energy.  KE=1/2mv^2.   No rest mass involved. 

What you stated is what I said it was, relativistic mass. 
So you are out to prove that an objects rest mass stays the same? why go to the trouble
And check your substitutions there

You should end up with E=gc2
Which says the same thing, mass increases. You are just now using the relativistic mass term instead of the rest mass where is the confusion?

What????????

E=gammamc^2 is the equation.  For low speeds, gamma is 1.  1*2=2*1 so I can rearrange it to E=mgc^2 if I wanted.  E=gc^2 isn't an equation. 


How do you just add terms to one side of the equation and not to the other side?

I never added terms. 
ANNIHILATOR OF  SHIFTER

It's no slur if it's fact.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #25 on: August 17, 2008, 09:07:55 AM »
How about the massive warp? Why aren't we turning into a black hole?
Ooompa ooompa

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Jack

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #26 on: August 17, 2008, 09:18:11 AM »
Why aren't we turning into a black hole?
Because our mass isn't large enough.

Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #27 on: August 17, 2008, 09:48:34 AM »
Why aren't we turning into a black hole?
Because our mass isn't large enough.

So, we aren't moving at near lightspeed?
Ooompa ooompa

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Jack

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #28 on: August 17, 2008, 09:58:26 AM »
Yes, we are.

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WardoggKC130FE

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Re: Acceleration causes gravitational effect?
« Reply #29 on: August 17, 2008, 09:58:52 AM »