The Flat Earth Society

Other Discussion Boards => Technology, Science & Alt Science => Topic started by: Pezevenk on April 12, 2021, 02:02:55 AM

Title: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 12, 2021, 02:02:55 AM


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA how did the city even agree to let this grifter do this? "Durrr instead of making a subway, how about we had a bunch of little cars doing the same thing but much worse, much more expensive and carrying much fewer people per hour and all for a damn 2 mile drive?".

This is even worse than the initial idea because apparently now you don't even enter it with your own personal car, but it's more like an ultra expensive taxi where you pay 20 dollars for a 2 mile ride.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Heiwa on April 12, 2021, 03:30:06 AM
I think the Suez canal is more embarrassing. You pay $500 000:- toll feel including pilot and when you hit the canal bank and block the canal for a week, you are fined $1000 000 000!- http://heiwaco.com/everg.htm
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 12, 2021, 05:35:52 AM


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA how did the city even agree to let this grifter do this? "Durrr instead of making a subway, how about we had a bunch of little cars doing the same thing but much worse, much more expensive and carrying much fewer people per hour and all for a damn 2 mile drive?".

This is even worse than the initial idea because apparently now you don't even enter it with your own personal car, but it's more like an ultra expensive taxi where you pay 20 dollars for a 2 mile ride.

Did you miss the part where this was built in Vegas?

I don't think they were going for "the most efficient, cheapest, boring, dull way of moving people from one end of a 2 mile convention center to the other side" here.  Besides, they already have cheaper options, this is meant to entertain.

What next, complain that the roller coaster you rode cost you twenty bucks and put you right back where you started?!?!! What a rip off.  ;D
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 12, 2021, 05:52:56 AM
0
Did you miss the part where this was built in Vegas?

Partially true, except this is being promoted and pushed hard by Musk as a solution to the traffic problems of every city, and apparently other cities are considering it.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 12, 2021, 09:26:16 AM
0
Did you miss the part where this was built in Vegas?

Partially true, except this is being promoted and pushed hard by Musk as a solution to the traffic problems of every city, and apparently other cities are considering it.

"We would love to build an underground transportation system in our city but we can't afford all the flashing lights and showgirls.  I wish there was some way to build this without all the bling bling" - Said by nobody

This is also how we figure things out. Having an actual, working system in place is invaluable for collecting data and seeing if this is indeed feasible, or if it isn't.  Thanks to Las Vegas for footing the bill for a nice experiment.

If you're afraid to try new things, you don't get new things.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 12, 2021, 11:27:23 AM
A simple look at the concept and anyone with a functioning brain cell would have known this would not solve transport issues.

Sure maybe Elon Musk could build his own private tunnel to get from A to B and if he didn't mind the billions of dollars in expenses, it could get him there quicker provided it has exit points everywhere he wants them

But trying to move millions of people in underground tunnels is ludicrous. All you do is shift congestion to the worst possible place you could have it

Imagine a car break down in there. Or someone needing emergency services etc. The idea was always stupid from a cost/benefit ratio.

Underground tunnels for public transport is great. Limited vehicles moving many people each with entry/exit points along the way. But privately? Crazy

This was never going to solve congestion problems. I already knew that. Why do you think billions need to be spent trying it out to find out?

Flying or hover cars - now that would be something. But seriously the way forward is cheaper and more efficient public transport systems. In Australia or at least my state, the public transport is shit, slow, expensive, few in number and the city is designed for private car use above all.

Elon Musk is a fruit cake.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 12, 2021, 11:43:19 AM
0
Did you miss the part where this was built in Vegas?

Partially true, except this is being promoted and pushed hard by Musk as a solution to the traffic problems of every city, and apparently other cities are considering it.

"We would love to build an underground transportation system in our city but we can't afford all the flashing lights and showgirls.  I wish there was some way to build this without all the bling bling" - Said by nobody

This is also how we figure things out. Having an actual, working system in place is invaluable for collecting data and seeing if this is indeed feasible, or if it isn't.  Thanks to Las Vegas for footing the bill for a nice experiment.

If you're afraid to try new things, you don't get new things.

Here's an idea.

Instead of whatever that is, we could have a catapult launching people into the air so that they could hopefully land where they want to go.

What's that? You don't think this is a good idea and maybe no one should pay attention to this? Why? Don't you want new things?

Thankfully people know how to plan and assess things before they try them.

Unfortunately this horrible idea is being taken seriously by various cities because it is being promoted by Musk. I'm not even sure he believes it is feasible himself. I think he just wants to divert the conversation away from solving traffic and environmental issues via public transport, because public transport doesn't sell cars.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 12, 2021, 11:53:42 AM
A simple look at the concept and anyone with a functioning brain cell would have known this would not solve transport issues.

Sure maybe Elon Musk could build his own private tunnel to get from A to B and if he didn't mind the billions of dollars in expenses, it could get him there quicker provided it has exit points everywhere he wants them

But trying to move millions of people in underground tunnels is ludicrous. All you do is shift congestion to the worst possible place you could have it

Imagine a car break down in there. Or someone needing emergency services etc. The idea was always stupid from a cost/benefit ratio.

Underground tunnels for public transport is great. Limited vehicles moving many people each with entry/exit points along the way. But privately? Crazy

This was never going to solve congestion problems. I already knew that. Why do you think billions need to be spent trying it out to find out?

Flying or hover cars - now that would be something. But seriously the way forward is cheaper and more efficient public transport systems. In Australia or at least my state, the public transport is shit, slow, expensive, few in number and the city is designed for private car use above all.

Elon Musk is a fruit cake.
Oh, this is worse because he appears to have abandoned the idea of people taking their own personal cars down there (at least for now) since it would probably become a nightmare, both from a logistical and a safety perspective unless you are willing to invest a ridiculous amount of money. No, now it's like underground Uber. Basically you go down to the station and you call one of the dedicated Teslas down there so you can do a 2 minute trip for $20. So it IS like the underground public transport thing, only instead of a train you have glorified underground taxis which is just dumb.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 13, 2021, 05:53:14 AM
0
Did you miss the part where this was built in Vegas?

Partially true, except this is being promoted and pushed hard by Musk as a solution to the traffic problems of every city, and apparently other cities are considering it.

"We would love to build an underground transportation system in our city but we can't afford all the flashing lights and showgirls.  I wish there was some way to build this without all the bling bling" - Said by nobody

This is also how we figure things out. Having an actual, working system in place is invaluable for collecting data and seeing if this is indeed feasible, or if it isn't.  Thanks to Las Vegas for footing the bill for a nice experiment.

If you're afraid to try new things, you don't get new things.

Here's an idea.

Instead of whatever that is, we could have a catapult launching people into the air so that they could hopefully land where they want to go.

What's that? You don't think this is a good idea and maybe no one should pay attention to this? Why? Don't you want new things?

Thankfully people know how to plan and assess things before they try them.

Unfortunately this horrible idea is being taken seriously by various cities because it is being promoted by Musk. I'm not even sure he believes it is feasible himself. I think he just wants to divert the conversation away from solving traffic and environmental issues via public transport, because public transport doesn't sell cars.

It's a horrible idea because you say so?  I'm sure the people who spent all the time planning, spending money and building this sure feel silly now that some armchair engineer looked at a few pictures and declared the entire idea horrible. They could have saved so much time!

"Thankfully people know how to plan and assess things before they try them."

Like... the people that planned and assessed the Tesla ride before building it. 

And how is what was built not public transport?  Please explain how this system is not public transport, but subways and busses are. What exactly disqualifies it?  I'm rather curious to hear your explanation.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 13, 2021, 06:16:14 AM
The whole concept of the boring and tunnel network was to reduce congestion for people driving by car (such as himself)

https://www.wired.com/story/elon-musk-boring-company-public-transit/
Quote
Transportation experts and urbanists of a more traditional stripe have been less than impressed. Musk’s first Boring Company concept video focused on the personal car, showing Teslas (of course) blasting down underground tubes onboard electric skates, which Musk has promised will move up to 150 mph. How can any form of transit promoting personal cars—vehicles carrying up to five (squished) people at a time, and more likely carrying just one—reduce congestion? What happens if you don’t own a car at all? Musk’s comments during a conference in December didn’t help matters, when he mocked mass transit.

Maybe you can tell us how moving traffic underground is going to solve congestion. Keep in mind, if there is a problem anywhere in the network, everyone is gridlocked and shit all chance of emergency services getting it out. This isn't just a few mass transit vehicles in a vast underground network here. This whole idea was based on having hundreds of thousands of vehicles moving about. ie, your garage at home can go down into the underground network and you can drive to work or the shops that way instead of above ground. Sounds cool until everyone else is doing it to, and then you must wonder 'what was the fucking point?'

If my car breaks down in the middle of the road or you have a car accident, you can move the car to the side of the road or divert traffic. In an underground system, not likely

I'm not against boring machines and tunnels - but what is being proposed as a 'solution' to a problem, is not a solution at all. The solution to traffic congestion is going to take a many pronged approach to solve

A few ideas

Staggered / flexible work hours
Working from home
More public transport/mass transit vehicles and cheaper

If you make everyones work start at 9am and finish at 5pm you are going to have major congestion at those hours for sure. So many kinds of work do not need those start and finish times and as this pandemic has proved, so many jobs can just as reliably be done from home. So have some people start and finish at 6-2, 7-3, 8-4, 9-5, 10-6, 11-7 etc.

Also why bore underground for another road? You could just make another road above the ground level road.

