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Messages - Fred

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1
Flat Earth Debate / Re: Rowbotham's style of logic
« on: July 19, 2011, 01:11:53 PM »
Over the course of 30 years of intensive study Rowbotham performed experiments which have demonstrated on numerous occasions that there is no curvature to standing water, disproving the Round Earth theory.

Is it not standard in the scientific community that one's experiments are only considered valid if they can be duplicated by other reputable scientists? It seems unlikely that no other scientist would be willing to attempt to verify a theory that has merit. The only conclusion to draw is that all other scientists believe Rowbotham's "proofs" were invalid. Even the craziest religious tenets have numerous supporters. Support for a flat earth theory is completely absent.

Regarding the notion of curvature on standing water, there's a lake near my home that is about two miles across. I'll bet that on calm waters, with a row boat, a six foot stick, and good binoculars, I could providing convincing proof of my own that there is curvature on standing water.

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Flat Earth General / Re: I am beginnging to doubt the existence
« on: November 06, 2009, 06:59:13 AM »
If you too want to have a private chat, do it via private messaging system. This is not a sleepover, girls.
Here's a private message for you: don't get your panties in a wad. Are you the forum Nazi?

Kick me out if you want to. I don't give flying fig.

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Flat Earth General / Re: I am beginnging to doubt the existence
« on: November 05, 2009, 01:46:40 PM »
Mike:

How brutal of you to have a spinning globe as your avatar. That's like dangling a nice, juicy steak in front of a vegetarian...

4
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Vision
« on: November 03, 2009, 03:54:47 PM »
the thing I don't get is why do people think the earth is so special, it's coincidence that the planet happened to have the right climate for life to start... it's not special, it's just in the right place at the right time
Then it follows that you are not special. In fact, you may have been strained through a sheet.

5
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Vision
« on: November 03, 2009, 02:55:56 PM »
The atmosphere is not perfectly transparent.
Would it be possible to have a rocket fly straight up and transmit images of the infinite horizon back to earth until it ran out of fuel? A good rocket could escape the imperfectly transparent atmosphere and see as far as the sun can shine. It could continue to climb until it ran out of fuel, but could see for many thousands of miles beyond our limited vision here on the surface. Would that be possible? If not, why not? If so, why hasn't it been done?

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: is there an edge on this so called flat earth
« on: November 03, 2009, 02:51:48 PM »
Does it not trouble you that Round Earthers can't agree?
I don't know what disagreement you are referring to.
Round Earthers agree on the following:

The earth is round (a sphere).
Gravity exists.
The earth orbits the sun which is 93 million miles away.
The moon orbits the earth at a distance of 240,000 miles.
The sun is approximately 40 times larger than the moon in diameter.
Lunar eclipses are caused by the earth passing between the sun and moon. (no shadow object is needed)
Solar eclipses are caused by the moon passing between the sun and earth.
The seasons are created by the earth's tilt on its axis.
There is no global conspiracy to hide the truth.
Airline pilots fly the straightest, most direct route possible between two points on the globe. (no need to fly a circular pattern to protect the conspiracy)
Antarctica has numerous scientific stations where people freely come and go as needed.
Flat-earthers are poorly informed.

If I've missed any, please advise.

7
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: The Infinite Plane
« on: November 02, 2009, 03:57:36 PM »
So FET does not believe in the big bang theory?
I've yet to find any consistent statement of what they believe. Some believe in an ice wall, others believe in an infinite plane. There are many inconsistencies in their beliefs, all of them founded in theory, not fact.

8
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Over the edge?
« on: November 02, 2009, 03:27:57 PM »
Antarctica is rich is minerals and oil. we can easily mine there but there is an international treaty preventing anyone form doing so.
It's part of the conspiracy, of course.

9
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Over the edge?
« on: November 02, 2009, 03:26:31 PM »
If it only shines straight down, what gives you any clue as to what it might do if pointed elsewhere?

Here's my basic complaint against all this: Every single answer you guys give implies that we know little more now than was known 3,000 years ago. You poo-poo any and all science that demonstrates your error, yet you refuse to produce any proof through your own investigation.

To me, there are just three possibilities for your position:
1. You live some Amish-like existence that prevents you from seeking scientific knowledge.
2. You are dumber than sawdust.
3. You are all frauds and are just yanking everyone's chain for your own amusement (which I'd be okay with).

Whichever it is, you're at least providing some entertainment for the rest of the world.

10
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Over the edge?
« on: November 02, 2009, 01:44:22 PM »
I'm guessing you're all idiots.

11
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Eclipses
« on: November 02, 2009, 01:41:40 PM »
So, a "shadow object" blocks the sun's rays that would have shone on the moon...

Why, then, can you not see the shadow object when the sun is shining on it?

Also, if the sun's rays are vertical, how is the moon illuminated at all? If the moon is the same altitude as the sun, there would be no illumination if there are no horizontal sun rays. If the moon is below the sun, the surface facing earth would always be in shadow. The second seems more likely since your explanation for solar eclipses is that the moon passes between the earth and the sun.

