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The See saw effect.

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fshy94

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #120 on: January 18, 2008, 01:30:34 PM »
You're missing the point. Sticky a topic on the top if you must, but you keep derailing topics with your obsessive need to make sure everyone uses scientific terms. It's a good idea...in theory, but you are doing far more damage than good with this absolute obsession with pointing out this every single time, regardless of whether or not it matters to the topic or not. That's my point.
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divito the truthist

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #121 on: January 18, 2008, 01:31:50 PM »
Education > letting misconceptions live on
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fshy94

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #122 on: January 18, 2008, 01:32:19 PM »
Quote from: fshy94 on January 18, 2008, 01:30:34 PM
You're missing the point. Sticky a topic on the top if you must.
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TheEngineer

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #123 on: January 18, 2008, 01:32:53 PM »
No, I like doing it this way.  Thanks for the suggestion, though.
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fshy94

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #124 on: January 18, 2008, 01:33:51 PM »
*Sigh* Still stubborn, as per usual ;D

Can't you at least make a topic with all of this, and just make a link that you can point people to, without the whole hoopla of derailing threads?

EDIT: Maybe even this topic? Just instead of making your point, add a link to this and say, read this topic. That way it won't get derailed?
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Quote from: Althalus
The conspiracy has made it impossible to adequately explain FE theory in English.
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TheEngineer

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #125 on: January 18, 2008, 01:34:31 PM »
Quote from: TheEngineer on January 18, 2008, 01:32:53 PM
No, I like doing it this way.  Thanks for the suggestion, though.
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fshy94

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #126 on: January 18, 2008, 01:35:26 PM »
So you like derailing threads? That's odd, for a moderator...
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The conspiracy has made it impossible to adequately explain FE theory in English.
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TheEngineer

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #127 on: January 18, 2008, 01:37:23 PM »
It's called educating.
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fshy94

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #128 on: January 18, 2008, 01:39:16 PM »
Which I'm all for. But not at the expense of good threads. Can't we have our cake and eat it too my way?
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Quote from: Althalus
The conspiracy has made it impossible to adequately explain FE theory in English.
^^LOL!
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TheEngineer

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #129 on: January 18, 2008, 01:42:46 PM »
No.  I am the dictator. 
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fshy94

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #130 on: January 18, 2008, 01:43:29 PM »
Quote from: TheEngineer on January 18, 2008, 01:42:46 PM
No.  I am the dictator wannabe. 

Fixed  ;D Whatever, have it your way. I'll just redirect them to this topic.
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NTheGreat

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #131 on: January 18, 2008, 01:44:24 PM »
Ah, Gravity not a force under the principles of General relativity. I probably shouldn't bring this up, but I'm going to.

There's no suitable evidence for General relativity being correct.
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fshy94

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #132 on: January 18, 2008, 01:46:14 PM »
Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute.... What??????? GR has been proved a million times over, we're not going to rehash this again?

They shot a light pulse through a predicted wrinkle in time, and that light pulse skipped over a fraction of a second in time, as only Einstein predicted. Everyone else said that was impossible. That was considered absolute proof. That said, I do wonder how FE says its been proved, because most of the experimental verification happened with satellites.
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^^LOL!
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TheEngineer

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #133 on: January 18, 2008, 01:50:16 PM »
Quote from: NTheGreat on January 18, 2008, 01:44:24 PM
Ah, Gravity not a force under the principles of General relativity. I probably shouldn't bring this up, but I'm going to.

There's no suitable evidence for General relativity being correct.
Gravitational lensing.  Precession of the perihelion of Mercury.  Time dilation.  Gravitational speed.  Gravitational time dilation.  Need I go on?
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NTheGreat

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #134 on: January 18, 2008, 01:53:57 PM »
Quote
I do wonder how FE says its been proved, because most of the experimental verification happened with satellites.

This is the main backing of my point. We have observations of the sun bending the light from stars close to it during a eclipse and the error in Mercury's orbit, bit IN FE the sun is a small 32 mile wide ball, not billions of tones of hydrogen making a huge dent in spacetime. We have a loss of energy from gravitational waves from two distant pulsars, but in FE the stars are 3,100 miles overhead and how the stars seem to work is rather wacky anyway. We have evidence from interplanetary satellites, and a wonderful set of results from Gravity probe A and B, but satellites don't seems to work in FE, and those that do wouldn't get the results we have.
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divito the truthist

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #135 on: January 18, 2008, 01:54:58 PM »
Hah, the infamous Gulliver retort. Bringing the FE into a discussion that was devoid of FE.
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TheEngineer

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #136 on: January 18, 2008, 01:55:22 PM »
Uh, I believe your point was:

Quote from: NTheGreat on January 18, 2008, 01:44:24 PM
Ah, Gravity not a force under the principles of General relativity. I probably shouldn't bring this up, but I'm going to.