Undergound tunnels work better for public transport, moving hundreds of people in the 1 vehicle going to the same destination/hubs. Not 1 vehicle to maybe sometimes 1 person, where thousands of users have thousands of destinations they want to go. Stupid
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 13, 2021, 08:31:27 AM
Also why bore underground for another road? You could just make another road above the ground level road.

Sure, it's so easy to build a road through a residential or city.  You seriously don't see how an underground tunnel that can go from any point to any other point is a better solution than demolishing a strip of houses and buildings to get from one side of the city to another?

No, you can't just "make another road above the ground level road". With Elon's boring tech it's going to be cheaper to make a tunnel than some ugly, expensive double decker road.  And building another on top of that one is going to require reinforcing the one below, probably rebuilding.

No... you can't just make another road.  ::)

Undergound tunnels work better for public transport, moving hundreds of people in the 1 vehicle going to the same destination/hubs. Not 1 vehicle to maybe sometimes 1 person, where thousands of users have thousands of destinations they want to go. Stupid

It works better, does it? In every situation? Your detailed studies on this that drew you to this conclusion? Or is it just based on your expert gut opinion that anything Elon does is bad cause he's that space guy and part of the conspiracy?

Individual cars moving through tunnels taking people to their destinations has been an idea for public transport ever since their was public transport. Trains, subway cars, big busses, small busses, and small vehicles that carry 1-4 people all serve different purposes and needs and you pick whichever works best for the situation.

Nobody is talking about ripping out packed subways and replacing them with single person cars. These networks are planned for routes that are too low volume to get a subway stop, but can work well if all you need is a tunnel and autonomous vehicles that can move through it.

What is stupid is limiting your vision to just one problem and forgetting there are lots of problems and solutions out there.

You might as well say ferries are stupid and should be gotten rid of because you can't fit a ferry in a subway tunnel and their isn't any water down there.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 13, 2021, 09:08:10 AM
The Elon love is strong in this one ::)

You dont need to demolish houses ::) WTF? You would have multi tiered roads on major arterial roads away from residential roads. Some places already have them.

(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTSfV64R_HhnNU_UlLOPPcfkig3uPXuFBZHCEuGvJN0qrtCB2W5jO30Zg5qAagS7AuCbxo&usqp=CAU)

 Do you really think you can have an underground road network with an entry and exit point for every house? LOL That was the inspiration for the hair brained scheme in the first place


Also, some areas are not suitable for underground tunnels and boring tunnels has been linked to the creation of sinkholes in the past

Underground cities are awesome, check out South Korea
https://en.blog.kkday.com/26386/asia-south-korea-seoul-underground-shopping-centers

As a transport system for private cars? Dumb. Remember his plan was for every house to have a garage to use the network so they wouldn't have to drive above ground and he mocked the notion of mass public transport

But keep creaming your pants for Elon ::)
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 13, 2021, 09:42:39 AM
The Elon love is strong in this one ::)

You dont need to demolish houses ::) WTF? You would have multi tiered roads on major arterial roads away from residential roads. Some places already have them.

(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTSfV64R_HhnNU_UlLOPPcfkig3uPXuFBZHCEuGvJN0qrtCB2W5jO30Zg5qAagS7AuCbxo&usqp=CAU)

 Do you really think you can have an underground road network with an entry and exit point for every house? LOL That was the inspiration for the hair brained scheme in the first place


Also, some areas are not suitable for underground tunnels and boring tunnels has been linked to the creation of sinkholes in the past

Underground cities are awesome, check out South Korea
https://en.blog.kkday.com/26386/asia-south-korea-seoul-underground-shopping-centers

As a transport system for private cars? Dumb. Remember his plan was for every house to have a garage to use the network so they wouldn't have to drive above ground and he mocked the notion of mass public transport

But keep creaming your pants for Elon ::)

The trolling is strong in this one.

I'm well aware of those undergrounds shopping malls in Korea, I've been to them.  They are way cooler in person and much bigger than that article shows, they go on for miles.  You brought them up, why?

You are still pretending you think you can just build a road on top of a road from anywhere to anywhere and you post a picture of an interchange, the most expensive and biggest eyesore we can make as evidence. 

You really think building THAT on top of your house is a better idea than a tunnel underneath it?  Seriously?  You actually think that it's better to build dozens of multi-level highways through a city, demolishing houses and destroying entire neighborhoods than to tunnel under them.

I mean, if you want to go there, ok, but it makes you look pretty dumb.

And yes, you have to demolish houses if you want to build major highways through a city. Just ask Boston, they have spent billions trying to fix doing just that, and saw their city suffer massively when they just sliced it into sections building the highways through it. They still haven't recovered.  But sure... it's a great idea because you know, Elon makes spaceships and you hate him.

And how do you build those all over the city below?  How many buildings should we demolish?  Where exactly are we going to fit all those cloverleafs in there? 

(https://i.imgur.com/UGu2MDP.jpg)
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 13, 2021, 10:33:47 AM
Trolling? Why do you say that? Cant stand the fact that I dont agree with Musks stupid vision or plan?

I have no problem with an underground tunnel catering for MASS TRANSIT of people. I dont think it's ludicrous that every garage will have its own entry to the network for every private citizen to take his private car. Who is going to pay for such infrastructure? It's not feasible or economic for private use

Public transport? No problems. Private transport? Dumb

Also like I said, there are other ways to reduce congestion and all it takes is a shift away from the 9-5 lifestyle we are accustomed to. Working from home and staggered working hours or even 24 hour cycles would do wonders.

Also, not sure why a multi tiered road absolutely has to look like an eyesore lol. You dont need to demolish houses. There are many arterial roads NOT in residential areas where making extra lanes is not doable. However you dont need to spend tens of billions of dollars boring a 10km tunnel to essentially add an extra lane of traffic.

I know it hurts you that there are people out there that think Elon is a dick with some pretty stupid ideas

How about his stupid mini sub to rescue some boys trapped in a cave and when an expert diver told him where he could shove his idea, Elon called him a 'pedo' guy

Or his hair brained BFR rocket so people can blast off and travel across the world in under 1 hour (trusting his landing success vs that of a plane and increasing everyones carbon footprint. Hell, the F in BFR stands for 'fucking' he's that uncouth

Or his idea to 'nuke Mars' to help terraform? Really?
https://futurism.com/the-byte/elon-terraforming-mars-nukes

So you'd need to launch 3500 nukes every single day for 7 weeks. I suppose he has a plan for that? Maybe he can invent the technology that gets rid of what would be a radioactive wasteland?

He's just a guy with money who tries to act cool. On the inside he's a toxic megalomaniac, narcissistic prick who says a lot of stupid shit hoping one of them lands on the money or at the least, get his butt fugly mug on the news

oh and as to your picture. Please explain how each individual living there can have access to their own private entry to this underground network and all leave roughly the same time and not have any congestion issues because... Underground? lol
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 13, 2021, 10:47:00 AM
Trolling? Why do you say that? Cant stand the fact that I dont agree with Musks stupid vision or plan?

Trolling because when when you're challenged on your claims that tunnels are dumb and it's EASIER to just build roads on top of roads through cities, you post a picture of a clover leaf like you can just stamp those down all over an existing city.  Lazy trolling.

Trolling because you're clearly just bashing Elon because you know your audience and he's the bad spaceman.  Because you can't possibly think tunnels are a bad idea, otherwise why not say we should abandon the subway system and build lots of quadruple decker highways right through everyone's houses. 

Because of what you said right there, your main problem is 'Musks stupid vision' not the facts of the matter.  This has to do more about him than what he built, as you can't go for two sentences without saying how much you think he's dumb or how anyone who agrees with him must be in love with him.

So yeah. Troll. You know it, I know it, quit pretending otherwise. You are entertained by doing it, I'm entertained by pointing it out.  ;D
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 13, 2021, 10:52:51 AM
Trolling? Why do you say that? Cant stand the fact that I dont agree with Musks stupid vision or plan?

Trolling because when when you're challenged on your claims that tunnels are dumb and it's EASIER to just build roads on top of roads through cities, you post a picture of a clover leaf like you can just stamp those down all over an existing city.  Lazy trolling.

Trolling because you're clearly just bashing Elon because you know your audience and he's the bad spaceman.  Because you can't possibly think tunnels are a bad idea, otherwise why not say we should abandon the subway system and build lots of quadruple decker highways right through everyone's houses. 

Because of what you said right there, your main problem is 'Musks stupid vision' not the facts of the matter.  This has to do more about him than what he built, as you can't go for two sentences without saying how much you think he's dumb or how anyone who agrees with him must be in love with him.

So yeah. Troll. You know it, I know it, quit pretending otherwise. You are entertained by doing it, I'm entertained by pointing it out.  ;D

It is a stupid vision. And I never said to destroy homes. Thats all you putting words in my mouth because you realize your argument is shit - however your love for Elon commands you defend him at any cost lol

Or maybe I missed something? Tell me how when you have a densely packed city like in the pic you posted, how you can have each one of them have a private car to take an underground tunnel to wherever they want. Thousands of people. Thousands of destinations. Somehow underground boring eliminates the congestion??? And can be done economically?

Help my brain do the mental gymnastics and backflips how such a thing is logical. Remember, his idea was NOT for public transport but for private
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 13, 2021, 11:13:17 AM
Trolling? Why do you say that? Cant stand the fact that I dont agree with Musks stupid vision or plan?

Trolling because when when you're challenged on your claims that tunnels are dumb and it's EASIER to just build roads on top of roads through cities, you post a picture of a clover leaf like you can just stamp those down all over an existing city.  Lazy trolling.

Trolling because you're clearly just bashing Elon because you know your audience and he's the bad spaceman.  Because you can't possibly think tunnels are a bad idea, otherwise why not say we should abandon the subway system and build lots of quadruple decker highways right through everyone's houses. 

