GPS again.

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #240 on: October 24, 2007, 08:47:54 AM »
How dare you! I do not back anything up! However, I shall try to do so.
Don't know exactly how much each ground-based station would cost, so will call this x.
Don't know exactly how much each satellite would cost, so will call this y.

So, if FE were to be GPSed using ground-based stations (GBS for short) then, the following would apply:
>Each station has a maximum operational radius of about 35 miles. That covers an area of 3848.4510006474967171167381445174 miles2.
> The total SA of flat earth is (based on a diameter of 24,900 miles) 486954715.28805192644480588101678 miles2
>So, the number of stations (minimum) required x is the total area divided by the area each can cover.
This comes out at 126533 stations (rounded to the nearest one). So, 126533x.

If FE were to be GPSed using satellites (or stratolites, since satellites won't work) then one stratolite could theoretically see the entire plane of the earth if high enough. So, use 3 with known positions to enable triangulation, gives us 3y.

In order for the two to be of equal cost, y would have to be 42,177 times more expensive than x.

My maths and logic are probably full of holes, but you can apply the same to RE using area = 4pi*r2. 3 stratolites are a minimum requirement, you'll probably need more, and you would need more GBSs because their ranges would have to intersect.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
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TheEngineer

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #241 on: October 24, 2007, 09:06:55 AM »
>Each station has a maximum operational radius of about 35 miles.
Why?


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yarbsea

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #242 on: October 24, 2007, 09:21:11 AM »
How dare you! I do not back anything up! However, I shall try to do so.
Don't know exactly how much each ground-based station would cost, so will call this x.
Don't know exactly how much each satellite would cost, so will call this y.

So, if FE were to be GPSed using ground-based stations (GBS for short) then, the following would apply:
>Each station has a maximum operational radius of about 35 miles. That covers an area of 3848.4510006474967171167381445174 miles2.
> The total SA of flat earth is (based on a diameter of 24,900 miles) 486954715.28805192644480588101678 miles2
>So, the number of stations (minimum) required x is the total area divided by the area each can cover.
This comes out at 126533 stations (rounded to the nearest one). So, 126533x.

If FE were to be GPSed using satellites (or stratolites, since satellites won't work) then one stratolite could theoretically see the entire plane of the earth if high enough. So, use 3 with known positions to enable triangulation, gives us 3y.

In order for the two to be of equal cost, y would have to be 42,177 times more expensive than x.

My maths and logic are probably full of holes, but you can apply the same to RE using area = 4pi*r2. 3 stratolites are a minimum requirement, you'll probably need more, and you would need more GBSs because their ranges would have to intersect.

3 sat's for triangulation is not enough for anything but an approximation of your position. Good enough for your car to "snap" your automobile to a road that it has programmed in it, but not for any "real" navigation. Look up some GPS setups for flying, most can acquire up to 12 sat's at a time. Cant' fly GPS approaches without at least 5 in most systems, and even then it's degraded.

Oh, and whoever thinks that GPS only would work with sat's is dumb. Sorry, I know there ARE sat's up there that run most of the signals, but again it's just most. Look up wide-area precisino enhancing landing systems related to GPS approaches at airports. Also look into land-based GPS precision enhancment stations on the ground. Ground based signals are used alot to enhance precision, because commercial GPS is "fudged" and the device can't decrypt the portion of the signal that the military/gov is using to get better accuracy.

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Brennan

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #243 on: October 24, 2007, 09:40:29 AM »
Like I said. 


Seems like we have another TheEngineer in our midst.
Fixed :)
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cpt_bthimes

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #244 on: October 25, 2007, 10:37:34 AM »
a couple of questions have gone unanswered, and gotten lost in the insults.

1: why do we have to point satellite dishes to a certain fixed point in the sky, if not to aim at geostationary or geosynchronous satellites?  esp. the ones that networks use which people (like a buddy of mine) pilfer which require huge dishes and precise aim.

2: what are all those points of light, that travel across the sky after sundown and before sunup on dark nights? you'd have to try hard not to see them, when lying on the ground in the middle of the desert.

