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Messages - Curiously

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1
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Dubious... (About FAQ)
« on: March 16, 2007, 03:48:01 PM »
Many satellites appear stationary in the sky, as their orbit matches the earth's rotation.  They are not moving across the sky, no would anything you were pointing a stationary dish receiver at, as it can only receive a direct signal. including a floating banana or any other fruit that may be hovering in the sky...

The temperatures have been noted significantly more 30 years, yet geographically speaking, still not a long time.  But the physics remain solid and the ice is disappearing from the ice caps at an alarming rate.   With less ice, you also have less reflecting energy.  The issues of global warming compound themselves.

2
Space travel is impossible, unfortunately.
To say something of this nature is impossible with actually having any real knowledge of it merely illustrated a closed mind.  Why, exactly do you believe space travel impossible?

3
The Lounge / Re: I Knew It!!!!!!!
« on: March 16, 2007, 11:58:04 AM »
LOL
And here I always thought Gore was an alien.......wrong again, I guess.

He could be an alien.  His possible origin is still speculation, some suggest Canada.
LOL... well, you can maybe give us Gore, but Bush is definitely one of yours.

Of course, this is America.  We can make anything we wish and not wish.
Who, exactly, wished for Bush??? :)

4
Are you suggesting the lack of proliferation of pirating is causing global warming??? LOL  Damn, I never made that connection before...

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Dubious... (About FAQ)
« on: March 16, 2007, 11:51:52 AM »
The conspiracy...  A conspiracy of this magnitude is so far beyond the realm of probability as to be impossible.  It's extremely paranoid to think that many people could work together without anything falling apart or without any published  contrary proof by someone.  The only way to rid someone of such a paranoid fantasy would have to be through therapy and medication.  Google schizophrenia, and keep an open mind as this might help.

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Dubious... (About FAQ)
« on: March 16, 2007, 11:27:50 AM »
Yes, the Rocky mountains do look washed out rather equally from top to bottom, however, there is a solid break on the horizon.  They don't fade to nothing at the bottom, as you can't see the bottom which is due to the curvature from the earth.

The "stations" would appear as more than dots if view from a telescope if situated in our atmosphere.  This would be impossible to cover up.

Again, it's not speculation, it's easily demostrated physics.  Some energy is converted obviously, but matter is converted back to energy.  Such is the cycle of life.  I thought the car analogy was simple enough to follow in my initial post.  Some energy is reflected away from the earth, some is kept.  If the balance is upset, then things change.  Why is it warmer on the surface of the earth, than the top of a mountain?  Because the energy is amplified by the atmosphere.  Thickening the atmosphere has the same effect as using a thicker magnifying glass.  It gets stronger.   The changes are gradual, but there.  It's a myth that there are is many studies disproving global warming as proving.  The controversy mostly exists in denying the cause.  Research the numerous studies.

As far as the Earth turning into a molten death trap, well... there is a point when the thicker atmosphere will actually begin to prohibit energy from traversing.  For example, a small amount of water will amplify, yet if you travel to the depths of the ocean, only so much can get through, and there comes a point when light is all but non-existent.  This could very well be what ends up causing ice ages, but THAT is speculative.

Never before has earth seen such a singular destructive force as man be he atheist, Christian or Muslim.  The rain forests are contributing to the excess of CO2 in the air (both by their burning and by the annihilation which deprives the earth of mass CO2 filters, so it's twofold).  Under the water, the raking of the ocean destroying the habitat of vegetation which actually do more to filter CO2 from the atmosphere than anything above the water.  Factories and cars and the like increase the CO2 content of our atmosphere.  This is fact.  The denial of global warming and the dangers of it is simply short sighted thinking.

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Dubious... (About FAQ)
« on: March 16, 2007, 10:40:48 AM »
So then, why would someone with a telescope be able to see the top of a building clearly on the horizon with a distinct break where it meets the horizon not a gradual fade as would be suggested by this theory?