Because of what you said right there, your main problem is 'Musks stupid vision' not the facts of the matter.  This has to do more about him than what he built, as you can't go for two sentences without saying how much you think he's dumb or how anyone who agrees with him must be in love with him.

So yeah. Troll. You know it, I know it, quit pretending otherwise. You are entertained by doing it, I'm entertained by pointing it out.  ;D

It is a stupid vision. And I never said to destroy homes. Thats all you putting words in my mouth because you realize your argument is shit - however your love for Elon commands you defend him at any cost lol

See, you're doing it again. You can't even go for one sentence without saying how much you dislike him and how anyone who doesn't agree with you must love and worship him. Lazy. Shows you have no argument if you have to constantly bash the guy, which is your real goal here, playing for the audience. Spaceman bad! Durrrr.

You yourself said it's easier to build roads than tunnels. I pointed out real examples of where houses and entire neighborhoods were demolished to make these roads.  Not putting words anywhere, just pointing out that if you want a road going from one side of the city to another, a tunnel doesn't require you to bulldoze a path, or build expensive multi-level roads.

Or maybe I missed something? Tell me how when you have a densely packed city like in the pic you posted, how you can have each one of them have a private car to take an underground tunnel to wherever they want.

Yeah you missed something.  You missed where I never said there had to be entrances and exits to every house on the planet. Talk about putting words in mouths, that's the second time you tried that.

You even mentioned South Korea's underground malls, they have tons of entrances all over in a big city just like I showed. Bigger even. It's not hard to put elevators, stairs and escalators down to a network. We do it all the time. Why do you think this is impossible?

The only difference is Musks system is meant to have more, smaller stops instead of fewer bigger ones.  You really need to understand the concept here.

You also keep claiming this system isn't public transportation, well really?  Ever see shuttle busses in big cities? They fit maybe a dozen people and take them from place to place.  You pay money, get on and go to where you want.

What's the difference with the Vegas system?  You pay money, get in a vehicle that holds 1-5 people, and get taken to where you want.

That's not public transportation?  Why, because it doesn't carry as many people per vehicle? That's a pretty specific definition you have there. What's the lower limit, 6 people?  I bet I could fit 6 people in a Tesla. So is it 7 now? LOL. Let me find some clowns, I bet I can get that number up higher. Then would it fit your very precise definition of public transportation?  ;D

Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 13, 2021, 11:28:11 AM
Yeah you missed something.  You missed where I never said there had to be entrances and exits to every house on the planet. Talk about putting words in mouths, that's the second time you tried that.

The whole point of Elons brain wave WAS for an individual to have their own private garage and entry to an undergound network ::)

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1118799_the-boring-company-wants-to-connect-your-garage-to-its-tunnels

So who pays for it? Thousands upon thousands of entry/exit points

It's an idea, cool in sci fi, but Musk has a big mouth that likes to imagine fiction is real (like 'nuke Mars' or his stupid mini sub to rescue people in a cave)

Maybe it's because you're American, you fall for this shit so easily. Just lap up whatever a flimflam is selling.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 13, 2021, 12:02:22 PM
Yeah you missed something.  You missed where I never said there had to be entrances and exits to every house on the planet. Talk about putting words in mouths, that's the second time you tried that.

The whole point of Elons brain wave WAS for an individual to have their own private garage and entry to an undergound network ::)

Uh-huh. So your entire "Do you really think you can have an underground road network with an entry and exit point for every house? LOL" is based on this article where is says...

"may one day take cars and drivers straight into the system from their garages"

So because you read that one sentence, you decided that the entire system is completely unworkable and a horrible idea due to your imagination running wild and not being able to understand the difference between what was actually built and a random comment about what could be. One quote about the idea of private connections and you turn it into a requirement that every house MUST be hooked up to it and because that's clearly unfeasible, well the whole idea must be bad.  Bad spaceman, bad!

You really need some lessons in reading comprehension and basic logic.  ::)
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 13, 2021, 12:17:24 PM
Yeah you missed something.  You missed where I never said there had to be entrances and exits to every house on the planet. Talk about putting words in mouths, that's the second time you tried that.

The whole point of Elons brain wave WAS for an individual to have their own private garage and entry to an undergound network ::)

Uh-huh. So your entire "Do you really think you can have an underground road network with an entry and exit point for every house? LOL" is based on this article where is says...

"may one day take cars and drivers straight into the system from their garages"

So because you read that one sentence, you decided that the entire system is completely unworkable and a horrible idea due to your imagination running wild and not being able to understand the difference between what was actually built and a random comment about what could be. One quote about the idea of private connections and you turn it into a requirement that every house MUST be hooked up to it and because that's clearly unfeasible, well the whole idea must be bad.  Bad spaceman, bad!

You really need some lessons in reading comprehension and basic logic.  ::)

That was Musks vision. As idiotic and unworkable as his 'Nuke Mars' nonsense. But he tweets and people lap it up

Remember his tweets regarding the pandemic....

The panic over the virus is dumb

Hydroxychloroquine is a better treatment

Kids are immune

“Give people back their goddamn freedom” regarding lockdowns

I have good reasons to be skeptical of whatever this over bloated moron says. Unlike you, I would not take what he says at face value.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 13, 2021, 12:19:04 PM
It's a horrible idea because you say so? 


No, because it is. It's like if you took a subway but removed everything that made it efficient.

Quote
I'm sure the people who spent all the time planning, spending money and building this sure feel silly now that some armchair engineer looked at a few pictures and declared the entire idea horrible. They could have saved so much time!
I am really really sorry for the engineers involved who had to carry through with Elon Musk's dumb scam. I feel sorry that they have Musk as an employer in general actually: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jun/13/tesla-workers-pay-price-elon-musk-failed-promises
https://www.inc.com/business-insider/elon-musk-rage-fires-employees-experts-say-its-terrible-leadership.html

Like, obviously they're not gonna tell him "uhhh this is not a great idea maybe" when he's probably just gonna fire them at the spot if they do.

Quote
And how is what was built not public transport?  Please explain how this system is not public transport, but subways and busses are. What exactly disqualifies it?  I'm rather curious to hear your explanation.
Because this is basically underground taxis.

I should have said mass transit, not public transport, but whatever, it's not public transport either, so far at least.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 13, 2021, 12:29:59 PM
Also I am not even sure why we are talking about roads, we don't need more roads. Literally just make cheap mass transit. I live in a city of around 3 million and we don't even have a great mass transit system (no money) but it's at least sort of decent, and it is good enough that we never get the massive traffic jams the US does all the time. We literally only have 3 subway lines (and another one is in construction) and they alleviate so much traffic. It is so much better than 20 years ago when that didn't exist. Imagine if instead of 3 there were, like, 8, and more busses. Maybe even a few monorails like they have in China, Japan etc.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: FE4 on April 13, 2021, 12:33:37 PM
Also I am not even sure why we are talking about roads, we don't need more roads. Literally just make cheap mass transit. I live in a city of around 3 million and we don't even have a great mass transit system (no money) but it's at least sort of decent, and it is good enough that we never get the massive traffic jams the US does all the time. We literally only have 3 subway lines (and another one is in construction) and they alleviate so much traffic. It is so much better than 20 years ago when that didn't exist. Imagine if instead of 3 there were, like, 8, and more busses. Maybe even a few monorails like they have in China, Japan etc.
What city is that? and what is the country your in?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 13, 2021, 12:35:32 PM
Also I am not even sure why we are talking about roads, we don't need more roads. Literally just make cheap mass transit. I live in a city of around 3 million and we don't even have a great mass transit system (no money) but it's at least sort of decent, and it is good enough that we never get the massive traffic jams the US does all the time. We literally only have 3 subway lines (and another one is in construction) and they alleviate so much traffic. It is so much better than 20 years ago when that didn't exist. Imagine if instead of 3 there were, like, 8, and more busses. Maybe even a few monorails like they have in China, Japan etc.
What city is that? and what is the country your in?
It is Athens, Greece. There is also a suburban railway.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: FE4 on April 13, 2021, 12:39:42 PM
Also I am not even sure why we are talking about roads, we don't need more roads. Literally just make cheap mass transit. I live in a city of around 3 million and we don't even have a great mass transit system (no money) but it's at least sort of decent, and it is good enough that we never get the massive traffic jams the US does all the time. We literally only have 3 subway lines (and another one is in construction) and they alleviate so much traffic. It is so much better than 20 years ago when that didn't exist. Imagine if instead of 3 there were, like, 8, and more busses. Maybe even a few monorails like they have in Chin
a, Japan etc.
What city is that? and what is the country your in?
It is Athens, Greece. There is also a suburban railway.
Well if theres no money to build a trzit system then you can walk or something.
i dont think the Comrades in North korea have a major tranzit systems either considering we spread the money equally(Yes i believe in Communism and no i dont live in north korea)
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 13, 2021, 12:42:53 PM
Yeah you missed something.  You missed where I never said there had to be entrances and exits to every house on the planet. Talk about putting words in mouths, that's the second time you tried that.

The whole point of Elons brain wave WAS for an individual to have their own private garage and entry to an undergound network ::)

Uh-huh. So your entire "Do you really think you can have an underground road network with an entry and exit point for every house? LOL" is based on this article where is says...

"may one day take cars and drivers straight into the system from their garages"

So because you read that one sentence, you decided that the entire system is completely unworkable and a horrible idea due to your imagination running wild and not being able to understand the difference between what was actually built and a random comment about what could be. One quote about the idea of private connections and you turn it into a requirement that every house MUST be hooked up to it and because that's clearly unfeasible, well the whole idea must be bad.  Bad spaceman, bad!

