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Round Earth Brainwashing

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I am not Tom Bishop but I can't prove it

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Round Earth Brainwashing
« on: April 26, 2007, 05:58:03 PM »
I have a question for all you round earth theorists...

When was the first time you "learned" that the earth was round?  Did you one day question the shape of the earth and go out and find out on your own?  Or did you turn to mommy and daddy?  Or ask your teachers?  Or did someone else bring it up to you the first time?  And what did you say to them?  Did you agree?  And if you didn't at the time, what happened?  Were you punished for it?

What I'm getting at is all of you guys have been brainwashed since a young age to distrust your senses.  How about the first time you saw "curvature" on the beach?  Did your mom and dad point to the horizon and say, "Look, you can see the curvature!"  I bet they did.  I doubt any kid went running to mommy and daddy saying, "The earth is round!!!!  I saw curvature!!!"

From a very young age, humans have been taught what to see, hear, smell, feel, think.  "Don't trust your senses, it's just an illusion."  "Scientists discovered that the earth is round by writing formulas.  Don't you think it's silly that people used to think the earth is flat?  You never thought that right?  You're not like those foolish people right?"

It's brainwashing, make no mistake about it.  Stop relying on others to tell you what to believe.  Question those who pick and choose their beliefs but stop you from choosing yours.  Learn to pick what is right for you.  Learn to question.
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Mr. Ireland

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2007, 06:02:57 PM »
I can't remember back that far, I can't remember ever thinking the shape of the earth as being anything but round.  As for being brainwashed, I think that book of Earth: Not a Globe does a good job of that.  There is nothing wrong with accepting what has been shown to us by various space organizations, rather than screaming "CONSPIRACY!1!!".
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I am not Tom Bishop but I can't prove it

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2007, 06:04:08 PM »
Exactly, you can't remember.  You just remember the earth was always round.  You just gobbled up whatever was dished out to you at the time.
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∂G/∂x

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2007, 06:05:10 PM »
It's not foolish to trust others, but as you say it is equally important to conduct your own investigations. Hence my photographic proof of RE thread, which is being ignored right now. Scientists didn't discover anything by writing formulas, they did it by doing science (formulas are involved). This distrust of mathematics is as baseless as your religious devotion to Rowbotham's (now falsified) experiments. Trusting your senses, while a neat romantic concept, can never be the basis of a science. If you trust your senses, you must refuse to believe in atoms, molecules or even viruses and bacteria, as none of these can be perceived by human senses. Trusting your senses entirely might also lead you to believe that police sirens really do increase their pitch as they approach...when does it end?
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Mr. Ireland

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2007, 06:05:34 PM »
And realized how true it was later, as indirectly mentioned later in my post.
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sokarul

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2007, 06:07:44 PM »
I remember int he third grade we learned about all the planets.  So I would of know the world was round before then. 
I have a question for you Truthseeker, at what time did you fall asleep in class when they were teaching science?
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∂G/∂x

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2007, 06:09:15 PM »
12:45 I expect. He slept through the whole of break too, and Arnold Jones stole his lunch money!

Conclusion: Flat Earth
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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2007, 06:16:21 PM »
Quote from: Gin on April 26, 2007, 06:05:10 PM
It's not foolish to trust others, but as you say it is equally important to conduct your own investigations. Hence my photographic proof of RE thread, which is being ignored right now. Scientists didn't discover anything by writing formulas, they did it by doing science (formulas are involved). This distrust of mathematics is as baseless as your religious devotion to Rowbotham's (now falsified) experiments. Trusting your senses, while a neat romantic concept, can never be the basis of a science. If you trust your senses, you must refuse to believe in atoms, molecules or even viruses and bacteria, as none of these can be perceived by human senses. Trusting your senses entirely might also lead you to believe that police sirens really do increase their pitch as they approach...when does it end?

I don't know this Rowbotham.  You are again confusing me with Tom.  But you are so certain we are one and the same that you no longer question this, along with your belief that the earth is round.

If the basis of science is not about trusting your senses, then what is it based on?  How does one determine the validity of something?

And I love how you said that if one trusts his senses entirely then there is no end to what one can question.  This just says it all.  You pick and choose a belief system so that you can explain everything and feel good about it.  It has nothing to do with the truth.  You want to decrease the level of anxiety you feel.  A world which contains things you cannot explain is too scary for you to live in.  So you hold on to these gobbly gook theories as if for dear life, convinced that this is truth.  After all, what would you do if turned out to be a big lie?  You'd probably freak out and run screaming out of your house.  Because having to trust your own senses and think for yourself is just too freightening a thought.  Easier to just go along with this program that the government has successfully brainwashed you into believing.
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∂G/∂x

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2007, 06:20:03 PM »
Whose government? Stop talking about my government!

