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What has FE science given to the world?

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Jikan

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What has FE science given to the world?
« on: November 15, 2007, 06:27:32 PM »
In another topic, someone mentioned that modern science is based on the (incorrect) RE model. [paraphrasing]

Correct me if I'm wrong but, hasn't modern science given us some great things? (Cell phones, TVs, computers etc...)

Is there a list of scientific achievements/accomplishments that FE science has bestowed upon the world? Oh wait, FE science has given us a list of things that are impossible, right?

If all modern science is based on a RE, then shouldn't you people say "thank you" to all of the world's "RE scientists?"

Maybe I'm just an optimist, but, I'd much rather "believe in" a science that says, "yes we can," rather than a science that says, "no we can't."

P.S. I may not be a scientist, but... you're welcome. :)
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Jack

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2007, 06:33:36 PM »
Quote from: Jikan on November 15, 2007, 06:27:32 PM
Is there a list of scientific achievements/accomplishments that FE science has bestowed upon the world? Oh wait, FE science has given us a list of things that are impossible, right?

Ice Wall, UA, E:NaG, and Tom Bishop.

Quote from: Jikan on November 15, 2007, 06:27:32 PM
If all modern science is based on a RE, then shouldn't you people say "thank you" to all of the world's "RE scientists?"
The discovery of DNA is based on RE?
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Dioptimus Drime

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2007, 06:34:01 PM »
TVs, computers, et cetera, are not based on the fact that the Earth is round. Thomas Edison didn't construct the lightbulb and then go, "WELL! It's a good thing the Earth isn't FLAT, because otherwise, this little fucker wouldn't work!" Graham Bell didn't go, "Oh man! I hope the Earth is round like I think it is, otherwise, this telephone would never work!"

Modern inventions have absolutely nothing to do with the Earth being roun, so give it up.

Flat Earth scientists haven't provided us with many valuble inventions, sure, but that's only because there are so few of them, and most aren't dedicated to inventing anything, but more into developing physics and experiments for the flat Earth. I really don't see your point is.

Not to mention, I don't see how "I'd rather believe a science..." has anything to do with which one is correct. All it shows is that you have a preliminary bias for one model over the other, which I'd say is a bad thing.

~D-Draw
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Jikan

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2007, 06:46:11 PM »
Quote from: Jack- on November 15, 2007, 06:33:36 PM
Quote from: Jikan on November 15, 2007, 06:27:32 PM
Is there a list of scientific achievements/accomplishments that FE science has bestowed upon the world? Oh wait, FE science has given us a list of things that are impossible, right?

Ice Wall, UA, E:NaG, and Tom Bishop.

Quote from: Jikan on November 15, 2007, 06:27:32 PM
If all modern science is based on a RE, then shouldn't you people say "thank you" to all of the world's "RE scientists?"
The discovery of DNA is based on RE?

Quote from: TheEngineer on November 15, 2007, 11:31:51 AM
Quote from: johnfrusciante on November 15, 2007, 10:09:52 AM
yeah, i'll take the word an eccentric inventor, spoken nearly two hundred years ago. 
Why not?  You RE'ers take the word of an alchemist, spoken over three hundred years ago and base almost all of modern science on it.

I missed the word, "almost." Still, to claim that "almost all of modern science" is based on a RE and then have another FEer (or non FEer, I don't care) dispute that claim shows me that FEers aren't a very close-knit group. Why is that? Oh, right, because you all believe different things:

The ice wall is 150 feet tall. No! The ice wall is 150,000 feet tall!

Tom Bishop is an example of what FE science has given to the world. NO! you cannot trust anything TB says; he is considered a joke by most FEers. Etc...

And don't get me started on the FAQ. Everytime somebody does a decent job disputing something within it, you claim that the FAQ is old and needs to be updated.

Consistancy would be nice for a change. :)
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Dioptimus Drime

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2007, 06:47:44 PM »
Scientists DISAGREEING on something?! THAT MUST MEAN IT'S WRONG. HOLY CRAP.


