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Messages - doyh

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61
You know, the fact that you decide what you want to do in the morning kinda means that you have control over your destiny.  The secretary you went out with the night before did not somehow influence you to feel that this morning you just want an apple, not cereal.


Oh really? Even if you don't realize it, you will have had a reason for the choice. Perhaps it is because you were raised in such a way that you cannot stand monotony. Or maybe you are missing vital nutrients that are provided by apples. The human body has been known to do things like that.

How can you account for personal responsibility and emotion?

Well, like I said before, you are still responsible. If you shoot a man while drunk, you still shot a man. I don't see why this is different.

But you said everything is determined to happen, so how can you hold anyone reasonable for what they do? They had absolutely no control over what they were doing according to you. How is anyone blame worthy for their actions when they didn't have a choice in what they did?

Because even if you were influenced by others, you still made a conscious decision. I suppose this could be a good argument for rehabilitative punishment instead of incapacitation, with the exception of societal protection (terms by Wikipedia), but if you have the personality type that allows you to break the law, you should be punished as at the very least a deterrence. Also, this isn't any different from things such as mental problems. It could be argued that the guy that shot Congresswoman Giffords didn't really know what he was doing, but he's still going to jail for a long time.

But you didn't make a conscious decision. According to you, everything is determined, which means that the man was determined to end up shooting that woman and it was completely out of his control. If you are determined to be born in a certain place, determined to be influenced by certain people, determined to think in a certain direction, how can you say that someone chose to do something. How can they be responsible for something that they had no control over? They were gonna end up doing it before they were even born according to your determinism.

I didn't say that everything is determined. That implies a higher power doing the determining. I said that we are unable to make our own choices because everything about us has been shaped by external factors.

62
Flat Earth General / Re: Flat earth??
« on: January 15, 2011, 09:20:14 PM »
Tom, which is easier to falsify, a few experiments in one book (which predates space flight by almost 100 years) or all of data, technology, photographs and science from all of the world's various space programs?

It's easier to fake a space mission than to conduct one.

That isn't what I asked you.  Do I need to invoke the rif.org link?

You asked me if it was easier to fake a space program or whether it was easier to run a space program.

The answer is that it's easier to fake one.

No Tom, I asked you if it's easier to fake a book or to fake a space program.

I can fact-check and verify the claims of ENAG, which I and others have done. I can verify the claims of a space program for between a million and 150 dollars, depending on my method.

So the answer is that it's much easier to fake reality than it is to fake a book.

Fixed. And Tom, as I've told you several times without response, refraction caused those results.

63
Flat Earth General / Re: Myth of the Flat Earth
« on: January 15, 2011, 09:17:36 PM »
None of those things were taught in my highschool.

Elementary, Middle, and High Schools are definitely still teaching the things that I mentioned.

For example; Government schools have not started teaching that fluoride is bad for you, that it causes neurological and muscular problems and causes cancer, not to mention not helping teeth. The US and British governments still maintain that fluoride is good for you in many areas of health. If the government ever did admit that fluoride was a toxin they would be sued into oblivion for putting poison into the water supply.

You seriously believe that? That myth started during the age of McCarthyism, and they said it was a communist conspiracy involving mind control. Tom, I'm starting to think that you're nothing but a conspiracy theorist.

http://jdr.sagepub.com/content/86/5/410
Is this enough proof for you? Or is it more conspiracy?

Well, like I said, the government continues to maintain that flouride is healthy and effective, despite many numerous stdies showing otherwise.

From the article -

Authors:

S.O. Griffin, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
E. Regnier, Defense Resources Management Institute, Naval Postgraduate School
Corresponding Author - sig1@cdc.gov

So yes, in other words. Conspiracy.

The government isn't going to publish anything admitting that fluoride is dangerous. If they did such a thing they would get sued into oblivion for putting poison in the water supply.

You don't understand how the scientific community works, do you? The government gives this man a grant, and he releases his findings. He keeps any money he does not use. The government doesn't decide whether or not to post it. If they did, it would be a bigger deal than poisoning the water supply.

64
You know, the fact that you decide what you want to do in the morning kinda means that you have control over your destiny.  The secretary you went out with the night before did not somehow influence you to feel that this morning you just want an apple, not cereal.

Oh really? Even if you don't realize it, you will have had a reason for the choice. Perhaps it is because you were raised in such a way that you cannot stand monotony. Or maybe you are missing vital nutrients that are provided by apples. The human body has been known to do things like that.

How can you account for personal responsibility and emotion?

Well, like I said before, you are still responsible. If you shoot a man while drunk, you still shot a man. I don't see why this is different.