Your post was, again, very romantic. However, I don't think you really got anywhere with it. Trusting your senses above an instrument that is more accurate is just plain foolhardy. If you trust your senses then how are you sure of a conspiracy? What sensory evidence indicates one? (Not the means for one or the possibility of one, the presence of one - been through that with Tom).

Incidentally I don't really care whether you and Tom are the same person or just as silly as each other, my point stands.
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Quote from: Proverbs 24:17
Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, and let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth.
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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2007, 06:29:53 PM »
Quote from: Gin on April 26, 2007, 06:20:03 PM
Whose government? Stop talking about my government!

Your post was, again, very romantic. However, I don't think you really got anywhere with it. Trusting your senses above an instrument that is more accurate is just plain foolhardy. If you trust your senses then how are you sure of a conspiracy? What sensory evidence indicates one? (Not the means for one or the possibility of one, the presence of one - been through that with Tom).

Incidentally I don't really care whether you and Tom are the same person or just as silly as each other, my point stands.

An instrument that is more accurate?  This an assumption you make.  How do you test to make sure an instrument is more accurate than a human being?  And is it even possible for a human being to create an instrument that is more truthful than its creator?

I am sure of a conspiracy because these "truths" that I am told about does not correspond to the reality I live in.  I don't notice any "curvature" when I drive into work in the morning.  I don't sense that the earth is supposedly whirling around on its axis, hurtling through space.
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∂G/∂x

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2007, 06:31:27 PM »
I know that a ruler estimates centimetres better than I do...
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Quote from: Tom Bishop
The universe has already expanded forever

Quote from: Proverbs 24:17
Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, and let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth.
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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #11 on: April 26, 2007, 06:35:02 PM »
But it's not entirely of the ruler's doing... you have to hold it to the object, keep it still, read the measurement, etc... With a formula or some computer, you just stick in some values and out comes the "truth."  I don't buy it...
« Last Edit: April 26, 2007, 06:37:32 PM by TruthSeeker »
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∂G/∂x

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2007, 06:37:26 PM »
A computer is just a very complicated ruler, if you understand the metaphor. You may not understand or trust technology but that doesn't mean it is not scientifically useful.
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Quote from: Tom Bishop
The universe has already expanded forever

Quote from: Proverbs 24:17
Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, and let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth.
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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2007, 06:41:17 PM »
The farther away the technology is from me, the less I am a participant and more just the receiver of information, the less I trust the information.  After all, how do I know it is accurate?  There is no way for me to confirm the truthfulness of it.
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∂G/∂x

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2007, 06:43:02 PM »
Good for you. I wouldn't drive if I was you, unless you can build a car. In fact, don't use the internet! Who knows what might happen with all this lying technology?
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Quote from: Tom Bishop
The universe has already expanded forever

Quote from: Proverbs 24:17
Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, and let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth.
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I am not Tom Bishop but I can't prove it

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #15 on: April 26, 2007, 06:47:23 PM »
We take risks everyday in life.  I just try to keep mine to an absolute minimum.  I go along with the program in as much as I go to work, get a paycheck, etc., but when it comes to believing that the earth is round and Everest is the tallest and the speed of light is the fastest, I question.  None of this directly impacts my life.  Which incidentally is why the government picked these things to distort because they are so far removed from the daily activities of man.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2007, 06:51:17 PM by TruthSeeker »
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∂G/∂x

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2007, 06:52:10 PM »
You are the silliest FEer I've ever seen. Don't say I'm saying that because I can't answer your post. You have no evidence to back up your assumptions. None at all. Even Tom throws the book. You're book-free and evidence-free.
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Quote from: Tom Bishop
The universe has already expanded forever

Quote from: Proverbs 24:17
Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, and let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth.
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Agent_0042

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2007, 07:07:26 PM »
Quote from: Gin on April 26, 2007, 06:52:10 PM
You are the silliest FEer I've ever seen. Don't say I'm saying that because I can't answer your post. You have no evidence to back up your assumptions. None at all. Even Tom throws the book. You're book-free and evidence-free.

Because Tom realized the book doesn't work, but doesn't want to admit it yet. So he gets his alter ego to do it.
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I am not Tom Bishop but I can't prove it

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #18 on: April 26, 2007, 07:08:02 PM »
Quote from: Gin on April 26, 2007, 06:52:10 PM
You are the silliest FEer I've ever seen. Don't say I'm saying that because I can't answer your post. You have no evidence to back up your assumptions. None at all. Even Tom throws the book. You're book-free and evidence-free.