~D-Draw
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TheEngineer

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2007, 07:47:57 PM »
Quote from: Jikan on November 15, 2007, 06:46:11 PM
Quote from: TheEngineer on November 15, 2007, 11:31:51 AM
Quote from: johnfrusciante on November 15, 2007, 10:09:52 AM
yeah, i'll take the word an eccentric inventor, spoken nearly two hundred years ago. 
Why not?  You RE'ers take the word of an alchemist, spoken over three hundred years ago and base almost all of modern science on it.

I missed the word, "almost." Still, to claim that "almost all of modern science" is based on a RE and then have another FEer (or non FEer, I don't care) dispute that claim shows me that FEers aren't a very close-knit group. Why is that? Oh, right, because you all believe different things:

The ice wall is 150 feet tall. No! The ice wall is 150,000 feet tall!

Tom Bishop is an example of what FE science has given to the world. NO! you cannot trust anything TB says; he is considered a joke by most FEers. Etc...

And don't get me started on the FAQ. Everytime somebody does a decent job disputing something within it, you claim that the FAQ is old and needs to be updated.

Consistancy would be nice for a change. :)
I think you missed the point of that post.
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divito the truthist

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2007, 08:45:24 PM »
Science is science. There is no RE science vs. FE science. Stop being stupid.
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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2007, 10:39:52 PM »
It's all based on the same science, man!  It's like, open your mind and reach in and twist things around in there a little, man!  You have to expand your horizons to see the truth.
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James

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2007, 06:45:17 PM »
Most of the alleged scientific achievements which actually do relate to globularism (space travel, "satellite" technologies, etc.) are heinous frauds anyway.
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dysfunction

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2007, 07:14:31 PM »
What has FE science given to the world?

Well, if you want to credit the RE model with all advances made by RE-believing scientists, then we can credit most advances made before  the first millennium C.E to FE.
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James

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2007, 12:45:28 PM »
Quote from: dysfunction on November 16, 2007, 07:14:31 PM
Well, if you want to credit the RE model with all advances made by RE-believing scientists, then we can credit most advances made before  the first millennium C.E to FE.

FE science brought us agriculture, fire, the wheel, cooking...
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Username

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2007, 02:10:22 PM »
Math.
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Ladon

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2007, 02:33:31 PM »
Science depends on finding the simplest and most logical explanation for anything. If God or Flat Earth made sense in ANY situation, they perhaps they could be included in real science.
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TheEngineer

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2007, 02:34:35 PM »
Quote from: Ladon on November 17, 2007, 02:33:31 PM
Science depends on finding the simplest and most logical explanation for anything. If God or Flat Earth made sense in ANY situation, they perhaps they could be included in real science.
You think Quantum Mechanics is simple?  How about General Relativity?
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Ladon

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2007, 02:40:35 PM »
Quote from: TheEngineer on November 17, 2007, 02:34:35 PM
Quote from: Ladon on November 17, 2007, 02:33:31 PM
Science depends on finding the simplest and most logical explanation for anything. If God or Flat Earth made sense in ANY situation, they perhaps they could be included in real science.
You think Quantum Mechanics is simple?  How about General Relativity?
Quote
most logical explanation
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TheEngineer

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #15 on: November 17, 2007, 02:46:56 PM »
You think Quantum Mechanics and General Relativity are logical? 
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James

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2007, 05:35:09 PM »
Quote from: Ladon on November 17, 2007, 02:33:31 PM
Science depends on finding the simplest and most logical explanation for anything. If God or Flat Earth made sense in ANY situation, they perhaps they could be included in real science.

God doesn't make sense in any situation. Flat Earth does.

Tell me, what's more logical/simple - the comprehensively developed architecture of Universal Acceleration, or a magic invisible force with origins and underlying principles which nobody can really explain and which causes everything to pull towards everything else?
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Tom Bishop

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2007, 05:39:36 PM »
Quote
Science depends on finding the simplest and most logical explanation for anything. If God or Flat Earth made sense in ANY situation, they perhaps they could be included in real science.