But you said everything is determined to happen, so how can you hold anyone reasonable for what they do? They had absolutely no control over what they were doing according to you. How is anyone blame worthy for their actions when they didn't have a choice in what they did?

Because even if you were influenced by others, you still made a conscious decision. I suppose this could be a good argument for rehabilitative punishment instead of incapacitation, with the exception of societal protection (terms by Wikipedia), but if you have the personality type that allows you to break the law, you should be punished as at the very least a deterrence. Also, this isn't any different from things such as mental problems. It could be argued that the guy that shot Congresswoman Giffords didn't really know what he was doing, but he's still going to jail for a long time.

65
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Plagerism.
« on: January 15, 2011, 08:29:39 PM »
But why is the citation condition necessary? If the learning, and experience aspects have been met, what makes requiring self-citations necessary? What's important about indicating whether or not you got credit for some of your ideas in the past? The teacher should not care about what other graders may have thought. And confidence in the ideas is already shown by turning it in.  ???

Remember, the main purpose of education is not to simply show off knowledge of particular facts or concepts, it is also to teach the student how to articulate their understanding about a topic and think critically. What this means is that practice is necessary in order for a student to develop precisely these skills. Additionally, the purpose of education is to broaden a student's understanding of the world in general, which involves the investigation of topics in many different ways, not just one which a particular student already understands.

What I'm trying to say is students can demonstrate critical thinking in one essay, and then duplicate it, but they are not fulfilling the requirement of critical thinking in the latter. I'd say that other than pure memorization work, which does occasionally occur in mathematics lectures and other subjects like that, assignments almost always require the demonstration of understanding and application.

Rewriting a paper is not thinking critically.

66
Flat Earth General / Re: What then?
« on: January 15, 2011, 08:27:10 PM »
I'm curious to know, what excuse are you going to come up with when people go up to space in the Virgin Galactic and see a round Earth? Brain washing? Accidently flying into an alternate dimension where the Earth is round? Someone slipped acid in the passengers' drinks?


Actually yes you are correct. There are two dimensions in existance now. In one the earth is a round sphere, in another the earth is an infinite plain.

Are you taking my transdimensional internet idea seriously?

67
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Plate Tectonics?
« on: January 15, 2011, 08:25:08 PM »
Dude, take a look at Pangea map. It's a puzzle that does not fit. Well it fits by the solo ego of the mainstream scientific community lol

Look at an actual map. The East coast of America fits almost perfectly into the West coast of Europe.

68
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Plate Tectonics?
« on: January 15, 2011, 07:53:02 PM »
then why are the himalayas still growing? and how would you explain folding rock formations? you cant deny these basic facts. the earths movement is observed and can been seen all over. how would you explain the fosilised sea life in the middle of a continent? i sopose nasa planted them there  ???


Himalayas are still growing? Oh boy same people that tell us we came from aples spew this non sense. James is right, the continents never joined together and Pangea is another lie from mainstream science. Google the map of Pangea and take a good look! The continents don't even fit together. Scientists did a very poor job of squeezing them all into one giant landmass. Shame!

Then why can you put all the continents together? And yes, they are. Every time someone climbs Everest, they set a world record. I think that it increases at four inches a year or something like that.

69
You know, the fact that you decide what you want to do in the morning kinda means that you have control over your destiny.  The secretary you went out with the night before did not somehow influence you to feel that this morning you just want an apple, not cereal.

Oh really? Even if you don't realize it, you will have had a reason for the choice. Perhaps it is because you were raised in such a way that you cannot stand monotony. Or maybe you are missing vital nutrients that are provided by apples. The human body has been known to do things like that.

How can you account for personal responsibility and emotion?

Well, like I said before, you are still responsible. If you shoot a man while drunk, you still shot a man. I don't see why this is different.

As for emotion, that is a factor created by a mix of genetics and external forces, and is thus a good example of what I am saying.

70
hm...let's give it a bit to see if he responds

Sorry. Forgot I'd posted here for a while.

71
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Guns and Such
« on: January 15, 2011, 07:44:52 PM »
Why can the American government not issue shoppers with a vest to stop the bullets?

Gabrielle Giffords was shot in the head.

72
Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Affluence Argument
« on: January 15, 2011, 06:56:22 PM »
I would argue that not spending the money on the children is criminally negligent manslaughter and compare it  to standing next to a man about to jump off a roof, and not stopping him because you would ruin your day talking to the police.

73
Flat Earth General / Re: Flat earth??
« on: January 15, 2011, 06:46:15 PM »
Markjo and Romer ---- two irritating trolls from the RE side of the track that probably should be banned.

But they probably won't ban you, I GUESS it's not your fault, you've just swallowed the fecal matter that NASA and the science community have spewed.

