1

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 30, 2009, 08:09:55 AM »

Everybody should have figured out by now that all this FET is just trolls.
Nobody can be so dumb that they believe dinosaurs would be as smart as humans, or that the Earth is flat - and it's just that noone have figured it out yet.

2

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 30, 2009, 06:00:26 AM »

Has anyone actually verified that dinosaurs arms and/or legs have the range of motion required for boat building?

And what would be wrong with using mouth and neck?  Like number4 said, it wouldn't have to be pretty.

Again, is the range of motion known for the various body parts involved?  Would those various body parts have enough strength and dexterity to manipulate the materials and/or any tools required?  A dino boat wouldn't have to be pretty, but it would have to be sturdy.

Yes the range of motion for T-Rexs arms is known. It is very very limited, it is barely bendable. Most think it was just used as a meat-hook or a "stabilisator", and they were fragile enough to very often break.

3

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 29, 2009, 07:28:23 AM »

What lives in Demark that doesn't live in Germany, apart from Danes?

Beavers fx. But you are avoiding my questions. Why is there such a big difference between Asian and European wildlife? They were connected back then in Pangae, and they are still connected today. Why haven't the creatures "travelled the world"?

4

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 29, 2009, 06:54:56 AM »

North America and Asia are conjoined right up until the end of the Cretaceous in Pangea theory. Our case study takes place during the Early Cretaceous, during which time Pangea theory alleges that these continents were conjoined, as shown on the map you posted.

"West coast of America and the East coast of Asia"

There is a huge difference between that, and North America being joined with Europe. Just because a continent is joined doesn't mean creatures will automtically populate ALL of it. As seen on Denmark vs Germany, South Africa vs North Africa etc etc. The climates is also pretty much the same in those examples.

Or we can take the example you want! Asia and Europe is connected now, as they was back then. Why is there such a huge difference in creatures between Asia and Europe then? According to you they would have travelled "everywhere".

5

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 29, 2009, 05:57:58 AM »

Why is there some "recent" animals we today only find in South Africa and not North Africa, or in Russia and not Denmark? Surely they would have to be all over the continent because there is nothing stopping them from walking a couple years north or south.

Climate precludes some species habitating certain areas. If the West coast of America and the East coast of Asia were right next to eachother, surely they'd have the same climate.

What makes you say they were right next to eachother? Seems pretty far away from eachother to me



Oh, and South Africa and North Africa is right next to eachother. Or Germany and Denmark.

Why am i even trying to argue with someone that believes dinosaurs was as smart or smarter than humans??

6

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 29, 2009, 05:35:44 AM »

KillaBee, if they had "just diverged" on a supercontinent, we would find specimens of both species in Asia AND America. We do not, we only find one in America and only find the other in Asia. Stop skirting the issue and answer this charge! Why do we ONLY find Adasaurus in Asia and ONLY find Dromaeosaurus in America if those continents were a single continent at the time? This is strong evidence against the Pangea thesis. You are refusing to answer this issue because you have no reasonable explanation in accordance with the Pangea theory.

Why is there some "recent" animals we today only find in South Africa and not North Africa, or in Russia and not Denmark? Surely they would have to be all over the continent because there is nothing stopping them from walking a couple years north or south.

7

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 05:30:57 PM »

For threatening me with armed physical violence, I have banned you from the forums for one week.

You are retarded. 

For circumventing the ban with a dummy account, I have banned the dummy account and extended the ban on your main account to one month. Further efforts to circumvent the ban, upon discovery, will result in progressive increases in the total amount of time your main account is banned for.

He is right, you are retarded it seems. Believing dinosaurs, who clearly had the size of a walnut and arms that had no purpose at all, was intelligent enough to build complex structures (that is NOT the same as using very simple tools to do very simple stuff, because most animals do that) and had a social colonization with every other dinosaur sort. It is the stuff you hear in a childrens book. It is just as retarded as believing the Earth to be flat when you can clearly look out your window and see the exact thing RET describes, and calling people for liars and fraudelents with no proof at all (the space agencies) - which is actually a pretty serious crime.

"New experiment, I am going to repeatedly hit you in the head as hard as I can with a baseball bat, and then you can go tape up your fingers and try and build a raft."
is not the same as
"For threatening me with armed physical violence, I have banned you from the forums for one week."

