Perpetual motion/"free energy"

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JJA

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #270 on: June 22, 2021, 01:19:11 PM »
It would be like creating a car engine that can 100% run without any loss, but no more. (A perpetual motion engine) Then it would be just an idle engine running.
Exactly! It's still a really cool discovery/invention that pretty much spits in the face of the laws of thermodynamics, but it is more like an art piece than a machine until it hits >100% efficiency. At 100% efficiency, I'm interested in reading the article. At 100.0000000000001%, I'm investing in the future of the company that demonstrated this is actually possible and not a scam.

Yeah, getting close to 100% efficiency is just an engineering challenge.

The ironic thing is the discovery of an over-unity device would make that company's stock worthless in the long run as it would usher in a post-scarcity Star Trek like era where money is worthless.

Not to mention breaking several major laws of physics in the process.

What seems to be missed by a lot of free energy, perpetual motion proponents is they don't seem to understand it's not the SCALE of how much free energy is produced, it's that you are getting over 100% at any value at all.

It's like casually mentioning you invented a telephone that lets you connect to God, but only for one minute so it's not that big a deal.  It's not how long or how much you break the laws of physics, it's that they are broken AT ALL that is the big deal that so many people seem to miss.

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NotSoSkeptical

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #271 on: June 22, 2021, 01:22:19 PM »
100% efficiency will never happen on a combustion engine.  Anyone that says they are even close is full of shit.

Combustion results in 2 forms of energy, heat (primary source of energy for combustion engines) and light.  The light energy is all wasted in a combustion engine.  Even if they figure out how to ensure all the fuel combusts, until you can figure out how to harness the energy that is emitted as light from the combustion of fuel, you'll never have 100% efficiency.
Rabinoz RIP

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JJA

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #272 on: June 22, 2021, 01:22:49 PM »
Einstein was a freemason. So was Charles Darwin.
It is all about keeping free energy from society.
The earth is flat and stationary and is basically one big magnet. There is no such thing as gravity. Only different mediums of density through which objects move.
Nor is there climate change. Just an excuse to take control over all resources on the planet by the cabal.

Going for a conspiracy theory hat trick here I see.

This cabal is pretty powerful, how come they haven't silenced you yet? In fact the seem to be so powerful they have made the laws of conservation of energy just to stop perpetual motion machines from working. I'd love to know how they managed that one.

I assume you have no actual proof of evidence of any of your claims?  Did the cabal steal it all from you?

     

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boydster

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #273 on: June 22, 2021, 01:59:51 PM »
It would be like creating a car engine that can 100% run without any loss, but no more. (A perpetual motion engine) Then it would be just an idle engine running.
Exactly! It's still a really cool discovery/invention that pretty much spits in the face of the laws of thermodynamics, but it is more like an art piece than a machine until it hits >100% efficiency. At 100% efficiency, I'm interested in reading the article. At 100.0000000000001%, I'm investing in the future of the company that demonstrated this is actually possible and not a scam.

Yeah, getting close to 100% efficiency is just an engineering challenge.

The ironic thing is the discovery of an over-unity device would make that company's stock worthless in the long run as it would usher in a post-scarcity Star Trek like era where money is worthless.

Not to mention breaking several major laws of physics in the process.

What seems to be missed by a lot of free energy, perpetual motion proponents is they don't seem to understand it's not the SCALE of how much free energy is produced, it's that you are getting over 100% at any value at all.

It's like casually mentioning you invented a telephone that lets you connect to God, but only for one minute so it's not that big a deal.  It's not how long or how much you break the laws of physics, it's that they are broken AT ALL that is the big deal that so many people seem to miss.
Hang on though, there's always the "Trade Secret" route of things, instead of the "I have a patent now" way of doing business. If someone came up with a way of generating energy over unity, I'd be willing to bet they'd opt for Trade Secret and keep things under very tight wraps. Once it is patented, too much info is available to other people to try and come up with a competing product.

But of course you can't get more energy out of something that you put into it. Even less so if it is doing work.

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Bullwinkle

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #274 on: June 22, 2021, 04:47:33 PM »
entropy

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JJA

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #275 on: June 22, 2021, 05:22:43 PM »
Hang on though, there's always the "Trade Secret" route of things, instead of the "I have a patent now" way of doing business. If someone came up with a way of generating energy over unity, I'd be willing to bet they'd opt for Trade Secret and keep things under very tight wraps. Once it is patented, too much info is available to other people to try and come up with a competing product.