But remember this, they laughed at old Al at first.  He was laughed at for over 30 years when he first said that the continents were drifting.   

Read it and weep, round-headed round earthers:
http://www.ucmp.berkeley.edu/history/wegener.html

Where are you going with this? And FET still doesn't accept this.

74
Flat Earth General / Re: evidence of a flat earth
« on: January 15, 2011, 06:43:13 PM »
I think what he's trying to say is that the space between the subatomic particles of an atom is a vacuum.

Yes. We aren't saying that gas is a vacuum, we're saying that the area between particles is. To use more familiar objects, it's like saying that the area between planets (RET) is a vacuum. We are not saying that the universe is one.

75
Flat Earth General / Re: evidence of a flat earth
« on: January 15, 2011, 06:35:27 PM »
Sorry, forgot to actually post the link to the article. Here it is: http://www.cracked.com/article/105_the-6-most-frequently-quoted-bullshit-animal-facts_p2

76
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Plate Tectonics?
« on: January 15, 2011, 06:33:37 PM »
again thats just a THEORY, just like flat earth THEORY. so it isnt actual fact but and educated guess so to speak. but movement in the earths crust is fact. there are solid facts too, i have seen this myself and im not a scientist

No, it's a theory like the theory of evolution.

77
Flat Earth General / Re: Help needed on my UA project
« on: January 15, 2011, 01:53:05 PM »
Quote from: Tom Bishop
Read the FAQ.

I can quote through time!

78
Flat Earth General / Re: Conspiracy motivation
« on: January 15, 2011, 01:31:49 PM »
Gotta agree with the last part.

79
Flat Earth General / Re: Help needed on my UA project
« on: January 15, 2011, 01:22:32 PM »
Because we are earthed. :)

Correct.

Then shouldn't my hair stick up when I jump?

How high did you jump?

Does it matter?

Yes, because if you didn't jump high enough you might still be in the photoelectric field which exists between the earth and sun.

Well, I did a cliff dive once. That high enough?

80
Flat Earth General / Re: Conspiracy motivation
« on: January 15, 2011, 01:20:44 PM »
Mounted along the ice wall in Antarctica where they are unseen and protected. Its why your TV satellite dish points south.

>implying the signals from a tower can reach over 10,000 miles.
Of course lol. The earth is flat! There is nothing to stop the transmissions. Its all LOS.

AT&T loses a lot of customers over this conspiracy.

81
Flat Earth General / Re: Conspiracy motivation
« on: January 15, 2011, 12:59:53 PM »
Mounted along the ice wall in Antarctica where they are unseen and protected. Its why your TV satellite dish points south.

I have Comcast, unfortunately. And those towers need to have massive range.

82
Flat Earth General / Re: Conspiracy motivation
« on: January 15, 2011, 12:52:35 PM »
To say that gps does not exist is an extremely nonsensical thing to say. Of course it exists. It is seen daily by millions in their cars. There is an actual, tangible device that you can hold in your hand. Not only does this device in the dash of my car exist in the sense that there actually is a device in the dash of my car, and is not just an hallucination, it also tells me how to get where I want to go from where I am at the time I ask for directions. If what you said was just a poorly thought out way to imply that it's just another piece of the puzzle in some vast conspiricy, you would first have to backtrack and say that this is what you meant, and then offer some plausible explaination for how this device does what it so obviously does. How does this device determine my location if not from the air?
GPS exists, of course it does.   I dont think he meant to say what he said - the point is, satellites are NOT what makes GPS work.  THAT is part of the conspiracy.

GPS works by triangulation, the "GPS" signals come from towers all over the planet.   It works just like the wiki page says in a mathematical way - but there are to "birds" in the sky.   It's all done from beacons right here on the earth.



Where are they?

83
Flat Earth General / Re: Will Anyone Else Miss FET?
« on: January 15, 2011, 12:45:44 PM »
I'm sorry but how are they supposed to simulate several minutes of zero gravity?

No need to appologize, they will simply drill a hole through the earth and drop the "shuttle" in. Once it decends so far, it will deploy UA catching wings and be accelerated upwards.  Then it's just a matter of catching the "shuttle" with a net.  

Of course. No one will notice this. Won't they feel themselves hitting the net?

Sure, but it will feel like touching down on a runway.

No. A plane touching down doesn't feel like hitting a net made of Spectra. Also, you'd die.

84
Flat Earth General / Re: Conspiracy motivation
« on: January 15, 2011, 12:19:50 PM »
The IRS are part of the conspiracy.

That makes a hell of a lot more than 445 people. Also, it seems to assume that one person is enough to contrrl the entire GPS industry.

