The FE sun is impossible

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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #60 on: October 24, 2007, 07:23:13 AM »
It has also come to my attention that the Arora Borealis (northern lights) comes into play.

"Auroras are now known to be caused by the collision of charged particles (ions (+) (-) ) found in the magnetosphere, with atoms in the Earth's upper atmosphere (at altitudes above 80 km). These particles travel into space with speeds of 300 to 1200 kilometers per second. A cloud of these particles is called plasma, and a stream of plasma coming from the sun is called solar wind. These charged particles are typically energized to levels between 1 and 15 keV and, as they collide with atoms of gases in the atmosphere, the atoms become excited. Shortly afterwards, the atoms emit their gained energy as light (see Fluorescence). Light emitted by the Aurora tends to be dominated by emissions from atomic oxygen, resulting in a greenish glow (at a wavelength of 557.7 nm) and especially at lower energy levels and at higher altitudes the dark-red glow (at 630.0 nm of wavelength). Both of these represent forbidden transitions of electrons of atomic oxygen that, in absence of newer collisions, persist for a long time and account for the slow brightening and fading (0.5-1 s) of auroral rays. Many other colors especially those emitted by atomic and molecular nitrogen (blue and purple, respectively)"

"Why are there Colors in the Aurora?" University of Alaska Fairbanks website
http://ffden-2.phys.uaf.edu/211.fall2000.web.projects/Christina%20Shaw/AuroraColors.html

This solar wind is specific to the radiation emitted from a sun sustained by stellar fusion. In other words, YOU FAIL.  8)
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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #61 on: October 24, 2007, 08:34:29 AM »
Ah, non, the Flat Earth, she has a magnetic field. As long as the FE sun works in the same way as the RE sun (which it can't) then it will still give off solar wind, which still produces the aroras.

Although, exactly where the south pole of the earth's magnetic field is, we do not know.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #62 on: October 25, 2007, 07:23:29 AM »
My point exactly. Studies on the Arora Borealis show that the sun emits radiation specific to stellar fusion. Stellar fusion uses immense gravity, heat, etc.

Conclusion: FE model broken. :o
« Last Edit: October 26, 2007, 08:17:55 PM by L0gic »
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Conspiracy Mastermind

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #63 on: October 25, 2007, 02:08:16 PM »
It was broken the day it was made. It's a factory fault, but the warranty has run out. Such a shame.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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ChiefConspirator

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #64 on: October 25, 2007, 02:10:02 PM »
Didn't they hear? There was a recall in, like, 1882?
I've never seen any round earth. Why should I believe in something I've never seen?

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #65 on: October 25, 2007, 02:12:32 PM »
Yes, but that expired in 1900. They wouldn;t take it back, they just kept hitting it screaming "Work damn you! Work!"
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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Conspiracy Mastermind

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #66 on: October 26, 2007, 12:52:59 AM »
He'll just make a really long post that has no answers.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #67 on: October 26, 2007, 08:14:55 PM »
bump.
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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #68 on: October 26, 2007, 08:26:18 PM »
Tom Bishop, I dare say your attention is required here. Basically everything posted since your last post is directed to you.

Heh.  You fuckin' kids crack me up.   ;D
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?

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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #69 on: October 27, 2007, 01:53:47 PM »
bump.
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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #70 on: October 27, 2007, 01:56:42 PM »
I'm sure that Tom Bishop would reply, but theEngineer would probably be better suited to actually answer our question.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

?

Loard Z

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #71 on: October 27, 2007, 05:46:01 PM »
I'm sure that Tom Bishop would reply, but theEngineer would probably be better suited to actually answer our question.

No, this is a classic case of defeated Bishop. He knows there's no way out, so he's going to copy and paste his usual stuff in some other threads, until he's defeated there, too.
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ChiefConspirator

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #72 on: October 28, 2007, 11:15:13 AM »
Another case of Tom Bishop running away with his tail between his legs:

http://theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=17694.40
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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #73 on: October 29, 2007, 04:38:45 AM »
bump.
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John Davis

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #74 on: October 29, 2007, 02:10:06 PM »
Its a property of aether.
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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #75 on: October 30, 2007, 04:56:49 AM »
Its a property of aether.
What makes you think aether exists?
Don't say its a medium for light because that's a property of light.
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John Davis

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #76 on: October 30, 2007, 05:50:22 AM »
What makes you think it doesn't?