My brain is my book and my senses are my evidence.

So at least you can now see the truth that I am not Tom.  There may be hope for you after all.  It's quite obvious that although Tom and I both believe the earth is flat, we come at it from very different angles.  But we still have more in common with one another than any of you round earth people, because we believe in these fundamental truths:

1. The only way to get to the truth is by relying on your own observations.
2. One of these truths is that the earth is flat.
3. There is a conspiracy to deny your senses and the truths that result from your observations because the government wants to control us.  Round earth theory is part of this conspiracy.
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cbarnett97

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #19 on: April 26, 2007, 07:16:39 PM »
Well if you only trust your senses then why do you believe that there is an ice wall, or why do you believe that the sun, moon and all the stars are so close and why do you belive that there is no gravity? It sounds to me that you have undergone a bit of brainwashing yourself.
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Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.
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I am not Tom Bishop but I can't prove it

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #20 on: April 26, 2007, 07:21:43 PM »
Quote from: cbarnett97 on April 26, 2007, 07:16:39 PM
Well if you only trust your senses then why do you believe that there is an ice wall, or why do you believe that the sun, moon and all the stars are so close and why do you belive that there is no gravity? It sounds to me that you have undergone a bit of brainwashing yourself.

This is the first good question I've ever heard on here by a round earth theorist.  Thank you, I really mean that.  The existence of an ice wall, the distance of sun, moon, and stars, etc, are not set in stone as far as I'm concerned.  Since what has been proposed so far by other flat earth theorists fit into my world view, I more readily accept it.  But I'm open to the idea that this could prove to be false in the future.  Perhaps this is where Tom and I differ.

But still, those fundamental truths that I spoke of earlier are HARD FACT DISCOVERIES.  On this point, I'm sure Tom stands shoulder to shoulder with me.

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Angelflesh

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #21 on: April 26, 2007, 07:27:26 PM »
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1. The only way to get to the truth is by relying on your own observations.

Wrong. A person's senses often deceive them. Hallucinations, mirages, phantom limbs, even ringing in your ears or deja vu, and many other examples. If all i ever trusted was my own senses, i would end up with anything but the truth. Tom can even agree with me with his numerous "illusions" that we RE'rs call evidence.

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2. One of these truths is that the earth is flat.

You need to explain, how using only your senses, you with out a doubt proved a flat earth.

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3. There is a conspiracy to deny your senses and the truths that result from your observations because the government wants to control us.  Round earth theory is part of this conspiracy.

This has nothing to do with your senses. This is just the only conclusion you can come up with because of your belief in a flat earth.
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cbarnett97

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #22 on: April 26, 2007, 07:29:04 PM »
Now I have used this argument before but if you have your nose right against a wall it would seem that the wall goes on forever when in reality it does end, this is because you are too close to see the big picture. This is where your senses will fail you, but if you step back a few feet, you would see an entirely different reality. This is the same with our planet, when you are on the surface you perceptions point to a flat earth but if you were to go up high enough then you would percieve a round earth So just because you cannot see something that does not mean it does not exist. It would be like saying that since I have never been to china it must not exist and anyone who mentions it must be lying to me.
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Big N

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #23 on: April 26, 2007, 07:31:55 PM »
The thread Big 3 of RE disproves a flat earth, and it makes the round earth look pretty believable at the same time.
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It's quite remarkable really that both Israel and Palestine have no qualms about slaughtering the crap out of each other - but they are perfectly willing to work together jovially and hide a secret that wouldn't make much difference to the world. -rdethgy
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Tom Bishop

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #24 on: April 26, 2007, 07:37:25 PM »
Your "Big 3" were accurately explained in full 150 years ago.  ::)
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I am not Tom Bishop but I can't prove it

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #25 on: April 26, 2007, 07:38:03 PM »
The argument that my senses can fail me is a valid one.  And yes, it is possible that my senses are deceiving me.  But I would argue the same applies to round earth theorists.  In their case, their "senses" (i.e. formulas, computers) can be deceiving them.  It's a matter of what you believe in more, your senses, or some computer spitting out mumbo jumbo formulas.

To prove the earth is flat, I did the beach-horizon-take-a-picture-draw-a-straight-line-using-a-ruler test.  I know you guys will say it's just an illusion, but I believe this isn't the case.  I believe computers and mathematical formulas are producing an illusion.