You really need some lessons in reading comprehension and basic logic.  ::)

That was Musks vision. As idiotic and unworkable as his 'Nuke Mars' nonsense. But he tweets and people lap it up

Remember his tweets regarding the pandemic....

The panic over the virus is dumb

Hydroxychloroquine is a better treatment

Kids are immune

“Give people back their goddamn freedom” regarding lockdowns

I have good reasons to be skeptical of whatever this over bloated moron says. Unlike you, I would not take what he says at face value.

So... once again you don't really have any factual arguments.  Just a lot of "Musk is dumb" and envy that his tweets get likes.

Not sure what you think I'm taking at face value... this whole thing started with his Vegas project, which was actually built and is functioning and transporting people. But I guess according you you "spaceman dumb" so yeah... everyone involved in the project is just not as smart as you Asussies and they built it TOTALLY ON HIS WORD and didn't do any of their own research. Sure.

But I suppose my entire opinion is based on how bad I want to have Elons baby or something.  I don't think I'm the one who has an obsession with him here...  8)
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 13, 2021, 12:53:26 PM
Yeah you missed something.  You missed where I never said there had to be entrances and exits to every house on the planet. Talk about putting words in mouths, that's the second time you tried that.

The whole point of Elons brain wave WAS for an individual to have their own private garage and entry to an undergound network ::)

Uh-huh. So your entire "Do you really think you can have an underground road network with an entry and exit point for every house? LOL" is based on this article where is says...

"may one day take cars and drivers straight into the system from their garages"

So because you read that one sentence, you decided that the entire system is completely unworkable and a horrible idea due to your imagination running wild and not being able to understand the difference between what was actually built and a random comment about what could be. One quote about the idea of private connections and you turn it into a requirement that every house MUST be hooked up to it and because that's clearly unfeasible, well the whole idea must be bad.  Bad spaceman, bad!

You really need some lessons in reading comprehension and basic logic.  ::)

That was Musks vision. As idiotic and unworkable as his 'Nuke Mars' nonsense. But he tweets and people lap it up

Remember his tweets regarding the pandemic....

The panic over the virus is dumb

Hydroxychloroquine is a better treatment

Kids are immune

“Give people back their goddamn freedom” regarding lockdowns

I have good reasons to be skeptical of whatever this over bloated moron says. Unlike you, I would not take what he says at face value.

So... once again you don't really have any factual arguments.  Just a lot of "Musk is dumb" and envy that his tweets get likes.

Not sure what you think I'm taking at face value... this whole thing started with his Vegas project, which was actually built and is functioning and transporting people. But I guess according you you "spaceman dumb" so yeah... everyone involved in the project is just not as smart as you Asussies and they built it TOTALLY ON HIS WORD and didn't do any of their own research. Sure.

But I suppose my entire opinion is based on how bad I want to have Elons baby or something.  I don't think I'm the one who has an obsession with him here...  8)

A lot of things come down to money. If the issue is traffic congestion, there are a plethora of cheaper ways to solve the issues than some stupid underground tunnel which wont work when you put many thousands of vehicles in it

Better and more efficient public transport and staggered working hours and even working from home. Much much cheaper

But Elon Musk made a tweet, people cream their pants as if it's divine and word of truth ::)
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 13, 2021, 12:56:47 PM
It's a horrible idea because you say so? 


No, because it is. It's like if you took a subway but removed everything that made it efficient.

Or... if you took a subway and removed all the things that made it inefficient to cover more of a city and made it suitable to spread out more using cars instead of trains.

Don't be so close minded to new ideas, or old ones.  A large network using individual cars to take people point to point is an idea as old as subways, we just now are getting to the point where it's feasible to make them.

Even if it's a bad spaceman doing it. :)

Quote
I'm sure the people who spent all the time planning, spending money and building this sure feel silly now that some armchair engineer looked at a few pictures and declared the entire idea horrible. They could have saved so much time!
I am really really sorry for the engineers involved who had to carry through with Elon Musk's dumb scam. I feel sorry that they have Musk as an employer in general actually: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jun/13/tesla-workers-pay-price-elon-musk-failed-promises
https://www.inc.com/business-insider/elon-musk-rage-fires-employees-experts-say-its-terrible-leadership.html

Like, obviously they're not gonna tell him "uhhh this is not a great idea maybe" when he's probably just gonna fire them at the spot if they do.

You have insider knowledge of this 'obvious' fact that probably is true? You know, if he does fire anyone who says no... that means that every decision at Space-X and Tesla is completely his since nobody can tell him no.  That makes him look even smarter if you ask me, and everyone who set no should have been fires, since they were clearly wrong. Are you a secret admirer of his? :)

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And how is what was built not public transport?  Please explain how this system is not public transport, but subways and busses are. What exactly disqualifies it?  I'm rather curious to hear your explanation.
Because this is basically underground taxis.

I should have said mass transit, not public transport, but whatever, it's not public transport either, so far at least.

How is it not public transit?  I asked Shifted this too but he ignored it.

Plenty of cities use small transport shuttles hardly bigger than a van. You wait at a stop, pay, and get taken to where you want to go. How is his system any different, other than building an underground network to operate on?  It's a system to move people around, run by a city, used for the public... what's your reasoning here other than simply saying it isn't?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 13, 2021, 01:05:07 PM
A lot of things come down to money. If the issue is traffic congestion, there are a plethora of cheaper ways to solve the issues than some stupid underground tunnel which wont work when you put many thousands of vehicles in it

"There are better ways so this way is totes stupid and won't ever work and is dumb and I don't understand it and we shouldn't ever do anything at all cause it's not my perfect idea."

Well why didn't you just say so in the first place?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 13, 2021, 01:14:58 PM
A lot of things come down to money. If the issue is traffic congestion, there are a plethora of cheaper ways to solve the issues than some stupid underground tunnel which wont work when you put many thousands of vehicles in it

"There are better ways so this way is totes stupid and won't ever work and is dumb and I don't understand it and we shouldn't ever do anything at all cause it's not my perfect idea."

Well why didn't you just say so in the first place?

Quit being a dumbarse and putting words in peoples mouths. Not what I have said at all

I dont mind tunnels but for private use its dumb. Public transport its great

Who is going to pay for the many thousands of km worth of tunnels to accommodate the many thousands of vehicles inside with many thousands of entry/exit points for peoples garages. It was always a dumb idea. Elon knows he cant tweet whatever he likes and idiots will squeal with glee. Like Trump. 'Hey Guys! you can drink or inject disinfectant to kill the corone!'

And what do you know, some idiots (Ameritards) did

A lot of the hype surrounding Hydroxychloroquine was because of Elon too which Trump heaped on. What the fuck does he know about medicine, disease and viruses?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 13, 2021, 01:24:06 PM
Also I am not even sure why we are talking about roads, we don't need more roads. Literally just make cheap mass transit. I live in a city of around 3 million and we don't even have a great mass transit system (no money) but it's at least sort of decent, and it is good enough that we never get the massive traffic jams the US does all the time. We literally only have 3 subway lines (and another one is in construction) and they alleviate so much traffic. It is so much better than 20 years ago when that didn't exist. Imagine if instead of 3 there were, like, 8, and more busses. Maybe even a few monorails like they have in Chin
a, Japan etc.
What city is that? and what is the country your in?
It is Athens, Greece. There is also a suburban railway.
Well if theres no money to build a trzit system then you can walk or something.
i dont think the Comrades in North korea have a major tranzit systems either considering we spread the money equally(Yes i believe in Communism and no i dont live in north korea)
Well yeah you can walk, thankfully the center is rather walkable. Of course that is an issue of urban planning.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 13, 2021, 01:41:16 PM
Or... if you took a subway and removed all the things that made it inefficient to cover more of a city and made it suitable to spread out more using cars instead of trains.

What makes a subway "inefficient"? Subways are incredibly efficient. You don't need to make it "spread out more", that's antithetical to precisely that which makes it efficient in the first place. You don't need that because most people are perfectly fine with something that takes them a walking distance (or at the very worst a bus trip) from where they want to go, and the rest can simply use a magical thing called a "road", like the ones that already exist. The point of a subway is that a single train can carry an incredible number of people who would otherwise create nightmarish traffic jams and pollution, not to mention that it is much more affordable for them. What makes it efficient is exactly that it is not split up into a million pieces. By doing that you undo what made it good in the first place.

Quote
A large network using individual cars to take people point to point is an idea as old as subways, we just now are getting to the point where it's feasible to make them.

No, it already existed. In fact it is the norm in places without mass transit. It's called "driving". Or "taking a taxi". It's not a new idea at all. That's the thing with these "new" ideas that Musk has. They're not new at all, they're just nonsense hybrids of things that already exist. "What if we had a subway, only instead of a train, it used taxis?".

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You have insider knowledge of this 'obvious' fact that probably is true? You know, if he does fire anyone who says no... that means that every decision at Space-X and Tesla is completely his since nobody can tell him no.  That makes him look even smarter if you ask me, and everyone who set no should have been fires, since they were clearly wrong. Are you a secret admirer of his? :)

What? Obviously Musk can't control everything going on with his businesses. However, he can say "I want a rocket program. Give me a rocket program". Alright, a rocket program is, well, reasonable enough with a lot of money. "I want new fancy electric cars." Alright Elon, here's your new fancy electric cars. "I want a subway, but with taxis instead". Ummm...

Also he typically doesn't fire people for any particular reason it seems. The reason seems to be that he was angry at the time and they happened to be in the wrong place. But yeah, I can't imagine I would want to be the guy to tell him his idea is dumb.

Quote
How is it not public transit?  I asked Shifted this too but he ignored it.

