Proof that God indeed exists

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #30 on: September 29, 2008, 01:24:23 AM »
i found salma hayeks breasts quite convincing

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #31 on: September 29, 2008, 01:32:57 AM »
With regard to proof of the existence of Allah, it is obvious to anyone who ponders the matter, and there is no need for a lengthy discussion. When we ponder the matter, we find out that it is divided into three categories: instinctive evidence, tangible evidence and from my religion which you wouldn't care.

1 – Instinctive evidence:
The instinctive evidence that God exists is the strongest of all evidence for those who are not led astray by the devils. Hence Allah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“So set you (O Muhammad) your face towards the religion (of pure Islamic Monotheism) Haneef (worship none but Allah Alone). Allah’s Fitrah (i.e. Allah’s Islamic Monotheism) with which He has created mankind” [al-Room 30:30]

Man’s sound nature (fitrah) testifies to the existence of God and man cannot turn away from that unless the devils mislead him; whoever is misled by the devils may not recognize this evidence.”

Every person feels inside himself that he has a Lord and Creator, and he feels that he is in need of Him; if some major calamity befalls him he turns his hands, eyes and heart towards the heavens, seeking help from his Lord.

2 – Tangible evidence:
This refers to the things that exist in this universe; we see around us things that exist, such as trees, rocks, mankind, the earth, the heavens, seas, rivers…

If it is asked: these things are so many – who created them and is taking care of them?

The answer is that if these things came into being by accident, spontaneously and with no cause, then there is no one who knows how they were created, and that is one possibility. But there is another possibility, which is that these things created themselves and are taking care of themselves. And there is a third possibility, which is that there is Someone Who created them. When we look at these three possibilities, we find that the first and the second are impossible. If we reject the first and the second, then the third must be the one which is correct, which is that these things have a Creator who created them, and that Creator is Allah. This is what is stated in the Quran, where Allah says:

“Were they created by nothing? Or were they themselves the creators?

Or did they create the heavens and the earth? Nay, but they have no firm Belief” [al-Toor 52:35]

Moreover, when were these mighty things created? For all these years, who is it that has decreed that they should remain in this world and has granted them the means of abiding?

The answer is, it is Allah who has given to each thing that which is suited to it and will guarantee its survival. Do you not see the beautiful green plants; when Allah cuts off their water supply, can they live? No, rather they become dry stalks. If you ponder all things you will find that they are dependent upon Allah. Were it not for Allah, nothing would remain.

And Allah has created everything to do that for which it is suited. So camels, for example, are for riding. Allah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Do they not see that We have created for them of what Our Hands have created, the cattle, so that they are their owners.

And We have subdued them unto them so that some of them they have for riding and some they eat” [36:71-72]

Look at the camel and how Allah has created it strong, with a strong back, so that it can be used for riding and it is able to endure harsh conditions which other animals cannot bear.

If you look at other creatures you will find that they are suited to the purposes for which they were created. Glory be to Allah.

“All the divinely-revealed laws point to the existence of the Creator and to the perfect nature of His knowledge, wisdom and mercy, because these laws must have been prescribed by someone, and that Lawgiver is Allah.”

With regard to your question: why did Allah create us?

The answer is: so that we would worship Him, thank Him and remember Him, and do that which He has commanded us. You know that among mankind there are unbelievers and there are Muslims. This is because Allah wants to test His slaves as to whether they will worship Him or worship others. That is after Allah has showed the way to everyone. Allah says (interpretation of the meaning):

 “Who has created death and life that He may test you which of you is best in deed” [67:2]

“And I (Allah) created not the jinn and mankind except that they should worship Me (Alone)” [51:56]
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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Saddam Hussein

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #32 on: September 29, 2008, 12:32:36 PM »
i found salma hayeks breasts quite convincing

How intelligent.

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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #33 on: September 29, 2008, 12:43:29 PM »
If it is asked: these things are so many – who created them and is taking care of them?

The answer is that if these things came into being by accident, spontaneously and with no cause, then there is no one who knows how they were created, and that is one possibility.
Perhaps without any matter in the universe General Relativity breaks down and Quantum Mechanics dominate on a large scale in which case matter can exist without cause, be in multiple places at once, etc. Once matter exists, it forms galaxies and super clusters etc etc etc.
This is mostly speculation, but we cannot simply label something to be impossible so easily.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2008, 12:50:41 PM by ﮎingulaЯiτy »
If I was asked to imagine a perfect deity, I would never invent one that suffers from a multiple personality disorder. Christians get points for originality there.

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Sean

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #34 on: September 29, 2008, 12:46:20 PM »
ARGUMENT FROM ASSUMPTION
(1) God exists.
(2) Therefore, God exists.
Quote from: sokarul
Better bring a better augment, something not so stupid.