Your explanation is flawed, and the notion of an invisible shadow object is absurd.

12
Flat Earth Q&A / Eclipses
« on: November 02, 2009, 01:22:12 PM »
How do FErs explain solar and lunar eclipses?

13
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Over the edge?
« on: November 02, 2009, 01:21:28 PM »
Antarctica exists in much the same way as in RET. It is a continent, just like the others. The actual ice wall or rim continent may be well beyond the reach of the sun's rays.
The sun can't shine more than a few thousand miles? What prevents it from doing so?

14
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Over the edge?
« on: November 02, 2009, 12:34:41 PM »
Some theorize that the earth is an infinite plane that bisects the universe; there might not even be an edge, for all we know.
Then I wonder what all the fuss is about concerning limited natural resources and global warming...

15
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: is there an edge on this so called flat earth
« on: November 02, 2009, 11:26:15 AM »
Yeah, lol idk even know what to say to these people.  I hope that there just kidding rather then actually think are earth is flat.
I've wondered that. They could just be a bunch of trolls egging everyone on for their own amusement. I believe that is far more likely than the possibility that they truly believe their claim.

16
Flat Earth General / Re: Washington Irving
« on: November 02, 2009, 10:36:09 AM »
The Earth was commonly believed to be flat for the first few centuries B.C.  Even after Aristotle challenged that idea, several noted philosophers, such as Anaximander, Lucretius, and Democritus still disagreed with him.  The believers within this society, for the most part, base their theory off of the work of Samuel B. Rowbotham.

By the way, I do understand what you're referring to-the commonly held misconception that people in the Middle Ages believed the earth to be flat-but that is irrelevant to this society's foundations and beliefs.
It would be far more convincing if your beliefs were based on verifiable science. Also, I met with considerable resistance when I suggested your society conduct experiments with independent third party observers and present you results in an established and reputable manner.

One thing that I've found as a weakness is that you refer to your position as a theory. Additionally, what was Rowbotham's qualifications? Scientists do not theorize that the earth is round or that gravity exists. They have scientifically proven it for thousands of years. There is simply no evidence to support your theory, and if there is, you have done nothing to bring it forward.

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Flat Earth General / Re: Washington Irving
« on: November 02, 2009, 09:37:01 AM »
Okay. Tell me about it. I'd love to know the actually historical account.

18
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: is there an edge on this so called flat earth
« on: November 02, 2009, 09:00:35 AM »
I can't fathom the Earth just ending with an edge. I also can't believe the Earth being an infinite plain. That's why most people believe in a RE; It's so much more believable.
It's not just believable. It's verifiable. That's the difference. Not only have the FErs not verified their claim, they have not attempted to verify their claim. That's what I was referring to when I asked if they are willing to bet their lives. There have been plenty who bet their lives to circumnavigate the globe. According to FErs, no one dares even to make the attempt to go to the ice wall.
Dude, the wall is heavily guarded. You would be shot down before you could even see it. They would know that you were coming. Thermal vision and such.
Then how does anyone actually know what's there if everyone who approaches is killed? That's sort of like saying that no one has ever returned from Loch Ness because the monster got them.

19
Flat Earth Q&A / Over the edge?
« on: November 02, 2009, 08:57:26 AM »
If the ice wall is unapproachable, why would the ancients have been afraid of falling off the edge of the earth? If it is approachable, they would have seen an impenetrable ice wall that would have prevented them from falling off the edge. In either case, there should have been no reason to fear the edge of the earth.

I guess the bigger question is this: if the ice wall is unapproachable, how does anyone know what is out there?

20
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: is there an edge on this so called flat earth
« on: November 02, 2009, 08:39:10 AM »
I can't fathom the Earth just ending with an edge. I also can't believe the Earth being an infinite plain. That's why most people believe in a RE; It's so much more believable.
It's not just believable. It's verifiable. That's the difference. Not only have the FErs not verified their claim, they have not attempted to verify their claim. That's what I was referring to when I asked if they are willing to bet their lives. There have been plenty who bet their lives to circumnavigate the globe. According to FErs, no one dares even to make the attempt to go to the ice wall.

21
Flat Earth General / Re: Washington Irving
« on: November 02, 2009, 07:48:59 AM »
I'm saying that if Washington Irving had not written his fictional account of Columbus, there would never had been any traction for the flat-earth nonsense.

Isn't it odd that you don't even know the source of your misinformation?

22
Flat Earth General / Washington Irving
« on: November 02, 2009, 07:35:01 AM »
Read a book by James Loewen titled "Lies my teacher told me." Actually, you only need to read a few pages regarding Washington Irving, the author or Rip Van Winkle and the Legend of Sleepy Hollow. Irving wrote a book in 1828 titled "The Life and Voyages of Christopher Columbus." In this book, Irving, which was largely written as a joke, indicated that Columbus set out to prove the world was round. This is utter nonsense. No one at the time or any time previous actually believed the world was flat. Nonetheless, Irving's work of fiction was regarded as truth by some, and somehow made its way into school history books.

