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Messages - st james

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Quote from: BiJane
The obvious question would be whether or not it's reasonable to accept the idea of NASA and every other space agency lying, but that's too lengthy a topic to go into. As far as going through the thermosphere goes, ships designed to go into space are going incredibly fast. their exposure is minimal: dropping something into a hot environment doesn't immediately bring it to that temperature, it has to heat at a certain rate. Shuttles and spacecraft are certainly robust, and that in addition to the short time in which they're in the thermosphere renders it, at the very least, possible to get through

its mainly NASA....if not exclusively them....AFAIK, they got a "strangle-hold" on all the info'.....we either get stuff solely from them or filtered through them;

the other prblm is that the thermo-sphere goes for hundreds of's no "quick passage" through it.....which, of course, rules out the moon landings and satellites being launched out of Earth's atmosphere into inter-stellar space.....but....others besides FETs have debunked and dismissed the moon landings on other grounds....

also: that ISS is, supposedly, floating around in the thermo-sphere....."in orbit" there.....that sounds mighty 'suss' to me...and, again, in fact, many FETs maintain that the ISS is a total hoax any-way....all the 'shots'/footage being staged in either special, zero-G air-craft or done in under-water tanks.....

i'm not sufficiently au fé with the physics of the thermo-sphere to even speculate on whether any man-made object (let alone a human being!) could survive in it.....except to say that, from a lay-man's perspective, it seems very unlikely and the 'explanations' given are less than convincing.....   ::)

For your desired 15-20 degrees, we need an altitude from 710km to 945km, which is about what I expected: 15 to 20 degrees is a lot

well....that 'rules out' any amateur rocket or balloon then......   :(

There are other ways to examine the shape of the Earth, some mathematical (I did a post a while ago on how the weather systems we see won't develop without RET's rotation), some physical, but the latter kind are apparently meaningless if you're happy to dismiss any and all evidence contrary to your view as doctored or faked

its only the photographic and film footage that is, usually, dismissed as doctored or faked....

the primary problem with the mathematical calculations is that, in many of them, AFA i can tell, the distance of the Earth from the Sun comes into it.....and.....of course....many FETs don't accept the 93mlln miles figure or wht-ever it is.....

a good example is that 'calculation' that was done a coupla thousand yrs back in Egypt by some ancient Greek using sticks....he calculated the circ of the Earth plus the distance to the anomaly is, apparently, easily explainable if, as many FETs do, you accept that the Sun is less than 40miles in diameter and much closer....only a few hundred klmtrs altitude......(maybe that's why the thermo-sphere is so hot, eh?) ???
its a conundrum to be sure, eh?!?

Quote from: BiJane
The question is how much curvature would be conclusive, for you

@ least 15-20°, i'd say, eh? be "conclusive"...

unfortunately, there's some-what of an impasse here, though.....especially vis á vis NASA;

i don't think i need to remind you that many FETs consider them a bunch of congenital liars.....

above 120klmtrs alt', there is an atmospheric layer called "the thermosphere" where temps rise to excess of 2000°C.....that's blast-furnace levels.....

the "official explanation" is that these mind-blowing temps wouldn't and don't effect any man-made vehicles....

of course.....many FETs don't accept this.....

so....@ the end of the day......the FETs claim that NASA never goes above 120klmtrs and that, ergo, most of their photos/footage is concocted.....

that presents a problem if, as you claim, you would have to go to @ least triple that alt' to notice any significant curvature.....

the only qstn here is.....are yr "back-of-the-envelope" calcs accurate?

Flat Earth General / Re: "concave" Earth
« on: January 31, 2015, 04:41:40 AM »
honestly, i don't think any-one would take his claims of being "the reincarnated Christ" seriously...maybe not even him.....  ???

apropos the "glass in the sky" claim....

LSC asserts that the 'evidence' for this are these things called megacryotite meteors or some-thing.......they are usually found in the latitudes of the Sahara Desert/Egypt....around that area, i think....

oh....and...also....there are historical records of giant chunks of ice (over 50klgrms!) having fallen from the sky.....

he claims that this is ice that has formed on the 'glass ceiling' and, then, fallen down...

he's got a Y-tb vid out there.....with all his stuff in it.....goes for abt 7hrs or so....

ah....ha ha...there's an interesting bit in it where he actually interviews some NASA fellow (a scientist or engineer or some-thing) and ties him up in knots.....its worth looking @ just for that alone, eh?   ;)

Flat Earth General / Re: a question for iWitness
« on: January 31, 2015, 03:51:19 AM »
if you "check out" the Y-tb vid' i linked to in another post ("Bible Skeptic"), then, yes, i think this pretty much represents the Biblical perspective....

i think the 'classical medieval' perspective is this....

(maybe Dante mentions it too...its a while since i read it though)

Flat Earth General / "concave" Earth
« on: January 31, 2015, 03:38:23 AM »
just wondering what people here thought of "the concave Earth theory"?

here is this fellow's FB...... ;

i'v looked @ his stuff a bit.....and he's got pretty much every-thing figured out AFA his 'theory' goes.....

but....i think he's got the same "problem" that FETs level against a RE.....
i.e: the oceans would just 'fall off' a spherical Earth;
i guess that, with a concave Earth, they would all fall to the bottom of the 'bowl' as it were.....