Taxis are not considered public transport generally. But it's just a word debate really.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 14, 2021, 06:32:15 AM
A lot of things come down to money. If the issue is traffic congestion, there are a plethora of cheaper ways to solve the issues than some stupid underground tunnel which wont work when you put many thousands of vehicles in it

"There are better ways so this way is totes stupid and won't ever work and is dumb and I don't understand it and we shouldn't ever do anything at all cause it's not my perfect idea."

Well why didn't you just say so in the first place?

Quit being a dumbarse and putting words in peoples mouths. Not what I have said at all

I dont mind tunnels but for private use its dumb. Public transport its great

Stop putting words in peoples mouths? You first.

Again, how is this not public transportation? Plenty of cities have small shuttle busses/vans that take people from place to place. Vehicles running on a route that people pay to take them from one place to another. But somehow Tesla's vehicles running on a route that people pay to take them from one place to another doesn't count.

Right.

It's only dumb to you because you have some hate for the bad spaceman. Get over it, he launches rockets, sorry that offends you so much.

And what do you know, some idiots (Ameritards) did

A lot of the hype surrounding Hydroxychloroquine was because of Elon too which Trump heaped on. What the fuck does he know about medicine, disease and viruses?

Sigh, can you actually manage to put together a single sentence without your hate for America and Elon becoming the focus of your angry rant? Nothing you said there contains any actual facts or reasoning, just a bunch of "I hate America and Musk!"
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 14, 2021, 06:38:51 AM
A lot of things come down to money. If the issue is traffic congestion, there are a plethora of cheaper ways to solve the issues than some stupid underground tunnel which wont work when you put many thousands of vehicles in it

"There are better ways so this way is totes stupid and won't ever work and is dumb and I don't understand it and we shouldn't ever do anything at all cause it's not my perfect idea."

Well why didn't you just say so in the first place?

Quit being a dumbarse and putting words in peoples mouths. Not what I have said at all

I dont mind tunnels but for private use its dumb. Public transport its great

Stop putting words in peoples mouths? You first.

Again, how is this not public transportation? Plenty of cities have small shuttle busses/vans that take people from place to place. Vehicles running on a route that people pay to take them from one place to another. But somehow Tesla's vehicles running on a route that people pay to take them from one place to another doesn't count.

Right.

It's only dumb to you because you have some hate for the bad spaceman. Get over it, he launches rockets, sorry that offends you so much.

And what do you know, some idiots (Ameritards) did

A lot of the hype surrounding Hydroxychloroquine was because of Elon too which Trump heaped on. What the fuck does he know about medicine, disease and viruses?

Sigh, can you actually manage to put together a single sentence without your hate for America and Elon becoming the focus of your angry rant? Nothing you said there contains any actual facts or reasoning, just a bunch of "I hate America and Musk!"

Go Google "Elon Musk Hydroxychloroquine" if you dont believe me

The difference between a tram moving from point A to B within a city is it doesn't require spending many billions of dollars just making the space available to put the thing

Like everything, it comes down to money. Building a network of tunnels as per Elon Musks 'vision' is far too expensive to actually be economically viable.

Who is going to pay for a person to have a garage that connects to these tunnels? You happy to spend your tax dollars offsetting the cost for a rich person to have his personal access to it?Or maybe we build every future house with them adding hundreds of thousands of dollars to the cost of buying a house whether you want the feature or not

If the goal is to reduce congestion, there are far better and cheaper methods to accomplish this goal.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 14, 2021, 06:42:26 AM
Or... if you took a subway and removed all the things that made it inefficient to cover more of a city and made it suitable to spread out more using cars instead of trains.

What makes a subway "inefficient"? Subways are incredibly efficient.

Yes, they are very efficient at what they were designed to do, carry massive amounts of people from a few centralized locations. Nothing wrong with that, I like subways, I think we should spend lots of money on them.

But as you add more and more nodes they get less and less efficient, and the whole idea of individual pods/cars is to allow point to point travel to a vast array of stations, were you have lots of pathways and stops and cars that can go right from one to another. You can't add a subway stop at every block as that would reduce the efficiency and make subway travel grind to a crawl, but you can with Elon's idea (and remember that the idea of pod transport has been around for a LONG time, it's not new, it's not really his idea, he's just the first to try it.)

Subways do lots of things well, but are not good at everything. What's wrong with looking into systems that can compliment subways?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 14, 2021, 06:46:51 AM
A lot of things come down to money. If the issue is traffic congestion, there are a plethora of cheaper ways to solve the issues than some stupid underground tunnel which wont work when you put many thousands of vehicles in it

"There are better ways so this way is totes stupid and won't ever work and is dumb and I don't understand it and we shouldn't ever do anything at all cause it's not my perfect idea."

Well why didn't you just say so in the first place?

Quit being a dumbarse and putting words in peoples mouths. Not what I have said at all

I dont mind tunnels but for private use its dumb. Public transport its great

Stop putting words in peoples mouths? You first.

Again, how is this not public transportation? Plenty of cities have small shuttle busses/vans that take people from place to place. Vehicles running on a route that people pay to take them from one place to another. But somehow Tesla's vehicles running on a route that people pay to take them from one place to another doesn't count.

Right.

It's only dumb to you because you have some hate for the bad spaceman. Get over it, he launches rockets, sorry that offends you so much.

And what do you know, some idiots (Ameritards) did

A lot of the hype surrounding Hydroxychloroquine was because of Elon too which Trump heaped on. What the fuck does he know about medicine, disease and viruses?

Sigh, can you actually manage to put together a single sentence without your hate for America and Elon becoming the focus of your angry rant? Nothing you said there contains any actual facts or reasoning, just a bunch of "I hate America and Musk!"

Go Google "Elon Musk Hydroxychloroquine" if you dont believe me

I never once said he didn't say those things. Didn't we just have a discussion about putting words into peoples mouths?

Elon saying crazy things still doesn't make your argument any better, and ranting about how much you hate him and my country is a poor substitute for actual debate.

You just say he's dumb and that somehow building a network of automated vehicles transporting people around a city isn't actual public transportation with no attempt to ever explain your reasoning or defend your statement.

Spaceman dumb, got it. Can you post even ONCE without insulting me or Elon?  Give it a try, maybe I'll try too. :)
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 14, 2021, 06:49:47 AM
A lot of things come down to money. If the issue is traffic congestion, there are a plethora of cheaper ways to solve the issues than some stupid underground tunnel which wont work when you put many thousands of vehicles in it

"There are better ways so this way is totes stupid and won't ever work and is dumb and I don't understand it and we shouldn't ever do anything at all cause it's not my perfect idea."

Well why didn't you just say so in the first place?

Quit being a dumbarse and putting words in peoples mouths. Not what I have said at all

I dont mind tunnels but for private use its dumb. Public transport its great

Stop putting words in peoples mouths? You first.

Again, how is this not public transportation? Plenty of cities have small shuttle busses/vans that take people from place to place. Vehicles running on a route that people pay to take them from one place to another. But somehow Tesla's vehicles running on a route that people pay to take them from one place to another doesn't count.

Right.

It's only dumb to you because you have some hate for the bad spaceman. Get over it, he launches rockets, sorry that offends you so much.

And what do you know, some idiots (Ameritards) did

A lot of the hype surrounding Hydroxychloroquine was because of Elon too which Trump heaped on. What the fuck does he know about medicine, disease and viruses?

Sigh, can you actually manage to put together a single sentence without your hate for America and Elon becoming the focus of your angry rant? Nothing you said there contains any actual facts or reasoning, just a bunch of "I hate America and Musk!"

Go Google "Elon Musk Hydroxychloroquine" if you dont believe me

I never once said he didn't say those things. Didn't we just have a discussion about putting words into peoples mouths?

Elon saying crazy things still doesn't make your argument any better, and ranting about how much you hate him and my country is a poor substitute for actual debate.

You just say he's dumb and that somehow building a network of automated vehicles transporting people around a city isn't actual public transportation with no attempt to ever explain your reasoning or defend your statement.

Spaceman dumb, got it. Can you post even ONCE without insulting me or Elon?  Give it a try, maybe I'll try too. :)

I've made many posts not insulting you. You cherry picking the ones that hurt your fee fees because of your empathy to Elon is not my problem. We all have different views on or about people and their ideas. You need to accept that people are different and dont have to align with your exact thinking.

I don't think Elon is a great guy and I think a lot of his ideas are bullshit. Get over it
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 14, 2021, 06:49:54 AM
Yes, they are very efficient at what they were designed to do, carry massive amounts of people from a few centralized locations.

Exactly. Add a good bus and tram system to compliment them, and boom, you have fixed congestion.

Quote

You can't add a subway stop at every block as that would reduce the efficiency and make subway travel grind to a crawl

You don't have to. You compliment them with busses and tram lines which is enough for most people. At the end of the day, you have mass transit servicing the needs of most people, leaving only a small number who have to use the roads. That way you fix congestion, pollution, etc. In fact you also drive down the need for cars, which is what Musk doesn't want.

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and remember that the idea of pod transport has been around for a LONG time, it's not new, it's not really his idea, he's just the first to try it.

Why pods? They are just cars. He is not the first to try cars. We already have roads for them. We don't need more, we just need to decongest the ones that are already there.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 14, 2021, 07:01:04 AM
Yes, they are very efficient at what they were designed to do, carry massive amounts of people from a few centralized locations.

Exactly. Add a good bus and tram system to compliment them, and boom, you have fixed congestion.

Why can't Elon's system compliment them and boom, fix congestion?