But of course you can't get more energy out of something that you put into it. Even less so if it is doing work.

You can't win, you can't break even, you can't even quit the game. One of my favorite quotes. :)

Whatever they have might be slightly more efficient, might or might not be revolutionary, probably is just trying to get investment money.

As for all the over-unity claims elsewhere, I see no possible motivation for a company to invent a machine that produces free energy, and then to just bury it.  It would at the very least, be MASSIVE short term profits, and what do CEOs like more than short term profits? Nothing at all.

Even if a CEO told their R&D department to bury it, they would need to murder the entire team as who wouldn't want to publish those findings and go down in history as the person who broke physics and unleashed a worldwide (hah I didn't say global) revolution that would literally change everything?

The idea that there are dozens of free energy devices collecting dust in company vaults is just nuts.

Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #276 on: June 22, 2021, 09:26:54 PM »
Water will not react with anything readily available on Earth.
LOL what is Rust.
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The earth is a globe.

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Timeisup

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #277 on: June 23, 2021, 12:51:17 AM »
Water will not react with anything readily available on Earth.
LOL what is Rust.

Itís amazing how stupid people can be. Did that person not realise he was 75% water give or take.

Even although rust is iron oxide rust wonít form on iron if there is no water present. Water is not only the universal solvent but is a requirement for many chemical reactions particularly those of a biological nature!

Another golden oldie of belief over knowledge.

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markjo

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #278 on: June 23, 2021, 08:41:21 AM »
Water will not react with anything readily available on Earth.
LOL what is Rust.

Itís amazing how stupid people can be. Did that person not realise he was 75% water give or take.
Did you not realize that you guys are replying to a nearly 13 year old post?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
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Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
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JJA

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #279 on: June 23, 2021, 10:46:34 AM »
Water will not react with anything readily available on Earth.
LOL what is Rust.

Itís amazing how stupid people can be. Did that person not realise he was 75% water give or take.
Did you not realize that you guys are replying to a nearly 13 year old post?

To be fair, is there any difference between 13 year old flat earth posts and today? I haven't really seen any progress having looked over posts from that era. Well, EA and UA were introduced 10 years ago so that's progress of a sort?

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boydster

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #280 on: June 23, 2021, 11:25:16 AM »
Water will not react with anything readily available on Earth.
LOL what is Rust.

Itís amazing how stupid people can be. Did that person not realise he was 75% water give or take.
Did you not realize that you guys are replying to a nearly 13 year old post?

To be fair, is there any difference between 13 year old flat earth posts and today? I haven't really seen any progress having looked over posts from that era. Well, EA and UA were introduced 10 years ago so that's progress of a sort?
Yes, there is one important difference - if you quote and reply to someone that posted today, the odds of getting a response from them are wildly higher than if you quote and reply to someone that in practical terms stopped posting almost 7 years ago. Trying to dunk on someone that doesn't post here anymore and hasn't for quite some time is a bit of a self-dunk, if you ask me. Who wants to be the person that, upon seeing ancient cave paintings depicting a hunt, borrows their girlfriend's stick of lipstick to write "LOL get guns you idiots DERPPPPPP" on the wall right next to the paintings?

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sokarul

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #281 on: June 23, 2021, 11:45:27 AM »
Correct me if Iím wrong but the oxygen  in iron oxide rust didnít come from the oxygen in the water molecule. It comes from the dissolved oxygen, which is what fish breath. Or just oxygen from air.
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boydster

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #282 on: June 23, 2021, 12:00:10 PM »
Correct me if Iím wrong but the oxygen  in iron oxide rust didnít come from the oxygen in the water molecule. It comes from the dissolved oxygen, which is what fish breath. Or just oxygen from air.
100% correct. Water is the usual catalyst, but it isn't exactly reacting. I almost pointed that out earlier too, but figured it would devolve into people pointing out water reacts with lots of other things (hello, sodium!), so Raist was still wrong but so were MouseWalker and Timmy.

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markjo

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #283 on: June 23, 2021, 01:12:43 PM »
To be fair, is there any difference between 13 year old flat earth posts and today?
Do you mean other than the fact that this thread has nothing to do with the shape of the earth?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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JJA

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #284 on: June 23, 2021, 01:39:48 PM »
Water will not react with anything readily available on Earth.
LOL what is Rust.