I don't think you realise how happy I am that no Flat Earther have any meaningful position in society, like scientists, lawyers, politicians etc. The world would be completely fucked.

8

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 02:11:54 PM »

Have you ever interacted with a dolphin? They cannot communicate coherently, they spend their entire lives mating, eating and inanely frolicing in the waves. They are by the standards of humanity completely and utterly dense.

Much like most humans?

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 02:10:34 PM »

Otters don't have to use tools either, but they do because it makes sense, showing they are more intelligent than dolphins.

Yes they have to use tools in order to crack open the shells to get their food. It is like a crab using a shell as a "backpack". Doesn't make it smart.
I doubt you realise the difference between using a stick or rock to crack something open with food in it for thousands of years, compared to building complex structures like boats for no short-term reason.

Nests are very similar to boats, structurally and conceptually. Building a boat to find new resources or avoid overpopulation is equivalent in importance to protecting your young by making them a nest. If your young will die because they have to compete for highly scarce resources amongst an overcrowded population, it makes sense to any rational animal to seek out new resources in different locations.

No they are not! They are not the same at all! We humans have built "houses" for as long as we have existed, but have only begun builting boats that can sail very far the last couple of thousand years, and small river-boats have only existed for a few ten-thousands years.
It doesn't make sense that a T-Rex would think "Hey we are running a little dry on ressources. You, cryphotaus, get me some wood. You, hopalitaus, get me a hammer. I'm going to build a boat so we can sail over the ocean into the unknown."
Why exactly would they use months/years building a boat, when they have no idea what's out there, and they instead could just WALK over the land or kill the other predators in their land.

The dichotomy you are trying to present between brains and brawn is highly misleading. Most successful species, humans included, recruit a combination of both in ensuring their survival. Of course, dinosaurs would have done the same.

No. We humans have almost no muscle-power. We have our brains instead. If we were to have the same muscle-power as an ape together with our brain, we would need way over 5000 calories daily to not lose weight. So we would probably need 6-7000 calories daily to gain weight to survive the cold winter. That is why we don't have large muscles - because we can't have both. That is also why so few animals have large brains. Because they consume alot of calories. I have heard that in a class, where you focus 100%, you can burn several hundreds kcal an hour.

the fact that dogs, dolphins, etc., coexist with humans and yet are completely moronic. The fact of the matter is, as a lethal and effective predator which was perfectly adapted to its environment, the prehistoric alligator would not have faced the kinds of evolutionary selection pressures which forced dinosaurs to develop intelligence in order to overcome the challenges which they faced.

Dogs, dolphins etc don't co-exist with humans. They are wild animals, that have nothing to do with humans. An alligator is a dinosaur, just like most birds are. They haven't changed much.
"develop intelligence in order to overcome the challenges which they faced"
Oh, like what?

But dinosaurs aren't reptiles.

Yes they are.

Dinosaurs would have transported the ancestors of the modern alligator and crocodile with them as livestock and/or pets. Also, both alligators and crocodiles are excellent swimmers, which explains a large amount of their local migration by water.

Why am I even debating with you?   Holding croc's as livestock? Come one.....

Dinosaurs of different kinds had a wide range of biological configurations which would have lent themselves to different technical proficiencies. Actually, you point out the short arms of the dinosaurs which were bipedal. In my opinion, this serves as further evidence of specialisation along the same lines as humanity. Bipedalism frees up the forelimbs for operations such as tool creation and use, and the adjustment of the lungs in bipedal land animals (of which humans are currently the only real example) actually allows for a wider range of noises to be produced, a prerequisite for verbal communication. Bipedal dinosaurs such as compsognathus, velociraptor and deinonychus were ideal candidates for the evolutionary trappings of civilisation.

Their arms was NOT meant for using tools. They were most likely used when running to "move" like we use our arms, or they were simple meathooks, or maybe they were just something that didn't have any purpose at all - after all we have many things in our body with no purpose at all. Like the "tail-bone". The thing is, many dinosaurs broke their arms very often. They simply didn't need them that much.
Their arms had VERY limited range of motion. They could barely be bended

10

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 01:48:08 PM »

That's not how science works. You produce evidence of your experimentation and then we verify it. I will accept a youtube link to a video of you taping your thumbs up and then trying to build a raft.

Dolphins aren't "incredibly stupid". And they do use tools.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/06/0607_050607_dolphin_tools.html

They just haven't got round to building boats yet.