Distinct break? I've only ever seen gradual fade outs at the horizon. Try to take a picture of this phenomena.

Quote
Also, is there any counter argument to the multitude of other points I made?

1.) I describe the origins of the conspiracy here.

2.) Satellite TV signals come from lighter than air geostationary broadcasting platforms located at very high altitudes. These airships are ridged structures filled with helium like the Geostationary Banana Over Texas.

3.) The illusion of the setting sun is accurately described in Chapters 9 and 10 of the book Earth Not a Globe by Samuel Birley Robotham.

Chapter 9
Chapter 10

5.) Global warming is pure speculation. I could find as many scientific papers against Global Warming as I could find papers in favor of Global Warming.

6.) The tides are a result of the Moon's gravitation. I'm not sure where the see-saw explanation came from.
1.  Have you seen the Rocky mountains from a distance?
2. These stations would be visible with a telescope and are not.
3. Guess I'll have to read that one...
5. (skipped for, but oh well) Global warming is not speculation, but rather the cause is in some cases disputed.  One has only to consider the basic science available to anyone to see what happens when energy is magnified.
6.  Again, what law gives the moon gravity but not the earth.  Dispute what you will, but physical laws are proven to affect everything.  Why does one body of mass which is smaller than the earth have gravity, while the earth does not?

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: United Nations: hiding the truth in plain sight
« on: March 16, 2007, 10:31:23 AM »
The united nationt includes countries from all over the world. It would be inpossible to show them all on a 3D globe picture.

So you acknowledge that Round Earthism cannot be represented, and thus is a sham? Interesting.
It is impossible to demonstrate any complete 3D model in 2D form without distorting it.  This really shouldn't confuse any educated person.

9
The Lounge / Re: I Knew It!!!!!!!
« on: March 16, 2007, 10:29:02 AM »
LOL
And here I always thought Gore was an alien.......wrong again, I guess.

He could be an alien.  His possible origin is still speculation, some suggest Canada.
LOL... well, you can maybe give us Gore, but Bush is definitely one of yours.

10
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Some proofs of FE
« on: March 16, 2007, 10:27:33 AM »
The proofs of FE are innumerable and beyond counting. Amongst them:

* When we look out at sea, the Earth looks flat. There is no so-called "horizon." Ships dissapear uniformly, not bottom to top.
* The gravitational vector never changes orientation, even when you go to "the other side of the planet," proving that we live on a flat surface where gravity is always straight down.
* The UN logo.
* Why should the Earth be finite? Why should it have 924,375,700 km circumference? Why not 924,375,600 km or 924,375,800 km? Stop denying the obvious truth of the Infinite Planar Earth.
* How could explorers report all these things in their secret journals about other lands? With such concordance? Are they ALL lying?
1.  Simply not true.  Things do not disappear uniformly.  This is why you can se the tips of mountains against the horizon. (Also, please note you have a spelling error above, which is curious given your earlier post on this topic - I made it bold for you to find easily)
2. Gravity is based on the attraction of matter.  As a sphere, you are equally attracted to the earth based on your distance from it, regardless of the position in relation to it.  An object has the same pull at 50 meters above sea level in Australia as it does 50 meters above sea level in New York.
3.  A logo constitutes proof?  I'm not sure what to say about this... ::)
4.  Even if you disagree with gravity, the argument that says in can't be impossible does not constitute proof of something.  Here's an experiment for you.  Close your eyes and have someone hold an object in front of you.  Given your current state, it's not impossible that they're holding a pencil; however, this in itself is not proof as to what the object is.

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The Lounge / Re: I Knew It!!!!!!!
« on: March 16, 2007, 10:14:24 AM »
LOL
And here I always thought Gore was an alien.......wrong again, I guess.

12
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What are REers trying to prove?
« on: March 16, 2007, 10:12:45 AM »
are u sure they do?
I haven't yet made my mind up whether the "believers" are serious or not, or whether this is either some practical joke, or some experiment to see the reactions of people and to see if they could actually convert anyone...it's possible someone will jump out and say "smile, you're on Candid Camera!"