3: what happened to the "pseudolite" argument, seems like that was just abandoned by the fe'ers when they couldn't bend it enought to fit their belief. now they invoke the magic word "stratolites", which is so far a vaporware pipe-dream. (but the must be working, they'd say, because the earth is flat which is therefore proof they exist.)

trust me, gps uses satellites. when you are in the middle of the pacific ocean, or in the middle of a barren wasteland with nothing man-made within a 200 mile radius, and all that bombed and shelled to powder, you tend to think there isn't another way to locate to within sub-meter accuracy. 

btw just to clarify for fellow re'ers, gps satellites are in low-earth, not geostationary orbits, and so cross the sky pretty quickly. that's why it takes so many of them to have at least three in line-of-sight at any given time and place on earth, even in mountain valleys. they also do require clocks, incredibly accurate atomic clocks that even have general relativity written into the algorithm to compensate for the earth's gravitational distortion as well as their own orbital velocity, because it's the differentials between the clocks due to speed of light, which gps receivers calculate.

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Conspiracy Mastermind

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #245 on: October 25, 2007, 02:22:13 PM »
>Each station has a maximum operational radius of about 35 miles.
Why?

Because that is apparently as far as we can see, according to FE dirty air theory. There is no quote for Radio waves I think, so I used that. The alternative is that they can reach every point on FE if placed high enough.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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narcberry

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #246 on: October 25, 2007, 05:46:10 PM »
>Each station has a maximum operational radius of about 35 miles.
Why?

Because that is apparently as far as we can see, according to FE dirty air theory. There is no quote for Radio waves I think, so I used that. The alternative is that they can reach every point on FE if placed high enough.


You're an embarrassment to our species.

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Tom Dipshit

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #247 on: October 25, 2007, 07:43:06 PM »
>Each station has a maximum operational radius of about 35 miles.
Why?

Because that is apparently as far as we can see, according to FE dirty air theory. There is no quote for Radio waves I think, so I used that. The alternative is that they can reach every point on FE if placed high enough.


I am an embarrassment to our species.
QFT
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Narcberry (smarticus): "Oceans are free from gravity."

Z' Lord of Purple: "yes, superfast jet streams for the win!!!"

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Conspiracy Mastermind

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #248 on: October 26, 2007, 12:58:21 AM »
>Each station has a maximum operational radius of about 35 miles.
Why?

Because that is apparently as far as we can see, according to FE dirty air theory. There is no quote for Radio waves I think, so I used that. The alternative is that they can reach every point on FE if placed high enough.


I am an embarrassment to my species.

I know you are. Until someone can tell me how far a radio transmission can travel on FE, that's the best estimation I can come up with. However, since it will be exactly the same as on RE, about 100Km, you can redo the calculation with that.
Radio waves are very different to visible light, they are low-energy long-wavelength, they are more penetrating than visible light, so could travel further in dirty air, you can see through clouds with radio waves.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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Misfortune

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #249 on: October 26, 2007, 07:00:36 AM »
You're an embarrassment to our species.
What, monkies?

That's what you are anyway. Nobody else would think that oceans float.


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divito the truthist

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #250 on: October 26, 2007, 07:02:44 AM »
And nobody intelligent would actually believe him.
Our existentialist, relativist, nihilist, determinist, fascist, eugenicist moderator hath returned.
Quote from: Fortuna
objectively good

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Conspiracy Mastermind

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #251 on: October 26, 2007, 12:32:51 PM »
However, we have thrown an intellectual blunder by thinking we can actually get Smarticus to think, at all.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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Misfortune

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #252 on: October 26, 2007, 01:57:49 PM »
However, we have thrown an intellectual blunder by thinking we can actually get Smarticus to think, at all.
So the only conclusion to this is: Smarticus does not have brains.

Although i think that was commonly known already.


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narcberry

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #253 on: October 26, 2007, 02:11:09 PM »
I got a perfect score on the ACT's which I didn't even study for because I was too busy banging your mom, who is actually a totally fat hag, right before I scored the winning touchdown in overtime at my local highschool which totally turned on the whole cheerleading squad so I banged them all too and filmed it so I could sell it later and make millions which I have already but I can use a couple more so whatever.

While I was doing that, you were thinking for two hours about how you could burn me on the internet and all you could come up with was:

Smarticus does not have brains.

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Misfortune

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #254 on: October 26, 2007, 02:19:36 PM »
I got a perfect score on the ACT's which I didn't even study for because I was too busy banging your mom, who is actually a totally fat hag, right before I scored the winning touchdown in overtime at my local highschool which totally turned on the whole cheerleading squad so I banged them all too and filmed it so I could sell it later and make millions which I have already but I can use a couple more so whatever.
And still you think that oceans should float. Also, remember a topic called "Shoe results are in!"?