That's pretty cool, didn't know that actually. Dolphins are some of the smartest animals besides humans

11

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 01:29:14 PM »

Your citation of those EQs only further demonstrates my point. The EQ of an otter or a bird is far lower than a dolphin, yet both otters and birds are adept at tool use, and dolphins are completely incapable by virtue of their incredible stupidity. Out of interest, what is the suspected EQ of a chimp? I'm genuinely interest to know.

No if dolphins HAD to use tools in order to survive, they would have developed arms or a proper mouth for tool-use. But the thing is: they have had no reason at all to use tools. Oh, and why are you saying dolphins are stupid? They are quite smart as seen by the tricks they can easily learn and how they interact with humans and other dolphins.
Some birds have to use tools to build a little nest or something. There is a HUGE difference between building a simple nest so your eggs/kids is protected, compared to building a boat, even if it was just a simple boat Do you know why humans use tools to such a large degree? Because we use our brains to survive instead of our big muscles. Did dinosaurs use their brains instead of their muscles to survive? No, if they did they would have had a larger brain.

The EQ of a chimp is 2-3.

Do you realise that alligators is one of the most ancient animals, who lived when dinosaurs was there too if I recall correctly? Do you see him building boats? He is just as smart as all other reptiles - dumb as a brick. How did crocodiles and alligators come almost all over the world?


Oh, and how exactly do you think this guy is going to build a boat? If he was designed for building things, he WOULD HAVE HAD SOME PROPER ARMS AND A PROPER BRAIN. I really can't see how you can believe a guy like this lived in a social colonization.

12

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 11:14:29 AM »

http://www.geo.cornell.edu/eas/education/course/descr/EAS109/109-Lec10.pdf

Maybe this would be soemthing for you then.

Pretty much all the evidence there is circumstantial or just plain wrong. How can having horns be construed as indicative of primitive social behaviour? Is the presence of teeth and nails in humans evidence for it? No.

Herding is used as another example, but herding is a great idea. People herd too, a lot of activities are much easier to accomplish in groups.

I'm not going to post rebuttals to every single flawed point in that lengthy screed, but perhaps if you'd like to post your favorites I could demolish those for you.

Oh, and I don't see Dolphins actually BUILDING complex things...

That was my exact point. Despite their excellent brain-body ratio, dolphins are completely thick. They are absolutely inanely stupid, which shows that a good brain-body ratio doesn't mean squat.

Humans have an EQ of 7 while dolphins have an EQ of only slightly above 2. Dinosaurs have an EQ of ~0.1 and most wild animals have an EQ of 0.1-1.
Do you now see why dolphins don't build anything complex like humans do? Or why dinosaurs don't either?

That PDF file is only ? a page long, between the "Evidence of intelligence" down to "How fast did they go?"
We know more about dinosaurs than you think we know, it seems.

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 10:00:46 AM »

Who cares if you can build a little raft without your thumbs? Try building a raft with your mouth or your feet, and we'll see if you succed. Oh, and try do that with your eyes closed to simulate how stupid dinosaurs were.

Many dinosaurs had clawed hands. The taping simulates this adversity they would have faced.

"The size of a brain does not dictate its intelligence, although in some species it can be indicative of it. The cereberal cortex, a relatively small part of the brain, plays a crucial role in the intelligence of an animal, the size and configuration of which do not necessarily correlate with the size of the whole brain. You have no idea how dinosaurs compared in intelligence to modern animals."

The EQ, as I just said... so yes, I have a pretty good idea how dinousaurs compared in intelligence to moderne animals

No, you are wrong. The configuration of the cerebral cortex can potentially affect intelligence far more than brain-body ratio. Dolphins, for example, have a very high brain-body ratio, but they are also phenomenally stupid.

http://www.geo.cornell.edu/eas/education/course/descr/EAS109/109-Lec10.pdf

Maybe this would be soemthing for you then.

Oh, and I don't see Dolphins actually BUILDING complex things...

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 09:50:32 AM »

Peanut sized brain you say...

Yes their brains was VERY very small compared to their bodies, which is what matters. The EQ of a dinosaur is roughly 5 times lower than that of an elephant, and 50 times lower than that of a human. Very few dinosaurs were as smart as todays wild beasts, but only a few of them. How would they go about colonization and building boats? This is just as stupid as the Flat Earth Theory

The size of a brain does not dictate its intelligence, although in some species it can be indicative of it. The cereberal cortex, a relatively small part of the brain, plays a crucial role in the intelligence of an animal, the size and configuration of which do not necessarily correlate with the size of the whole brain. You have no idea how dinosaurs compared in intelligence to modern animals.

