Looking for an intelligent argument. (Terminal Velocity)

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #630 on: August 29, 2008, 12:11:57 PM »
Uh, no I am not.  In fact:
The t subscript indicates terminal velocity
so you just added the term into the equation and then removed a known quantity?
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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TheEngineer

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #631 on: August 29, 2008, 12:13:40 PM »
No, the terminal velocity is not known nor did it replace a known.


BTW, I am serious about the inquiry into what grade you are in.  I think your limited view of physics is what is causing you to fail.


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #632 on: August 29, 2008, 12:17:37 PM »
No, the terminal velocity is not known nor did it replace a known.


BTW, I am serious about the inquiry into what grade you are in.  I think your limited view of physics is what is causing you to fail.
there is no termnal velocity in the FE model, there is only a terminal acceleration, maybe you should go back and really look at the model you are defending. And if you are truly understanding your model then your knowledge of physics are laughable, but then again we are in a realm where you can not look this stuff up on Wiki so I understand if it is difficult for you to understand.
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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TheEngineer

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #633 on: August 29, 2008, 12:19:08 PM »
Do you not understand what terminal velocity is?


What grade are you in, again?


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #634 on: August 29, 2008, 12:39:36 PM »
Do you not understand what terminal velocity is?


What grade are you in, again?
do you not understand the model you are defending? you read english right? I am sure it can be translated to another if you are having difficulty
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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divito the truthist

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #635 on: August 29, 2008, 01:28:58 PM »
It seems cbarnett is trying to swap terminal velocity for his own "terminal acceleration." Even though they are the same thing...
Our existentialist, relativist, nihilist, determinist, fascist, eugenicist moderator hath returned.
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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #636 on: August 29, 2008, 01:32:14 PM »
It seems cbarnett is trying to swap terminal velocity for his own "terminal acceleration." Even though they are the same thing...
they are not the same thing the models dictate different outcomes theengineer is just trying as hard as he can to make the FE model fit reality
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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TheEngineer

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #637 on: August 29, 2008, 05:31:04 PM »
They will show the same outcome, as I have already mathematically proven.  You have yet to break my equations. 


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #638 on: August 29, 2008, 06:10:12 PM »
They will show the same outcome, as I have already mathematically proven.  You have yet to break my equations. 
You are wrong because you assert that the velocity of the object will reach a point where it no longer increases and the FE model says that is not possible, the RE model on the other hand says that at one point your velocity will stop increasing.
So what you are trying to do is apply the equations incorrectly by including items that do not exist in your model
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #639 on: August 29, 2008, 06:12:02 PM »
It seems cbarnett is trying to swap terminal velocity for his own "terminal acceleration." Even though they are the same thing...
how are they the same thing? If an object is accelerating how is its velocity constant?
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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TheEngineer

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #640 on: August 29, 2008, 06:33:57 PM »
You are wrong because you assert that the velocity of the object will reach a point where it no longer increases and the FE model says that is not possible
So like I said, you don't know what terminal velocity means.  Well, that is something you should work on. 

What grade are you in?


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

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TheEngineer

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #641 on: August 29, 2008, 06:36:02 PM »
how are they the same thing? If an object is accelerating how is its velocity constant?
First question:

A plane must create an upwards acceleration equal to that of 'gravity' so that it will maintain altitude, correct?


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #642 on: August 29, 2008, 06:40:37 PM »
You are wrong because you assert that the velocity of the object will reach a point where it no longer increases and the FE model says that is not possible
So like I said, you don't know what terminal velocity means.  Well, that is something you should work on. 

What grade are you in?
well when you learn what a free-body shows and then learn how to set one up maybe you will see that Wiki can not teach you everything. Oh wait you are supposed to be an engineer of some sort so you should know how to do one by now.

Since you are obviously an expert tell me how we can include the accleration of an object that is not in the system in our equations?
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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TheEngineer

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #643 on: August 29, 2008, 06:45:45 PM »
well when you learn what a free-body shows and then learn how to set one up maybe you will see that Wiki can not teach you everything. Oh wait you are supposed to be an engineer of some sort so you should know how to do one by now.
There is this thing they teach us in engineering school: Critical thinking.  You kind of need it in the real world where there are no textbook examples and the answers are not in the back of the book.  Look at my equations.  They are perfectly set up for the situation at hand.  I know it is probably too much for an eighth grader to understand, but try.