(interestingly, apparently, many WWII German scientists ascribed to this theory)

Quote from: BiJane
A good way to prove a flat Earth, should be something that could also prove a round Earth

NASA et al regularly fly space shuttles &c up to 100klmtrs altitude;

they also 'transmit' footage from that altitude which shows a spherical Earth;

footage from a balloon or amateur rocket @ the same alt' or nearly the same would, again, provide conclusive proof.....

i would have to investigate my-self what the min' alt' to see the spherical curvature of the Earth would be but i doubt if it would be that much....

if its less than, say, 10mls or 16/17 klmtrs, then, the Y-tb vid of the "Red Bull"-sponsored amateur rocket is, in and of itself, pretty conclusive, i'd say.... :-\

Flat Earth Debate / Re: GLOBAL CONSPIRACY
« on: January 30, 2015, 11:46:46 PM »
Quote from: ausGeoff
As a lifelong atheist....

a life-long FOOL would be more likely.....

I've never had any personal issues with theists or agnostics. I'm very much of the "live and let live" school of relationships

except when they start presenting evidence and facts to justify their beliefs....then.....the gloves come off, right? i guess that's why they held that atheist conference in yr neck of the woods some years back, eh?.....the low moral quality of the people attending that farce matches the low moral quality of the country in general i guess, eh?  ::)

I do however get seriously pissed off when people such as iWitness, and now this st james character start in with their religious sermonising on what's nominally a science-based forum.

do you own  this Forum?
if not, then who are you to say what should and shouldn't be posted, eh?

This is definitely not the place for theists to endlessly quote biblical scripture
uh....what "biblical scripture" did i "endlessly quote"?

or make any attempts to conflate science and religion
define "science";
define "religion";

I'm also aware that a great many contemporary scientists are also theists;  Freeman Dyson comes to mind immediately for one.  In that sense, science and religion are not incompatible—one doesn't necessarily diminish the relevance of the other.  Imperious religious zealotry is another thing altogether though.

so....go yr own way....
i couldn't care LESS what happens to this world or the next!

oh....BTW....."atheism" IS a religion......(see here)
does that make you a hypocrite also?

Quote from: BiJane
I think the real challenge would be to show those court cases are 'bogus', but even beyond that, what you say remains irrelevant.

!Google! up "Ian Plimer"....he was the atheistic so-&-so involved in the "Ron Wyatt" case in Australia.....this might get you (or any-one who's interested) started......

if my posts are totally irrelevant and 'off topic', then, doubtless, i will be rebuked by the 'mods' here.....

Plenty of REers are theists, plenty of FEers non-theists

i agree....
but.....their (the REs') position is totally untenable and indefensible and, in fact, they do Christianity (at least) more harm than good by trying to concoct bogus, ad hoc explanations.....the same could probably be said for Islam;

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">this series of Y-tube vidz' is, IMHO, invaluable in demonstrating this......

and as for whether or not the expedition is a scam, Pongo asked for $4 million months ago, has yet to provide any budget, or any indication he's put any effort into this beyond once googling a completely different expedition (maybe five minutes of work) seems a quite trivial allegation when compared to the massive frauds perpertrated by various God-hating atheists and secular humanists around the world....but, of course, most of them get off scot free because the whole wordly establishment is enslaved by "the God of this world".....locked into a matrix from which they are unwilling or unable to escape from.....   :(

that said....i believe the easiest way to prove a flat Earth would be to fund some sort of amateur balloon or rocket to go up to, say, almost 100klmtr/60miles altitude....with a bank of good, HD cameras....transmitting 'live' feed.....

if the Earth is "flat as" from that altitude....then....AFAIMC.....its case closed!

Flat Earth Debate / Re: GLOBAL CONSPIRACY
« on: January 30, 2015, 05:05:02 AM »

uh......."personal insults and offensive language"?

don't you mean content that challenges your politically correct, pseudo-marxist, God-hating garbage "world view" ?.....which seems to be the national "religion" of your country, eh?

You need to be made aware that these forums are nominally science-based, and are not intended to act as a platform for religious proselytizing.  Science and religion are not compatible, and religion has no place in any serious scientific debate.

excuse me!
but if the FET is true...which seems likely (although i am still not fully convinced of it, quite frankly), then, science and THE BIBLE (note i said "the Bible", not "science and religion) are 100% compatible .....although, admittedly, other texts such as the Q'uran and the Bhagavada Gita [sic?] also have a claim.....

here i would like to direct some thanks to a Y-tb channel run by "Bible Skeptic" who pointed out the innumerable Biblical verses that speak of a flat Earth....unequivocally....and of the ludicrous if not absurd antics of "apologists" who do extreme violence to the Scriptures by trying to say OTW....