Even a regular human isn't smart enough to build a boat. It takes some studying to build a boat that can carry a big load and won't sink or break.

Not at all. Back when I ran the South West of England FES group, we would often provide counterexample to this ridiculous claim (I assure you, you are not the first to dispute the thesis that dinosaurs built boats) by taping together, on each hand, our thumbs to our index fingers, and our middle fingers to our ring fingers, and then proceeding to construct crude watercraft. Building a raft with some logs and withies is incredibly easy, and with our hands taped together to prevent us using our opposable thumbs, small groups were usually able to collaborate and construct rafts with relative ease.

Who cares if you can build a little raft without your thumbs? Try building a raft with your mouth or your feet, and we'll see if you succed. Oh, and try do that with your eyes closed to simulate how stupid dinosaurs were.

"The size of a brain does not dictate its intelligence, although in some species it can be indicative of it. The cereberal cortex, a relatively small part of the brain, plays a crucial role in the intelligence of an animal, the size and configuration of which do not necessarily correlate with the size of the whole brain. You have no idea how dinosaurs compared in intelligence to modern animals."

The EQ, as I just said... so yes, I have a pretty good idea how dinousaurs compared in intelligence to moderne animals

15

Flat Earth Debate / Re: Why hasn't this been discussed by lead scientists?

« on: May 27, 2009, 08:34:28 AM »

We are the lead scientists.

No, no lead scientist would believe in a Flat Earth. Which is why there have been done no experiments on this since the 1800's

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Riddle me this

« on: May 27, 2009, 08:28:51 AM »

yes its fog.  But in the observation that was explained earlier, it would be on a clear day where there be no clouds nor fog

Find me air with no suspended water vapur, pollutants, dust, etc and I'll find you a sterile laboratory.

Stand ontop of a mountain or go on a plane. You can clearly see MANY MANY miles. How is that possible? The air would still be as "thich" near the surface no matter where you stand, so how come you can see so much further the higher you stand? well, that's because the Earth is round, my friend

17

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 06:18:56 AM »

Peanut sized brain you say...

Yes their brains was VERY very small compared to their bodies, which is what matters. The EQ of a dinosaur is roughly 5 times lower than that of an elephant, and 50 times lower than that of a human. Very few dinosaurs were as smart as todays wild beasts, but only a few of them. How would they go about colonization and building boats? This is just as stupid as the Flat Earth Theory

Even a regular human isn't smart enough to build a boat. It takes some studying to build a boat that can carry a big load and won't sink or break.

18

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 05:19:49 AM »

By continetal drift. If dinosaurs were meant for using tools to this degree, they would have proper arms and a brain larger than a peanut.

A large brain and "proper arms" are prerequisite for complex tool use, are they?

Would you care to explain the plain fact that a great number of birds, which not only do not possess "proper arms" but in fact possess no arms at all are capable of extensive tool use and construction? Would you care to explain how otters, who by comparison to humanity are phenomenally stupid, are able to manipulate rocks with their crude, clawed forelegs in order to open oysters and other shellfish?

As has already been pointed out, continental drift is impossible. If it occured on any large scale, the Earth would break apart. Clearly, this has not occured.

Do you realise the difference between using a small stick to find a worm, and building huge boats to sail with`? Did I not say "using tools to this degree"? Clearly someone with a peanut brain and so small arms can't build boats.

Clearly this has occured. The world have "broken apart". Continental drift.

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What about the Dinosuars?

« on: May 27, 2009, 03:52:53 AM »

Don't be ridiculous. We've presented a large body of evidence and passionately defended that thesis over and over again for the last three or four years. Why would it be a joke? If it was a joke, how else would the distribution of fossils be explicable?

By continetal drift. If dinosaurs were meant for using tools to this degree, they would have proper arms and a brain larger than a peanut.

20

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: answer this one then! :)

« on: May 26, 2009, 04:52:48 PM »

Oh, so you admit that the image is completely inadmissable as evidence. That's fine by me.

That picture is not the best, but it wasn't me that posted it. So you agree you attacked the picture on a wrong assumption?