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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #35 on: September 29, 2008, 12:53:03 PM »
If it is asked: these things are so many – who created them and is taking care of them?

I also want to add in that assuming anything that exists requires a creator, than you are moving the dilemma onto an assumption without solving it, because this logic persists in that the creator would need a creator.
If I was asked to imagine a perfect deity, I would never invent one that suffers from a multiple personality disorder. Christians get points for originality there.

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Wendy

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #36 on: September 29, 2008, 03:07:50 PM »
Which would need a creator. And so forth. But this is not true, because Allah always existed. The thing is that this is also true for the matter in the universe, according to the big bang theory, because there is no "before" Big bang.
Here's an explanation for ya. Lurk moar. Every single point you brought up has been posted, reposted, debated and debunked. There is a search function on this forum, and it is very easy to use.

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #37 on: September 29, 2008, 03:30:40 PM »
That's why Allah said

"HE is the First and the Last, and the Manifest and the Hidden, and HE has full knowledge of all things. "

Quote
Which would need a creator. And so forth. But this is not true, because Allah always existed. The thing is that this is also true for the matter in the universe, according to the big bang theory, because there is no "before" Big bang.


(He is the Originator of the heavens and the earth.) (101)

This information given in the Quran is in full agreement with the findings of contemporary science. The conclusionthat astrophysics has reached today is that the entire universe, together with the dimensions of matter and time, came into existence as a result of a great explosion that occurred in no time. This event, known as “The Big Bang” produced the entire universe about 15 billion years ago, creating it from nothingness as the result of the explosion of a single point. Modern scientific circles are in agreement that the Big Bang is the only rational and provable explanation of the beginning of the universe and of how the universe came into being.

Before the Big Bang, there was no such thing as matter. From a condition of non-existence in which neither matter, nor energy, nor even time existed and which can only be defined metaphysically, matter, energy, and time were all created. This fact, only recently discovered by modern physics, was announced to us in the Quran 1,400 years ago.
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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Parsifal

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #38 on: September 29, 2008, 03:36:13 PM »
ARGUMENT FROM ASSUMPTION
(1) God exists.
(2) Therefore, God exists.

lrn2citation
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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Raist

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #39 on: September 29, 2008, 05:01:16 PM »
That's why Allah said

"HE is the First and the Last, and the Manifest and the Hidden, and HE has full knowledge of all things. "

Quote
Which would need a creator. And so forth. But this is not true, because Allah always existed. The thing is that this is also true for the matter in the universe, according to the big bang theory, because there is no "before" Big bang.


(He is the Originator of the heavens and the earth.) (101)

This information given in the Quran is in full agreement with the findings of contemporary science. The conclusionthat astrophysics has reached today is that the entire universe, together with the dimensions of matter and time, came into existence as a result of a great explosion that occurred in no time. This event, known as “The Big Bang” produced the entire universe about 15 billion years ago, creating it from nothingness as the result of the explosion of a single point. Modern scientific circles are in agreement that the Big Bang is the only rational and provable explanation of the beginning of the universe and of how the universe came into being.

Before the Big Bang, there was no such thing as matter. From a condition of non-existence in which neither matter, nor energy, nor even time existed and which can only be defined metaphysically, matter, energy, and time were all created. This fact, only recently discovered by modern physics, was announced to us in the Quran 1,400 years ago.
The Quran claims the Earth is flat.

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #40 on: September 29, 2008, 06:44:05 PM »
Quote
The Quran claims the Earth is flat.

Shouldn't you guys be happy? or it would just prove that the theory of flat earth is wrong :P
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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Raist

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #41 on: September 29, 2008, 07:33:34 PM »
Quote
The Quran claims the Earth is flat.

Shouldn't you guys be happy? or it would just prove that the theory of flat earth is wrong :P
You said the big bang theory supports the quran.

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #42 on: September 29, 2008, 08:51:01 PM »
Quote

Shouldn't you guys be happy? or it would just prove that the theory of flat earth is wrong :P
You said the big bang theory supports the quran.

I am sorry if my words would disappoint you but actually Big Bang or other established facts cannot support the Quran because the Quran doesn't supports to be the words of God, it's that science are being supported by the Quran. However we are using these stuffs to prove to people that a man like Mohammed with no technology cannot write a book like that that's one of the reasons n_n
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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Raist

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #43 on: September 29, 2008, 11:18:12 PM »
Quote

Shouldn't you guys be happy? or it would just prove that the theory of flat earth is wrong :P
You said the big bang theory supports the quran.

I am sorry if my words would disappoint you but actually Big Bang or other established facts cannot support the Quran because the Quran doesn't supports to be the words of God, it's that science are being supported by the Quran. However we are using these stuffs to prove to people that a man like Mohammed with no technology cannot write a book like that that's one of the reasons n_n
So the quran was wrong?