No scientist, or person of a scientific bent believes in the existence of supernatural entities and paranormal phenomena—as you obviously do.

i'm not 100% sure what you mean by "paranormal phenomenon", but if yr referring to scientists who believe the's FIFTY of them's a nice little "deconstruction" of the village idiot atheist critique of such "paranormal phenomenon" as miracles

All your postings thus far have been nothing more than thinly-disguised religious and racist diatribes which have no relevance or bearing on the content of any of these forums.

they've got every bearing....or...@ least as much bearing as yours have....i seen through your agenda pretty much straight away.....

and....don't try to beat me over the head with ad homs like "racist"...i couldn't give a STUFF if people think i'm "racist"  (a 'term' invented by a God-hating, marxist psychopath, incidentally!)....i'm only interested in the facts....

you see.....and this applies not only to "scepticmatic" (?) has previously pointed out.....why are people like YOU even on this Forum, eh?

if you think the FET is so absurd.....then....there are other venues that would suit you better.....

personally....i think it is because you are very, very afraid that it might, just might be true....and.....if so.....then....the Bible or, @ least, monotheism, must, ipso facto, also be true.....and.....that leaves you where?....standing accountable for your life before some sort of holy and awesome Being?.....i guess that makes you and yr ilk a tad uncomfortable, eh?

Please go away.  Thank you.

maybe you should take yr own advice! thank-you!

Quote from: BiJane
If you can back up what you've said, do so. None of what you've said is related to the topic at hand, though: whether or not the proposed expedition to Antarctica, to see whether or not it matches the FE definition, is genuine, a scam, or a joke. It's not a free pass to talk about any hypothesized conspiracy.

the assertion of the OP was that this FE expdtn was "a scam".....

that implies some sort of illegal activity.....or....that it might well be illegal;

my counter-claim was that such allegations are frequently levelled by members of the atheist, secular humanist establishment to shut people they don't like up and to shut them down.....

i cited two examples of such: Ron Wyatt and Kent Hovind......

there were  bogus court cases initiated against them in Australia and the US respectively.....
(although, in the case of Ron Wyatt, i think it was against his Australian representative and the ministry he ran)

any-one can get prelim' info' on those two from Wiki.....

If necessary......i can then provide further elaboration and back-ground info' myself......if required.....

Quote from: BiJane
There's a philosophy, religion and society section. Your posts may be more at home there, given you've added nothing to the discussion here beyond assertion

i can back up every-thing i'v said, if necessary....

i maintain that its relevant to the OP's claim here of "illegal scams"....if not directly relevant, then, certainly relevant as a warning

Yours, a god-hating (just about), feminist, bisexual atheist.

who are you talking about? your-self?

Flat Earth Debate / Re: GLOBAL CONSPIRACY
« on: January 30, 2015, 02:26:37 AM »
Quote from: ausGeoff
Low content;  off-topic;  personal insults;  offensive language.  Let's see if the moderators do their job as they should with his comments.

uh......."personal insults and offensive language"?

don't you mean content that challenges your politically correct, pseudo-marxist, God-hating garbage "world view" ?.....which seems to be the national "religion" of your country, eh?!?   ::)


Quick summary of FE expedition funding...

•  In six months only Pongo has donated $1,300.
•  As he's effectively only holding his own money, no IRS laws have been breached.
•  No other person has yet donated any money at all.
•  To date only 0.0325 percent of the $4 million has been raised.

once again, its the typical tactic of atheist/secular humanists to use shaky and bogus laws to attack those that upset them some-how.....

good examples of that are the legal persecution of the late Ron Wyatt by a violent, atheist professor in your country and, in the US, the totally unjust imprisonment of Kent Hovind [sic?]

then, we have total nonsense like "racial/religious" vilification laws
(usually only utilised by a certain exclusive, super-privileged and super powerful ethnic minority group ........although, some would call them a criminal GANG)

and.....that old "stand-by".....bogus allegations of decades-old incidences of "child abuse".....the Catholic Church is a target of this.....and....again.....has been viciously attacked in your country by the usual gang of suspects.....atheists, God-haters, radical feminists, homo-sexuals and those "shilling" for the afore-said powerful and sinister ethnic minority group......  :-X

Flat Earth Debate / Re: GLOBAL CONSPIRACY
« on: January 29, 2015, 08:04:29 PM »
just wondering if any-one here has "checked out" those Y-tb vidz which show a flat Earth horizon from several miles up......   ???

there is one with a balloon that went up to, i think, over 35klmtr altitude and another with an amateur rocket that went up to abt 30klmtr altitude......

all clearly showed the Earth "as flat as a pan-cake"  :-X

(the balloon Y-tb vid' was of a flight/ascent sponsored by Red Bull drinks, i think)

the secular-humanist/atheist brigade and their fellow travellers are well known for using elastic if not out-right bogus laws to shut down their opponents;

of course: they're total hypocrites because the many orgs/funds/associations/trusts/what have you that adhere to/promote their "party line" and are, many times, crooks and psychos' of the worst order, always get a free pass and a get-out-of-gaol free card!  :(

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