You're funny.

Plus, you're terribly incorrect. My mom is not fat.

Quote
While I was doing that, you were thinking for two hours about how you could burn me on the internet and all you could come up with was:

Smarticus does not have brains.

Again, you're terribly incorrect. It actually took me 3600 times less.


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narcberry

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #255 on: October 26, 2007, 02:26:51 PM »
Actually she is fat, and has a vaginal growth. You should tell her to see a doctor. It was pretty disgusting.

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Misfortune

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #256 on: October 26, 2007, 02:29:39 PM »
...And there he was, with no brains, telling his boring test results he has no evidence he actually made, and at the same time, flaming my mom hopelessly like a 10-year old.

 ::)


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Conspiracy Mastermind

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #257 on: October 26, 2007, 03:10:24 PM »
Indeed. Well, back on topic, eh chaps?
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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Username

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #258 on: October 26, 2007, 03:23:36 PM »
I don't see how there is anything else to discuss.
If ou can't argue both sides, you understand niter

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Conspiracy Mastermind

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #259 on: October 26, 2007, 03:26:39 PM »
No. We seem to have covered everything, satellites and stratollites can perform the same function, so GPS can function on FE. I think that's about it.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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Misfortune

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #260 on: October 27, 2007, 02:30:20 AM »
So now let's move to the next topic: Why is Smarticus so god damn stupid.


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Conspiracy Mastermind

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #261 on: October 28, 2007, 05:05:05 AM »
Bcause, when he was a child, a ladybird stole most of his brain.
Quote from: Tomcooper84
there is no optical light, there is just light and theres no other type of light unless you start talkling about energy saving lightbulbs compared to other types of light bulbs
ENaG: Evidence Not a Guarantee.

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Torn Bishop

Re: GPS again.
« Reply #262 on: October 28, 2007, 06:04:42 AM »
Bcause, when he was a child, a ladybird stole most of his brain.
She tried at least, she was cheated.

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Winky

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #263 on: October 20, 2008, 02:09:50 AM »

You guys really are funny. Stratollites instead of satellites? You do realise that Stratollites themselves require GPS in order to keep themselves in a known position?  From your own wiki link...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stratellite (Performance section)
Navigation: 6 onboard GPS units connected to the ship's engines

So, your argument that GPS works using stratollites is a bit daft as stratollites use GPS (from satellites!)

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Parsifal

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #264 on: October 20, 2008, 02:10:59 AM »
You guys really are funny. Stratollites instead of satellites? You do realise that Stratollites themselves require GPS in order to keep themselves in a known position?  From your own wiki link...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stratellite (Performance section)
Navigation: 6 onboard GPS units connected to the ship's engines

So, your argument that GPS works using stratollites is a bit daft as stratollites use GPS (from satellites!)

Prove that stratellites can't stay in one place without GPS. And when I say "prove", I mean something more substantial than linking to Wikipedia.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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Parsifal

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #265 on: October 20, 2008, 05:44:09 AM »
Providing quotes doesn't make you right. If you're going to argue that stratellites need GPS to stay where they are, you'll need to provide reasons why they can't do so without it.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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Parsifal

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #266 on: October 20, 2008, 06:33:13 AM »
You'll need to provide reasons why they can't do so without it.

No I won't. That's your job. If you claim that SansWire are lying when they say they're using GPS you'll need to provide evidence that they're lying, then provide evidence of how they're commiting this deception.

I'll remind you that SansWire Corp are a publicly listed stock, whose value will be quite sensitive to rumour. This being the case they probably take defamation very seriously.

I'm not saying they're lying.
I'm going to side with the white supremacists.

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Dr Matrix

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #267 on: October 20, 2008, 06:50:15 AM »
A stratolite could just use triangulation from ground stations to keep its location constant, especially over a flat Earth.
Quote from: Arthur Schopenhauer
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

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ﮎingulaЯiτy

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #268 on: October 20, 2008, 09:14:45 AM »
If I was asked to imagine a perfect deity, I would never invent one that suffers from a multiple personality disorder. Christians get points for originality there.

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Dr Matrix

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Re: GPS again.
« Reply #269 on: October 20, 2008, 09:26:01 AM »
Are you saying that's what Sanswire are doing?

I have no idea what they're doing, if I'm honest, I hadn't even heard about them before reading this thread.  I'm just saying it's possible.
Quote from: Arthur Schopenhauer
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.