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: But Why?

« on: May 26, 2009, 04:13:27 PM »

im a RE,er i to be onest i think it is stupid that anyone can think that the earth is not round. im not a smart uni student, im no doctor. and just a trades person. so tell me this

what would be the point in hiding that the world is indeed Flat?
What does this achive for anyone?

is obvious there is no conspiricy. just people that choose not what to belive that is right in front of them.

NASA gets millions in taxes and only need to spend a little bit on photoshopping photos

Umm no. They would spend billions on props and photoshops and fake movies and bribes and scientists and all their employees.
It isn't exactly FREE to run a company with SO many employees. And do you really think all those employees just sit around doing nothing? What exactly do you think NASA's thousands of employees actually do?

22

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Pangea

« on: May 26, 2009, 04:10:47 PM »

The evidence for dinosaur colonialism and seafaring is ample. Your refusal to correctly interpret the evidence is the problem. Thousands upon thousands of plant and animal remains testify to the advanced civilisation which the dinosaurs constructed.

STFU if you don't have anything nice to say. Didn't your mother tell you that?

Answer the replies, which brought up some rather good indirect questions

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: answer this one then! :)

« on: May 26, 2009, 04:09:22 PM »

With regard to the image posted:

I'm afraid that's not curvature, at least, not the kind you're looking for. The bump on the left hand side of the wing is a hill, since the bump on the right hand side of the wing doesn't match up with it and form one larger curve, as might be expected if the Earth were, as you claim, a giant ball.

Umm no it would be that way if it was a large ball. But the fact is, that it is an ULTRA-GIANT ball. I don't think you have any idea how large the "ball" is. That is also the reason why the earth looks flat for 10+ miles.

24

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What would it take for me to prove to you the Earth is round?

« on: May 26, 2009, 12:08:53 PM »

The reason you've said I haven't answered is that you have completely ignored/misunderstood the answer. You've even replied to demand I dumb them down for you already.

How do you get "If we are able to create life and transfer years of work almost instantly, " to "them"? Are you fucking stupid? Do you even read what I have said? That one sentence makes no sense at all, the others makes sense - they are just damn illogical and they are avoiding my questions too.

Like the thing about: why isn't NASA and all its thousands of employees innocent until proven otherwise? Or the thing about how you can't just "fake" a moon rock. You do realise they are sold for $250.000 pr. gram to collectors, don't you? Do you really think they wouldn't have them examined for many hours before buying?

25

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What would it take for me to prove to you the Earth is round?

« on: May 26, 2009, 09:41:41 AM »

You've never heard of proxies?

Oh so I would set up a proxy, create a new account just to post 10 posts in order for me to finally pwn you?
Get a grip, you aren't important.

No the reason some people have said you haven't answered me is because YOU HAVENT

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Pangea

« on: May 26, 2009, 09:39:49 AM »

They're observed moving on a tiny scale, they're not about to float halfway across the Earth, even in millions of years.

Ummm even as little as they are moving now, the Earth have existed for 4? billion years. Do you realise how much the continent would have moved if it was just 1 mm every year? I think it is more they are moving pr year though.

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What would it take for me to prove to you the Earth is round?

« on: May 26, 2009, 09:35:26 AM »

Or maybe it's because you're all the same person, and you're just as retarded in every persona.

Find a moderator. You do an IP-check then?

EDIT: Find*

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What would it take for me to prove to you the Earth is round?

« on: May 26, 2009, 09:34:02 AM »

Oh, and still waiting for my replies from General douchebag

You've got them several times over. Get some new points or piss off, I don't have time for you.

Nope you haven't given my answers. Should I ask the questions again, or should we just agree that you have been pwned and therefor cannot give proper answers to the questions?

I'll just let you think that. Have fun.

It's funny how others in this thread didn't think you have given any answers to my questions either.

Oh wait, thats because you havent

29

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What would it take for me to prove to you the Earth is round?

« on: May 26, 2009, 09:31:33 AM »

Oh, and still waiting for my replies from General douchebag

You've got them several times over. Get some new points or piss off, I don't have time for you.

Nope you haven't given my answers. Should I ask the questions again, or should we just agree that you have been pwned and therefor cannot give proper answers to the questions?

30

Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Pangea

« on: May 26, 2009, 09:10:13 AM »

in b4 "dinosaurs was very smart and used lots of tools. They even made boats"