Itís amazing how stupid people can be. Did that person not realise he was 75% water give or take.
Did you not realize that you guys are replying to a nearly 13 year old post?

To be fair, is there any difference between 13 year old flat earth posts and today? I haven't really seen any progress having looked over posts from that era. Well, EA and UA were introduced 10 years ago so that's progress of a sort?
Yes, there is one important difference - if you quote and reply to someone that posted today, the odds of getting a response from them are wildly higher than if you quote and reply to someone that in practical terms stopped posting almost 7 years ago. Trying to dunk on someone that doesn't post here anymore and hasn't for quite some time is a bit of a self-dunk, if you ask me. Who wants to be the person that, upon seeing ancient cave paintings depicting a hunt, borrows their girlfriend's stick of lipstick to write "LOL get guns you idiots DERPPPPPP" on the wall right next to the paintings?

That assumes the sole reason for responding to a post is to get some kind of reaction from the poster and that there is no value in the debate itself. Just because something was said in the past means it no longer has any meaning?

So what if he won't respond, several other people have already chimed in. Maybe another flat earther will take up the mantle and defend his honor.

Ehh. On of my pet peeves is the entire concept of necro-shaming. I don't see why people get so uptight over it. It's just weird.

Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #285 on: June 23, 2021, 02:08:12 PM »
To be fair, is there any difference between 13 year old flat earth posts and today?
Do you mean other than the fact that this thread has nothing to do with the shape of the earth?
The shape of what now?
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markjo

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #286 on: June 23, 2021, 03:55:54 PM »
The shape of what now?
The shape of the gears in a perpetual motion machine, of course.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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boydster

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #287 on: June 23, 2021, 05:18:24 PM »
That assumes the sole reason for responding to a post is to get some kind of reaction from the poster and that there is no value in the debate itself.
I'm not sure you paid attention to the quotes you left nested in your last post if you think MouseWalker and Timeisup added something of value. They both took the opportunity to attempt a cheap shot at someone who isn't here.

Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #288 on: June 23, 2021, 09:59:53 PM »
That assumes the sole reason for responding to a post is to get some kind of reaction from the poster and that there is no value in the debate itself.
I'm not sure you paid attention to the quotes you left nested in your last post if you think MouseWalker and Timeisup added something of value. They both took the opportunity to attempt a cheap shot at someone who isn't here.
oops I started to read the thread in the very beginning I got there and had a knee-jerk reaction I was not watching the dates; I will endeavor to do better next time.
The the universe has no obligation to makes sense to you.
The earth is a globe.

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JJA

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #289 on: June 24, 2021, 03:39:02 AM »
That assumes the sole reason for responding to a post is to get some kind of reaction from the poster and that there is no value in the debate itself.
I'm not sure you paid attention to the quotes you left nested in your last post if you think MouseWalker and Timeisup added something of value. They both took the opportunity to attempt a cheap shot at someone who isn't here.

It's clear the initial post was made not realizing how old the post was, which in no way invalidates anything said about it.

One persons valuable entertainment is another's necro post. I can value whatever I want, and pointing out the ridiculousness of an argument is something I always value. :)

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markjo

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #290 on: June 24, 2021, 06:34:15 AM »
I can value whatever I want, and pointing out the ridiculousness of an argument is something I always value. :)
Do you think that you pointed out anything that wasn't already pointed out 13 years ago in the previous 9 pages?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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boydster

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #291 on: June 24, 2021, 06:36:19 AM »
That assumes the sole reason for responding to a post is to get some kind of reaction from the poster and that there is no value in the debate itself.
I'm not sure you paid attention to the quotes you left nested in your last post if you think MouseWalker and Timeisup added something of value. They both took the opportunity to attempt a cheap shot at someone who isn't here.

It's clear the initial post was made not realizing how old the post was, which in no way invalidates anything said about it.

One persons valuable entertainment is another's necro post. I can value whatever I want, and pointing out the ridiculousness of an argument is something I always value. :)
Which is why you really enjoyed pointing out that water doesn't react with iron to make rust, right?

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Bullwinkle

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #292 on: June 24, 2021, 08:58:02 PM »
Ahhhh, my HEAD Hurts !!!