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: The Earth is infinite!
« on: March 16, 2007, 10:10:25 AM »
"Infinite matter" is not a priori impossible. A finite Earth is.
A finite earth is not at all impossible, even given the interesting circumstances you believe it exists in.  Let's assume that your statement is correct, that matter is infinite (which as another post states, is not a requirement of it being eternal), you also assume that it has to be on earth, which by your own theories is not the case, since there are celestial bodies orbiting the earth.  Additionally, we see a finite end of the earth on at least one side (the side that we inhabit), which would suggest it's the case after the "ice wall." 

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: A FEW INCONSISTENCIES IN YOUR FAQ!
« on: March 16, 2007, 10:02:47 AM »
Good luck, I'm not getting much feed back on my similar post on the FAQ... :D

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Dubious... (About FAQ)
« on: March 16, 2007, 10:02:07 AM »
Also, is there any counter argument to the multitude of other points I made?

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: What are REers trying to prove?
« on: March 16, 2007, 10:01:19 AM »
Why do REers invade a board dedicated to Flat Earth research? And why are they so hostile, and not considerate at all about their invasion, sometimes outright trolling threads? To me it looks like they really have something important to prove to themselves.

My position is that they must be very shaky in their Round Earthist belief, and seek reassurance by ganging up on easy prey.

Why is your faith so shaky?
Well, I can't speak for everyone but I wandered here because I thought this was some kind of joke.  Then upon reading, I discovered that some here might actually take this theory seriously.  Ever a curious person, I really seek to understand how someone could believe in an idea that seems thoroughly ridiculous in the face of physical laws we face on a daily basis, even if NASA is a grand conspirator.

Return question...why do you classify yourself as easy prey?

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: The Earth is infinite!
« on: March 16, 2007, 09:56:59 AM »
Why should the Earth be finite? Why should it have 924,375,700 km circumference? Why not 924,375,600 km or 924,375,800 km? Stop denying the obvious truth of the Infinite Planar Earth.

What you call "Earth" is only our local area, there are many other lands surrounding it, beyond the Ice Wall.

There is PureLand, where humans who are pure enough, through abstaining of drugs (most Round Earthers would be disqualified just by that criterion), drink, gambling or criminal activities, may enter and enjoy a life of felicity.

There is also the land of Structo, where corrupt humans pass on to live a life controlled by a central authority called The Computer. There, no one is free to do anything without approval from the relevant authority. People are conditioned to obey, obey, obey, and forget their own desires, even going so far as to kill their loved ones. It is a living hell filled with paranoia and self-hatred.

Finally, we know about something the Pagans called Summerland, which has a veil that can only be pierced by spirits. Since no one here is a spirit, its composition is as yet unknown.
And since you believe that a round earth is a religion, and that a flat earth is science, I'm sitting here eagerly awaiting your scientific proof of these worlds, as you must have seen them with your own eyes... You were question grammar and spelling in a different thread, therefore you must have some passion. 

Science is defined as:
1.   a branch of knowledge or study dealing with a body of facts or truths systematically arranged and showing the operation of general laws: the mathematical sciences.
2.   systematic knowledge of the physical or material world gained through observation and experimentation.
3.   any of the branches of natural or physical science.
4.   systematized knowledge in general.
5.   knowledge, as of facts or principles; knowledge gained by systematic study.
6.   a particular branch of knowledge.
7.   skill, esp. reflecting a precise application of facts or principles; proficiency.

Please explain where these beyond the great ice-wall words fit into this definition.

18
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Dubious... (About FAQ)
« on: March 16, 2007, 09:27:47 AM »
So then, why would someone with a telescope be able to see the top of a building clearly on the horizon with a distinct break where it meets the horizon not a gradual fade as would be suggested by this theory?