I recall in the 6th grade seeing a drawing in my social studies book depicting Columbus sitting on the shore, watching ships come over the horizon, and determining for himself that the earth had to be round. He therefore set out to sail around it to prove his theory. If you ask any grammar or high schooler, you'll likely get a similar answer to the question as to why Columbus sailed in 1492. This is rubbish.

So, you all owe your silly flat-earth beliefs to a work of fiction written by Washington Irving. Ironically, Irving even admitted at the time that it was a joke, but many took it seriously anyway, just as you do now.


23
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: is there an edge on this so called flat earth
« on: November 02, 2009, 07:23:04 AM »
No, it does not.  Some others believe it does, however.
Doesn't it trouble you that flat-earthers cannot agree? Some say there's an ice wall, which is just plain dumb, and others say it's an infinite plane, which is just plain dumber.

Here are the facts, folks: Every physical aspect of the round earth is 100% verifiable and accepted by every reputable scientist and all but a few thousand of the earth's inhabitants. None of the flat-earthers' claims are verifiable, nor will will FErs even attempt to verify them.

Here's the true test: Would any of you flat-earthers be willing to bet your life that you are correct? I didn't think so.

24
Flat Earth General / Re: Flat Earthers, where is your outrage?
« on: October 30, 2009, 10:31:18 AM »
Politicians are not a part of the conspiracy, and it wouldn't cost nearly as much many as you say.  Please lurk moar.
Your grammar skills are deficient.

Does it really matter who is part of the conspiracy? Should you not be outraged nonetheless?

25
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What if??
« on: October 30, 2009, 10:29:13 AM »
As far as the physical nature of the earth, nothing would change. The only change would be social, and at the very least, there would (or should) be a global outcry over the wasted resources gone to covering up the flat earth theory. Within a week every governmental leader worldwide would be in prison, and all the wasted resources would be redirected to solving all our problems. Either that, or there would be mass hysteria, and we'd all be dead from the chaos.

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Flat Earth General / Flat Earthers, where is your outrage?
« on: October 30, 2009, 10:17:17 AM »
In a world (round or flat) where poverty is rampant, starvation is pandemic, terrorism is uncontrolled, and the environment is being destroyed, where is your outrage that all of the world's governments are wasting hundreds of trillions of dollars (essentially all the world's resources) every year propping up a vast conspiracy to keep your inconsequential truth from being known?

Why do your leaders not attempt to overthrow these governments? Why do you not try to get elected to high political offices? Why do you not make life a living hell for those politicians you believe are thwarting your beliefs? Why do you not employ reputable scientists to verify your theories? Why do you not seek documentation of the government conspiracies? Why do you not establish your own media outlets to flood the world with your message?

Regardless of whether you are right or wrong, if you believe there is a conspiracy, why do you not act? Perhaps the shape of the planet does not really matter, but the wasted resources do matter, do they not?

If world-wide governments are ignoring critical social and economic problems in favor of hiding the truth, why are you not outraged?

27
Flat Earth Q&A / Government Manipulation
« on: October 17, 2006, 01:33:21 PM »
Nearly 100% of the earth's population has believed for THOUSANDS of years that the earth is round. This must then imply that any conspiracy that upholds that belief has also been around for thousands of years.

So let me paint a picture...

Back in the 1770's the American colonists were desperate for their freedom. They planned, prepared, fought, died, and eventually prevailed to gain independence from England. But during all this struggle and conflict, they decided to continue to go along with the government conspiracy that England was surely a part of. Seems odd.

Then, a similar episode took place with every other country who sought independence from its mother land. Yet they all agreed to continue in the conspiracy. Seems odd.

Iraq and Iran are bitter, murderous enemies, but they agree to participate in the conspiracy. Seems odd.

North and South Korea barely speak to one another but...

Not just odd, but downright asinine.

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Flat Earth General / Re: Has anyone actually seen the "Ice Wall"?
« on: October 17, 2006, 11:16:47 AM »
Not unless you do a better job of explaining it.

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Flat Earth General / Re: Has anyone actually seen the "Ice Wall"?
« on: October 17, 2006, 09:00:03 AM »
Quote from: "beast"
Surely if this is The Flat Earth Society then you can't convince people of anything with your claim that lack of evidence = lack of existence.  If you want to suggest the ice wall doesn't exist the burden of proof must be on you.


Mr. Beast:

As I've tried to pound into your flat head, there are mountains of evidence to prove you wrong, but you (and your kind) claim it is all fake and part of a conspiracy. What hope is there for anyone to convince you if you refuse to consider the possibility?

"A man convinced against his will
Is of the same opinion still."

I don't intend to convince you of anything, I'm just here to poke fun, and perhaps amuse myself in the process.

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Flat Earth Q&A / How about that sun?
« on: October 11, 2006, 09:26:37 AM »
It's also possible that you guys make up your answers as you go along.

Anytime you don't have a real answer (because one doesn't exist) you hedge by reverting to hypothetical jibberish.

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