Einsteins work explicitly states the need for ether.  As does ae-theory and quantum mechanics.   Are you saying we should throw those out?
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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #77 on: October 30, 2007, 06:34:43 AM »
I just don't like to justify observed phenomenons with unproven concepts. My own common knowledge is in agreement with the statement:
"The general attitude to this amongst physicists today seems to be that Einstein's comments don't count because they stretch the idea of aether theory too far: it is argued that a "non-particulate" aether theory is not really an aether theory, or at least, it doesn't correspond to the idea of "historical" aether theory that is currently taught."

It was a speculative tangent for a potential explanation. No factual experimental evidence (that I have heard of) proves it existence. This is not nearly enough to base an entire debate on when the RE theory has no need for special properties to trick our senses. That like stating a lamp post, four feet away on a clear day in temperate weather, a mirage before mirages were proven to exist. Except mirages do exist.

Einsteins work states a need for a solution and aether was merely a possibility he thoroughly examined.

Besides, how can you attribute this effect to aether without more knowledge of what it is? I assume you don't completely understand what it is. If I'm wrong, can you explain what non particulate aether is?
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John Davis

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #78 on: October 30, 2007, 06:48:21 AM »
I just don't like to justify observed phenomenons with unproven concepts. My own common knowledge is in agreement with the statement:
"The general attitude to this amongst physicists today seems to be that Einstein's comments don't count because they stretch the idea of aether theory too far: it is argued that a "non-particulate" aether theory is not really an aether theory, or at least, it doesn't correspond to the idea of "historical" aether theory that is currently taught."
The word ether is frowned upon, true, however the concept has been used elsewhere.

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It was a speculative tangent for a potential explanation. No factual experimental evidence (that I have heard of) proves it existence. This is not nearly enough to base an entire debate on when the RE theory has no need for special properties to trick our senses.
Because it tricks our senses it is less true?  What? 

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That like stating a lamp post, four feet away on a clear day in temperate weather, a mirage before mirages were proven to exist. Except mirages do exist.
Worst analogy ever.

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Einsteins work states a need for a solution and aether was merely a possibility he thoroughly examined.

Besides, how can you attribute this effect to aether without more knowledge of what it is? I assume you don't completely understand what it is.
What else do you suggest is refracting the light in this way?

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If I'm wrong, can you explain what non particulate aether is?
Yes I can, but it has been shown that there is particulate aether too.  And yes, I understand what both are.  However, I am not here to do your research.  You should know what a particle is.
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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #79 on: October 30, 2007, 07:05:47 AM »
...

So night could not possibly happen in FE. The suns light, since it travels in all directions, will hit the atmosphere at the right angle in the right place to get to the ground on the side of the earth that should be "dark".

Tom,

Can you please respond to this diagram. It appears to blow you refraction theories out of the water (if there there was indeed that much refection taking place).

MS
I haven't performed it and I've never claimed to. I've have trouble being in two places at the same time.

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #80 on: October 30, 2007, 07:10:17 AM »
That diagram would be true if the FE sun were spherical. However, that is merely a theory, since the actual shape of the FE sun and how it works has not been solidified, so we cannot debate whether it is right or wrong. My diagram shows that the sun in FE cannot be spherical and emit light in all directions.
So, the hypothesis is now that the sun is a spotlight, however how such an object would function is again in the realms of speculation, because FE does not have an explanation for the workings of an FE sun. Until it does, the theory is flawed and therefore wrong.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #81 on: October 30, 2007, 08:31:28 AM »
I just don't like to justify observed phenomenons with unproven concepts. My own common knowledge is in agreement with the statement:
"The general attitude to this amongst physicists today seems to be that Einstein's comments don't count because they stretch the idea of aether theory too far: it is argued that a "non-particulate" aether theory is not really an aether theory, or at least, it doesn't correspond to the idea of "historical" aether theory that is currently taught."
The word ether is frowned upon, true, however the concept has been used elsewhere.
Where has it been used? Perhaps you could enlighten me.
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It was a speculative tangent for a potential explanation. No factual experimental evidence (that I have heard of) proves its existence. This is not nearly enough to base an entire debate on when the RE theory has no need for special properties to trick our senses.
Because it tricks our senses it is less true?  What? 
You're saying aether refracts the light to make the sun appear the same size throughout the day, right?
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Worst analogy ever.
Perhaps.  :D
My intent is still to show how ridiculous using pure speculation to justify reality is.
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Einstein's work states a need for a solution and aether was merely a possibility he thoroughly examined.