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #644 on: August 29, 2008, 06:47:06 PM »
well when you learn what a free-body shows and then learn how to set one up maybe you will see that Wiki can not teach you everything. Oh wait you are supposed to be an engineer of some sort so you should know how to do one by now.
There is this thing they teach us in engineering school: Critical thinking.  You kind of need it in the real world where there are no textbook examples and the answers are not in the back of the book.  Look at my equations.  They are perfectly set up for the situation at hand.  I know it is probably too much for an eighth grader to understand, but try.
what does a free body diagram show?
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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TheEngineer

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #645 on: August 29, 2008, 09:15:30 PM »
An unbalanced force.


First question:

A plane must create an upwards acceleration equal to that of 'gravity' so that it will maintain altitude, correct?


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

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Parsifal

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #646 on: August 29, 2008, 10:57:46 PM »
I sometimes wonder how people with so little intelligence can work out where to plug the ethernet cable into the back of their computer.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #647 on: August 29, 2008, 11:35:26 PM »
An unbalanced force.
So if you have an unbalanced force what is the result you get?


First question:

A plane must create an upwards acceleration equal to that of 'gravity' so that it will maintain altitude, correct?

not the same problem
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #648 on: August 29, 2008, 11:47:06 PM »
Good God, he's still trying.
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?

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Parsifal

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #649 on: August 29, 2008, 11:50:54 PM »
I think someone needs to change the thread title, because this is far from an intelligent argument.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #650 on: August 29, 2008, 11:55:37 PM »
Good God, he's still trying.
Yes I am patient I will help him all I can. If someone is going to defend a model they should at least understand that model
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #651 on: August 29, 2008, 11:56:10 PM »
Good God, he's still trying.
Yes I am patient I will help him all I can. If someone is going to defend a model they should at least understand that model

 ::)
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?

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TheEngineer

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #652 on: August 30, 2008, 12:09:26 AM »
So if you have an unbalanced force what is the result you get?
An acceleration...   :-\

Quote

First question:

A plane must create an upwards acceleration equal to that of 'gravity' so that it will maintain altitude, correct?

not the same problem
No, but it may aid in your understanding.  Answer it.


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #653 on: August 30, 2008, 12:19:01 AM »
So if you have an unbalanced force what is the result you get?
An acceleration...   :-\

Quote

First question:

A plane must create an upwards acceleration equal to that of 'gravity' so that it will maintain altitude, correct?

not the same problem
No, but it may aid in your understanding.  Answer it.
Of course it will but that is not the same thing, in that problem we are trying to maintain a distance between 2 objects, we are not looking at an object and trying to figure out what happens. You are basically trying to show that we need to take the acceleration of the FE into account when we calculate the lift generated by the wing.
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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TheEngineer

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #654 on: August 30, 2008, 12:29:55 AM »
Of course it will

It seems cbarnett is trying to swap terminal velocity for his own "terminal acceleration." Even though they are the same thing...
how are they the same thing? If an object is accelerating how is its velocity constant?

Quote
in that problem we are trying to maintain a distance between 2 objects,
So that must mean the the accelerations are...equal.


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #655 on: August 30, 2008, 12:33:15 AM »
Of course it will

It seems cbarnett is trying to swap terminal velocity for his own "terminal acceleration." Even though they are the same thing...
how are they the same thing? If an object is accelerating how is its velocity constant?

Quote
in that problem we are trying to maintain a distance between 2 objects,
So that must mean the the accelerations are...equal.
but that is what we are solving for in that problem, in what we have been talking about we are not looking for it to maintain a constant altitude we are wondering what happens to the object, like I said before, your argument is implying that we need to take the acceleration of the FE into account to calculate the lift of the wing.
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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TheEngineer

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #656 on: August 30, 2008, 12:36:30 AM »
but that is what we are solving for in that problem, in what we have been talking about we are not looking for it to maintain a constant altitude
Not a constant altitude, but a constant velocity.  Relative velocity.  Relative acceleration. 


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #657 on: August 30, 2008, 01:12:03 AM »
but that is what we are solving for in that problem, in what we have been talking about we are not looking for it to maintain a constant altitude
Not a constant altitude, but a constant velocity.  Relative velocity.  Relative acceleration. 
it is not relative to anything though after we figure out the acceleration of the object then we can relate that to the acceleration of the earth, but not before.
or specifically:
aobject=CdpA{(aairt)-vobject}2/2m

From there you can use calculus or numerical modeling to calculate when the objects acceleration stops increasing(in this case when it reaches 9.81m/s2). only after this can you then relate that to the earth.
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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Jack

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #658 on: August 30, 2008, 02:41:05 AM »
Is this Gulliverism...?

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Dr Matrix

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Re: Looking for an intelligent argument.
« Reply #659 on: August 30, 2008, 03:14:15 AM »
Wake me up when someone wins...
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