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NotSoSkeptical

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #293 on: June 25, 2021, 05:30:42 AM »
Ahhhh, my HEAD Hurts !!!

That's why your supposed to your lube.
Rabinoz RIP

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JJA

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #294 on: June 26, 2021, 07:00:34 AM »
That assumes the sole reason for responding to a post is to get some kind of reaction from the poster and that there is no value in the debate itself.
I'm not sure you paid attention to the quotes you left nested in your last post if you think MouseWalker and Timeisup added something of value. They both took the opportunity to attempt a cheap shot at someone who isn't here.

It's clear the initial post was made not realizing how old the post was, which in no way invalidates anything said about it.

One persons valuable entertainment is another's necro post. I can value whatever I want, and pointing out the ridiculousness of an argument is something I always value. :)
Which is why you really enjoyed pointing out that water doesn't react with iron to make rust, right?

That was someone else, I never pointed it out. I just enjoyed seeing someone else do it.

For me, that's entertaining. For the OP it was responding to, it was educational since they clearly didn't know that fact. So when they come back here they will have the chance to learn something. Win-win!

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JJA

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #295 on: June 26, 2021, 07:01:35 AM »
I can value whatever I want, and pointing out the ridiculousness of an argument is something I always value. :)
Do you think that you pointed out anything that wasn't already pointed out 13 years ago in the previous 9 pages?

Sure I did. Where in the previous 9 pages was there a discussion about necroing threads? My entire conversation here is brand new to this thread. I'm a content creator!

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boydster

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #296 on: June 28, 2021, 10:48:00 AM »
I can value whatever I want, and pointing out the ridiculousness of an argument is something I always value. :)
Do you think that you pointed out anything that wasn't already pointed out 13 years ago in the previous 9 pages?

Sure I did. Where in the previous 9 pages was there a discussion about necroing threads? My entire conversation here is brand new to this thread. I'm a content creator!
You misspelled "thread derailer."

Which is why you really enjoyed pointing out that water doesn't react with iron to make rust, right?

That was someone else, I never pointed it out. I just enjoyed seeing someone else do it.
Right, I know, which is kind of the point. You first indicated that those posts were adding something of value to the conversation. And now that it was pointed out that they weren't, you have pivoted.

Perhaps a separate thread is warranted for the very important conversation around necro posting that JJA would like to... perpetuate. If so, JJA I invite you to make such a thread. This is not that thread. This thread is about perpetual motion machines and extracting free energy.

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Timeisup

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #297 on: July 04, 2021, 06:16:57 AM »
Correct me if Iím wrong but the oxygen  in iron oxide rust didnít come from the oxygen in the water molecule. It comes from the dissolved oxygen, which is what fish breath. Or just oxygen from air.
100% correct. Water is the usual catalyst, but it isn't exactly reacting. I almost pointed that out earlier too, but figured it would devolve into people pointing out water reacts with lots of other things (hello, sodium!), so Raist was still wrong but so were MouseWalker and Timmy.

Sorry for the late reply, but some Joker keeps banning me!

Iron oxide will only form in the presence of moisture where the moisture or water, call it what you may, is a catalyst. Pop a lump or iron in a moisture free oxygen rich atmosphere and it won't react.

So how was I wrong, he who keeps banning people?

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boydster

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #298 on: July 04, 2021, 07:48:47 AM »
Water doesn't react with iron. Do try and keep up.

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sokarul

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Re: Perpetual motion/"free energy"
« Reply #299 on: July 05, 2021, 07:40:08 PM »
Correct me if Iím wrong but the oxygen  in iron oxide rust didnít come from the oxygen in the water molecule. It comes from the dissolved oxygen, which is what fish breath. Or just oxygen from air.
100% correct. Water is the usual catalyst, but it isn't exactly reacting. I almost pointed that out earlier too, but figured it would devolve into people pointing out water reacts with lots of other things (hello, sodium!), so Raist was still wrong but so were MouseWalker and Timmy.

Sorry for the late reply, but some Joker keeps banning me!

Iron oxide will only form in the presence of moisture where the moisture or water, call it what you may, is a catalyst. Pop a lump or iron in a moisture free oxygen rich atmosphere and it won't react.

So how was I wrong, he who keeps banning people?
We all said the same thing sort of. I probably said the only thing possible wrong. I just like pointing out fish dont breathe the oxygen molecules bonded to a hydrogen molecule.
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