What's the simpler explanation; that man has created and developed the multi-trillion dollar rocket technologies to send massive payloads into space, and that NASA can do the impossible on a daily basis and wow the nation by landing a man on the moon and sending robotic rovers to mars; or that it's all just a Conspiracy?
« Last Edit: November 17, 2007, 05:47:22 PM by Tom Bishop »
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questions

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2007, 06:30:45 PM »
Quote from: Tom Bishop on November 17, 2007, 05:39:36 PM
Quote
Science depends on finding the simplest and most logical explanation for anything. If God or Flat Earth made sense in ANY situation, they perhaps they could be included in real science.

What's the simpler explanation; that man has created and developed the multi-trillion dollar rocket technologies to send massive payloads into space, and that NASA can do the impossible on a daily basis and wow the nation by landing a man on the moon and sending robotic rovers to mars; or that it's all just a Conspiracy?

I'm fairly certain that TomB is the ONLY person on this site that will call the conspiracy "simple."

Quote from: Jikan on November 15, 2007, 06:46:11 PM
[Tom Bishop is an example of what FE science has given to the world. NO! you cannot trust anything TB says; he is considered a joke by most FEers. Etc...

No one (at any rate, I certainly hope no one) will ever say that FE giving TomB to the world was a GOOD thing.   ;D
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Ladon

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2007, 11:08:05 PM »
Quote from: Tom Bishop on November 17, 2007, 05:39:36 PM
Quote
Science depends on finding the simplest and most logical explanation for anything. If God or Flat Earth made sense in ANY situation, they perhaps they could be included in real science.

What's the simpler explanation; that man has created and developed the multi-trillion dollar rocket technologies to send massive payloads into space, and that NASA can do the impossible on a daily basis and wow the nation by landing a man on the moon and sending robotic rovers to mars; or that it's all just a Conspiracy?

When I said simple, I didn't mean simple minded.
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TheEngineer

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2007, 11:28:04 PM »
Quote from: TheEngineer on November 17, 2007, 02:46:56 PM
You think Quantum Mechanics and General Relativity are logical? 
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Ladon

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #21 on: November 17, 2007, 11:29:41 PM »
Quote from: TheEngineer on November 17, 2007, 11:28:04 PM
Quote from: TheEngineer on November 17, 2007, 02:46:56 PM
You think Quantum Mechanics and General Relativity are logical? 
Compared to something as impossible as magic, yes. They make much more sense to me.
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Username

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #22 on: November 17, 2007, 11:39:13 PM »
Quote from: Ladon on November 17, 2007, 11:29:41 PM
Quote from: TheEngineer on November 17, 2007, 11:28:04 PM
Quote from: TheEngineer on November 17, 2007, 02:46:56 PM
You think Quantum Mechanics and General Relativity are logical? 
Compared to something as impossible as magic, yes. They make much more sense to me.
Magic? Sorta like how gravity supposedly works in RE?

As Dogplatter said:
Quote
Tell me, what's more logical/simple - the comprehensively developed architecture of Universal Acceleration, or a magic invisible force with origins and underlying principles which nobody can really explain and which causes everything to pull towards everything else?

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Tom Bishop

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #23 on: November 17, 2007, 11:44:08 PM »
Quote
Compared to something as impossible as magic, yes. They make much more sense to me.

How do Relativity and Quantum Mechanics make sense when the two theories are completely and absolutely contradictory?

For example; is Gravity a bending of space-time or is Gravity a Sub Atomic particle called a Graviton?

When Modern Science cannot even tell us what gravity is, if time exists, or even be certain of my velocity and position in the universe; it's safe to say that Modern Science is completely hypothetical and is simply waiting to be replaced.
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Ladon

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #24 on: November 18, 2007, 12:06:21 AM »
Quote from: Username on November 17, 2007, 11:39:13 PM
Quote from: Ladon on November 17, 2007, 11:29:41 PM
Quote from: TheEngineer on November 17, 2007, 11:28:04 PM
Quote from: TheEngineer on November 17, 2007, 02:46:56 PM
You think Quantum Mechanics and General Relativity are logical? 
Compared to something as impossible as magic, yes. They make much more sense to me.
Magic? Sorta like how gravity supposedly works in RE?