Busses are great and I support them, but they are also a pain and often run late and sometimes just go right past you and make you wait 20 minutes for the next one. I've used them a LOT and can say for certain I'd love a better option. Why so opposed to looking for one?

Why pods? They are just cars. He is not the first to try cars. We already have roads for them. We don't need more, we just need to decongest the ones that are already there.

Pods because before Elon came along, everyone had the idea that a point to point underground system would need pods on rails, like mini-subway cars complete with the complex systems for switching to other tracks and queueing and stacking them up.

Elon's use of electric cars and simple flat surfaces combined with a cheap tunneling machine is what makes the 'pod' idea something potentially feasible.

Or at the very least, worth studying. Let him build his networks and see how they work before throwing out the pod idea which has been around forever, and finally looks like we can start actually trying it.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 14, 2021, 07:13:21 AM
Yes, they are very efficient at what they were designed to do, carry massive amounts of people from a few centralized locations.

Exactly. Add a good bus and tram system to compliment them, and boom, you have fixed congestion.

Why can't Elon's system compliment them and boom, fix congestion?

Busses are great and I support them, but they are also a pain and often run late and sometimes just go right past you and make you wait 20 minutes for the next one. I've used them a LOT and can say for certain I'd love a better option. Why so opposed to looking for one?


because for the cost of a few km of an underground tunnel you could put another thousand buses on the road that can service the entire city

My city did a stupid idea and we put 12km of a light rail track at the cost of nearly $1 billion dollars. 12km! And that was above ground

The cost could have put several hundred more buses instead. Now the public transport is 'fractured'. Before you could take a bus from near your house and go to many destinations with it. Now you take a bus to the light rail station. The light rail to the city and then another bus from the city to somewhere else where before you could just take the 1 bus from your home

Just because something costs more or looks cool, doesn't make it better. That $1 billion here could have bought hundreds more buses instead of a gloried 12km track that only services a fraction of the people along its very small corridor. But everyones housing rates in the city went up to pay for it. Imagine if they decided to go underground instead at the cost of many more billions. Just make existing public transport more plentiful and more cheaper to use and people will go on it. I would

Hell, when I was overseas in the likes of London, Korea, China and even Poland the public transport was so good I was thinking why the hell would people want a car when the public transport services almost every place!? You see one bus and the next bus is like 2 mins behind it. In Canberra the buses can be 30-60 mins behind each other and it costs a shitload to get on. Stupid!
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 14, 2021, 07:27:11 AM
Why can't Elon's system compliment them and boom, fix congestion?

Because there is no good reason why you would want to drill a massive network of tunnels to do what roads already do. Great mass transit is adequate to solve congestion, you don't need something more. As I said before, I live in a city of around 3 million or so, and we don't have significant congestion issues even with just 3 subway lines (1 more under construction), a suburban railway, and an existent but not particularly sophisticated bus network.

Quote
Busses are great and I support them, but they are also a pain and often run late and sometimes just go right past you and make you wait 20 minutes for the next one. I've used them a LOT and can say for certain I'd love a better option. Why so opposed to looking for one?

Well, then you could get a taxi, which is already a thing.

Quote
Pods because before Elon came along, everyone had the idea that a point to point underground system would need pods on rails, like mini-subway cars complete with the complex systems for switching to other tracks and queueing and stacking them up.

Elon's use of electric cars and simple flat surfaces combined with a cheap tunneling machine is what makes the 'pod' idea something potentially feasible.

So it's cars. But in underground tunnels.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Stash on April 14, 2021, 07:42:26 AM
I don't see what the issue is. If Vegas wants to pay for a bunch of tunnels and ultimately have a gazillion autonomous teslas scooting around in them with folks paying whatever to ride in the perhaps semi-convenient-novelty-thrill way of not having to walk the strip, so be it. Is it a commuter "solution"? Absolutely not. Is it somewhat frivolous? Absolutely yes. But, it's Vegas: A terra-formed unbearably hot desert manufactured oasis and we built a massive dam just to irrigate the needless American destination.

Anyway, most likely Vegas will turn it into a waterpark where ASU spring breakers and obese middle American families can go tubing from casino/attraction to casino/attraction.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 14, 2021, 07:44:55 AM
Yes, they are very efficient at what they were designed to do, carry massive amounts of people from a few centralized locations.

Exactly. Add a good bus and tram system to compliment them, and boom, you have fixed congestion.

Why can't Elon's system compliment them and boom, fix congestion?

Busses are great and I support them, but they are also a pain and often run late and sometimes just go right past you and make you wait 20 minutes for the next one. I've used them a LOT and can say for certain I'd love a better option. Why so opposed to looking for one?


because for the cost of a few km of an underground tunnel you could put another thousand buses on the road that can service the entire city

My god.  I'm trying to imagine a few thousand busses in my city.  Now there is a traffic nightmare.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 14, 2021, 07:50:00 AM
Yes, they are very efficient at what they were designed to do, carry massive amounts of people from a few centralized locations.

Exactly. Add a good bus and tram system to compliment them, and boom, you have fixed congestion.

Why can't Elon's system compliment them and boom, fix congestion?

Busses are great and I support them, but they are also a pain and often run late and sometimes just go right past you and make you wait 20 minutes for the next one. I've used them a LOT and can say for certain I'd love a better option. Why so opposed to looking for one?


because for the cost of a few km of an underground tunnel you could put another thousand buses on the road that can service the entire city

My god.  I'm trying to imagine a few thousand busses in my city.  Now there is a traffic nightmare.

Why? For every bus on the road (provided they are managed well and priced attractively) you could take dozens of cars off the road. I would argue that dozens of cars on the road is worse than a single bus. But you do you
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 14, 2021, 07:52:58 AM
Why can't Elon's system compliment them and boom, fix congestion?

Because there is no good reason why you would want to drill a massive network of tunnels to do what roads already do. Great mass transit is adequate to solve congestion, you don't need something more. As I said before, I live in a city of around 3 million or so, and we don't have significant congestion issues even with just 3 subway lines (1 more under construction), a suburban railway, and an existent but not particularly sophisticated bus network.

But roads can't do what the tunnels do, which is have fully automated cars moving along an easy to navigate tunnel without having to worry about pedestrians, other cars, animals and weather conditions.

It's great your city works well, not all of them do, and you can't just tear down and rebuild a city to straighten out it's transportation issues. Your city doesn't need this? Fine. Doesn't mean others couldn't make good use of it.

I just don't see the hate for actually building a new way of moving people around and trying out an idea.  It's like you desperately want him to fail and in the process abandon an idea that's been around forever just because Elon was the one to try it.

Quote
Pods because before Elon came along, everyone had the idea that a point to point underground system would need pods on rails, like mini-subway cars complete with the complex systems for switching to other tracks and queueing and stacking them up.

Elon's use of electric cars and simple flat surfaces combined with a cheap tunneling machine is what makes the 'pod' idea something potentially feasible.

So it's cars. But in underground tunnels.

Yes, fully automated electric cars in underground tunnels built with new, cheaper tunneling tech. That is the idea we have been discussing the entire thread. :)
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 14, 2021, 08:37:02 AM
But roads can't do what the tunnels do, which is have fully automated cars moving along an easy to navigate tunnel without having to worry about pedestrians, other cars, animals and weather conditions.
What does it matter whether or not they are automated? Regardless, automated cars can be driven in normal roads.

Quote
It's great your city works well, not all of them do, and you can't just tear down and rebuild a city to straighten out it's transportation issues. Your city doesn't need this? Fine. Doesn't mean others couldn't make good use of it.


It doesn't need this because unlike most of the US it has functional mass transit proportional to its size. Part of it is urban planning too but really any city can do a lot better with mass transit, a badly planned out city just requires a somewhat greater investment (also you can probably fix the planning in less time than building a massive underground network would take).

Quote
I just don't see the hate for actually building a new way of moving people around and trying out an idea.  It's like you desperately want him to fail and in the process abandon an idea that's been around forever just because Elon was the one to try it.
No, it would be an equally bad idea regardless of who tried it, it's just that only Musk both has the resources, the sway and weirdness to actually do it. Also vested interests against mass transit, like all other car manufacturers  (which is the main reason so many places don't have adequate mass transit).

Quote
new, cheaper tunneling tech.
It is actually not cheaper because of new boring methods, they use off the shelf equipment for the most part. The reason it is cheaper is because he skirted the law to make smaller tunnels than are normally allowed.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 14, 2021, 12:07:30 PM
So... once again you don't really have any factual arguments.  Just a lot of "Musk is dumb" and envy that his tweets get likes.

Musk isn't dumb - he just persuaded someone to give him $50m to create an advert for Tesla.  Marketing that someone else pays for - that's pretty clever.

The people who commissioned this idiocy - now they are as dumb as fuck.  Got to suspect it's now starting to sink in that they have been had.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 14, 2021, 11:03:04 PM
I mean, yeah, it's not so naive. He doesn't have to have a good solution in general. He only has to make cities at least consider his "idea" or make a prototype, and it's advertisement for him, while also pushing back plans to build mass transit since "we don't need it, we're gonna do Musk's idea".
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 15, 2021, 06:17:49 AM
But roads can't do what the tunnels do, which is have fully automated cars moving along an easy to navigate tunnel without having to worry about pedestrians, other cars, animals and weather conditions.
What does it matter whether or not they are automated? Regardless, automated cars can be driven in normal roads.

Automated cars in a controlled environment like a tunnel with no pedestrians or human drivers are going to be far safer than anything moving along on the surface. You forget that busses are a trade-off, and requiring expensive error-prone humans at the wheel of each one is one of those.

I still don't get all the hate and disdain I'm seeing here.