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Benocrates

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #44 on: September 30, 2008, 05:39:49 AM »
If the Koran said anything stunningly revolutionary about genetics or germ theory, I'd be impressed.
Quote from: President Barack Obama
Pot had helped
Get the fuck over it.

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Zhong

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #45 on: September 30, 2008, 09:27:09 AM »
It is as Chairman Mao observe of peasants uprisings : the people has displaced the corrupt governors and priests. How many has idols and gods displaced? none!

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #46 on: September 30, 2008, 08:08:21 PM »
Quote
So the quran was wrong?

Quran is never wrong :)
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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cmdshft

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #47 on: September 30, 2008, 08:25:02 PM »
Quote
So the quran was wrong?

Quran is never wrong :)

Wrong. It says God exists, when he clearly does not, and I have proof. Check the sticky thread.

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Raist

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #48 on: September 30, 2008, 09:32:24 PM »
Quote
So the quran was wrong?

Quran is never wrong :)
Oh. So it is wrong.

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #49 on: September 30, 2008, 09:52:29 PM »
Quote
So the quran was wrong?

Quran is never wrong :)

Wrong. It says God exists, when he clearly does not, and I have proof. Check the sticky thread.

LoooooL   ;D

I swear your post made me laugh alot, Hara you never fail to amuse me  ;)

I lost
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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cmdshft

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #50 on: September 30, 2008, 09:53:10 PM »
Are you insulting my belief?

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #51 on: September 30, 2008, 09:56:29 PM »
Are you insulting my belief?

No seriously I am not it made me laugh

I am not insulting ^_~
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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cmdshft

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #52 on: September 30, 2008, 09:59:04 PM »
Are you insulting my belief?

No seriously I am not it made me laugh

I am not insulting ^_~

It was not supposed to amuse, I was being serious. I am offended.

Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #53 on: September 30, 2008, 10:00:18 PM »

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #54 on: September 30, 2008, 10:04:57 PM »
I was serious when I said Quran is never wrong :)

Quote

It was not supposed to amuse, I was being serious. I am offended.

I am sorry  :'(

To know what is offending see this >>> at 0.38



And your belief is sometimes considered even more offending than that :)

Quote
People cry because of your beliefs
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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cmdshft

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #55 on: September 30, 2008, 10:13:52 PM »
But I am not out to please everyone, only myself. Insulting my belief would be as if I told you that Mohammad used drugs and hallucinated his prophecies. This is not what you believe but it's what I am insinuating. Does that make it true? What proof can you provide that shows the Qu'ran truly is the be all end all? You can't just claim that it isn't wrong and not provide proof. That's blind riding, and is not the truest of faith, which is bearing false witness against your creator, something which is frowned upon. Will you be a shepherd or the sheep?

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Benocrates

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #56 on: September 30, 2008, 10:19:56 PM »
Insulting my belief would be as if I told you that Mohammad used drugs and hallucinated his prophecies.

Or that he was a megalomaniacle, manipulative, repugnant, pedophilic, rhetorician who fabricated revelations and retarded a society by leading  hoi polloi into a death cult.
Quote from: President Barack Obama
Pot had helped
Get the fuck over it.

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AbdulAziz

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #57 on: September 30, 2008, 10:22:22 PM »
But I am not out to please everyone, only myself. Insulting my belief would be as if I told you that Mohammad used drugs and hallucinated his prophecies. This is not what you believe but it's what I am insinuating. Does that make it true? What proof can you provide that shows the Qu'ran truly is the be all end all? You can't just claim that it isn't wrong and not provide proof. That's blind riding, and is not the truest of faith, which is bearing false witness against your creator, something which is frowned upon. Will you be a shepherd or the sheep?

Many proves I've posted before, just because One's mind can't grasp doesn't mean it cannot be considered a prove :) The Quran itself is the prove for the existence of God because no humans could create such a book with all the facts I have posted before with not even a single contradictions. I am not blindly following my religion but there are people who are denying to even at least read and accept the truth not because the lack of proves.

Give me one prove that God doesn't exists :)

I ask you only for 1 and I created a topic regarding this "Atheist proves that god doesn't exists" I challenge every human being to give me one prove
"And say, `All praise belongs to ALLAH; HE will soon show you HIS Signs, and you will know them.' And thy Lord is not unaware of what you do."

"Were they created of nothing, or were they themselves the creators? "
(Translations of Allah's Words)

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Benocrates

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Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #58 on: September 30, 2008, 10:26:31 PM »
Quote from: President Barack Obama
Pot had helped
Get the fuck over it.

Re: Proof that God indeed exists
« Reply #59 on: September 30, 2008, 10:31:21 PM »
wasnt there a contradictions of the qaran thread not long ago?

so what were we made out of
water
dust
clay
soil
what?
it says all those things and more
in what way is that not a contradiction?