My evidence for a conspiracy is not direct evidence, yes I'll admit that.  It's not like I came across some document that spelled this all out.  But based on the fact that the majority of the world believes in something which I consider to be an illusion and I believe that my senses are not deceiving me, I conclude that there is conspiracy to cover up the truth.  I can't think of another explanation.
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Agent_0042

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #26 on: April 26, 2007, 07:44:44 PM »
Quote from: Tom Bishop on April 26, 2007, 07:37:25 PM
Your "Big 3" were accurately explained in full 150 years ago.  ::)

By the same book which says this:

Quote from: Earth Not a Globe
The light of the moon is damp, cold, and powerfully septic; and animal and nitrogenous vegetable substances. exposed to it soon show symptoms of putrefaction. Even living creatures by long exposure to the moon's rays, become morbidly affected. It is a common thing on board vessels going through tropical regions, for written or printed notices to be issued, prohibiting persons from sleeping on deck exposed to full moonlight, experience having proved that such exposure is often followed by injurious consequences.

It is said that the moon has a pernicious effect upon those who, in the East, sleep in its beams; and that fish having been exposed to them for only one night, becomes most injurious to those who eat it.

At Peckham Rye, a boy named Lowry has entirely lost his sight by sleeping in a field in the bright moonlight.

If we place in an exposed position two pieces of meat, and one of them be subjected to the moon's rays, while the other is protected from them by a screen or a cover, the former will be tainted with putrefaction much sooner than the other.

Professor Tyndall describing his journey to the summit of the Alpine Mountain, Weisshorn, August 21st, 1861, says: "I lay with my face towards the moon (which was nearly full), and gazed until my face and eyes became so chilled that I was fain to protect them with a handkerchief."

Try again.  ::)
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cbarnett97

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #27 on: April 26, 2007, 07:45:59 PM »
Quote from: TruthSeeker on April 26, 2007, 07:38:03 PM
The argument that my senses can fail me is a valid one.  And yes, it is possible that my senses are deceiving me.  But I would argue the same applies to round earth theorists.  In their case, their "senses" (i.e. formulas, computers) can be deceiving them.  It's a matter of what you believe in more, your senses, or some computer spitting out mumbo jumbo formulas.

To prove the earth is flat, I did the beach-horizon-take-a-picture-draw-a-straight-line-using-a-ruler test.  I know you guys will say it's just an illusion, but I believe this isn't the case.  I believe computers and mathematical formulas are producing an illusion.

My evidence for a conspiracy is not direct evidence, yes I'll admit that.  It's not like I came across some document that spelled this all out.  But based on the fact that the majority of the world believes in something which I consider to be an illusion and I believe that my senses are not deceiving me, I conclude that there is conspiracy to cover up the truth.  I can't think of another explanation.

Related to your beach test see my earlier post, a further example of how the perception can be false would be in physics: When you are calculating an electric field the charge you are measuring can always be assumed to of infinite size because your "Test Charge" will always be so close that its length will always seem to be infintie with relation to the charge.
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Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.
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akira

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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #28 on: April 26, 2007, 07:50:55 PM »
I can't believe this idiot created a thread with such low arguments in it. Go back to school.
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Re: Round Earth Brainwashing
« Reply #29 on: April 26, 2007, 07:53:58 PM »
Quote from: cbarnett97 on April 26, 2007, 07:45:59 PM
Quote from: TruthSeeker on April 26, 2007, 07:38:03 PM
The argument that my senses can fail me is a valid one.  And yes, it is possible that my senses are deceiving me.  But I would argue the same applies to round earth theorists.  In their case, their "senses" (i.e. formulas, computers) can be deceiving them.  It's a matter of what you believe in more, your senses, or some computer spitting out mumbo jumbo formulas.

To prove the earth is flat, I did the beach-horizon-take-a-picture-draw-a-straight-line-using-a-ruler test.  I know you guys will say it's just an illusion, but I believe this isn't the case.  I believe computers and mathematical formulas are producing an illusion.

My evidence for a conspiracy is not direct evidence, yes I'll admit that.  It's not like I came across some document that spelled this all out.  But based on the fact that the majority of the world believes in something which I consider to be an illusion and I believe that my senses are not deceiving me, I conclude that there is conspiracy to cover up the truth.  I can't think of another explanation.

Related to your beach test see my earlier post, a further example of how the perception can be false would be in physics: When you are calculating an electric field the charge you are measuring can always be assumed to of infinite size because your "Test Charge" will always be so close that its length will always seem to be infintie with relation to the charge.

And I would say valid illusions in real life would be dreams (no, I don't believe what is happening in my dreams are real), the illusion of water on a hot road, etc.  These are encountered in daily life.  But the earth being round, or Everest being the tallest, or light being the fastest is not something I encounter.
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