19
You are not answering my initial question. How come half of the Round Earth fanatics on this board can't spell at a high school level, but virtually all Flat Earthers can write just fine?
Personally, I'm for writing as best we can regardless of the media we are partaking in, however it seems to be largely acceptable practice on the net to take short cuts and worry less about spelling and grammar.  And, what is the English language, but centuries of changes due to acceptable practice.  It's been an evolution its entire existence, often with many modes of acceptable use.

So to answer your question, it would appear that FE'ers are much more anal in regards to grammar around this site, yet grammar does not necessarily correlate with logic.  An aptitude towards science and math does not always relate a care to perfect language.  Hope this clears up your question.

20
A religion requires faith and a belief system, which is not true for knowing that the Earth is round. Therefore, it isn't a religion.

Your faith is the faith in pseudo-science. Your belief system, well... it's plastered all over this board.

FE faith is merely just pseudo-science and speculation.
pfftt...next you'll tell me that alchemy isn't a true science... lol

Certain aspects of alchemy is a science, which helped determine the chemical properties of elements.  If alchemists were to use particle excelerators, they can turn certain elements into gold.  Of course, the use of these particle excelerators would not be considered alchemy.
I was being glib.   :D 

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Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Dubious... (About FAQ)
« on: March 16, 2007, 09:12:46 AM »
Then how is it they may travel (and indeed see) farther when elevated? 

22
A religion requires faith and a belief system, which is not true for knowing that the Earth is round. Therefore, it isn't a religion.

Your faith is the faith in pseudo-science. Your belief system, well... it's plastered all over this board.

FE faith is merely just pseudo-science and speculation.
pfftt...next you'll tell me that alchemy isn't a true science... lol

23
I, Francois Tremblay, of the Infinite Plane, am offended at this remark! I demand you apologize!

the fact that you're anti-christian suggests we are aligned

http://www.goosetheantithesis.blogspot.com/

And yet you support the Round Earthist religion?
"Round Earthist religion?"... this is a pretty funny statement.  Religions are based on faith.  Theories are based on scientific exploration and logic.  If you can't accept the earth as a sphere, than at least have the objectiveness to see it as a theory.  There is certainly not more evidence to support the Flat Earth theory (and please note, I'm trying to be kind here) than that for a sphere.   To say Round Earth Religion really just demonstrates ones ignorance and closed mind.

24
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: Dubious... (About FAQ)
« on: March 16, 2007, 08:57:17 AM »
Thanks for the response, but my question about AM and FM waves was more to do with the fact the FM will not travel past the line of sight, regardless of power.  Higher towers increase the range of these waves (by increasing the line of sight) and I was wondering how this would be explained in a flat earth scenario.

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Flat Earth Q&A / Dubious... (About FAQ)
« on: March 16, 2007, 08:23:02 AM »
Ok...this is going to be a LONG post... Some things I would be confused about...I'm wondering if you could explain AM and FM radio waves to me, and why you need high towers to send FM radio signals to extend their distance as well as your line of sight (using a telescope)  For those who don't know, FM waves are limited to line of sight, while AM waves are affected by gravity, and if powerful enough can travel around the curvature of the earth... Speaking of gravity, your FAQ says the gravitation pull of the earth is caused by it's movement, but what exactly cause the sun and moon to orbit the earth if it has no natural attraction of it's own.  Without some kind of pull, momentum would cause both to continue on in a straight line.

I was also wondering what's on the other side of the earth.  I'd very much like to see some physics model for the universe and I'm curious as to whether you believe in anything NASA has done?

I'm reading your FAQ right now, and I have some issues with the logic... First, it says:

"Q: "The government could not pull off the conspiracy successfully"

A: Actually, they could."

The magnitude of such a conspiracy makes it prohibitive.  When you consider that all the governments do not have the same agenda, at some point one would have certainly disputed the claim.  To achieve such a conspiracy, the sheer number of people involved tax the laws of probability to an insane degree.  With so many possible problems, without a doubt someone, somewhere would have gotten the "real" information out. 

To use an example, very little can go wrong with a wedge.  It's simple, and it works...the more moving parts a machine has, the greater the chance of it breaking down.  If you have an extremely complex machine, over time it is inevitable that it will break down in several areas.