Besides, how can you attribute this effect to aether without more knowledge of what it is? I assume you don't completely understand what it is.
What else do you suggest is refracting the light in this way?
I'm suggesting that the light basically isn't being refracted. RE model doesn't require it.
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Quote
If I'm wrong, can you explain what non particulate aether is?
Yes I can, but it has been shown that there is particulate aether too.  And yes, I understand what both are.  However, I am not here to do your research.  You should know what a particle is.
I know what a particle is. That's not what I'm asking. Are you saying that aether is nothing more than the existence of scarce particles above the atmosphere? How has it been shown?
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John Davis

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #82 on: October 30, 2007, 12:51:22 PM »
Where has it been used? Perhaps you could enlighten me.
I meant, scientists would rather call something "quantum foam" or "dark energy" or whatever instead of calling it aether, just because it has gotten, and forgive me, a "bad rap".

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You're saying aether refracts the light to make the sun appear the same size throughout the day, right?
No, I didn't. 

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I'm suggesting that the light basically isn't being refracted. RE model doesn't require it.
You are right, perhaps the RE model is a tiny bit more elegant in this regard.  This doesn't make it correct, though.  The question though, which I should have stated clearer, should have been: what else could explain it in a FE model?

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I know what a particle is. That's not what I'm asking. Are you saying that aether is nothing more than the existence of scarce particles above the atmosphere? How has it been shown?

The existence of a non-particulate aether follows directly from Einstein's work.  The existence of of a particulate aether is shown in quantum physics.  Furthermore, you have other examples of aether concepts such as dark energy etc scattered about.

So no, I am not saying that.  It seems to be much more.
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ChiefConspirator

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #83 on: October 30, 2007, 01:06:53 PM »
The existence of of a particulate aether is shown in quantum physics.

What aspect of "quantum physics" shows this?
I've never seen any round earth. Why should I believe in something I've never seen?

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Conspiracy Mastermind

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #84 on: October 30, 2007, 01:10:33 PM »
Back to the topic.
So far: It has not been established how the FE sun works,
therefore the theory does not work.
It works in RE, due to known science.
Therefore RE > FE.

Come on FE'ers, fight for what you believe!!
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #85 on: October 30, 2007, 01:37:24 PM »
Its a property of aether.
Quote from: l0gic
You're saying aether refracts the light to make the sun appear the same size throughout the day, right?
No, I didn't.

What's a property of aether then?

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You are right, perhaps the RE model is a tiny bit more elegant in this regard.  This doesn't make it correct, though. The question though, which I should have stated clearer, should have been: what else could explain it in a FE model?
I don't think anything explains the FE model while obeying the laws of physics  :( .

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Quote
I know what a particle is. That's not what I'm asking. Are you saying that aether is nothing more than the existence of scarce particles above the atmosphere? How has it been shown?

The existence of a non-particulate aether follows directly from Einstein's work.  The existence of of a particulate aether is shown in quantum physics.  Furthermore, you have other examples of aether concepts such as dark energy etc scattered about.

So no, I am not saying that.  It seems to be much more.

What is the 'much more'?
"Aether" seems to be a rather broad term much like "radiation" is a broad term.
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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #86 on: October 30, 2007, 01:38:22 PM »
Back to the topic.
So far: It has not been established how the FE sun works,
therefore the theory does not work.
It works in RE, due to known science.
Therefore RE > FE.

Come on FE'ers, fight for what you believe!!

But YES! Back to topic since aether is not responsible for the appearance of the sun.  :D
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Conspiracy Mastermind

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #87 on: October 30, 2007, 03:48:05 PM »
Although apparently it is.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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Iskaros

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #88 on: October 31, 2007, 05:39:19 AM »
I have said this once I will say this again

I declare victory discussion closed.
"Always take an oblique approach" General Flavius Belisarius

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Re: The FE sun is impossible
« Reply #89 on: October 31, 2007, 06:07:59 AM »
It's not your place to declare that, tbh. As much as I like seeing the FE community squirm, they have the right to put up their argument. In this case, an explanation of how the FE sun works, which is the topic of this thread.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.