Busses, subways and taxis all help with congestion.  Why so opposed to combining them in new ways when technology offers up new solutions? You're literally throwing an entire concept out the window because you don't like who proposed it.

Would you be saying busses are terrible if Elon starts making automated electric busses and running them in tunnels instead of cars? Because there is no reason you couldn't do that.

You seem hyper focused on the Vegas production which is just a big advertisement. Look at the big picture, think how the elements being shown off can be added to existing systems to improve them. Elon wants to sell boring machines and electric vehicles. If people can figure out how to use them effectively what exactly is the problem?

What saddens me is how opposed to new ideas people here seem to be. And this isn't even a new one, does nobody read science fiction? This sort of thing has been one of the future visions of transportation for longer than any of us have been alive.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 15, 2021, 08:05:20 AM
Automated cars in a controlled environment like a tunnel with no pedestrians or human drivers are going to be far safer than anything moving along on the surface.

Look up "tunnel fire". Then look up "Tesla fire". Then combine the two. Now add hundreds of other cars zooming around.

Quote
Busses, subways and taxis all help with congestion. 

Taxis don't help with congestion. Taxis cause congestion (in small part). This can never fix congestion unless you fill the place with it, in which case you have other problems.

Quote
Why so opposed to combining them in new ways when technology offers up new solutions? You're literally throwing an entire concept out the window because you don't like who proposed it.

No, I am throwing it out of the window because there is zero value to it. Null. Or rather there is negative value. There is negative value in cities investing a bunch of money into a horrible idea like that.

Quote
Would you be saying busses are terrible if Elon starts making automated electric busses and running them in tunnels instead of cars? Because there is no reason you couldn't do that.

Yeah, he could do that. In fact he may even decide to make it even more efficient by stringing together a bunch of these busses so that more people can embark at once. And then he could do away the nasty lithium tunnel fire risk plus make the vehicles a lot lighter by moving the power supply from batteries on board to an external power source (which would also be better resource and cost wise). One idea for example would be to introduce a guidance system similar to what he unsuccessfully tried to implement at first, which would also provide the vehicle with power while making it even more safer in case the autopilot fails and slams into the walls. Yeah, that actually sounds like a pretty sweet idea.

Oh wait, that's literally a subway.

I would support him making a subway, if that is what you are asking.


Quote
Elon wants to sell boring machines and electric vehicles.

Elon doesn't make boring machines. Well, they are designing one, but it's not really ready for application yet. Its diameter is also suited for building the dumb Tesla tunnels so it's not particularly useful beyond that. I guess it might be good for storm drains. Maybe in the future TBC will start selling boring machines, but that is not the case yet. Musk's focus is the cars.

Quote
What saddens me is how opposed to new ideas people here seem to be.
Not new ideas, bad ideas. New ideas are good, if they are good ideas. Not every new idea is good. Besides, this isn't even a new idea, it's just taking existing things and combining them in ways that work against their strengths.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 15, 2021, 09:33:02 AM
This Is the Most Embarrassing News Clip in American Transportation History (https://www.vice.com/en/article/pkbekv/this-is-the-most-embarrassing-news-clip-in-american-transportation-history)

Bit hyperbolic, but not far off.

I want to know what they are going to provide for wheelchair users?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 15, 2021, 11:02:07 AM
Automated cars in a controlled environment like a tunnel with no pedestrians or human drivers are going to be far safer than anything moving along on the surface.

Look up "tunnel fire". Then look up "Tesla fire". Then combine the two. Now add hundreds of other cars zooming around.

Tunnels bad, got it. Lets get rid of subways because we never had any fires in those.

Nobody ever died in a bus crash. Nobody ever died being hit by a bus.

I can throw out dangers of every transportation system we have, does that mean we should just get rid of them all?

What's so scary about new things? I still don't understand the irrational hate here. Elon bad spaceman, yeah, got it. I sometimes forget what site I'm on. :)
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 15, 2021, 12:20:31 PM

What's so scary about new things?
It's just cars driving slowly in tunnels.   There's nothing new, just something deeply inefficient to the point of being laughable.   We've been building better transit systems than this for over 100 years - it's completely retrograde.

Quote
Elon bad spaceman,
It seems to be the other way round.  You seem to be defending this idiocy because eLoN mAKEs rOkeT gO brrRRrr.


Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 15, 2021, 12:33:15 PM
This Is the Most Embarrassing News Clip in American Transportation History (https://www.vice.com/en/article/pkbekv/this-is-the-most-embarrassing-news-clip-in-american-transportation-history)

Bit hyperbolic, but not far off.

I want to know what they are going to provide for wheelchair users?
LOL they copied my title.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 15, 2021, 12:40:56 PM
This Is the Most Embarrassing News Clip in American Transportation History (https://www.vice.com/en/article/pkbekv/this-is-the-most-embarrassing-news-clip-in-american-transportation-history)

Bit hyperbolic, but not far off.

I want to know what they are going to provide for wheelchair users?
LOL they copied my title.
ikr?

I assumed that was this was the article you'd linked, then realised you were just referring to the same embarrassing clip as Vice.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 15, 2021, 12:58:42 PM
Automated cars in a controlled environment like a tunnel with no pedestrians or human drivers are going to be far safer than anything moving along on the surface.

Look up "tunnel fire". Then look up "Tesla fire". Then combine the two. Now add hundreds of other cars zooming around.

Tunnels bad, got it. Lets get rid of subways because we never had any fires in those.

I looked up subway fire, I could only find two and they were both arson.

Subways don't tend to catch on fire because trains don't have anything flammable on them. And even if they do, it is a lot easier to escape because the tunnels are made so that that is possible. I'm not even sure you can fully open the doors in Musk's tunnels.

Teslas on the other hand catch on fire all the time. And not just any fire, lithium fires, which are notoriously hot, hard to extinguish, and produce lots of really nasty fumes.

Quote
Nobody ever died in a bus crash. Nobody ever died being hit by a bus.
Yes, these things have happened, but why would you go out of your way to make a more dangerous mode of transport when there is safer ones that are also better? You claimed this is safer. It is not. It's hundreds of cars with big flammable lithium batteries running around in very high speeds in short succession through narrow underground inaccessible tunnels, constantly accelerating and decelerating. Lots of moving parts, lots of wear and tear, lots of risk. In many places I suspect even if he does try to implement it he will be stopped by regulators for safety compliance etc and then he will go on twitter to complain about evil big government regulation stopping his innovative plans.

Quote
What's so scary about new things?
Why are you framing this as being about new things? Do you think every new thing is good? Do you think my idea of catapult transportation is good just because it's "new"? Well, at least that is actually new, I don't think anyone has ever proposed it as a solution, as opposed to, uh, taxis and tunnels.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 15, 2021, 12:59:32 PM
This Is the Most Embarrassing News Clip in American Transportation History (https://www.vice.com/en/article/pkbekv/this-is-the-most-embarrassing-news-clip-in-american-transportation-history)

Bit hyperbolic, but not far off.

I want to know what they are going to provide for wheelchair users?
LOL they copied my title.
ikr?

I assumed that was this was the article you'd linked, then realised you were just referring to the same embarrassing clip as Vice.

I guess embarrassing is the first thing that pops into your mind when you see that lol
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 15, 2021, 01:04:36 PM
A really good but slightly old video on the loop:

Thunderf00t is very annoying but he did make a decent newer video on this:


Donoteat1, the person who made the first vid, also has a podcast where they also discussed the recent Las Vegas loop (although it wasn't finished when they made it). It's not as good though because it is mostly them fucking around and making jokes:
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Zippy on April 18, 2021, 05:43:18 PM
He built a tunnel/road he owns, charges fees to use and can only be used by cars he manufactures. What's the embarrassing part?


Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 19, 2021, 12:43:10 AM
That someone gave him money to make it.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 19, 2021, 01:24:48 AM
He built a tunnel/road he owns, charges fees to use and can only be used by cars he manufactures. What's the embarrassing part?
The gushing news report.  Do keep up.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 19, 2021, 05:24:06 AM
I feel like posting links to every badly designed subway, bus route and every other form of mass transportation and demanding nobody ever try any of them again because they clearly are total failures and we should scrub the very idea of them from history.

Lets all agree never try anything new again because it might not work. Scary. (Spaceman bad!)

The lack of imagination on display here is staggering. Not sure what I was expecting though. ;D
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 19, 2021, 05:29:55 AM
I feel like posting links to every badly designed subway, bus route and every other form of mass transportation and demanding nobody ever try any of them again because they clearly are total failures and we should scrub the very idea of them from history.

Lets all agree never try anything new again because it might not work. Scary. (Spaceman bad!)

The lack of imagination on display here is staggering. Not sure what I was expecting though. ;D

You keep saying that. I gave you a very imaginative mode of transport: catapults. Do you or do you not like it as an idea?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 19, 2021, 05:46:49 AM
He built a tunnel/road he owns, charges fees to use and can only be used by cars he manufactures. What's the embarrassing part?

The worlds richest man did not use his own money. He got some sucker to do it

I would imagine if this transport technology became mainstream, Elon would not be paying for it either. Tax payers would, although he'll be taking credit and royalties and you'll have to constantly see his name and fugly mug at every terminal similar to North Koreans seeing a picture of their Dear and Great leader everywhere they go

ONLY be used by Tesla cars? How does that solve the traffic problem when Tesla cars represent a poofteeth of the % of cars out there? So does that mean we will have separate tunnel networks depending on the brand of car you own? Maybe we will have to drive our cars above ground to these stations and get on these vehicles. Oh wait, we already kinda do that with trains, rail, buses etc ::)
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JJA on April 19, 2021, 05:54:42 AM
I feel like posting links to every badly designed subway, bus route and every other form of mass transportation and demanding nobody ever try any of them again because they clearly are total failures and we should scrub the very idea of them from history.