As Dogplatter said:
Quote
Tell me, what's more logical/simple - the comprehensively developed architecture of Universal Acceleration, or a magic invisible force with origins and underlying principles which nobody can really explain and which causes everything to pull towards everything else?


Gravity is caused by a displacement in space by an object. The larger the object, the larger the displacement. If I recall, that was recorded officially a number of years ago, might have been more recent. If I have remembered details incorrectly, please correct me :)

In simple terms: the effect is similar to placing objects on a trampoline. Not bouncing them, just placing them. The more mass (not weight, that would be pretty circular), the more the trampoline is displaced. Imagine that same effect in a 3d space, and that is how gravity works.
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Username

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #25 on: November 18, 2007, 12:22:54 AM »
Quote from: Ladon on November 18, 2007, 12:06:21 AM
Gravity is caused by a displacement in space by an object. The larger the object, the larger the displacement. If I recall, that was recorded officially a number of years ago, might have been more recent. If I have remembered details incorrectly, please correct me :)

In simple terms: the effect is similar to placing objects on a trampoline. Not bouncing them, just placing them. The more mass (not weight, that would be pretty circular), the more the trampoline is displaced. Imagine that same effect in a 3d space, and that is how gravity works.
And what of gravitons?  How is this "displacement of space" transmitted?  How do you reconcile quantum mechanics and general relativity?
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TheEngineer

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #26 on: November 18, 2007, 12:24:40 AM »
Quote from: Ladon on November 18, 2007, 12:06:21 AM
In simple terms: the effect is similar to placing objects on a trampoline. Not bouncing them, just placing them. The more mass (not weight, that would be pretty circular), the more the trampoline is displaced.
Speaking of circular, what would happen to your example if there was no gravitation to begin with?
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Jack

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #27 on: November 18, 2007, 12:58:13 AM »
Quote from: Tom Bishop on November 17, 2007, 11:44:08 PM
Quote
Compared to something as impossible as magic, yes. They make much more sense to me.

How do Relativity and Quantum Mechanics make sense when the two theories are completely and absolutely contradictory?

For example; is Gravity a bending of space-time or is Gravity a Sub Atomic particle called a Graviton?
TomB is actually right about this.

Quote from: Tom Bishop on November 17, 2007, 11:44:08 PM
When Modern Science cannot even tell us what gravity is, if time exists, or even be certain of my velocity and position in the universe; it's safe to say that Modern Science is completely hypothetical and is simply waiting to be replaced.
DNA is hypothetical? So, what causes cell division? What makes us?
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Ladon

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #28 on: November 18, 2007, 01:02:06 AM »
Quote from: TheEngineer on November 18, 2007, 12:24:40 AM
Quote from: Ladon on November 18, 2007, 12:06:21 AM
In simple terms: the effect is similar to placing objects on a trampoline. Not bouncing them, just placing them. The more mass (not weight, that would be pretty circular), the more the trampoline is displaced.
Speaking of circular, what would happen to your example if there was no gravitation to begin with?
My example was just to give a most understandable graphic representation of mass displacing space. Do you mean what would happen if I tried placing objects on a trampoline without earth's gravity being involved? Because it wasn't really a very solid example if you think of it any way than graphically :P
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Ladon

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Re: What has FE science given to the world?
« Reply #29 on: November 18, 2007, 01:04:07 AM »
Quote from: Tom Bishop on November 17, 2007, 11:44:08 PM
Quote
Compared to something as impossible as magic, yes. They make much more sense to me.

How do Relativity and Quantum Mechanics make sense when the two theories are completely and absolutely contradictory?
I didn't say they made sense when combined. That's a very strange assumption...

Why didn't you mention string theory?

Quantum Mechanics and Relativity both have explanations for gravity. Only Relativity has been proven.

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,2057529,00.html

Sorry, it was NASA.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2007, 01:12:40 AM by Ladon »
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