GPS does not exist. It is a creation of the conspiracy.
To say that gps does not exist is an extremely nonsensical thing to say. Of course it exists. It is seen daily by millions in their cars. There is an actual, tangible device that you can hold in your hand. Not only does this device in the dash of my car exist in the sense that there actually is a device in the dash of my car, and is not just an hallucination, it also tells me how to get where I want to go from where I am at the time I ask for directions. If what you said was just a poorly thought out way to imply that it's just another piece of the puzzle in some vast conspiricy, you would first have to backtrack and say that this is what you meant, and then offer some plausible explaination for how this device does what it so obviously does. How does this device determine my location if not from the air?

Do a quick search for psuedolites and stratalites.  They don't say GPS does not exist but that they technology is not satellite based but a function of multiple differing methods to simulate a satellite system.  The GPS works - its a conspiracy that it uses satellites.

Berny
Back from work - going to work.


That would require thousands of engineers to ne in on the conspiracy. Not 45 random people in high places.

85
Flat Earth General / Re: Will Anyone Else Miss FET?
« on: January 15, 2011, 12:06:16 PM »
This thread is a bit like someone predicting the end of the world. Its a really silly thing to do.

If FET ever did go the way of the dodo (although all the signs are the movement is gathering pace), then who would read this thread? There would be no FET for people to think hmmmm. He got that prediction right. But conversely if FET stands the test of time, well he gets made to look a bit silly.
Like the end of the earth, its making a bet you don't want to win. :(

Are you reading this? We aren't speculating about the end of FET. It decayed into people baselessly accusing Virgin Galactic of High Fraud.

86
Flat Earth General / Re: Will Anyone Else Miss FET?
« on: January 15, 2011, 11:39:22 AM »
I'm sorry but how are they supposed to simulate several minutes of zero gravity?

No need to appologize, they will simply drill a hole through the earth and drop the "shuttle" in. Once it decends so far, it will deploy UA catching wings and be accelerated upwards.  Then it's just a matter of catching the "shuttle" with a net. 

Of course. No one will notice this. Won't they feel themselves hitting the net?

88
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Plate Tectonics?
« on: January 15, 2011, 10:54:57 AM »
Plate tectonics is quite simply a myth. The continents have always been much as they are today, they certainly didn't split apart from one giant continent like globularists claim!

Then how do you explain earthquakes? And the whole "the Earth is still changing" thing?

89
Flat Earth General / Re: Will Anyone Else Miss FET?
« on: January 15, 2011, 10:52:18 AM »
Virgin Galactic seems quite sure.

Are you privy to Virgin Galactic's plans?

Through the use of elementary deduction, yes you could say so.

Sounds more like wild speculation to me.

Speculation based on the strictest, and thereby most compelling, principles of reasoning.

Only by comparison to daydreaming while high.

90
Flat Earth General / Re: evidence of a flat earth
« on: January 15, 2011, 10:46:28 AM »
Nope.


That's random too.

I have to go to bed but you can read more on the full moon problem here. RErs in the past were forced to concede there is no such thing as a full moon in RET.
http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=43884.msg1087346#msg1087346

Anticyclonic tornadoes are consistent with RET.
Not in the direction this video shows.

not nessecarily, you said not on small things so prove it, don't be ridiculous, hollywood and they don't exist ... in that order.

really must go.

Not on small objects because other things such as imperfections in bathtubs. Atoms operate in perfect vacuums, and thusly do not have this problem.

It is not ridiculous. Read up on how bees fly.

Hollywood: What do you mean?

Satellites: Didn't think before putting that down.

In that order.

Atoms are in a vacuum? Not on earth the are not. Not where they would be subject to atmospheric Coriolis. (If it existed lol)
Hollywood ... I'll do another time because the one below is more interesting
So, an expert on how bees fly huh?
How do bees fly?
I charge you with the fact that bees cannot fly!

http://scienceray.com/biology/zoology/bees-cant-fly/
http://www.jimloy.com/physics/bee.htm
http://www.ftexploring.com/askdrg/askdrgalapagos.html
http://insects.ummz.lsa.umich.edu/mes/notes/entnote10.html

You may accept that bees cannot fly, or concede scientists just haven't got a clue how they fly. Therefore negating your argument that Coriolis is involved in bee flight and that we know all about it. We don't even know how they get airborne!



The idea that bees cannot fly was made by a somewhat respectable scientist while drunk, and stuck for some reason. Here is a Cracked.com article on the subject. It also has several other interesting myths, such as piranhas being able to eat a cow in under a minute. They create a low pressure vvortex thing under them, which propels them.

As for atoms working within a vacuum, what would you call the space between atoms?

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