There's no suitable evidence for General relativity being correct.
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TheEngineer

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #137 on: January 18, 2008, 01:55:45 PM »
Quote from: divito the truthist on January 18, 2008, 01:54:58 PM
Hah, the infamous Gulliver retort. Bringing the FE into a discussion that was devoid of FE.
So true.
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Tom Bishop

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #138 on: January 18, 2008, 01:57:52 PM »
Quote
Gravitational lensing.  Precession of the perihelion of Mercury.  Time dilation.  Gravitational speed.  Gravitational time dilation.  Need I go on?

Which of those aren't also predicted by the Graviton Theory of Quantum Mechanics?
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fshy94

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #139 on: January 18, 2008, 01:58:50 PM »
 ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)

I'll leave engy to deal with this mess.
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NTheGreat

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #140 on: January 18, 2008, 02:03:10 PM »
This is probably why I expected I'll regret it.

My main problem is that you dismiss why gravity doesn't pull the planet together, or pull celestial objects down but still allows the moons to orbit the planets and the tides to work, is that there's no gravity. There's only the bending of spacetime due to the principles of GR. But there's no evidence for GR in a FE model. There's only an apparent force between objects, which we would attribute the name gravity to. there's a force pulling up the tides and holding moons around Jupiter in a FE model. There's no dent in spacetime for the tides to flow up, or the moons to follow.

Plent of other posts have come up whilst typing this, so I doubt this addresses everything. We shall see.
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NTheGreat

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #141 on: January 18, 2008, 02:10:02 PM »
Quote
Hah, the infamous Gulliver retort. Bringing the FE into a discussion that was devoid of FE.

Can't say I've heard of the Gulliver retort. I thought this discussion was to do with the use of the term 'gravity' in a FE model. Perhaps I was mistaken. I may have been a little pushy, but I've been meaning to  query about this for a while. This seems to have been one of the few opportunities lately to try it out, and it seemed fitting with the topic at the time.
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divito the truthist

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #142 on: January 18, 2008, 02:33:34 PM »
Quote from: NTheGreat on January 18, 2008, 02:10:02 PM
Can't say I've heard of the Gulliver retort. I thought this discussion was to do with the use of the term 'gravity' in a FE model. Perhaps I was mistaken. I may have been a little pushy, but I've been meaning to  query about this for a while. This seems to have been one of the few opportunities lately to try it out, and it seemed fitting with the topic at the time.

Gulliver was a somewhat admirable and intelligent REer that used to frequent this forum before being banned for racist comments. He commonly would resort to bringing the current discussion to focus on the subject AND the FE after he had lost the argument about simply the subject.
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fshy94

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #143 on: January 18, 2008, 02:36:05 PM »
Quote from: divito the truthist on January 18, 2008, 02:33:34 PM
Quote from: NTheGreat on January 18, 2008, 02:10:02 PM
Can't say I've heard of the Gulliver retort. I thought this discussion was to do with the use of the term 'gravity' in a FE model. Perhaps I was mistaken. I may have been a little pushy, but I've been meaning to  query about this for a while. This seems to have been one of the few opportunities lately to try it out, and it seemed fitting with the topic at the time.

Gulliver was a somewhat admirable and intelligent REer that used to frequent this forum before being banned for racist comments. He commonly would resort to bringing the current discussion to focus on the subject AND the FE after he had lost the argument about simply the subject.

These sections seem somewhat contradictory :D No matter...thanks for the background info though.
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The conspiracy has made it impossible to adequately explain FE theory in English.
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divito the truthist

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #144 on: January 18, 2008, 02:47:14 PM »
Well, as far as I know, it was only one instance of racist comments. And the second part wasn't common in that sense, but when he did lose an argument, he would always do that.
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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #145 on: January 18, 2008, 02:58:53 PM »
Gulliver also claimed to have hired someone on Craig's list to stalk TOm Bishop at his place of worship.
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Jack

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #146 on: January 18, 2008, 04:01:56 PM »
Quote from: NTheGreat on January 18, 2008, 01:16:51 PM
Quote
Which is why I said major articles always dumb down their viewers.
...I know, but I thought you were using that site to support your views...
Why would I? You wanted me to show you a source referencing gravitation being a force. Thus, I showed you one. Simple.
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Jack

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Re: The See saw effect.
« Reply #147 on: January 18, 2008, 04:06:21 PM »
Quote from: NTheGreat on January 18, 2008, 01:16:51 PM
Wikipedia seems to suggest that Gravity is the name for the apparent force and gravitation is the name for the Theory, as has already been mentioned.
Apparently, the wording was changed since the last time I used that page "gravitation". Gravitation can NEVER be the name of a theory or the theory itself. It just doesn't make sense. Gravitation is the phenomenon. It is the theories that explain gravitation, not gravitation explaining itself.
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