"Q: "Please explain sunrises/sunsets."

A: It's a perspective effect.  Really, the sun is just getting farther away; it looks like it disappears because everything gets smaller and eventually disappears as it gets farther away."

Um...not sure what to say about this.  The moon, for example, doesn't really appear to get smaller.  You can see it against the horizon, often cut in half... it does not get smaller.  Also, taking into consideration that the moon is rarely full, goes far to dispel the theory that it is it's own source of light, when the explanation that it's merely reflecting another light source is much more reasonable.

"
Q: "What about satellites? How do they orbit the Earth?"

A1: They don't, satellite signals come from radio towers."

They do not come from radio towers.  Take TV dishes, for example.  They must be pointing at the satellite in order to receive the signal.  Consider the mass multitude of dishes which need to point at the sky to receive the signal.  If you've ever attempted to set a dish up, you'd see that they must be very specifically directed to work.  Also, with a strong enough telescope, you can see satellites.

"Q: "Why does gravity vary with altitude?"

A: The moon and stars have a slight gravitational pull.

Q:  Follow-up to previous question:  How is it that the Earth does not have a gravitational pull, but stars and the moon do?

A:  This argument is a non sequitur.  You might as well ask, "How is it that snakes do not have legs, but dogs and cats do?"  Snakes are not dogs or cats.  The Earth is not a star or the moon.  It doesn't follow that each must have exactly the properties of the others, and no more."

This analogy does not work.  Snakes and dogs follow the same rules of physics, the issue of legs does not relate.  If a body of the moon has a gravitational pulled, it stands to reason that a similar mass would have a same effect.   Science suggests that all mass has attraction and the greater the mass, the greater attraction.  The theory of the universe in this sense works.  To suggest that the moon and stars have gravity without any reason greatly lessons the credibility of the model.

"Q: "Why doesn't water run off the Earth?"

A: There is a vast ice wall that keeps the water where it is. The ice wall is roughly 150ft high. This also explains why you can find a vast plane of ice when you travel south."

Have you seen the ice wall?  I ask this question only since the central idea that I'm hearing is that you believe the world to be flat because it's what you see... I wonder at the faith in this "ice wall" that no one has any actually proof of...

"Q: "How does global warming affect the ice wall?"

A1: Global warming is melting the ice wall, but the government isn't doing anything because cutting carbon emissions would damage the economy, and they only care about making money.

A2: Global Warming doesn't happen. It and its counter-theory (Global Cooling) are effects that cancel each other out. Remember, these "greenhouse gasses" can reflect heat back out into space as well as keep it on Earth. Yes, there are recorded rises in temperature, but the only records we have go back, at most, around 150 years. This is very likely an occurrence that happens every [x>150] years, that's happened before (perhaps many times), and that the Earth has thus survived before."

The green house effect is simple.  The thicker atmosphere does not both reflect AND magnify.  Consider a car parked in the sun with the windows closed.  The glass magnifies energy and keep it in the car.  Glass does not reflect, as it's transparent.  The ice is responsible for reflecting the energy, but as it melts, less and less get reflected away from the earth, thus increasing the "warming" effect.  If you question this theory, go back to the car analogy.  Touch a white car sitting in the sun, then touch a black car sitting in the same area.  You'll notice that the black car has absorbed a considerable amount of heat compared to the white.

"Q: "What about tides?"

A: The tides exist due to a slight see-saw effect on the earth. As it goes back and forth, the water rushes to the side that is lower. Note, this is a very slight wobble. Remember, these wobbles are created by very minor earthquakes. They keep the tides in check. Notice that large earthquakes result in large tides or "tsunami"."

Exactly what physical law causes the "see-saw" effect?  All the laws of physics suggest that an object in motion requires much more energy to change course than to stay the course.  To prove this, take your car around a sharp turn, and in the apex, let go of the wheel.  Without direction, it will continue along a forward path.



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