Lets all agree never try anything new again because it might not work. Scary. (Spaceman bad!)

The lack of imagination on display here is staggering. Not sure what I was expecting though. ;D

You keep saying that. I gave you a very imaginative mode of transport: catapults. Do you or do you not like it as an idea?

It's a great idea, where did I say it wasn't?  Ever heard of a Lofstrom Loop space launcher?  Sled-based launchers build alongside a mountain are also ideas worth considering.  And I hear we launch jet fighters like that all the time from aircraft carriers.

Don't forget the grand daddy of all catapults, the space hook.

Now your particular implementation has issues, but that's no reason to throw out the entire concept.  It does work, ever been to a circus?  They launch people out of cannons all the time into nets, and it works perfectly well for what it's designed to do.

Saying we should never even try to imagine ways of using catapults is like... saying a fancy bling bling ride in Vegas can't be duplicated in NYC and work, which is obvious.  But no reason to decide that the basic concept should be ignored and will never, ever work in any situation, ever.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Shifter on April 19, 2021, 05:59:21 AM
I propose a transport network system like in Futurama. You just need an oxygen supply so you can breath while in the tubes which can operate on a vacuum.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 19, 2021, 06:14:28 AM
Lets all agree never try anything new
The lack of imagination on display here is staggering. Not sure what I was expecting though. ;D
You appear to be stuck on this particular strawman and just keep posting it over and over.  As we have repeatedly said: this isn't anything new or imaginative.  It is cars being driven slowly in a tunnel.  That's it.

If this wasn't Musk/Telsa it probably wouldn't even get any media coverage.  Maybe just a few people scratching their heads and going "Eh, what?  Oh well, it's Vegas"

This project isn't getting a hammering because people are afraid of the future, but because the whole thing is inherently shit.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 19, 2021, 09:16:42 AM
Elon Musk's Dumb Tesla Tunnel Now The Lamest Thing In Las Vegas (https://jalopnik.com/move-over-keno-elon-musks-dumb-tesla-tunnel-now-the-l-1846654974)

"..it’s about as exciting as a sheet of unpainted drywall discarded in a closed office park. It’s just some Tesla Model 3s driving slowly in a tube, and if that gets you excited then I hope you enjoy the many orgasms you get while driving down a spiral ramp in a parking deck."   :P

Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 19, 2021, 11:41:02 AM
It's a great idea, where did I say it wasn't?

I take it then that you will grant me money to make a catapult that launches people from station to station then?

Quote
Now your particular implementation has issues, but that's no reason to throw out the entire concept. 

True. You just throw away the cars, make the tunnel a bit wider, and put a train in it. That's what I've been saying too.

Quote
They launch people out of cannons all the time into nets, and it works perfectly well for what it's designed to do.
Have they also tried commuting like that?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 19, 2021, 02:02:31 PM
True. You just throw away the cars, make the tunnel a bit wider, and put a train in it. That's what I've been saying too.
I suspect they will end up with airport style electric  shuttle buses down there.  The ones that can take wheelchairs, luggage etc....

Though I can't imagine this tunnel will open to the public any time soon, especially in light of the recent crash:

Quote
Firefighters, he said, used at least 32,000 gallons of water to extinguish the flames fed by the car’s lithium-ion battery, he said. Firefighters at the scene contacted Tesla for advice on how to extinguish the blaze and were told just to let it burn out, Herman said.
How's that going to work in the tunnel?  Presumably the only thing they can do is limit passenger throughput?  Are the stations set up for this?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 20, 2021, 01:05:25 PM
True. You just throw away the cars, make the tunnel a bit wider, and put a train in it. That's what I've been saying too.
I suspect they will end up with airport style electric  shuttle buses down there.  The ones that can take wheelchairs, luggage etc....

Though I can't imagine this tunnel will open to the public any time soon, especially in light of the recent crash:

Quote
Firefighters, he said, used at least 32,000 gallons of water to extinguish the flames fed by the car’s lithium-ion battery, he said. Firefighters at the scene contacted Tesla for advice on how to extinguish the blaze and were told just to let it burn out, Herman said.
How's that going to work in the tunnel?  Presumably the only thing they can do is limit passenger throughput?  Are the stations set up for this?

Doubt they'd put busses because I don't think they would fit. The only selling point so far is that the tunnels are cheap because they are small, I don't think anyone would pay to have them made larger to fit busses. And Tesla doesn't make busses right now so they won't really want to do that.

Also tunnel fires are extremely hard to deal with even when they aren't lithium fires. The tunnel gets so hot and full of fumes that it is impossible to get anywhere near. If one of these catches on fire in the tunnel, the whole think shuts down until it's out of material to burn.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 20, 2021, 01:11:51 PM

Doubt they'd put busses because I don't think they would fit. The only selling point so far is that the tunnels are cheap because they are small, I don't think anyone would pay to have them made larger to fit busses.
Yeah, good point.  How they going to handle people in wheel chairs?   Presumably they will have to provide something, or face class action suits....

Quote
And Tesla doesn't make busses right now so they won't really want to do that.
They don't own the tunnel though, do they?

Quote
Also tunnel fires are extremely hard to deal with even when they aren't lithium fires. The tunnel gets so hot and full of fumes that it is impossible to get anywhere near. If one of these catches on fire in the tunnel, the whole think shuts down until it's out of material to burn.
Indeed.  And these tunnels don't have all the normal safety features, which is why they came in relatively cheap.  I suspect they will just have to severely limit passenger numbers.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Jura-Glenlivet II on April 21, 2021, 02:54:48 AM
Lets all agree never try anything new
The lack of imagination on display here is staggering. Not sure what I was expecting though. ;D
You appear to be stuck on this particular strawman and just keep posting it over and over.  As we have repeatedly said: this isn't anything new or imaginative.  It is cars being driven slowly in a tunnel.  That's it.

If this wasn't Musk/Telsa it probably wouldn't even get any media coverage.  Maybe just a few people scratching their heads and going "Eh, what?  Oh well, it's Vegas"

This project isn't getting a hammering because people are afraid of the future, but because the whole thing is inherently shit.


Yeah, come on JJ.
Accuse people of being Luddites if he’s ripping your body into its component atoms and chucking it down a tube at the speed of light to be assembled by a million chimpanzees with tweezers, if they say, “oh no, you first”, they would be backward looking future-phobes.
Tootling down what looks like 60’s kiddie ride or a cuttlefishes colon does not fill me with wonder for the impending Musk golden age.
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 22, 2021, 03:18:55 AM

I take it then that you will grant me money to make a catapult that launches people from station to station then?


Elon Musk Unveils Urban Slingshot System Able To Move 6 Pedestrians Across Street Per Hour (https://www.theonion.com/elon-musk-unveils-urban-slingshot-system-able-to-move-6-1846702819)

"AUSTIN—Boasting that the system used 75% less power than normal cars and could be installed on almost any street corner with 400 square feet of free space, Tesla CEO Elon Musk unveiled a new urban slingshot system Wednesday that he claimed was capable of of moving up to six pedestrians across the street per hour. “America is still stuck in the 19th century when it comes to crossing the street, but I know we can do better,” said Musk, presenting a detailed rendering of the integrated “Skypod” crossing system that would launch sealed, individually seated pedestrians pods with a motorized sling above the street to a predetermined location on the adjoining sidewalk. “Getting to the other side of the street used to mean wasting energy by using your legs and being exposed to dozens of other people, but that is in the past. Each crossing network costs only $10 million to install and is fully automated, with a climate-controlled environment for the five-minute loading process and journey across the street. And while there have been several instances of the pods crushing pedestrians when they land, I can assure you the lawsuit costs are nothing compared to the savings over helicopter crossing.” At press time, 34 cities across the country had bid more than $10 billion to become the first Skypod City."
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 22, 2021, 01:17:41 PM
Elon Musk Unveils Urban Slingshot System Able To Move 6 Pedestrians Across Street Per Hour (https://www.theonion.com/elon-musk-unveils-urban-slingshot-system-able-to-move-6-1846702819)

Can everyone please stop copying my posts for their headlines?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: FE4 on April 22, 2021, 01:20:10 PM
Elon Musk Unveils Urban Slingshot System Able To Move 6 Pedestrians Across Street Per Hour (https://www.theonion.com/elon-musk-unveils-urban-slingshot-system-able-to-move-6-1846702819)

Can everyone please stop copying my posts for their headlines?
No, this is a free country.
Damn how do you spell it again?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 22, 2021, 02:17:06 PM
Elon Musk Unveils Urban Slingshot System Able To Move 6 Pedestrians Across Street Per Hour (https://www.theonion.com/elon-musk-unveils-urban-slingshot-system-able-to-move-6-1846702819)

Can everyone please stop copying my posts for their headlines?
No, this is a free country.
Damn how do you spell it again?
It is an "I" followed by a "T".
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Pezevenk on April 23, 2021, 07:11:37 AM
Elon Musk Unveils Urban Slingshot System Able To Move 6 Pedestrians Across Street Per Hour (https://www.theonion.com/elon-musk-unveils-urban-slingshot-system-able-to-move-6-1846702819)

Can everyone please stop copying my posts for their headlines?
No, this is a free country.
Damn how do you spell it again?

What country is this?
Title: Re: World's most embarrassing transport system.
Post by: Denspressure on April 27, 2021, 12:51:25 PM
I'm pretty sure a metro would be able to handle more people, and faster?

From what I have seen of the public transport system in the USA though its a nasty and dangerous place with trash everywhere and people stealing/stabbing.